is my weed magic?
- Thread starter Green Kiwi
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KeroZen
Chronic vapaholic
If I may chime in, it's a recurrent problem I've experienced on this forum: we think we talk about the same thing, using similar words but apparently not.
Whatever the vaporizer I use, when I talk with other users in their respective threads, for a given reported amount of material, say 0.1g or 0.05g (100mg / 50mg) some users will say they only get 3-4 hits, while I consistently get on average 30 hits.
It's tempting to think it's a difference in the material, but even if I always got primo buds, they can't be that different from say other users residing close to sunny Mendocino or other places on the west coast having a long breeding history and top notch strains.
My conclusion is that it's mostly a cultural thing: North Americans vape like if they were hitting bongs. If they don't hit bongs they hit other glass pipes, and since they don't mix with tobacco, they have to hit them big and fast otherwise the damn thing keeps lighting off and it's a PITA (I imported some Cali "hippie glassware" to test back then in the past and it's not my cup of tea at all!) And well, even when they smoke spliffs, they do it in a most peculiar way. So I'm under the impression that they try to translate that kind of experience when they switch to vaping.
Also there's so much difference between what users call "done". Many will stop at the slightest decrease in taste or when it feels not "fresh" anymore and dump the stuff. Some will stop when taste is fully gone... but we all know there's plenty left in that popcorny/ABV'ish region afterwards, you can sometimes get as many hits after the taste is gone that what you got to get there.
In Europe most cultures mix their weed with tobacco and smoke spliffs more like cigarettes. The average spliff lasts 15 minutes unless you are in a hurry. Tobacco keeps it alight and you don't have to use your lighter every 30 seconds. Going big and fast is often something youngsters do but it's not that widespread. Using glassware often has a bad cultural connotation and is associated to hard drugs use, like crack, etc.
So in the end, my current theory is that it all boils down to what kind of past smoking experience we try to replicate when we vape. Whatever floats your boat, as long as you are satisfied with the results, it doesn't matter if it's wasteful or not (who cares when you live in a legal state if your ABV is still potent or not?) as long as it keeps us all away from nasty combustion, the mission is accomplished.
Whatever the vaporizer I use, when I talk with other users in their respective threads, for a given reported amount of material, say 0.1g or 0.05g (100mg / 50mg) some users will say they only get 3-4 hits, while I consistently get on average 30 hits.
It's tempting to think it's a difference in the material, but even if I always got primo buds, they can't be that different from say other users residing close to sunny Mendocino or other places on the west coast having a long breeding history and top notch strains.
My conclusion is that it's mostly a cultural thing: North Americans vape like if they were hitting bongs. If they don't hit bongs they hit other glass pipes, and since they don't mix with tobacco, they have to hit them big and fast otherwise the damn thing keeps lighting off and it's a PITA (I imported some Cali "hippie glassware" to test back then in the past and it's not my cup of tea at all!) And well, even when they smoke spliffs, they do it in a most peculiar way. So I'm under the impression that they try to translate that kind of experience when they switch to vaping.
Also there's so much difference between what users call "done". Many will stop at the slightest decrease in taste or when it feels not "fresh" anymore and dump the stuff. Some will stop when taste is fully gone... but we all know there's plenty left in that popcorny/ABV'ish region afterwards, you can sometimes get as many hits after the taste is gone that what you got to get there.
In Europe most cultures mix their weed with tobacco and smoke spliffs more like cigarettes. The average spliff lasts 15 minutes unless you are in a hurry. Tobacco keeps it alight and you don't have to use your lighter every 30 seconds. Going big and fast is often something youngsters do but it's not that widespread. Using glassware often has a bad cultural connotation and is associated to hard drugs use, like crack, etc.
