New member here, looking for DIY advice

[blokenoname]

@Squonk

Very nice and pragmatic setup there! Great work! Thank you
Also thank you for your kind words

So, looks like we built our respective units following very much the same principles there, apart from only minor differences.

I'm running at 12v here, while you're opting for 120v
My bulb is a Osram Halostar Starlight, 12v/10w, G4 two pin socket with 9mm OD, which allows for the leaner 11mm/10mm OD/ID stainless steel tubing for a heater cover and port. Heater cover is usually screwed into place, though I've just used another washer and an expanding clip-ring, to fasten it in this unit for faster access. Air intake is via two narrow slits situated at the sides near the base of the tube.
The off the shelf ceramic sockets I use are made for 12v and therefore also a bit leaner, than the 120v socket you're using there. It sits within a 20mm OD cork base, which is held by friction fit in a corresponding hole at the bottom of my heater well, its teflon insulated wiring then soldered to the 12V DC jack, fitting your typical 5,5mm/2,1mm barrel plug.

Here also some more detail pics:

Temp regulation goes either via a 12v equivalent of your rotary dimmer there or a small buck converter with a digital display, showing the applied voltage. Also no PID here. We judge the temps just by fatness of the clouds produced

 

[Squonk]

@Squonk

So, looks like we built our respective units following very much the same principles there, apart from only minor differences.

Temp regulation goes either via a 12v equivalent of your rotary dimmer there or a small buck converter with a digital display, showing the applied voltage. Also no PID here. We judge the temps just by fatness of the clouds produced

Yep. It's a fun hobby for sure. Do you intend to produce and sell your vaporizers?
At first I taught about it, but I changed my mind. I prefer to keep it as a hobby.

 

[blokenoname]

Yep. It's a fun hobby for sure. Do you intend to produce and sell your vaporizers?
At first I taught about it, but I changed my mind. I prefer to keep it as a hobby.

At least for the time being, I also prefer keeping it as a very satifactory hobby here
I'm already self employed and gladly forgo the investment, stress and hassle turning this into a business and setting up shop would entail. In my experience, that kills most of the fun too, which isn't worth it.

 

[TommyDee]

Sockets ordered

@blokenoname - What is the source for the stainless tube if you please?

@Squonk - Are you using the stainless mesh (0.5 x 10 x 50) to transfer heat from the bulb to the tube?

 

[blokenoname]

Sockets ordered

@blokenoname - What is the source for the stainless tube if you please?

@Squonk - Are you using the stainless mesh (0.5 x 10 x 50) to transfer heat from the bulb to the tube?

Small shop that sells only locally in Germany. Doesn't help you much.

You want thinwall (aka 'capillary') stainless steel tubing. You can get that in small quantities from shops, that sell stuff for building airplane model kits.

Here is another one from Germany, that also has a English language website/shop and sells internationally.
https://toni-clark-shop.com/Thinwall-Stainless-Steel-Tubing_1

Seems out of the 11mm*0,3mm at the moment, but the 10mm*0,3mm should already do, if you get a 9mm OD bulb, or otherwise the 12mm*0,3mm. You've to create your own roasting tubes then, of course, as Vapcaps and Arizer glass needs the 11mm*0,3mm.

 

[Squonk]

At least for the time being, I also prefer keeping it as a very satifactory hobby here
I'm already self employed and gladly forgo the investment, stress and hassle turning this into a business and setting up shop would entail. In my experience, that kills most of the fun too, which isn't worth it.

I totally agree with you. I don't need the stress either

@Squonk - Are you using the stainless mesh (0.5 x 10 x 50) to transfer heat from the bulb to the tube?

Yes I think the stainless mesh helps to transfer the heat from the bulb to the sleeve and vice versa.
The stainless mesh allows to minimize the gap between the bulb and the sleeve.

Imagine that the gap between the bulb and sleeve was much bigger and that there was no mesh screen.
While sipping or puffing, the fresh air would probably not get as hot.

I hope this make sense, but that's how I understand it.

 

[TommyDee]

Great info, thank you @blokenoname ... I should be able to find something locally if not a salvaged piece.

