Discontinued herbalAire

[Egzoset]

Hi CDS,

...but is also infamous in my view for having such a very hot bowl which causes always-on conduction vaporization.

Perhaps there's no "bitching" about it because we don't actually know for sure if that bowl even reaches the vaporization temperature... What if it's designed to be just hot enough in order to avoid drawing energy from the heated airflow while the space around our herb is being flooded by it? What if the HA bowl happens to bring a passive thermal inertia element required to stabilize the retro-active temperature regulation loop, making the HA as efficient as it is now? What if there's something about that bowl and the structures around it which is common to the way the Oracle works somehow (the only other vaporizer i've read about that doen't need its owner to "grind"/"stirr")?

I think some questions remain without answers and this reminds me that i yet have to see inside an HA at all.

 

[Learner]

finer screens

Where are said finer screens procured?

 

[Magic9]

finer screens

Where are said finer screens procured?

I got mine from ebay. Like $6 for 100 stainless steel. Search "pipe screens". 5/8 fit into the bowl perfectly. I had to clip a little piece to fit into bottom of mouthpiece.

It was from this guy. He's got many sizes, brass or SS.

http://cgi.ebay.com/100-Stainless-S...418?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item51986caeb2


Also, what can I do with the ABV? I know there is a thread on this, but the HA is a special beast. Is there anything left after vaping at 375? If so, What do I need to do and how much do I need?

 

[steiner666]

Hi CDS,

...but is also infamous in my view for having such a very hot bowl which causes always-on conduction vaporization.

Perhaps there's no "bitching" about it because we don't actually know for sure if that bowl even reaches the vaporization temperature... What if it's designed to be just hot enough in order to avoid drawing energy from the heated airflow while the space around our herb is being flooded by it? What if the HA bowl happens to bring a passive thermal inertia element required to stabilize the retro-active temperature regulation loop, making the HA as efficient as it is now? What if there's something about that bowl and the structures around it which is common to the way the Oracle works somehow (the only other vaporizer i've read about that doen't need its owner to "grind"/"stirr")?

I think some questions remain without answers and this reminds me that i yet have to see inside an HA at all.

yeah ive noticed the conduction in the HA, like i loaded a crucible of ground herb (it was grinded for use in my wdz but i ended up getting company over who specifically wanted to try HA so we used it) and dropped it in to the HA while it was heating and a minute or two later something came up and we had to go. i decided to dump the crucible out to see what it looks like after just sitting inthere with no one taking a hit or pumping, and the herb was, id say about 75% tan with the rest being green still. we still got a few bags out of it when we got back later, but i wonder sometimes how many more we would have gotten if we could have just started right away and captured it all. there definitely would have been more of that fresh green flavor in the first bag though.

this is around when i started to really want a redesigned crucible/mouthpiece, where they are combined, and possibly better insulated., and could be removed between hits. this would end up being something similar to pulling a stem out of the PD/WDZ after every hit, so you can be sure that no undesired vaping is going on when you arent hitting it. even if its just lightly vaping, most ppl agree thats the best part of it.

but i also considered the possibility that the conduction of the crucible might be part of how the HA puts out consistent stream of vapor like it does, like you said. that the conduction keeps everything just below vaping temps so that as soon as you start drawing its starts coming off the buds, rather than taking maybe a few seconds to get back up to temp from a more room-like temp. but i think the HA has good enough heat retention in the airpath and a powerful enough element that it shouldnt effect it too much if the crucible was better insulated against conduction.

either way, i just always sit and vape on the crucible from the moment i load it in until its completely kicked now days to keep myself from worrying about wasted vapor, and if i do really need to quit mid session for some reason i just shut the HA off and take a few hits while its cooling, which i figure should help cool it down to well below vaping temps pretty quick ( i do get a few clouds usually too). even tho im sure if there is its a negligible amount and not really worth fretting over as much as we all do, some of us are obsessive about it i guess

finer screens

Where are said finer screens procured?

I got mine from ebay. Like $6 for 100 stainless steel. Search "pipe screens". 5/8 fit into the bowl perfectly. I had to clip a little piece to fit into bottom of mouthpiece.

