Old Head Hot Rod

😢 there is a lot the hr does. Re: the Flip, Runt, Junior, & more. Love to see how I’ll get it to work with a JetDry. My mistake throwing REFC in my last comment. Bad boy me. I’ll stop.
 
Out of here,

Timps27

Well-Known Member
So I’ve been thinking. Not sure if I’m the only one, but unless I get aggressive and precise with my stirring I tend to end up with an inverted cone of “less” vaped material buildup from the glass on the perimeter of the bowl. After trying a lot of different combos out I really like the simple screen maintenance (and performance obv) of the HR bowl; this leftover edge bit seems to be the only “con” to the design.

Don’t get me wrong, it’s nice sometimes when you’re like “whoa that was a good bowl…wait, I can get another hit out of the perimeter material!?!?!?” ; but similar to my eventual transition from 4 piece to 3 piece grinders I’d just as soon intake my medicine the first time around.

I wonder if there is enough room to get some perimeter ventilation by a series of small holes in the glass that just dumps back into the stem? Might be the perfect injector bowl?
 

monochord71

Well-Known Member
Not sure if I’m the only one, but unless I get aggressive and precise with my stirring I tend to end up with an inverted cone of “less” vaped material buildup from the glass on the perimeter of the bowl.
Sometimes I get this, but it really seems to depend on how much "pull" the glass I use has. I also find that the temp setting I use varies a LOT depending on which bong I use. Adding an ashcatcher w/ a percolator gave me totally different results, too.
When I get that "less vaped perimeter" effect I angle the heat injector very slightly, maybe 10 degrees off-center, and do a slow rotation as I'm finishing up my hit, "stirring" with hot air. Kinda like the first hit here (not the second clean-up hit):

 
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Steel28

Well-Known Member
Sometimes I get this, but it really seems to depend on how much "pull" the glass I use has. I also find that the temp setting I use varies a LOT depending on which bong I use. Adding an ashcatcher w/ a percolator gave me totally different results, too.
When I get that "less vaped perimeter" effect I angle the heat injector very slightly, maybe 10 degrees off-center, and do a slow rotation as I'm finishing up my hit, "stirring" with hot air. Kinda like the first hit here (not the second clean-up hit):

My exact technique learned from you bro.
 

Kudzu407

Para-Vaper
Looks like maybe Hot Rod becomes a Freight Train.Just said on IG he is stopping Hot Rod temporarily to get out Freight Train Ti injector.
 
Kudzu407,

madhockeydad

Art is beauty
Sounds like they are being caught up in more of this banking mess. The politicians are really screwing up the cannabis markets with all kinds of BS. I know what the goal was - but the real problem is the illicit market and non-tested materials being consumed and for this the legal market is punished. It's A** backwards. I really want a Hot Rod and I'll be super excited to get a Freight Train. I do want our friend at Old Head to get the money the bank is holding from the Hot Rod sales. That really sucks.
 

Timps27

Well-Known Member
Um, I think it was less about a solitary look at one price and calling it too much, and more an overall comment about the amount of injector vapes on the market (some at reasonable prices) compared to a “head only” option at $120; meaning you still need to buy a PID, coil and any thermal mass material. That’s easily going to be over $300 by the time you’re done; so seems fair to call it out as not a truly affordable priced option.
 
Timps27,

madhockeydad

Art is beauty
That's a different way of talking about the costs. For the hand made devices, I think the labor is being under-valued actually but it's what the market bears. I'm glad there are a range of price point options from the DIY very low cost to handmade with all the bells and whistles. Each has a different cost and all of us can value how we spend our money. That's the way I see it. I'm super glad for the artisan makers - I'm not the most handy and I have a lot of other things going on. I enjoy vaping cannabis so I'm super happy and excited that I'm able to support some of these artisan makers. Price is a tricky thing as I hope all the makers are earning money which means turning a profit. Clearly, many are struggling financially and the current banking environment is not making it any easier.
 

Timps27

Well-Known Member
Um, no it’s pretty much the only way of talking about costs. The all in cost is the cost. So to call something that has an all in cost above $300 in a market with sub $200 options available “affordable” is a stretch at best.

