Life Saber (LSV) by Elev8 Vehicles

[stinkmeaner]

Of course you are responsible for what your online distributors say, you are the manufacturer.
I mean come on man, you don't have that many to keep track of, your not a company like Sony which has thousands of products and thousands of online distributors. There are only a handful of major online distributors and you only distribute 2 products & their accessories, I think it is possible to proof read what goes on their site to make sure it is correct.

 

[lwien]

However, I can't stand behind anything that some other website says. I could show you TONS of websites that have wrong information about our products. Why do you attack us for others mistakes?

Ok, I was going to stay out of this, but now I have to step in, only because of my retail and wholesale marketing background.

Chirs, I am going to assume that the sites that Stink posted up are authorized dealers, am I correct ? And if, in fact, you have authorized them to sell your product, than you are also responsible for how they represent your company and how they expose your product in the marketplace. If one of your representative dealers are misrepresenting your product, than it IS your responsibility to correct them.

If it true what you said, that you could show us TONS of websites that have wrong information about your products, then..............shame on you for your lack of marketing control for it is that lack of control that will come back to haunt you every damn time.

If you don't correct them, than you have in fact, given them your blessings to say whatever in the hell they want to say about your vapes, and apparently, by your own admission, that is exactly what is happening.

So..........in answer to your question of "Why do you attack us for others mistakes?", the fact of the matter is, you can't separate you and them. They are YOUR representatives and as such, it makes no difference if inaccurate statements about your product was generated on your site, or on theirs.

 

[stinkmeaner]

Thanks lwien, you explained it perfectly. One thing I will add, since the the 7th Floor DBV sites stated the DBV's were made in the USA, chances are the distributors were just going by what was said on the websites.

 

[Vapetologist]

Chirs, I am going to assume that the sites that Stink posted up are authorized dealers, am I correct ?

Not always. We can't stop(but are trying) unauthorized resellers. There are so many, its astounding. Not my department, but I will find out about those three. We have spent great effort trying to get just this kind of thing cleaned up. Not everyone makes corrections as fast as I do.

One thing I will add, since the the 7th Floor DBV sites stated the DBV's were made in the USA, chances are the distributors were just going by what was said on the websites.

This could be correct, if all those websites were built in the last four weeks.

Stinkmeaner....Made in the USA? Just going to ignore that post? But again, we are severely off topic...don't want to violate the rules.

 

[finch]

holy shit this thread...

do you old timers also spend your weekday mornings endlessly arguing with the Mcdonald's barista?



Oh yeah LSV looks pretty cool Chris, hopefully we won't have 213 pages of "made in China" queries

 

[Pappy]

holy shit this thread...
do you old timers also spend your weekday mornings endlessly arguing with the Mcdonald's barista?

 

[stinkmeaner]

Chirs, I am going to assume that the sites that Stink posted up are authorized dealers, am I correct ?

Not always. We can't stop(but are trying) unauthorized resellers. There are so many, its astounding. Not my department, but I will find out about those three. We have spent great effort trying to get just this kind of thing cleaned up. Not everyone makes corrections as fast as I do.

One thing I will add, since the the 7th Floor DBV sites stated the DBV's were made in the USA, chances are the distributors were just going by what was said on the websites.

This could be correct, if all those websites were built in the last four weeks.

Stinkmeaner....Made in the USA? Just going to ignore that post? But again, we are severely off topic...don't want to violate the rules.

The old sites had the same wrong information, this is no new revelation or something, we have been discussing this for a while now before the websites were changed.

You guys just don't say that these products are made in America, you practically celebrate it, making it an obvious selling point.

Here is a quote from the DBV website where you clearly take a cheap shot on imported vaporizers when your vaporizer is imported:
Be aware of imported vaporizers, they are most likely knock-offs of a good American brand, using the poorest quality materials and may use toxic glues to hold the parts together.
Then you talk about the toxins in other vaporizers, do you have tests to confirm this? OR even a test to confirm your products are safe?

Then you write some sob story on the SSV website, stating how you can't source components in the USA and how you try to keep it as American made as you can.
I have news for you, most things can still be sourced here if you look hard enough, like your dimmers and the metal tubing that you get from China, so why the sob story about not being able?
Are you saying a machine shop in the USA can't cut angled pieces of aluminum tubing for all three products: LSV, SSV, DBV?

My point is this: If they are not made in America, then why go into great detail about USA manufacturing and mention nothing about CHINA. Why mention anything at all, especially the LSV & DBV since they are made in CHINA. I don't see other companies going into great detail about manufacturing in USA, Zephyr seems to be doing okay and they have been upfront from the get go about being made in CHINA, honesty goes a long way.