So in the end, my current theory is that it all boils down to what kind of past smoking experience we try to replicate when we vape. Whatever floats your boat, as long as you are satisfied with the results, it doesn't matter if it's wasteful or not (who cares when you live in a legal state if your ABV is still potent or not?) as long as it keeps us all away from nasty combustion, the mission is accomplished.
check out the work by Dr. Dedi Mieri PhD who heads cannabinoid research for cancer at the Technion (Israel's MIT) - when using "clones" the cannabinoid profiles of the same plant would vary considerably when tested. He also found that just growing in different greenhouses would result in completely different profiles. The same cutting that worked for Patient X's seizures, from greenhouse 1 might work great, yet the same "clones" from greenhouse 2 would be completely ineffective.
It's called the photocopy effect - you copy something so many times that the image will lose details, until it eventually become illegible.
It's called the photocopy effect - you copy something so many times that the image will lose details, until it eventually become illegible.
arb
Semi shaved ape
Neither one of these are the issue.
Not sure what caused it or if there even was one 10 years on the same plant you are going to become "immune" to said plants psychotropic properties.
Could also have been a virus or insect..
The only difference between two cuts is growing conditions.
Genetic drift gets talked about a lot but has never been proven in cannabis.
My personal experience leads me to think that unless diseased cuts stay the same for decades.
Looking at the vast majority of commercial cultivars propagated by cuts you don't see genetic drift being a issue of cuts over time but rather pollen from outside cultivars being introduced accidentally into seed stocks........my understanding anyways.
Doesnt vapor bonging come from the Netherlands though?
Funny you say that, for the most part I've been puffing the same plants for around 10 years myself, over the last few years I've started really questioning the stability of cloned genetics since it seems like they all fell off to me. But I'm the only one vaping them, everyone else smokes them, and I've never heard anyone else complain - and they've all been smoking these same genetics as long or longer than I've been vaping them. Sometimes I think vaping truly is more efficient, which could ultimately lead to less effectiveness in the long term from a resistant tolerance.
My problem is it's not limited to plants I steam up regularly, I find that nearly anything on a dispensary shelf will lose its luster by about the third session. It's honestly usually just one good zap off a fresh cultivar.
Cheebsy
Microbe minion
How can pollen affect a cutting though?Looking at the vast majority of commercial cultivars propagated by cuts you don't see genetic drift being a issue of cuts over time but rather pollen from outside cultivars being introduced accidentally into seed stocks........my understanding anyways.
Absolutely, if you're cultivating seeds for the following crops, or seeds socks, infiltrated pollen can definitely be an issue, but then so can generic drift (less likely if using the same mother and father plants from clones).
You have way more years experience than me though so I'm probably missing a crucial step in the thought process lol.
arb
Semi shaved ape
Doesnt vapor bonging come from the Netherlands though?
Funny you say that, for the most part I've been puffing the same plants for around 10 years myself, over the last few years I've started really questioning the stability of cloned genetics since it seems like they all fell off to me. But I'm the only one vaping them, everyone else smokes them, and I've never heard anyone else complain - and they've all been smoking these same genetics as long or longer than I've been vaping them. Sometimes I think vaping truly is more efficient, which could ultimately lead to less effectiveness in the long term from a resistant tolerance.
My problem is it's not limited to plants I steam up regularly, I find that nearly anything on a dispensary shelf will lose its luster by about the third session. It's honestly usually just one good zap off a fresh
I said genetic drift is only a issue in commercial cultivation when it applies to seed stock and outside pollen tainting the resulting seeds or was trying to.
MegaMan2k
Well-Known Member
If you have kept the same mother for many generations there is also the chance that it has some build up pathogens or viruses over the years which also can prevent it from reaching its full potential. If its some strain you made ur self and you really love maybe sentimental value you could send it in to someone who does tissue culture and have them "scrub it" i think thats what they call it. should return it to its former glory.
Yeah virus or stress is a likely culprit, there have been some tough times over the years. and the girls have had to survive through a lot.