ETA: I suppose I should clarify that the word we should be using here is “price”; as “cost” has a specific and different meaning in an economic sense.
 
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bkkbob

Obsessive Collector
Very glad I got my hotrod when it first came out, a shame. I genuinely think people would pay more for the device, as it has the beautiful wood by sticky brick as well as a pretty damn good, and heavy-hitting vape. I didn't read all the comments, but I know I would pay a bit more for it because of the quality of the build and finish, and the artesian design. I would hope that Brian would sell them for what he feels is a reasonable price for his work, and release the new device alongside. Just my 2 cents, that won't mean much :)
 

madhockeydad

Art is beauty
Um, no it’s pretty much the only way of talking about costs. The all in cost is the cost. So to call something that has an all in cost above $300 in a market with sub $200 options available “affordable” is a stretch at best.

ETA: I suppose I should clarify that the word we should be using here is “price”; as “cost” has a specific and different meaning in an economic sense.

"Affordable" is a qualitative term. Even comparatively when one is more expensive than the other that it doesn't reflect any other characteristic. Instead of judging something as too much or too little, I think of each product falling along a range of price points and all of us pick for different reasons: A) available funds: B) need vs want: and C) personal preference/asethetics.

Affordability is a debate I've heard with Hands-On ratchet tools - where some argue you buy a single high price and high quality tool or rather a cheaper options where you can get a bigger or more complete set. But the answers really depends on whether you are a mechanic/person that has a real use or need or "wants" the better gadget.

Most of what I buy is non-essential (except for food, shelter, medicine, etc) so my reasons for investing in more vapes is really to fulfill a personal desire so what I buy and how much I spend will be different than others. I share my perspective but I try and not to judge the choices people make.

I prefer when our conversations include less "personal" judgmental and more a conversation about objective matters or our thought processes for why something is or isn't a good fit for the way we think. I'm interested in that more than an opinion that something is over-priced.
 

Timps27

Well-Known Member
Sir, this is a Wendy’s.


The comment was made that reddit was calling it “overpriced”; and that it was some victim statement that everyone should get free ball vapes? There was nothing of the sort that I saw in the comments. It was posted that there was a desire to provide an “affordable” option to increase the availability to those who might not have the expendable income. It was also posted that the “affordable” option was a head only option for $120; in a market where you can build a COMPLETE ball vape for nearly that price that is objectively NOT affordable.
 
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monochord71

Well-Known Member
The comment was made that reddit was calling it “overpriced”; and that it was some victim statement that everyone should get free ball vapes?
Nah, that ain't it.
I mean, no one's REALLY complaining about the abundance of injector vapes.
No one's complaining about the abundance of log vapes or chinese conduction cheapos.
But when the hot rod comes up the same gang of people chime in with "I could have made this myself for $80" comments - but you didn't make it yourself, go on and make something aesthetically pleasing that I would like to see sitting in my living room and I might buy it.
Or comparisons to DIY stuff.
I've said it before and I'll say it again...I think stuff like the dc elev8r or this new TIG welder tip "pinky" thing are cool as hell, but I have no desire to make one myself and for the life of me I can not imagine my 83 year old dad hitting one.
 

Timps27

Well-Known Member
So in your view, $120 for a head only injector vape is objectively affordable in the current market?
 
Timps27,

monochord71

Well-Known Member
I have no idea, I haven't investigated that specific one enough to form an opinion, since I'm not in the market for one.
I don't know what "objectively affordable" means to you.
I do know that titanium is a bitch to work with, and that pretty much anything you can buy can be purchased for less somewhere, usually china.
I'm also really glad I work in an industry where people who aren't even actual customers discuss my business practices and theorize about how they could have "done the same thing for less" on internet forums.
 

madhockeydad

Art is beauty
I have no idea, I haven't investigated that specific one enough to form an opinion, since I'm not in the market for one.
I don't know what "objectively affordable" means to you.
I do know that titanium is a bitch to work with, and that pretty much anything you can buy can be purchased for less somewhere, usually china.
I'm also really glad I work in an industry where people who aren't even actual customers discuss my business practices and theorize about how they could have "done the same thing for less" on internet forums.

Totally agree. THANK YOU.

