InVerzion Vaporizer

invertedisdead

Defenders Of Glass
Figured I'd start this thread to facilitate discussion on a little something I've been working on. Many thanks to those who have already been following me along with this project, I really appreciate all the kind-hearted support, FC has always been an incredible place that many of us call home, and I couldn't think of a better spot to talk about my vaporizer designs.

I first started fiddling with this idea in 2017, after experimenting with aftermarket glass bowls for my Flowerpot, I was very intrigued with the smoother vapor from such a seemingly minor change. I wondered how the vapor would differ if the entire thing was made of glass. During this same time, the Glass Symphony was making strides here on FC, I was always impressed with Jojo's pure design, but always a little bit nervous of the form factor, unfortunately I never had a chance to try that awesome vape.

I sketched out a bunch of different concepts, attempting to condense the purity of the Glass Symphony into the size of a Flowerpot. The thing about glass is certain things that are easy to do with metal, are difficult to do with glass. One of my main problems was figuring out how to securely fasten the coil to a glass vape - the Flowerpot uses a screw and nut system to secure the coil, but to make something like that out of glass could be extremely cost prohibitive. This coil mounting issue stumped me for quite a while and I somewhat lost interest in the project for some time. In fact, after doing some beta testing for Dabpress, I pretty much lost interest in vaping flower altogether, transitioning full-time into dabbing rosin. I was greatly impressed with how affordable and commonplace it was when dabbing to have an all glass air path, for years it's pretty much been standard, and I found that smooth vapor hard to beat.

The thing about rosin is if the flower doesn't yield particularly well, you can end up vaping a weeks worth of herb in one afternoon... I knew I wasn't done with rosin, but I needed a way to vape flower again for those economic times that demand conservation! Largely inspired by the simple quartz banger, I tried to come up with a conversion kit that would work with my existing e-nail setup and turn it into a dry herb convection powerhouse. The problem with that idea is a quartz banger primarily uses conduction to vaporize oils, because of that, the airflow routing is not really optimal for convection. Inspired by Buildozer and Stu's Evo On A Stick thread, I built and posted my first sapphire powered prototype, fitted inside a simple male to male glass adapter, and heated with a 25mm barrel coil I was using for my banger. I started sketching vaporizer concepts again, wondering if there was an exsiting product I could already use for inspiration? I looked through a ton of lab glass and smoking glass apparatuses for anything promising and landed on the carbon filter adapter, a smoking accessory which uses activated carbon processed from coconut husks to filter the smoke.

The carbon filter adapter seemed like a great candidate for a heater housing, and for a while I strongly considered that as my new starting platform. The only issue with that was...

  1. How was I going to mount the coil to the heater? I knew from my experiences with quartz bangers if a coil was fitted too tight, it could crack the glass on the cool-down as the coil contracts.
  2. If a pre-existing carbon filter wasn't the perfect diameter as-is, then I'd probably have to source a custom heater. The problem with that is I knew wanted to use an existing coil to keep things simple. KISS!
I knew I wanted to do something a little different from other glass ball vapes, I had been using ruby and sapphire terp pearls in my rosin rig for a while and figured I could migrate those supercharged thermal properties over to a convection heater. Sapphire is more thermally conductive than stainless steel or titanium, and retains heat longer than glass, all while keeping that clean and pure flavor and smooth vapor. Plus with a convection vape, thermal shock issues of sapphire is pretty much a non-issue. Major win. :D

I took more inspiration from my dab rig, after a particularly inspiring dab :science: I looked over at my enail and thought "what if I had a rod attached horizontally to secure the coil, just like my enail setup." This was a major pivotal point for this design, finally I felt like I was on to something. Even more progress was made when I changed that rod to a tube, this could double as the coil arm and the air inlet - another issue I was trying to figure out. With this new design I could eliminate the old carbon filter concept entirely, saving almost an inch in height just by removing that extra glass joint which would be at the top of the carbon filter.

A few prototypes later and I've finally got something that I feel worthy of sharing, I'm still working out a few more little details and finishing touches, but I really just wanted to put myself out there (something I really struggle at) and share my work thus far.

If you've read this far I sincerely appreciate your patience and your time, thank you so much for following along! :wave:

I'd like to present a little video clip of a quick vapor session - I've since made a small modification which I believe improves performance further and I'm excited to share more about that!


I hope to post more usage videos, photos, theories, concepts, and renderings here and hope you'll follow along for the ride.