 

[blokenoname]

Yes I think the stainless mesh helps to transfer the heat from the bulb to the sleeve and vice versa.
The stainless mesh allows to minimize the gap between the bulb and the sleeve.

Imagine that the gap between the bulb and sleeve was much bigger and that there was no mesh screen.
While sipping or puffing, the fresh air would probably not get as hot.

Yes. I would go along with that explanation. What you're doing there is restricting airflow over the heater and creating turbulences, allowing the bulb to transfer more heat to a lesser volume of air passing over it and the turbulences help stripping the heat film away from the bulb and transfer it to the load, where you want it.

 

[TommyDee]

@Squonk - Genius! Basically, a heat radiator that provides surface area and air flow.

 

[Squonk]

Yes. I would go along with that explanation. What you're doing there is restricting airflow over the heater and creating turbulences, allowing the bulb to transfer more heat to a lesser volume of air passing over it and the turbulences help stripping the heat film away from the bulb and transfer it to the load, where you want it.

That's a great explanation ... thanks!

 

[TommyDee]

Looking through available 12V halogen bulbs I found there are 35W versions that looks to be what the 20W form-factor is. I'll have to go do some shopping but if true, that does provide potentially higher outputs without enlarging the tube. Edit: 35W bulb ordered.

Question; Considering I am targeting herb, how far away from the bulb do you typically place your stash?

 

[blokenoname]

The 20w has about 2 times the heat output needed already! 35w is overkill.
My heater covers are 4,5cm long. Bulb is about 2 to 2,5cm long subtracting the pins. Heater port is about 1cm. So the debris screen inside the tube located right below the heater port (where the crimp is) is about 1cm away from the bulb.

 

[TommyDee]

Sweet, thanks! Maybe I'm off here but wouldn't 20W into a 35 watt bulb still produce the same heat? Or am I throwing away power somehow? Basically I will be putting less voltage to get to 20W. It may even get me down to the 7.4V range for a dual 18650 Li-Ion solution. I'm not an EE but somehow these thoughts seem right.

 

[blokenoname]

Desktop devices and battery powered portables have different needs.
Desktop devices are made for running hours on end, some even for running 24/7, like Log vapes. That's why heat up times are secondary there.
Portables are made for instant heat up, short use cycles and rapid cool down.


With a desktop device using only rudimentary temp control via a dimmer or simple buck converter, like Log Vapes, you want the vaping point as close to max power output as possible, to prevent the user from accidentally combusting and also from overheating the body, soldered connections and so on, if, for instance the vape runs accidentally for hours on end with more power, than is needed. User may end up, burning down the house! Not good
Due to the function of potentiometers, it's also very difficult to adjust temps in the lower output range, as most of the voltage change happens within the first 1/2 of the scale (about 1v to 9v), so that minimal miss-adjustment of the dial there may translate into changes of a whole volt or more already, while the voltage change within the second 1/2 of the scale (say 10v to 12v) is only fractional, so that it is easier to dial in a preferred voltage/temperature there. In short: with a rotary style dimmer without digital voltage output display, it's easier to pinpoint 10,5v on the dial, than say 7,5V or 4V.

With a battery powered portable you want a more powerful heater anyway, to make it as instant as possible, to compensate for the initial heat loss to the colder body of the vape via conduction. You also want a heater with only minimal mass, to optimize Its own heat up and cooling down time. You also need to take into account, that most box mods can only deal with resistances up to 3,5ohm, sometimes 4,0ohm. The 35w bulb, is still above that! 50w bulb is a good starting point for a portable Halo project there, I'd say.
@Abysmal Vapor can give you more info there, as he's working on such a project.

 

[brainiac]

@Squonk - thanks for the technical info. It's generous of you to share.
I'd be interested to know if you made the heater cover parts yourself or did you manage to find them off the shelf? And how did you build the body of the log?

@blokenoname - a detailed and informative response

 

[TommyDee]

Understood, @blokenoname . Yes, I am after portable. Understood about the power too. Just getting into Arduino programming where I can see making an intelligent supply voltage and even ramp profiles. I am also considering a thermister for a temp read-back (simple miniature glass bulb on 2 wires). These implementations are way beyond my initial interest but I do have them in mind for a separate pocket power pack.

