Impurities Found In ALL Canned Butane...Not Good

[vaporonly]

AFAIK vodka at 96% is pure grain alcohol aka everclear.

basically american vodka is pure grain alcohol cut with water: 100 proof is 50% PGA and 50% water etc

 

[vape4health]

Wouldn't the higher water content have a similar effect as water curing. I use a paper towel to suck the water off when it getts to that state of no more alcohol smell. ? I say give a small test run a go and see what comes out.

 

[darkrom]

This is very disappointing to read. I cant get everclear shipped to my state or buy it here and i dont feel any better using ISO. What to do, what to do

In the liquidizer thread someone listed a site that ships to me, even though every other site I checked said not to my state. It is worth checking that thread. I forget the name of the place sorry.

 

[Mynameismud]

In the liquidizer thread someone listed a site that ships to me, even though every other site I checked said not to my state. It is worth checking that thread. I forget the name of the place sorry.

Thanks for the heads up. I will look into it when i have a chance

 

[Silver420Surfer]

Obviously everyones health caring regiment is different, especially those seriously/fatally ill. With that said, I hope we stick to the facts here and not start "scaring" people.

From the article:
"Even if nothing is present at levels of serious health concern, I would prefer to not have any of that stuff in there, so in addition to fractional distillation using vacuum, we will be experimenting with Bentonite filters."

Darkrom even admits"
"continue using BHO and realize that the level of impurities is REALLY low, and technically a candle from the store is more likely to be toxic." Do we want to scare away someone from concentrates based on something less than a candle can do? Not saying you are trying to scare people, but they may do it to themselves after reading some of this.


Probably inhaling even more "baddies" by breathing "fresh air" outside.
This was my local air quality index report for today. "Air quality is acceptable; however, for some pollutants there may be a moderate health concern for a very small number of people who are unusually sensitive to air pollution." Sounds just as "potentially" harmful as the butane, no?

Not trying to troll here, just want to keep things in perspective.

 

[Abysmal Vapor]

For the record.. i've being trough all kind of solvents.. And i must say ... Straight cold ethanol extraction on frozen dry bud is the best tasting shit you will ever get.. ,,, I stop using tane years ago.. Where i live 1l ethanol costs like 4 euro.. 95%

 

[darkrom]

Obviously everyones health caring regiment is different, especially those seriously/fatally ill. With that said, I hope we stick to the facts here and not start "scaring" people.

From the article:
"Even if nothing is present at levels of serious health concern, I would prefer to not have any of that stuff in there, so in addition to fractional distillation using vacuum, we will be experimenting with Bentonite filters."

Darkrom even admits"
"continue using BHO and realize that the level of impurities is REALLY low, and technically a candle from the store is more likely to be toxic." Do we want to scare away someone from concentrates based on something less than a candle can do? Not saying you are trying to scare people, but they may do it to themselves after reading some of this.


Probably inhaling even more "baddies" by breathing "fresh air" outside.
This was my local air quality index report for today. "Air quality is acceptable; however, for some pollutants there may be a moderate health concern for a very small number of people who are unusually sensitive to air pollution." Sounds just as "potentially" harmful as the butane, no?

Not trying to troll here, just want to keep things in perspective.

I am trying to keep things in perspective too and just present facts as we learn them. I am NOT trying to scare anyone. I am continuing to use my BHO, and will in all likelyhood blast away with the last can I have, while I explore other options. I do not think BHO is poison, I simply think we can do better and not have this shit in our concentrates at all. I'm experimenting with other options, but make no mistake about it I woke up and used my BHO in the cera this morning.

People need to know what is in this stuff and they can make their own decisions about it, while we allow people to try to figure out a way to avoid the impurities completely.


Here is a pic of what I got with the everclear from a single gram of the blue dream. It is a white powder basically, I can scrape little powder onto my dabber, but it will NOT stick to itself like BHO will when I fold my slick mat. I'm not sure how to use this from here honestly. I think I may need to heat it at low temp to melt it into a different consistency so I can actually handle it. Sorry the pic sucks but you get the idea, milky white powder from my blue dream. Not sure if this is what I'm supposed to be seeing. It is seriously 100% dry powder no liquids left.

 

[Trever]

I am trying to keep things in perspective too and just present facts as we learn them. I am NOT trying to scare anyone. I am continuing to use my BHO, and will in all likelyhood blast away with the last can I have, while I explore other options. I do not think BHO is poison, I simply think we can do better and not have this shit in our concentrates at all. I'm experimenting with other options, but make no mistake about it I woke up and used my BHO in the cera this morning.

People need to know what is in this stuff and they can make their own decisions about it, while we allow people to try to figure out a way to avoid the impurities completely.