Much love, FC!
:cheers:


:bigleaf:
 
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muunch

hotboxing the cockpit
Really love when a passionate, knowledgeable enthusiast among our ranks decides to make their own vape to satisfy their own demands, rather than chasing $$$$$$$

Will be watching this with great interest! Pretty much the only desktop on my radar... I was very close to biting on a another desktop a few weeks ago and after seeing this thing in action, I'm no longer as eager... Very hard to beat all glass airpath.

Always here to help if ya need some extra lungs, too! :tup:

Cheers and best of luck brotha!! :clap::rockon::cheers:
 

invertedisdead

Defenders Of Glass
Really love when a passionate, knowledgeable enthusiast among our ranks decides to make their own vape to satisfy their own demands, rather than chasing $$$$$$$

Will be watching this with great interest! Pretty much the only desktop on my radar... I was very close to biting on a another desktop a few weeks ago and after seeing this thing in action, I'm no longer as eager... Very hard to beat all glass airpath.

Always here to help if ya need some extra lungs, too! :tup:

Cheers and best of luck brotha!! :clap::rockon::cheers:
Thank you very much my dude! :rockon:I greatly appreciate those words of encouragement, and I'm super stoked that you're liking what you see! :brow:

I'm glad you're going through with this project, @invertedisdead. I'll be paying close attention, to be sure as this is right up my alley.

If/when you choose to sell any, you'll need to let us know in advance in order to set you up as a commercial account, ok?

Great work!

:peace:
Hey thanks a ton @Stu ! I really appreciate your interest, it definitely means a lot coming from such an extensively experienced vaporizer enthusiast as yourself! :bowdown:

Will certainly contact you when I'm at that stage :rockon:

100% glass airpath? hell yea, great job man! the taste must be very pure!
It's not technically 100% glass at this point, my original prototype utilized a ring of indentations to function as a glass screen to hold the sapphire beads. The original plan was to use the air inlet/arm as 3 functions - one of them was to load the beads, and there would be zero metal in the heater. It did work, and I might explore that again when I order my next prototypes, but two things I like about the current setup - with the spike screen the heater is at least 5mm further away from the load then with the stainless steel screen. One of the tricky parts about designing a glass vape like this is the load sits kinda far away from the heater. Due to inverse square law this has a direct effect on how hot you need your heater to be to heat the air to vaporization temps. The 19/22 male joint is 22mm long (almost 1 inch = 25.4mm) so getting the load further away from the hot zone of the heat exchanger is not really ideal and every little bit helps.

Holy :shit: this post is gonna be kinda long so you might wanna load the vape. :science:

I'm also using a SS screen in the bowl right now, though I'm still planning on testing a true 100% glass screen bowl I came up with that should truly work for ground green. I just haven't really messed with it much as I'm focusing my attention on the heater first. I'm actually curious how many people even care about a 100% glass bowl, versus one with a high grade stainless steel screen? My thoughts with a glass screen is I think it will actually improve extraction/contact time slighty as well as add a little bit of draw
restriction which I know people have kinda grown to not like... but I actually think it could be a good thing!

This vape builds up pressure as air travels through the nooks and crannies but it loses that pressure when it gets to the joint and the air expands. If you think of a garden hose turned on, it shoots out a little bit, but if you cover the end of the hose partially with your thumb, pressure is built up and the water shoots much further. I believe this could be applied to hot air to "blast" the vaporizable material... see this is why I wanted to start this thread cause I have a bunch of these :science: ideas in my head and I'm really stoked to talk about them with other passionate vaporists. One of my earlier tests was to fill the joint completely with beads all the way to the end, I thought that was really brilliant, I was going to triple the thermal mass and vapor path length. Guess what? It didn't work. At all. It produced absolutely zero vapor! Past the hot zone (where the coil is) the conductivity of sapphire caused it to start acting as a heatsink. I've already been experimenting with sapphire as a cooling unit for a while now so I could tell right away what was going on.

Went on such a tangent I don't even remember what we were talking about :hmm:

:rofl:

Here's what I'm thinking, if I get this custom glass screen produced, maybe I could put that same one from the bowl in the heater to hold the sapphire pearls for a 100% metal free air and vapor path. Or I could put the glass screen just in the bowl and use a SS screen in the heater and claim that its a 100% metal free vapor path since the metal is before where the vapor phase change occurs... now that's just great marketing! :cool:But seriously, I'm curious how many people would be interested in a true 100% glass bowl with a glass screen that actually works for ground herb, assuming that there might be a little bit more draw restriction, and you might need somewhat of a more course grind? It would work for a lot of other vapes that use the same 18F connection so I figure that's a plus, maybe herborizer or elev8r peeps or whatever might want one too?