I have said my peace and I will let this thread get back on track, the people know the truth if they care to look.

 

[NoSmoke]

Very well written!

 

[Vapetologist]

The old sites had the same wrong information, this is no new revelation or something, we have been discussing this for a while now before the websites were changed.

I can only speak for the sites and content I have managed, which are the three new sites for our products. If the information was wrong in the past, I can't change that, nor control it. I can only move forward.

You guys just don't say that these products are made in America, you practically celebrate it, making it an obvious selling point.

We celebrate the hell out of it, because we are damn proud of it. But only on the SSV site. If we could make it all here at the same price points, we would.

Here is a quote from the DBV website where you clearly take a cheap shot on imported vaporizers when your vaporizer is imported:
Be aware of imported vaporizers, they are most likely knock-offs of a good American brand, using the poorest quality materials and may use toxic glues to hold the parts together.

Yes...DBV is imported. But again, yes everyone should be *aware*. Because such a high percentage of all vapes are imported...and use plastics, glues, et. al., its not a cheap shot. Its the truth. If your at a store, and faced with two imported vapes, one that uses top quality materials, and one that doesn't...yes Stinkmeaner, we want the customer to be aware of that. An educated customer can make the best decision.

Then you talk about the toxins in other vaporizers, do you have tests to confirm this? OR even a test to confirm your products are safe?

This is a key feature to our vapes. Many vaporizers mix the air with the electronics internally, and if glues are used, which are often toxic "when consumed"(to be fair)...the air passes over this before and/or after it is heated. Our vapes isolate the air from everything but the ceramic heater and glass. We feel it to be the freshest possible air. Obviously the glues that are toxic 'when consumed' are being not consumed here...not in the traditional way, anyway. But when faced with potentially toxic materials vs non-toxic, we didn't really ponder any testing. The choice was clear. Our customers health, the main concern. Taste, obviously a HUGE second factor.

Tests that our products are safe? We are in this business to offer a safer, healthier alternative to smoking. Am I missing something here?

Then you write some sob story on the SSV website, stating how you can't source components in the USA and how you try to keep it as American made as you can.

Hey stinky, lets keep it civil, huh? We are people...in Colorado(and China!) There is no reason to be insulting. We do try to keep as much of it here as we can. Man, I can't express that enough.

Ultimately our owner has created 28 direct jobs in this country(and untold indirect), and I believe up to 12 jobs outside the country. This will continue to grow, but the plan for growth is mostly here. This is real opportunity for alot of people, when viewed from a US-Centric yet global perspective, which we do. This is something that he takes great pride in, and rightly so!

 

[lwien]

holy shit this thread...

do you old timers also spend your weekday mornings endlessly arguing with the Mcdonald's barista?

Why just limit it to weekday mornings ?

 

[notmyrealUSERname]

i assume that 7th Floor are in compliance with the governments requirements (laws) for a product to be labeled "Made in USA" - http://business.ftc.gov/documents/bus03-complying-made-usa-standard


so.....

wheres the product review already?

 

[stinkmeaner]

Here is a quote from the DBV website where you clearly take a cheap shot on imported vaporizers when your vaporizer is imported:
Be aware of imported vaporizers, they are most likely knock-offs of a good American brand, using the poorest quality materials and may use toxic glues to hold the parts together.

Yes...DBV is imported. But again, yes everyone should be *aware*. Because such a high percentage of all vapes are imported...and use plastics, glues, et. al., its not a cheap shot. Its the truth. If your at a store, and faced with two imported vapes, one that uses top quality materials, and one that doesn't...yes Stinkmeaner, we want the customer to be aware of that. An educated customer can make the best decision.

You directly said be aware of imported vaporizers while emphasizing that the DBV was made in USA when it is made in CHINA, again false advertising. It just seems that you and Vapor Brothers both scare people into buying your vaporizers with the idea that other vaporizers are not safe.

It would be different if you were just a member on here, one of the boys so to speak. Say we were all discussing the safety of vaporizers, I have done this many times and have pointed out vaporizers which have poorly thought out air paths (Like the Extremes with exposed PCB)
But, as a manufacturer it really is not right to post which vaporizers to stay away from without proper proof that imported vaporizers are not safe, just because they are knock offs doesn't mean they are not safe, they could be just as safe as any other. Comments like that seem like scare tactics.

Then you talk about the toxins in other vaporizers, do you have tests to confirm this? OR even a test to confirm your products are safe?