Here is a pic of what I got with the everclear from a single gram of the blue dream. It is a white powder basically, I can scrape little powder onto my dabber, but it will NOT stick to itself like BHO will when I fold my slick mat. I'm not sure how to use this from here honestly. I think I may need to heat it at low temp to melt it into a different consistency so I can actually handle it. Sorry the pic sucks but you get the idea, milky white powder from my blue dream. Not sure if this is what I'm supposed to be seeing. It is seriously 100% dry powder no liquids left.

You will see the same results sometimes using qwiso. You purged with no heat right? Just a fan? That would be a big reason, 90-98 degrees is the perfect temp in my opinion when purging to get that nice shattery consistency. Try folding your slickmat and holding it down on a griddle very low heat then let it come back to room temp while still holding, usually it will stick to itself and you can work it from there. Looks tasty though!

 

[Dreamerr]

I thought heat just sped up the process not necessary to use? TIA

 

[Trever]

I thought heat just sped up the process not necessary to use? TIA

Heat is a big factor into the consistency of the end product. Especially using Polar solvents Like EC or ISO. Butane evapped with no heat will turn into a shattery consistency even without heat. But never in my experience has EC or ISO done that unless its a winterized BHO product will it evap with no heat into a shatter. EC and ISO allways for me makes a powder without heat, Id say ive done over 100+ runs with EC maybe only 20 or 30 with ISO. And probably 300+ bho runs

 

[Dreamerr]

I had to clean an ascent I borrowed and dumped my iso jar no bho...I just put it on top of the fridge as that has some heat but I will go put it on a heating pad I suppose if that matters....Thanks trever. It has been sitting for two days already and still a lot more to go.

 

[Trever]

I had to clean an ascent I borrowed and dumped my iso jar no bho...I just put it on top of the fridge as that has some heat but I will go put it on a heating pad I suppose if that matters....Thanks trever. It has been sitting for two days already and still a lot more to go.

Get a laser thermometer and do a double boil one pyrex full of water and the other pyrex with your slick mat inside. Makes keeping that temp stay +-1 degree pretty easily because the water will stay the same temp alot easier than the surface of the hot plate. Also if its reclaim your getting out of the ascent its never going to get completely shatter itll be sappy. You get out what you put in always remember <3

 

[darkrom]

So I ruined the experiment in a good way. Dumped the pile of powder into the cera while warm and let it melt and soak into the cart. The cart still was dirty with overheated BHO, so I can't judge the flavor. I just needed easy portable medication tonight. I'm going out with the girlfriend for her birthday dinner, and don't wanna carry a grinder etc, so I just dumped my kieflike everclear hash in heated and I guess I'll see how it goes.

I've got a pic I'll upload later/tomorrow, but I'm going to try to start a new batch on 3.5g exactly. This time I'll actually weigh the results as well and I can take my time and not rush anything.

Interesting consistency for sure, but next time I want to heat it a bit after I get this powder, and fold on the griddle until it melts together. No reason other than it'll be much easier to work with that way.

 

[darkrom]

I've got 7.2g of bud that I wasn't crazy about evaporating now. This time I'm going to scrape the powder into the middle of the slickmat, warm up the electric griddle, fold the slickmat and try to heat press it all together to be easier to work with.

Also going to weigh it this time, and clean my cera before filling it. Still not sure I'm loading the cera correctly really, so I'm learning as I go.

 

[vaporonly]

Obviously everyones health caring regiment is different, especially those seriously/fatally ill. With that said, I hope we stick to the facts here and not start "scaring" people.

From the article:
"Even if nothing is present at levels of serious health concern, I would prefer to not have any of that stuff in there, so in addition to fractional distillation using vacuum, we will be experimenting with Bentonite filters."

Darkrom even admits"
"continue using BHO and realize that the level of impurities is REALLY low, and technically a candle from the store is more likely to be toxic." Do we want to scare away someone from concentrates based on something less than a candle can do? Not saying you are trying to scare people, but they may do it to themselves after reading some of this.


Probably inhaling even more "baddies" by breathing "fresh air" outside.
This was my local air quality index report for today. "Air quality is acceptable; however, for some pollutants there may be a moderate health concern for a very small number of people who are unusually sensitive to air pollution." Sounds just as "potentially" harmful as the butane, no?

Not trying to troll here, just want to keep things in perspective.

i don't think you are trying to troll but your statement that people stick to facts and not scare people is kind of confrontational.

people who think canned butane or other industrial grade solvents are safe should be scared out of this false belief, which i see as darkrom's point for posting.

i also don't think these comparisons between canned butane oil and candles or outside air have any place in a factual discussion on the issue....notice the 'more likely' and the 'probably' which make them conjecture not fact.

until long term studies of the effects of using butane with these impurities has been done, we are left waiting to see...

solvents are used every day in many products for human consumption but they sure as heck aren't using industrial grade solvents to do it

 

[bill]

Hey guys, This read might shed some light on the subject. I am done with BHO, only everclear for me. Peace

http://forum.grasscity.com/incredib...y-canna-bombs-more.html/page-37#entry13446289

 

[darkrom]

I am continuing to use my BHO for the time being. My everclear from 7.1g of fresh buds is almost done evaping. I should be able to finish the last of the water with gentle heat today. This time instead of powder it is looking like a thin layer of film. It looks like it is turning itself to shatter honestly, not crumbs this time. I'm going to throw it on some heat for a little bit, maybe 1/2 hour at the lowest temp of the electric griddle. How does that sound?