Still, I'm really impressed with how easily I can just crush bowls with this thing and not get what I deemed "convection wear n' tear" aka that singed feeling of a roasted throat, even when I use small dab rigs that normally irritate me with convection hits.
 

Abysmal Vapor

Saturnine in my mind
Good luck with your product dude, I am probably up for one, I am eyeing on 25mm enail avaiable in the EU a sweet price for some time.Your vape would totally justify getting it,cause i dont like concetrates that much,actually i dab only cbd isolate with terps. I know you are a big rosin fan,but that moment that things get in contact with silicone,under pressure, just dont feels like pure path. Probably i am overreacting,but when want to have things at a higher percantage of purity,even a metal screen,could matter to once mind :D..For me extracting directly from herb is the way that offers least degradation of terpenes and active ingredients,so really glad to hear your thoughts and details about your product :) !
 

710yota

Well-Known Member
Very cool! I've enjoyed reading your input on other things I enjoy like my flowerpot and have seen mentions of this vape you were building, its awesome to be able to see it!

I certainly would think an all glass air path is super rad but I could also deal with a little bit of metal if it resulted in better function. All glass would certainly be unique though compared to the other heavy hitting desktops currently available.

I look forward to seeing more of this and maybe even snagging one myself in 2020!
 

invertedisdead

Defenders Of Glass
Good luck with your product dude, I am probably up for one, I am eyeing on 25mm enail avaiable in the EU a sweet price for some time.Your vape would totally justify getting it,cause i dont like concetrates that much,actually i dab only cbd isolate with terps. I know you are a big rosin fan,but that moment that things get in contact with silicone,under pressure, just dont feels like pure path. Probably i am overreacting,but when want to have things at a higher percantage of purity,even a metal screen,could matter to once mind :D..For me extracting directly from herb is the way that offers least degradation of terpenes and active ingredients,so really glad to hear your thoughts and details about your product :) !
Thank you very much my friend! Much respect coming from a FCOG such as yourself :rockon:

I understand the parchment paper skepticism, one of the things that kinda bothers me is that you can literally press rosin right through the other side of the parchment if too much pressure is applied.

After trying true full melt water hash off my sapphire e-nail I finally understood what the great @herbivore21 was talking about all those years! :drool: That's my new "holy grail" - :mmmm: but the low yield makes it extremely difficult to be more than a rare treat for me. I always liked raw flower, it's just the convection wear and tear that always caught up to me! I'm trying pretty hard with this one, but still getting nothing but smooth vapor! :sherlock: Kinda trips me out honestly, especially since I'm mostly using my small oil rig for glass.



Very cool! I've enjoyed reading your input on other things I enjoy like my flowerpot and have seen mentions of this vape you were building, its awesome to be able to see it!

I certainly would think an all glass air path is super rad but I could also deal with a little bit of metal if it resulted in better function. All glass would certainly be unique though compared to the other heavy hitting desktops currently available.

I look forward to seeing more of this and maybe even snagging one myself in 2020!
:cheers: really appreciate you stopping by and saying that, thank you!


Yeah, this. I dont do flower any more but if I did, I'd be all over this. First time I can say that since getting into the flowerpots during its first iteration.

It means nothing, but thats high praise from me tbh.
My sapphire brother from another rosin mother!! :rockon: Much respect my friend, I really appreciate hearing that!


Old iPad vape ideas from 2017 :lol: various wax pen concepts, Quartz concentrate adapter for Arizer vapes, mini rosin press idea, a butane powered vape, oh yeah, sapphire inserts for quartz bangers... In 2017 I came up with the idea of using a sapphire wafer to cover the floor of a quartz banger cause I wanted the purity of a Sapphire Halo without the titanium base... Gosh I'm an idiot for not seeing that one through, I could be selling $1000 inserts :doh: :lol::whoa:



Vape sketches: My initial carbon filter concept, next to the improved "a-ha!" version :science: where I changed the coil arm from a rod to a tube, turning it into a multifunction part and shaving 22mm off the design.



Rendering I made for my first prototype:



Quick little session on this rainy Southern California day:

 

EmDeemo

ACCOUNT INACTIVE
I always liked raw flower, it's just the convection wear and tear that always caught up to me! I'm trying pretty hard with this one, but still getting nothing but smooth vapor! :sherlock: Kinda trips me out honestly, especially since I'm mostly using my small oil rig for glass.
Hmm. HMMM.