I would have said I was sentimental before, she has served me well for so many years, but now that i have tried the 2 new varieties I've been growing, I'm ok with letting her go. Having said that, my last cuttings of her are ready to come out to flower now. I should just dump them but I can't do it. I'll let them finish their lives flowering happily for old times sake.
Cheesequake
Free Men Don't Ask
You're probably just taking significantly smaller hits than those people are. The amount of vapor most average users inhale for a good hit could be equal to about 1/4 or 1/5 (possibly even less) of what someone who has a high tolerance and good lungs will inhale.Now ,reading about what who is vaping and how,I'm Starting to Wonder?
To vape, I use exclusively the mighty, about 10 bowls trough a bong and about 2 bowls dry a day on average.
everybody has his or her favourite device, mine happens to be the Mighty.
My head scratch, is this: I read about people having 12 or 14 or so puffs on a bowl,and then it get's
.
or there is no tasty vapour left.
I grow outside in the bush only for self-support ,I don't use any fertiliser, or root blast hormons or anything.
the amount I pull off one plant is laughable, say 20 grams dry.
I start on 180 and end on 190 Celsius.
Now I get around 60 puffs on a bowl, and they all are tasty and cloud the room up....after that it keeps producing vapour but it get's dry and taste slowley disappears.soo I dump it.( I love my potent a.v.b. by the way)
I file around 0.15 grams a time in the bowl.
is my weed exceptional, or are people dumping good weed?
one thing I notice , when I'm in holland my bowls only last 12 good puffs max.
is it our harsh ozonhole or is it just my?
I do admit that I in general think, other weed is not that good\powerful\tasty.
Witch is why I grow my own in the bush.
curious for replies. aroha Green Kiwi.
For example, I can COMPLETELY clear a Grasshopper bowl in one long hit while someone else could take 15.
Green Kiwi
Well-Known Member
No, to be honest I get quite often the comment: holy Shit That was a huge pull!
I do believe actually the opposite, I take massive hits.
I honestly believe, what I said before: Ozonhole straight above us(massive radiation from U.V. and gamma radiation)volcanic soil and no fertilisers, is what creates this exceptional weed.
When vaping the inside stuff, it never last as long, just down here.
by the way before people from Ausie,or Tasmania think yeah but we don't experience that right here...:you are right you don't, have a look were the Ozonhole is in the last 3 years, you guys over there in Aus. are a lot safer than you where in the past and we(NZ) got actually worse...
.To give you an example(and I am brown haired and tone up easy), I sat today for 17 minutes outside, in the sun ,having one beer, after that I thought I Feld the burn coming.......I am now red as an apple.......
.I think, or actually know nowwhere else is it like this..... and there is the resinous weed kicking in and coming to the party
.Just look into what makes a plant produce the and resin.
arb
Semi shaved ape
Box set that shit up then homie!No, to be honest I get quite often the comment: holy Shit That was a huge pull!
I do believe actually the opposite, I take massive hits.
I honestly believe, what I said before: Ozonhole straight above us(massive radiation from U.V. and gamma radiation)volcanic soil and no fertilisers, is what creates this exceptional weed.
When vaping the inside stuff, it never last as long, just down here.
by the way before people from Ausie,or Tasmania think yeah but we don't experience that right here...:you are right you don't, have a look were the Ozonhole is in the last 3 years, you guys over there in Aus. are a lot safer than you where in the past and we(NZ) got actually worse...
To give you an example(and I am brown haired and tone up easy), I sat today for 17 minutes outside, in the sun ,having one beer, after that I thought I Feld the burn coming.......I am now red as an apple.......
I think, or actually know nowwhere else is it like this..... and there is the resinous weed kicking in and coming to the party
Just look into what makes a plant produce the and resin.
So that is why I am going bald!
I have given people clones to grow outside since last century and it always looks and smell/tastes more earthy than my own that is hydro grown and therefore able to be flushed well with filtered Tassie rainwater to be left sitting in inert perlite instead of chook shit or whatever the growers secret recipe is that year.