So 35W doesn't sound like a bad start. Thermal mass; understood. I do want to stay within your 10mm ID and 11mm OD recommendation. Current limiting supply voltage is also not an issue since I do have a fairly comprehensive Li-Ion and power supply design background. This part of the project is a simple study of creating a viable heat source and maximizing packaging of said source. And of course, not killing myself in the process.

I do thank you for your expansive explanations.

 

[blokenoname]

Great

Also dug up @Abysmal Vapor 's 'Halo Mesh' thread from the DIY section for you, where we both and some others played with the halo portable concept last year:

http://fuckcombustion.com/threads/510-halo-mesh.33528/

 

[Squonk]

I really like this simple concept. Did you say you are running unregulated?

Please see post #31

@Squonk - thanks for the technical info. It's generous of you to share.
I'd be interested to know if you made the heater cover parts yourself or did you manage to find them off the shelf? And how did you build the body of the log?

@blokenoname - a detailed and informative response

Sure, here are the details:
I used a mini metal lathe to machine the heater cover and washer out of aluminum. The bottom of the sleeve is press fit with the washer (1/4" thick ) and the heater cover is loosely fit at the top of the sleeve). The heater cover is machined for an easy fit while I use the cooling stem. (cooling stem ID: 11mm OD: 16mm).

The body of the log was made by using a 3/4" pine planck. I used 2 hole saw and a press drill to make 6 rough dougnout shape with OD: 2 1/2" and ID: 1 3/4". Then I stack them and use carpenters glue and let dry. I used my metal lathe to bring the final touch and turn it so that the final OD: 58mm and ID: 45mm.
I used 1/4" forstner bit for the holes around the body.

 

[TommyDee]

Aha.. went back to #19 and saw the rheostat. @Squonk , how do you use this particular setup? Sorry, I know this is a very novice question but I still have a lot of vagueness on how herb can be placed in the heat path on these setups. I see a big glass 'bowl (?)' on your tray there. Can you take the explanation to the next step please?

 

[Squonk]

Aha.. went back to #19 and saw the rheostat. @Squonk , how do you use this particular setup? Sorry, I know this is a very novice question but I still have a lot of vagueness on how herb can be placed in the heat path on these setups. I see a big glass 'bowl (?)' on your tray there. Can you take the explanation to the next step please?

The cooling stem is equipped with a concave ss screen installed near the tip of the stem. I just put cannabis inside the screen and tamp it just a little bit so that it doesn'nt fall. Then I simply put the loaded stem on top of the heater cover. You can use this setup with one hand. You just hold the log and the stem stays on top. You inhale and voila ... psychedelic effects.

 

[blokenoname]

Aha.. went back to #19 and saw the rheostat. @Squonk , how do you use this particular setup? Sorry, I know this is a very novice question but I still have a lot of vagueness on how herb can be placed in the heat path on these setups. I see a big glass 'bowl (?)' on your tray there. Can you take the explanation to the next step please?

Ah... you mean 'how to use!?'

Easy:

 

[TommyDee]

Now I get it... and cooling beads ... and that must be a red o-ring-held mouthpiece I'm looking at to finish things off.

Thanks for completing the chain Effects, ...I mean understanding is setting in now!


@blokenoname Ha! Snortin' Herb into the draw tube! What's next

So let me ask the next obvious challenge for a newbie designer... what minimizes accidental combustion?

 

[blokenoname]

 

[TommyDee]

Consumption is pretty straight forward for me. Almost too natural!

 

[blokenoname]

Janü... easy does it!

Edit:
"What minimizes accidental combustion?"
For the general Log Vape type setup, foremost the choice of a heater, that doesn't get much hotter, than is absolutely needed, to get good dense and satisfying vapor at a defined max. voltage input! A bit surplus as a reserve is ok to prevent heat fatigue at heavy back to back use, but too much beats the purpose here.
Then the use of a simple rotary dial type dimmer or a VVPS/buck converter, to let you dial down from that defined max. voltage/temp, in case you prefer a bit lower temps.
Simple, but effective.

These type of vaporizers are kind of 'old school', regarding temp control. Original patent goes back into the late 70's