PBW & the Chemistry of Clean

[Bongologist]

Couple observations after using PBW for a few weeks: my pieces stay cleaner longer compared to ISO washes. I generally change the water everyday and give it a decent rinse with hot tap water. I have been cleaning with pbw every five days and the vapor buildup is clearly less then using ISO. PBW cleans better, faster and I've had no problems with residual white marks or rings. I am filling my pieces to normal levels and shaking for a minute, then completely filling using corks and letting it sit for five minutes. I have been mixing the pbw and hot water in a large mason jar and it seems to really blend well. Bonus...a full 2qt? bigmouth mason jar fills my UFO exactly to the top.

I have also used pbw to clean some glasses and old decorative jars, and in the dishwasher. The jars specifically turned out great, but even after being submerged for 8 hours in pbw still needed to go through a dishwasher cycle to really shine. Using pbw in the dishwasher I have noticed the dishwasher itself is cleaner. The walls seem cleaner, with a shine, and the filters are cleaner and holding less gunk. At first I thought this might be confirmation bias because I like this stuff so much, but my wife confirmed the dishwasher was looking new. I still intend to try alconox but would recommend pbw any day.

 

[Roth]

I stopped using PBW a long time ago. Once I started working with glass and getting to know blowers and cold workers I was told to stay away from PBW on high end pieces

I switched to Alconox! It was originally recommended to me by Mothership for a stain on the internals of my klein. After seeing what it can do, I will NEVER use anything else again. PBW was created originally to clean bar glass!

Alconox is a laboratory grade glass cleaner. Not saying anything negative about PBW, just saying that it couldn't shine alconox's shoes with our glass.

http://www.alconox.com/

What was the reason for staying away from high end pieces with PBW? I know it can dissolve a Ti signature, but is there another reason?

 

[mvapes]

What was the reason for staying away from high end pieces with PBW? I know it can dissolve a Ti signature, but is there another reason?

No more mixing, no more white residue, and now that I work with glass I've seen that just about every high end artist recommend it.

Once you use it you'll see. And dissolving ti signatures and labels is enough for me.

 

[CameraNerd]

I purchased liquinox instead of alconox. I am waiting to speak to alconox directly to make sure that this is a liquid version of the well reviewed alconox. My pipe isnt dirty enough to test it out yet... I personally wont be purchasing pbw again, the chalk is brutal on the inside of the fabegg that cant be cleaned easily.

 

[MinnBobber]

I purchased liquinox instead of alconox.

...............................
Yes, please let us know how the liquinox works out for you.

What method did you use for cleaning the fabegg? I've never had one spec of PBW chalk from using it dozens of times. Curious as that's a bummer.
I always heat distilled water in microwave to very very hot, then stir in minimal PBW (much less than recommended) until it's totally dissolved, preheat glass piece with med hot distilled water, dump and fill hot PBW. Watch it dissolve the gunk for one minute, give a little shake shake shake, a few more minutes of soaking and dump.
Never use too much PBW or too much soak time. 10 minutes max.
Always sparkles like crystal and never a spot.

 

[CameraNerd]

I soaked it last night in liquinox...
Woke up this morning, and all of the resins had sunk to the bottom of the pipe, a quick rinse, and it was sparkly like new. It even removed the stubborn pbw chalk stains. i soaked it for about 8 hours.

i have a tall vase that is about 1 inch larger in diameter. this was perfect for fully submerging the pipe in the fluid with out wasting liquinox.

Unfortunately, i found liquinox pretty harsh on the hands, and the wait is unnecessary. I prefer iso or acetone with salt.

so in summary.. unless you have a stubborn stain, or cant shake your pipe, use ISO + unscented epsom salts... but if you must, liquinox is superior to pbw (in my experience)

 

[Dank Sinatra]

Hey guys quick question:

I recently bought some PBW to clean my glass with and it works great. Would I be able to use it to clean out my Lotus Water Pipe Adapter? It's metal with (silicone?) o-rings.

 

[SeanFloyd]

Leave PBW alone and stick with Alconox. No chances of stains and your pieces look immaculate every time.