JBone65
Well-Known Member
Fascinating subject. I'm consistently getting 11 satisfying hits per 0.19g chamber load in my grasshopper IO. I've been accused of microdosing but I'm hitting it hard and getting plenty of vapor. For several months, I've averaged 1 1/2 loads per day equal 16-17 hits per day equals 90 days per ounce. Staying fully buzzed for about $1.35/day, while making no effort to conserve.
There's probably no substitute for properly grown hydro sativa if starting with genetically proven seeds, but I currently use a store bought 24% thc sativa which works incredibly well. It usually costs $125-140/oz in a local shop.
The IO temp ranges from 220° to a whopping 430°F. With a strong sativa, I can get a somewhat unique "mostly terpenoid" hit on the lowest setting at 220°. The super low temp doesn't seem to excite THC so you end up stripping out terps. I finish with 3 hits at full blast. I admit there is a huge difference in taste between the first hit and the last, but all are rich and satisfying, even enjoyable. While not theoretically perfect hits, each hit is better than a combusted bong hit. You can always get less in number but more enjoyable hits, the trick is to match the vapor strength with your personal ability to absorb and enjoy, IMO. Advancing the temp 1/2 mark each hit seems to activate more THC with each increase, probably a steady progression up the scale of THC compounds. It quickly becomes apparent that the 11th hit is still excellent. I taste a noticable difference with the 12th, but I'll hit that if I don't feel like getting up. I usually hit it until it's gone.
Note that this probably wouldn't work with inferior weed or with most portable vaporizers. The chamber doesn't hold much, and not all are convection devices, etc.
I guess I'm lucky. My IO has never combusted. Have measured up to a 43% reduction in mass of loads before and after.
There's probably no substitute for properly grown hydro sativa if starting with genetically proven seeds, but I currently use a store bought 24% thc sativa which works incredibly well. It usually costs $125-140/oz in a local shop.
The IO temp ranges from 220° to a whopping 430°F. With a strong sativa, I can get a somewhat unique "mostly terpenoid" hit on the lowest setting at 220°. The super low temp doesn't seem to excite THC so you end up stripping out terps. I finish with 3 hits at full blast. I admit there is a huge difference in taste between the first hit and the last, but all are rich and satisfying, even enjoyable. While not theoretically perfect hits, each hit is better than a combusted bong hit. You can always get less in number but more enjoyable hits, the trick is to match the vapor strength with your personal ability to absorb and enjoy, IMO. Advancing the temp 1/2 mark each hit seems to activate more THC with each increase, probably a steady progression up the scale of THC compounds. It quickly becomes apparent that the 11th hit is still excellent. I taste a noticable difference with the 12th, but I'll hit that if I don't feel like getting up. I usually hit it until it's gone.
Note that this probably wouldn't work with inferior weed or with most portable vaporizers. The chamber doesn't hold much, and not all are convection devices, etc.
I guess I'm lucky. My IO has never combusted. Have measured up to a 43% reduction in mass of loads before and after.
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shredder
Well-Known Member
So that is why I am going bald!
I have given people clones to grow outside since last century and it always looks and smell/tastes more earthy than my own that is hydro grown and therefore able to be flushed well with filtered Tassie rainwater to be left sitting in inert perlite instead of chook shit or whatever the growers secret recipe is that year.
I always take more clones than I need, and then gift what I don't need to other growers.
The plants and the buds they grow can be vastly different from mine.
There are lots of reasons. The light available is big, the temperature, the soil or medium and the fertilizer all makes differences.
Of course I can be a bit obsessive. I go as far as fermenting my own fertilizers from things I grow for that purpose.
Not something practical on a large scale and too labor intensive for most, but my buds rock. Come on over Les, and I'll prove it, lol.
If you lived in Canada or New Zealand...maybe, can't say I would want to visit the US anymore, just too dangerous...and I have camped near crocodiles!