He's tempting me folks, that tricky little trickster, with all his smooth words!
 

invertedisdead

Defenders Of Glass
Very cool friend! Look forward to following this, hope to be one of the earlier users once you offer them up. :rockon:
Thank you!! :rockon:

Nice dude , wishing you lots of luck on this , it definitely looks cool .
Much respect bro! Appreciate you stopping by and saying that :cheers:

Hmm. HMMM.

He's tempting me folks, that tricky little trickster, with all his smooth words!
:evil::evil::evil: Testing a bit of freshly trimmed super lemon haze in the InV today! :science:
I believe it may be considered "scrumptious" on your side of the pond! :D

Nice work ! Have you considered/tried using an axial coil upside down on it?
Thank you! I did consider an axial, but I like that the 20mm barrel coil can be easily sourced in various controller pin outs and voltages already. Since the heater is closed up top it does a good job at storing heat and redirecting that energy back into the sapphire core. Neat little observation from a recent modification: the 6mm Ruby at the air inlet acts like a one way ball valve of sorts. When you draw air through the heater the ruby is pulled to the side to allow air to flow in; when you stop inhaling the ruby ball closes off the air inlet, functioning like an oven door to help quickly regenerate any heat lost during the previous draw. It's pretty neat! :sherlock:
 
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invertedisdead

Defenders Of Glass
G you know I’ll be following this. I’ve been researching ceramic bands heaters which go down to an inch in diameter for I’m thinking the heat transfer maybe more efficient. Have you looked at other heater form factors?
Definitely!! There's some pretty interesting stuff out there that I've been researching.

As you noticed though, most of those band heaters only go down to 25mm which I think is just a little too large for anything with a 19mm joint. Reason being, the inner diameter of the male joint at its smallest point reduces to around 12mm, so I think a smaller diameter heater will help to keep the hot zone localized.

Possibly they could do a smaller band heater as a custom part, which I would be interested in, but to keep costs down for this project I like the idea of using an off the shelf part. I like the idea of the band heater for a cylindrical, fragile part though. The gem core is so effective though, my coil is barely even attached and it still rips hard in the 600-700 range; with my next prototype and proper fitment I wouldn't be surprised to see those numbers drop a hundred degrees.

As far as other form factors, I have a couple ideas that use a cartridge heater - I have a few other vape designs, so if I make a dollar off this vape it would go into research and development of other vaporizer concepts. I got this torch vape idea that I think could be pretty big, but it needs testing. :science:
 

PPN

TopGreen X-Max Representative
Company Rep
Nice vape @invertedisdead !

I'm using myself a diy vape using the same idea since years (even before the flowerPot comes out), I posted in the diy section in a thread called "how to vaporize flowers with an enail".

I agree about the smooth comment, very, very smooth vapor!
Although I'm thinking it might be difficult to make money with that idea cause most peoples can do it themselves, a 16mm barrel coil+a elev8r quartz (or boro) heater, maybe a thin sheet of stainless steel to help for a tight fit, a controller and a 18/18mm(or 14/18) female to female (or male to female) with a screen for the bowl... and you are good to vape.

That vape kept me away of the FlowerPot (I can't imagine it might be better so much) and makes me sell my Herborizer Ti (it was amazing but I got issues to find the sweet spot, I suppose the new DigiTi is better about this), Ti was much more small and convenient, when you have a controller that's less easy to bring to the garden table.

Personnally I tested the boro Elev8r heater and a "home" ceramic heater and I prefer the ceramic but without any true reason cause the Elev8r is great too... maybe cause it's less breakable...

Good luck for all your vape-ideas! That's fun!
 

nonamekevin

Well-Known Member
Nice vape @invertedisdead !

I'm using myself a diy vape using the same idea since years (even before the flowerPot comes out), I posted in the diy section in a thread called "how to vaporize flowers with an enail".

I agree about the smooth comment, very, very smooth vapor!
Although I'm thinking it might be difficult to make money with that idea cause most peoples can do it themselves, a 16mm barrel coil+a elev8r quartz (or boro) heater, maybe a thin sheet of stainless steel to help for a tight fit, a controller and a 18/18mm(or 14/18) female to female (or male to female) with a screen for the bowl... and you are good to vape.

That vape kept me away of the FlowerPot (I can't imagine it might be better so much) and makes me sell my Herborizer Ti (it was amazing but I got issues to find the sweet spot, I suppose the new DigiTi is better about this), Ti was much more small and convenient, when you have a controller that's less easy to bring to the garden table.

Personnally I tested the boro Elev8r heater and a "home" ceramic heater and I prefer the ceramic but without any true reason cause the Elev8r is great too... maybe cause it's less breakable...