 

[OF]

Hey guys quick question:

I recently bought some PBW to clean my glass with and it works great. Would I be able to use it to clean out my Lotus Water Pipe Adapter? It's metal with (silicone?) o-rings.

Should be just fine. I don't have that piece, but I've washed lots of different metals and o-rings (Silicone, Buna and Viton) with no troubles. I've also put it in the dishwasher several times, no problems there with seals or plastic stuff but it sure took care of that 'haze' of mineral build up, it shines in there these days.

It's a detergent (with conditioners and buffers), not a solvent like ISO or similar. Basically 'soap and water safe stuff' should be fine.

OF

 

[Teedub]

I like cleaning my elb's in pbw gets most of them looking them brand new. It worked great on stainless steel as well but rust spots formed very quickly on some cheaper steel.

Is titanium safe in pbw? I read about the anodized ti grinders losing the anodizing and looked online but couldn't find a solid answer for titanium, Just that soft metals are supposedly safe. I'm going to test a ti dabber in it see if i get any reaction.

 

[OF]

I like cleaning my elb's in pbw gets most of them looking them brand new. It worked great on stainless steel as well but rust spots formed very quickly on some cheaper steel.

Is titanium safe in pbw?

Makes perfect sense. The PBW did exactly what it's designed to do, removed all the nasty organic junk......in this case the surface oils protecting the steel? This leaves Iron atoms in intimate contact with an atmosphere rich in Oxygen......good old Stoichiometry takes care of the rest. Iron and Oxygen going to rust (Oxidation) is much more popular than rust reverting to Iron and Oxygen (reduction). The process continues quickly until the metallic Iron is isolated from the Oxygen which slows it to a stop (or nearly so).

If you wash conventional steels (not SS), I'd protect it immediately, using a water penetrating oil while wet?

PBW should be fine on Ti, it worked fine when I tried it. But caution is a good idea?

OF

 

[Teedub]

Agreed, thanks OF

 

[jim-bob]

This is probably a dumb question, but I did a quick skim and didn't find anything.

Is PBW ziploc-bag-safe? Can I use it the way I use iso, by tossing something into a ziploc, pouring some paw solution in, and agitating it? Or will it eat through the bag and leave me with an embarrassing mess?

 

[RenDabs]

This is probably a dumb question, but I did a quick skim and didn't find anything.

Is PBW ziploc-bag-safe? Can I use it the way I use iso, by tossing something into a ziploc, pouring some paw solution in, and agitating it? Or will it eat through the bag and leave me with an embarrassing mess?

I find PBW to be most effective when mixing it with boiling or near boiling water, so using the plastic bag method with super hot water wouldn't be all that easy and you'd probably burn your hands. I've used thicker plastic containers before for PBW soaks with boiling water though and they held up fine.

 

[MinnBobber]

Leave PBW alone and stick with Alconox. No chances of stains and your pieces look immaculate every time.

...........................
@SeanFloyd , does Alconox remove stains inside a plastic sports bottle?
I mix ice, water, and pure juice for my sports drink. With that natural sugar, the threads on the cap get
a thin black deposit that is very tough to remove.

Have you ever tried Alconox on such a deposit?
I'm 100% satisfied with PBW on glass--when used at a low concentration and for minimal soak time (to not get white stains). It works fine on my glass.

PBW on sports bottle gunk ---- 75% satisfied. Doesn't really get it all off

 

[Dramma Lamma]

Anyone have any experience with Mile High Cleaner? (MHC)

Someone left a sample of it at my work.

Mainly curious if it will damage anything, such as a label on the glass or metal in any way.

 

[Smelly Dog]

Found this. http://technotes.alconox.com/industry/biotechnology/alconox-liquinox/

http://technotes.alconox.com/detergents/alconox/differences-alconox-liquinox/

 

[subway13029]

I bough one of the purr travel bubblers that is made of indestructible polycarbonate i believe but my mqin problem is its gets sticky gunky reclaim stuck on inside and nothing will clean it..ive already deatroyed 1 by using iso and trying to get it clean..pbw hasnt seemed to work either..any ideas?

 

[MinnBobber]

.pbw hasnt seemed to work either..any ideas?