I also have my bubble bag and machine now, and was thinking on running bubble from 3-4 ounces of trim my friend donated to me.


Productive day trying to make other concentrates besides BHO, while vaping BHO in the cera.

 

[Quetzalcoatl]

I thought heat just sped up the process not necessary to use? TIA

It's not really "necessary" if you have other ways to purge butane from oil, but a lot of people don't. You'd need a dessicator/vac chamber and a vacuum to lower the pressure so that the butane boils out faster. Heat + vac is more thorough, as the heat excites the molecules and especially any solvent molecules. I usually see recommendations for 88-98f under a 28.5 vac pressure thing (vac pulled to 28.5 on the meter).

I am continuing to use my BHO for the time being. My everclear from 7.1g of fresh buds is almost done evaping. I should be able to finish the last of the water with gentle heat today. This time instead of powder it is looking like a thin layer of film. It looks like it is turning itself to shatter honestly, not crumbs this time. I'm going to throw it on some heat for a little bit, maybe 1/2 hour at the lowest temp of the electric griddle. How does that sound?

I also have my bubble bag and machine now, and was thinking on running bubble from 3-4 ounces of trim my friend donated to me.

Sounds like the right way to change consistency to me? I also ended up with shatter and the shatter powder/"sugar oil" as I call it after doing some ISO washes. I think it's a solvent thing. In any case, I resolved this by heating the oil and then scraping. The heat makes it more viscous and oily IME, compared to a room-temperature shatter that would break and pieces would shoot out of the dish and fly around the room.

on the bubble, I love bubble hash!! Have you considered pulling kief from the trim using some dry ice and bubble bags? I've seen some impressive yields using that method, and dry ice is really cheap and available at most chain grocery stores (up front by the registers usually).

 

[AdmiralAlpacha]

I was really worried about this until I saw the video of the lady addicted to huffing butane for the last 20 years or something crazy.

I know this isn't science but it is enough to keep my anxiety from kicking in over the subject. I am going to be getting a vac purge to better purge my oils, but I don't think I am going to stop consuming BHO unless more harmful information comes out.

Ill probably be dead wayyyy before any possible negative long term effects appear on me.
That and my lungs have only improved since I started consuming BHO, it is most likely due to a change in medication, but I'm gonna keep dabbing just to be safe

Edit: That and I just bought a 12 pack of tane I can't just throw away

 

[darkrom]

I was really worried about this until I saw the video of the lady addicted to huffing butane for the last 20 years or something crazy.

I know this isn't science but it is enough to keep my anxiety from kicking in over the subject. I am going to be getting a vac purge to better purge my oils, but I don't think I am going to stop consuming BHO unless more harmful information comes out.

Ill probably be dead wayyyy before any possible negative long term effects appear on me.
That and my lungs have only improved since I started consuming BHO, it is most likely due to a change in medication, but I'm gonna keep dabbing just to be safe

Edit: That and I just bought a 12 pack of tane I can't just throw away

I feel similarly, but thought it was my DUTY to share this info with all my friends here at FC.

I honestly believe that a candle from the mall is more dangerous than BHO, but at the same time I believe we should be improving BHO tech to make it even safer.

Its like how I feel about smoking cannabis. It won't hurt you to smoke it, but vaping is even better. We should always be improving everything, or what is the point?

 

[vaporonly]

i'm just playing devils advocate but in relation to the woman huffing butane do you guys feel less bad about smoking cigs when you find evidence of one person smoking for 30 years with little visual damage?

 

[darkrom]

i'm just playing devils advocate but in relation to the woman huffing butane do you guys feel less bad about smoking cigs when you find evidence of one person smoking for 30 years with little visual damage?

Well to put this in perspective it would be more like smoking 1 cigarette over 30 years vs boxes a day. Since we are inhaling parts per BILLIONTH of the undesirable chemicals vs this lady sucking down cans. I'd wager one can of sucked down butane is quite a bit more harmful than a lifetime of inhaling parts per billionths of butane residue.

 

[jdee]

Here is what Graywolf posted yesterday
-------------------------------------

Marty, the project manager, has been gone all week, so that was not who was talked to at Specialty Analytical. He told me that they had taken a special interest in the project and had gone over it in more detail than the above author indicates.