I am not knocking all outdoor grows that are done in soil/dirt/special blend, but most do not care or have a real clue. That will be me this year as I am going to grow 1x plant in soil from one of my raised veggie patches.
hinglemccringleberry
Well-Known Member
WTF?!
If I just sat there for 16 hours a day with a vape strapped to my mouth and every inhale was a lung full of vapor I still wouldn't be able to consume that much in a day. That is fuckin wild mate.
Sounds like you are making something to drink!
Not saying anything except a Plenty bowl can hold about 3.5g of herb and I got sick of micro dosing with a Mighty
shredder
Well-Known Member
Les, you'd like this, occasionally I use ground up 6 row malted barley. I use it for the enzymes, but most people make beer with it.
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shredder
Well-Known Member
IDK what KNF is.
What I make is referred to as fermented plant extracts, or FPE.
One downside to these ferments is the smell. It's pretty much smells like it went through a horse or cow, lol. No biggie for me cause I grow in an outbuilding, and I kinda got used to it.
An upside is if you get it on you, your skin gets really soft and subtle. Amazing really, but stinky.
And here's a biggie, while fermenting it gives off CO2. So I ferment in my grow room for the CO2 boost.
Basically I put plant materials in a 5 gallon paint strainer mesh bag. Put that in a 5 gallon bucket, fill to the top with water, close it up and let it ferment. It helps to put the bucket on a tray because they can leak once it starts working.
Cheebsy
Microbe minion
Thanks for that man, very interesting.
KNF is Korean Natural Farming, mostly made famous today by a macadamia nut farmer who lives in Hawaii called Chris Trump. His you tube videos are fascinating. One Part of the KNF method uses, what he calls, FPJ or fermented plant Juice, and it sounds very similar to what you do!
christrump.com
KNF is Korean Natural Farming, mostly made famous today by a macadamia nut farmer who lives in Hawaii called Chris Trump. His you tube videos are fascinating. One Part of the KNF method uses, what he calls, FPJ or fermented plant Juice, and it sounds very similar to what you do!
Fermented Plant Juice - Liquid Compost - Natural Farming | Chris Trump
Fermented plant juice is a natural farming method that uses nutrients from plants to create a liquid compost. Learn more!
christrump.com
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MegaMan2k
Well-Known Member
The way i usually make my ferments is with a 1:1 ratio of raw sugar to plant material weight.
Here is a good video explaining the types of sugars
So far i tried with a mix of fruits and veggies for an all around bloom nutrient which seems very powerful
Took a "class" with a person from IG called KNF_garden.
He dosnt teach "Pure" KNF or whatever you wanna call it, more like a moderenized version or his own version,
Was fun learning about his "method" The end quality is def a notch higher than what ive seen from regular bottled nutrients.
@Cheebsy def recommend looking up knf_garden if u want to go down this rabbit hole for real, there is also another person called "theworldslasthope" he has a more advanced version class, depends on how deep you want to go. For beginner i would say start with knf_garden and move on from there, just a fair warning they do charge money for these classes, Personally i think this kind of knowledge should be free for everyone to enjoy -.-.
Here is a good video explaining the types of sugars
So far i tried with a mix of fruits and veggies for an all around bloom nutrient which seems very powerful
Took a "class" with a person from IG called KNF_garden.
He dosnt teach "Pure" KNF or whatever you wanna call it, more like a moderenized version or his own version,
Was fun learning about his "method" The end quality is def a notch higher than what ive seen from regular bottled nutrients.
@Cheebsy def recommend looking up knf_garden if u want to go down this rabbit hole for real, there is also another person called "theworldslasthope" he has a more advanced version class, depends on how deep you want to go. For beginner i would say start with knf_garden and move on from there, just a fair warning they do charge money for these classes, Personally i think this kind of knowledge should be free for everyone to enjoy -.-.