Have you tried PBW mixed into really hot water? I microwave my water really hot, like 170+, as that really gets it working. It'a like turbocharged with higher temps as you can watch the goo lift off

Note for glass---I preheat good glass like bubblers with 120 water to not "temp shock it" too much.
With polycarb you shouldn't have to worry about temp shock.
If you haven't used really hot water, it's worth a try

 

[grimeade]

I stopped using PBW a long time ago. Once I started working with glass and getting to know blowers and cold workers I was told to stay away from PBW on high end pieces

I switched to Alconox! It was originally recommended to me by Mothership for a stain on the internals of my klein. After seeing what it can do, I will NEVER use anything else again. PBW was created originally to clean bar glass!

Alconox is a laboratory grade glass cleaner. Not saying anything negative about PBW, just saying that it couldn't shine alconox's shoes with our glass.

http://www.alconox.com/

Hey! So i got alconox as per your suggestion, and i put a teaspoon in side the rig, put some hot water, shook it up, and let it sit over night and then shook and drained in the morning, and while it made the glass nice and sparkly, it didnt exactly remove the claim off the sides. It just made it easier to scrape off. I did ISO + salt after w/ shake and it looks great. So im guessing abrasion also needed? I also ordered some PBW which comes in tomorrow. Im gonna try that to hopefully w/ + super hot water and then take away the need for the ISO salt step (which i hate). any tips or suggestions? thanks!

 

[MinnBobber]

Hey! So i got alconox as per your suggestion, and i put a teaspoon in side the rig, put some hot water, shook it up, and let it sit over night and then shook and drained in the morning, and while it made the glass nice and sparkly, it didnt exactly remove the claim off the sides. It just made it easier to scrape off. I did ISO + salt after w/ shake and it looks great. So im guessing abrasion also needed? I also ordered some PBW which comes in tomorrow. Im gonna try that to hopefully w/ + super hot water and then take away the need for the ISO salt step (which i hate). any tips or suggestions? thanks!

.....................................................................................
I always mix hot water and PBW outside the rig, in a bowl or whatever to make sure it's thoroughly dissolved. Any undissolved PBW in your water kind of sticks to the sides/ can leave white stains.
I always use less PBW than they recommend and only soak 15 or 20 minutes max: err on the side of less PBW and less time to make sure----some who soak overnight or who use heavy concentration level get white stains.

It works great

 

[grimeade]

.....................................................................................
I always mix hot water and PBW outside the rig, in a bowl or whatever to make sure it's thoroughly dissolved. Any undissolved PBW in your water kind of sticks to the sides/ can leave white stains.
I always use less PBW than they recommend and only soak 15 or 20 minutes max: err on the side of less PBW and less time to make sure----some who soak overnight or who use heavy concentration level get white stains.

It works great

Hey might have been a mis communication, but actually i put in a teaspoon of
alconox, not PBW. What is your Alconox-TEK haha? Thank you for the response!

 

[Smelly Dog]

Would anybody know if these two products are the same, or are they different from each other? They are priced a few bucks apart from each other. I wan't to buy the correct one.

Thank you in advance for the help!

Alconox.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B003FZAQ2Y...UTF8&colid=20YF3RUYV7EZ5&coliid=I2Z75Q0A4LAF9


http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0000WU828...TF8&colid=20YF3RUYV7EZ5&coliid=I1LNPC5Q9J75EI

 

[CameraNerd]

@Smelly Dog... they are the same.

look for liquinox though... dont dick around mixing powders... Liquinox or Detonox are what the company itself recomends for us?

i am a reporter... i actually called them and told them i was cleaning bongs. They sold me some detonox. Detonox is superior, and relies less on heating your pipe, which has been disastrous for many.

 

[Smelly Dog]

@Smelly Dog... they are the same.

look for liquinox though... dont dick around mixing powders... Liquinox or Detonox are what the company itself recomends for us?

i am a reporter... i actually called them and told them i was cleaning bongs. They sold me some detonox. Detonox is superior, and relies less on heating your pipe, which has been disastrous for many.

Thanks a bunch, I'll look for Detonox, if I can't find that i'll order the liquinox.

Thanks again!