Marty's credentials, and Specialty Analytical's credentials are a matter of record. What are the credentials of the above author?

We've moved from only opinions of what the Mystery oil is, to results from a GS/MS which some of the folks now have the opinion that it wasn't accurate enough. When do we move from opinions to embracing the scientific data so carefully acquired?

When do we also cut to the chase and consider what the numbers actually mean, even if there are misconceptions?

If we take the worst anecdotal example to date at 180 ppm, and scan the analysis for bad nasties, our eyes fall on Dichlorobenzene, a carcinogen.

It is present at the level of 82.6 parts per billionth in the 180 ppm sample, or a total concentration of .000,180 X .000000082 = .000,000,000,014,760, or 147.6 parts per trillionth

300ml or .3 liters of butane at .573 grams/ml would weigh about 171.9 grams, which would contain about .000,000,002,537 grams of Dichlorobenzene, or 2537 parts per billionth, that would be left in the oil.

If we used 300 ml to extract a 1" X 12" tube, or about 40 grams, and yielded 20%, we have about 8 grams of oil, which would contain about .000000002537 grams of Dichlorobenzene, at a level of .000,000,000,250, or 250 parts per trillion.

Here is the Section 8 from the MSDS for Benzene from http://www.sciencelab.com/msds.php?msdsId=9927339 , showing 1 ppm, or .000,001 as the exposure limits. Those of ya'll with a proclivity for math, will note that parts per trillion, is million times lower than parts per millionth, which should put things in perspective.

You are breathing in higher levels of many of these, from the air around us.

Section 8: Exposure Controls/Personal Protection

Exposure Limits:

TWA: 0.5 STEL: 2.5 (ppm) from ACGIH (TLV) [United States] TWA: 1.6 STEL: 8 (mg/m3) from ACGIH (TLV) [United States] TWA: 0.1 STEL: 1 from NIOSH TWA: 1 STEL: 5 (ppm) from OSHA (PEL) [United States] TWA: 10 (ppm) from OSHA (PEL)
[United States] TWA: 3 (ppm) [United Kingdom (UK)] TWA: 1.6 (mg/m3) [United Kingdom (UK)] TWA: 1 (ppm) [Canada] TWA: 3.2 (mg/m3) [Canada] TWA: 0.5 (ppm) [Canada]Consult local authorities for acceptable exposure limits.

 

[Silver420Surfer]

solvents are used every day in many products for human consumption but they sure as heck aren't using industrial grade solvents to do it

Sounds like conjecture. You are aware of..."A study conducted by researchers at the University of Texas Health Science Center at Houston found that samples of prepackaged foods and beverages contained industrial chemicals called phthalates. These are synthetic compounds used to make shampoo, soap, perfumes and other common household products. Phthalates have been linked to reproductive and endocrine damage, premature breast development in girls and premature birth."
Just one of many examples out there that anyone can find.

From the above article:
You are breathing in higher levels of many of these, from the air around us.

Section 8: Exposure Controls/Personal Protection

Exposure Limits:

TWA: 0.5 STEL: 2.5 (ppm) from ACGIH (TLV) [United States] TWA: 1.6 STEL: 8 (mg/m3) from ACGIH (TLV) [United States] TWA: 0.1 STEL: 1 from NIOSH TWA: 1 STEL: 5 (ppm) from OSHA (PEL) [United States] TWA: 10 (ppm) from OSHA (PEL)
[United States] TWA: 3 (ppm) [United Kingdom (UK)] TWA: 1.6 (mg/m3) [United Kingdom (UK)] TWA: 1 (ppm) [Canada] TWA: 3.2 (mg/m3) [Canada] TWA: 0.5 (ppm) [Canada]Consult local authorities for acceptable exposure limits.

Sorry I didn't list similar info or my own experiences with shitty air when I claimed "Probably inhaling even more "baddies" by breathing "fresh air" outside." If you grew up in the Mon-Valley area near Pittsburgh(like I did), you don't need to have somebody tell you about ppm and shit, you just went outside to find your once-white laundry hanging up to be a nice shade of grey after the coke stacks vented. Not to bring more "conjecture", or "probabilities" into the mix, vaporonly, but if you lived here, you'd PROBABLY have a higher than normal chance of getting cancer, which is one of the reasons I moved away.

 

[darkrom]

Good read. Also 36 in a million odds of getting cancer? Comforting to me as someone terrified of that horrible disease. Better odds than I thought.


I'm glad this thread is remaining logical. We don't have anyone saying "BHO will cause cancer" and we also don't have anyone saying "BHO is completely harmless". What we have is real conversation about the trace amounts of nasties in butane and what it means for us all. I think we all know the world is a dangerous place, and the goal of this thread seems united in just learning more and improving the concentrates we know and love.