This is a key feature to our vapes. Many vaporizers mix the air with the electronics internally, and if glues are used, which are often toxic "when consumed"(to be fair)...the air passes over this before and/or after it is heated. Our vapes isolate the air from everything but the ceramic heater and glass. We feel it to be the freshest possible air. Obviously the glues that are toxic 'when consumed' are being not consumed here...not in the traditional way, anyway. But when faced with potentially toxic materials vs non-toxic, we didn't really ponder any testing. The choice was clear. Our customers health, the main concern. Taste, obviously a HUGE second factor.

Tests that our products are safe? We are in this business to offer a safer, healthier alternative to smoking. Am I missing something here?

The Tests I am referring to a lab test like Storz & Bickel did with the Leiden University on the safety and health of their product. Again, if your products are not tested then you, me, or anyone else is really in no place to decide what is safe and to slander imported vaporizers as a whole because people get this stigma that some vapes are toxic when there are no such tests that exist.
Unless you are qualified then you are not really in a position to determine if any imported vaporizer is less safe than yours.

I will point out however that your products have more than ceramic & glass in the air path. There is also a metal shim and metal around the base of the element, and the paint/powdercoat at the base of the airway. Hardly medical grade construction. You could easily make it all glass by making a double sleeve heater cover.

Hey stinky, lets keep it civil, huh? We are people...in Colorado(and China!) There is no reason to be insulting. We do try to keep as much of it here as we can. Man, I can't express that enough.

Ultimately our owner has created 28 direct jobs in this country(and untold indirect), and I believe up to 12 jobs outside the country. This will continue to grow, but the plan for growth is mostly here. This is real opportunity for alot of people, when viewed from a US-Centric yet global perspective, which we do. This is something that he takes great pride in, and rightly so!

I didn't insult you, I am commenting on a statement on your website that incites the reader to feel pity up the manufacturer, quit trying to blow things out of proportion, I just said sob story as in sad story. When you write a statement like this: The SSV is not 100% made in the USA. Unfortunately, due to the way electronics are made today it is just not possible to find all parts here in the USA anymore
"Just not possible", it makes people think that it is impossible, what else are they supposed to think. It alludes people that you would purchase everything domestically if you could which is not the case since an American made dimmer can easily be bought here, you cant say things like

Well we are already clear that the SSV is the ONLY 7th Floor vaporizer to have any significant manufacturing step in America, and even the SSV has all the metal cutting/machining done overseas. Huh.

 

[Vapetologist]

all the metal cutting/machining done overseas. Huh.

Again, completely, 100% untrue. Just because you create the idea in your mind, does not make it true.

I am willing to continue this conversation with you, but you continually use made up *facts* as the basis for your arguments. That makes an intelligent two-way argument is impossible.

 

[elmomuzz]

You know where the iphone and most every other cool gadget is made? Yea that's right. China. Not everything they make is junk.

 

[stinkmeaner]

i assume that 7th Floor are in compliance with the governments requirements (laws) for a product to be labeled "Made in USA" - http://business.ftc.gov/documents/bus03-complying-made-usa-standard


so.....

wheres the product review already?

Excellent site notmyrealUSERname, here is a quote form the website on complying to "Made in USA" law:

What factors does the Commission consider to determine whether a product is "all or virtually all" made in the U.S.?


Example: A company produces propane barbecue grills at a plant in Nevada. The product's major components include the gas valve, burner and aluminum housing, each of which is made in the U.S. The grill's knobs and tubing are imported from Mexico. An unqualified Made in USA claim is not likely to be deceptive because the knobs and tubing make up a negligible portion of the product's total manufacturing costs and are insignificant parts of the final product.
*They consider he Knobs & Tubing on this grill to be insignificant and they are allowed a "Made in USA" claim, this is just the opposite of the Silver Surfer & Da Buddha where all parts except the "glass knobs & wands are made here, So according to this, the product would denied "Made in USA"

Example: A table lamp is assembled in the U.S. from American-made brass, an American-made Tiffany-style lampshade, and an imported base. The base accounts for a small percent of the total cost of making the lamp. An unqualified Made in USA claim is deceptive for two reasons: The base is not far enough removed in the manufacturing process from the finished product to be of little consequence and it is a significant part of the final product.
*The example lamp is assembled in the US from American made brass on an imported base and can not be labeled "Made in USA"
*The SSV uses foreign Metal housing, Base, dimmer, electronics, and the only thing done in the USA is painting & assembly. If the lamp can not claim "Made in US" then surely 7th Floor can not claim "Made in USA" since all metal and machining takes place in China, along with the components

Assembled in USA Claims

A product that includes foreign components may be called "Assembled in USA" without qualification when its principal assembly takes place in the U.S. and the assembly is substantial. For the "assembly" claim to be valid, the product's last "substantial transformation" also should have occurred in the U.S. That's why a "screwdriver" assembly in the U.S. of foreign components into a final product at the end of the manufacturing process doesn't usually qualify for the "Assembled in USA" claim.