Again, I'm not commenting about what an affordable entry price point is or should be and what that should include. I simply know what I'm willing to pay and what I'm looking for. I'm glad there are a ton of options - my preference is a device made by someone who is invested and knows what they are doing and has excellent craftwork. That's what I want. To me the price point for the Old Head is affordable. I'm not saying that's true for anyone else.

I'm watching with enthusiasm the PINKY thread. It's not for me but I'm glad it's out there. The more options, the better, and I hope the community keeps growing and that there is enough to support the small custom makers. I don't drink but I live in a place with a strong craft brewing culture. I prefer that but it's still just beer and I only have one or two a year!!
 

Timps27

Well-Known Member
Le sigh. I’m not sure if you’re even reading.

a comment was made that claimed the Reddit posters were calling the entire project and device “overpriced”. Do you disagree?

when I went to said comment thread all I saw were a few people balking at the concept that a “$120” head only option should be called “affordable” in the market context, given several options exist for a fraction of the all in cost when coil, PID and thermals are considered. Did you go to that thread? Did you read the comments and come away with a different take on the comments?
 
Timps27,
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monochord71

Well-Known Member
Again, I'm not commenting about what an affordable entry price point is or should be and what that should include. I simply know what I'm willing to pay and what I'm looking for. I'm glad there are a ton of options
If you frequent guitar forums you'll find that the exact same conversations take place, the same outrage from "shrewd consumers" and the same criticism of anyone who's making "more money than they deserve to make" by people who've never actually made anything.
Probably true for any hobby forum, regardless of topic.
Only the nomenclature is different.

I’m not sure if you’re even reading.
I appreciate your concern for my literacy, thanks.
I already said I don't know about the new product. I was talking about the Hot Rod coments, which should be apparent if you....read:

But when the hot rod comes up the same gang of people chime in with...
 
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madhockeydad

Art is beauty
Le sigh. I’m not sure if you’re even reading.

a comment was made that claimed the Reddit posters were calling the entire project and device “overpriced”. Do you disagree?

when I went to said comment thread all I saw were a few people balking at the concept that a “$120” head only option should be called “affordable” in the market context, given several options exist for a fraction of the all in cost when coil, PID and thermals are considered. Did you go to that thread? Did you read the comments and come away with a different take on the comments?

Hey Timps27 - sorry I'm way off that topic. My bad. I'm talking about something totally different. I don't really have any data to respond to the actual question you asked!! Digression exception requested please.

New Acronym: DER: digression exception request.
 
madhockeydad,
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Some of the "it's overpriced" reddit comments crack me up.
It is as if some people are genuinely pissed that the guy makes a profit from selling something he designed, and that it is his obligation to provide the thing at cost.
Yeah not getting the whole it's overpriced part, but I must admit it is interesting some of the points of what was said. The whole terp torch selling out then pulling production, hot rod selling out then pulling production, I can see what the guy is saying about artifical scarcity although I don't believe that's the case. Although I do agree if the banking/payment processing is the actual issue, I don't see how dropping one product to start another is going to change anything surely the exact same thing will happen? Either way, really hope Brian does revisit the Hot rod as I missed the initial drop and would love to grab one.
 

monochord71

Well-Known Member
Yeah not getting the whole it's overpriced part, but I must admit it is interesting some of the points of what was said. The whole terp torch selling out then pulling production, hot rod selling out then pulling production, I can see what the guy is saying about artifical scarcity although I don't believe that's the case.
If the message was "hey guys I found fifty unopened terp torches, selling 'em for ( new inflation-adjusted COVID era supply chain price) of $350, make sure you order right now due to the humongous demand" then the "artificial scarcity" thing would make sense.
Seems kinda obvious he needs to actually make them to benefit from it.

Having said that, I'm still not sure what sets his "freight train" thing apart from other enail type devices.
I guess if it is entirely USA-made with quality materials it is worth paying a premium over chinese mystery metal.

Anyway,, the guy's making his own choices, for better or worse, it's his business how he wants to run his business.
Doesn't affect me.
I was hoping the next thing he made would be some old-timey telegraph lookin' contraption I'd want sitting on my desk, but I'm not going poop on him online if he decides otherwise, either.

The online peanut gallery is always a great source of amusement.
 
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