Good luck for all your vape-ideas! That's fun!
Hello friend! I also put something up on the diy pages for an enail dry herb vape. Mine was inspired by the elev8r, but wanted a drop in solution for currently available enails. The elev8r is great for sure, but because it requires extra steps to make work with an enail, I can see that turning people off from the idea.

I dig how the piece that @invertedisdead came up with is direct drop in, and secures to the enail with commonly available components (where my efforts fell short :(). I can see how a ready to go, right out of the box, all glass dry herb vape would be very desirable.
:rockon:
 

invertedisdead

Defenders Of Glass
Nice vape @invertedisdead !

I'm using myself a diy vape using the same idea since years (even before the flowerPot comes out), I posted in the diy section in a thread called "how to vaporize flowers with an enail".

I agree about the smooth comment, very, very smooth vapor!
Although I'm thinking it might be difficult to make money with that idea cause most peoples can do it themselves, a 16mm barrel coil+a elev8r quartz (or boro) heater, maybe a thin sheet of stainless steel to help for a tight fit, a controller and a 18/18mm(or 14/18) female to female (or male to female) with a screen for the bowl... and you are good to vape.

That vape kept me away of the FlowerPot (I can't imagine it might be better so much) and makes me sell my Herborizer Ti (it was amazing but I got issues to find the sweet spot, I suppose the new DigiTi is better about this), Ti was much more small and convenient, when you have a controller that's less easy to bring to the garden table.

Personnally I tested the boro Elev8r heater and a "home" ceramic heater and I prefer the ceramic but without any true reason cause the Elev8r is great too... maybe cause it's less breakable...

Good luck for all your vape-ideas! That's fun!
Thank you! :nod:

I remember that thread for sure, I had a flowerpot at the time but I was still interested in buying one of your ceramic heaters :D

Hello friend! I also put something up on the diy pages for an enail dry herb vape. Mine was inspired by the elev8r, but wanted a drop in solution for currently available enails. The elev8r is great for sure, but because it requires extra steps to make work with an enail, I can see that turning people off from the idea.

I dig how the piece that @invertedisdead came up with is direct drop in, and secures to the enail with commonly available components (where my efforts fell short :(). I can see how a ready to go, right out of the box, all glass dry herb vape would be very desirable.
:rockon:
:smug:


:cheers:

Gonna try and get the gears turning today and see if I can come up with anything new in the vaporverse!
 

lazylathe

Almost there...
Dude!! I want one, no I NEED one of these in my arsenal.
Do you have a time line for when these will be available?
Or have you started the waiting list yet?:brow:
+1!!!!
So compact and powerful!
I am literally throwing money at my computer screen right now to no effect...:D:D:D

@invertedisdead
Over in the vapbong thread, an owner talks about how pure ceramic tastes compared to glass.
Any possibilities of ceramic beads?
This will be the next Glass Symphony, only in a much smaller package!!!
Very excited!!!
 

invertedisdead

Defenders Of Glass
Dude!! I want one, no I NEED one of these in my arsenal.
Do you have a time line for when these will be available?
Or have you started the waiting list yet?:brow:
:rockon::rockon:

As far as timeline - the heater design is pretty much done, I need to check if my glassblower is working or not right now during all this COVID stuff.

Still want to get a custom bowl made - it seems to vape evenly within the hot zone, but since the female to male adapter I'm using has a flared lip, a few unvaped herb crumbs fall outside that hot zone that get stirred back in. I assume this is why they cut the joint down on the elev8r heater. I ordered a few off the shelf scientific glass adapters that looked to have the right tolerance, but they haven't showed up yet. Once that's addressed that should eliminate any real reason to stir. At that point the vape should be ready to go!

I definitely want to do a couple accessories I've been thinking about for a while, but they don't necessarily have to be done at the same time as the heater/bowl. Hoping to collaborate with a couple other FC vendors for some of those! ;)

+1!!!!
So compact and powerful!
I am literally throwing money at my computer screen right now to no effect...:D:D:D

@invertedisdead
Over in the vapbong thread, an owner talks about how pure ceramic tastes compared to glass.
Any possibilities of ceramic beads?
This will be the next Glass Symphony, only in a much smaller package!!!
Very excited!!!
:cheers:

Really appreciate your interest !! :party:
Ceramic beads are most definitely a possibility - it's something I've been wanting to try, but just haven't gotten around to it yet. :myday:

Part of how I shrunk my design is by using Ruby/sapphire beads instead of glass - lab grown sapphire is pure al203 crystalline aluminum oxide (same chemical composition as alumina ceramic) which features extreme chemical stability and zero porosity, while being more thermally conductive than titanium or stainless steel!
 
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