Example: All the major components of a computer, including the motherboard and hard drive, are imported. The computer's components then are put together in a simple "screwdriver" operation in the U.S., are not substantially transformed under the Customs Standard, and must be marked with a foreign country of origin. An "Assembled in U.S." claim without further qualification is deceptive.

Since the DBV final assembly requires no more than a screwdriver, it does not seem eligible for the assembled in US claim.

 

[AGBeer]

I dont want to be an out of left field dickweed here, but this thread has gotten derailed pretty far off topic if you ask me. (But you didnt so here I give it to you anyway)

I initially thought this was a Q&A for the LSV. Not an integrity and where is your shit made and why is it so expensive thread. I believe we have a 7th Floor Q&A thread that this discussion would be much better suited so that people can further discuss what this thread is supposed to be about - THE LSV.

Am I wrong here?

 

[stinkmeaner]

I dont want to be an out of left field dickweed here, but this thread has gotten derailed pretty far off topic if you ask me. (But you didnt so here I give it to you anyway)

I initially thought this was a Q&A for the LSV. Not an integrity and where is your shit made and why is it so expensive thread. I believe we have a 7th Floor Q&A thread that this discussion would be much better suited so that people can further discuss what this thread is supposed to be about - THE LSV.

Am I wrong here?

Agreed, I should have finished when I was ahead but I felt like every fact I would present was finished with an excuse, like he had to get the last word even when wrong. I did get carried away though and I apologize to all members and parties involved, should make for some interesting reading down the road though.

With the last post though, with the .Gov website that notmysuername graciously provided, it has been proven once again that none of the 7th floor products qualify for the title of Made in U.S. That is not to speak for their durability because they have all proven themselves over the years, and at the moment for the price their products are probably the best buy for the money for a whip based vaporizer. Putting pricing issues aside, I am sure the LSV will prove to be a good product as well.

 

[Vapetologist]

one more question for you though... does 7th Floor really have the vinyl tubing your selling made especially just for you?

I checked and indeed, the tubing is made especially for us, we requested softer food grade tubing than was currently available, so our supplier made a new formulation for us.

 

[smokeberry]

Regardless of where it is built my three year old SSV feels as solid as tank and is easily one of the better vapes I have had the pleasure of using. It's been dropped on numerous occasions on to a tiled floor and, apart from a wonkey dial, it's never missed a trick.
I enjoy seeing new products from 7th floor because they produce goods with excellent build quality that are designed to last and in that respect the LSV looks to continue the trend.

Thanks for giving us that little bit more choice 7th floor and congratulations on an excellent looking vape!

 

[Vapetologist]

Thanks for giving us that little bit more choice 7th floor

Thank you! Your experience with your SSV is exactly what we strive for.

 

[DeepFried]

You know where the iphone and most every other cool gadget is made? Yea that's right. China. Not everything they make is junk.

Yeah about that iphone, bad example for quality made in China. I hope the LSV works better than an iphone4

http://www.cultofmac.com/pr-experts-iphone-4-hardware-recall-is-inevitable/50565

http://news.cnet.com/8301-31322_3-20010352-256.html

http://www.appleinsider.com/article...t_voluntary_recall_full_refunds_possible.html

 

[lwien]

^^ The issue with the iPhone's antenna has nothing to do with the manufacturing but everything to do with the designing and engineering.

On the other hand, the LSV doesn't use an antenna, so it should work great.

 

[elmomuzz]

Actually that is a design flaw. Iphone is designed in the United States. There has been no problem with the manufacturing. It works as designed.

 

[Troi]

Hi SSV Chris, and all SSV Members.

FC members read:
It looks like everyone on FC is waiting for someone to actually order this product and give it a real review. I just ordered the product, so stay tunned for a review.

For SSVChris

I just purchased the SSV Vaporizor + 19 mm Water attachment, I also want to mention I've purchased both your DBV and SSV. I used the fuckcombustion discount, if you can expedite my order that would be great, I'm sure theres a lot of people ready to buy this thing just waiting for some real review, pictures.

I'll be honest, your website is lacking in providing me a clear understanding of how the glass enclosure, or glass connection works. I will be taking a lot of pictures and providing the information FC members need to make a decision on purchasing. My order # is #L100023

Keep everyone tuned.

 

[Beezleb]

Look forward to it Troi and happy testing