It was from this guy. He's got many sizes, brass or SS.

http://cgi.ebay.com/100-Stainless-S...418?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item51986caeb2


Also, what can I do with the ABV? I know there is a thread on this, but the HA is a special beast. Is there anything left after vaping at 375? If so, What do I need to do and how much do I need?

eh, if i only vape up to around 375-380 i usually keep the abv, otherwise i just pitch it if i go any higher. i crumble the buds up into the container with the rest of my abv from my other vapes, and once i get a good sized amount of it i make some QWISO with it. depending on if i'm getting low on herb or not i might make some up with just like 7g of abv, but ideally i would say more like 28g if youre just using HA @ 375F abv for sure. there are a few threads out there on how to make it, but the short ver is soak the abv in enough iso alcohol to cover the abv for x amount of time ( some ppl say like 30s-1min but i just let it sit for 5 or so personally), pour mixture through some sort of filter (unbleached coffee filter or better yet a fine tea diffuser or cheesecloth) and into a flat level glass or maybe metal i guess pan, make sure you squeeze out all the iso from the abv good. then either let it sit and evap for a day or two or put it over a pot of water and boil it (careful if youre using gas stove... no im not talking from experience ) for about 5-10 mins, just make sure you open a window or two. scrape up goo with razor and enjoy on your next load of herb

 

[Egzoset]

Hi Steiner666,

You know what, i've had an heretic idea behind my head for some time now and it's about time i spit it out!

What if HA ABV happens to be so depleted simply because the noble molecules get only 2 options:

1) Exit the crucible and be captured in a bag, or directly inhaled.
2) Stay in the crucible and be destroyed right there on the spot.

?

Here's where this is leading...

In other words, we know in qualitative terms that the ABV in a HerbalAire is the most "spent" of all.

...well, at least i believe it's true lots of people would tend to agree on that...

But i wonder, in any case!



How do we know the HerbalAire really extracted all of the goodies out of that ABV???

E. G., could it be dark-brown just because whatever won't leave gets deeply baked?...

Euh...

OKay, i'm ready. Who wants to crucify me?

 

[Hippie Dickie]

2) Stay in the crucible and be destroyed right there on the spot ...E. G., could it be dark-brown just because whatever won't leave gets deeply baked?...

good question! i've wondered that myself. "dark brown" means very well oxidized (short of being ignited). but does the thc not extracted get reabsorbed by the ABV? or just chemically reduced into what? vapor, right? the dark brown means the herbal material is adequately heated to vaporize the thc. where else can it go?

 

[notmyrealUSERname]

cds:

I've never used a log vape, but suffice it to say the HA is famous for extremely thorough extraction, but is also infamous in my view for having such a very hot bowl which causes always-on conduction vaporization. No one else seems to bitch about it. All that considered, you can still drop in very little and get what seems like quite alot.

i think that vapes that use both conduction and convection heat are better at producing efficient clouds. lets look at four popular vapes, the pd, sv, ha, and the vxc. i would suggest that all of these vapes use conduction and convection heat in order to be as efficient as they are. the pd stem, ha crucible, the sv 'load tube', and the vxc ez bowl, are all metal. i am sure that this helps keep the vaping material at a constant temp so that when the air is drawn over it, the vape will be able maintain temp better (react quicker to temp changes, in order to stabilize to the desired temp).

i don't think you will ever be able to eliminate the conduction aspect from these vapes, so if it really bothers you then i think you will need to go back to your dbv, where you can manually remove the bowl in between hits. but then you will have to deal with other negatives like whips, stirring and repacking your bowl. as far as i can tell the only negative to having a conduction style vape is that you should finish the bowl in one sitting - otherwise it can be wasteful. but in the end this could be a benefit as you should only pack what you need anyways.

egozet:

How do we know the HerbalAire really extracted all of the goodies out of that ABV???

i have tried to do a qwiso wash with my abv, and it was not good. therefore, i would have to assume that there is nothing good left in it. to know for sure i would think that you would need to do a gas chromotography test.

E. G., could it be dark-brown just because whatever won't leave gets deeply baked?...

this is an interesting idea, i will need some time to think about it. hwoever, if you are constantly moving air through the crucible aka blowing bags, then wouldn't all the medicine get caught up in the moving air? i am assuming that the medicine weighs less than the air... therefore, the left over plant material will be browned due to the conduction heating of the crucible.

 

[Tstat]

Hi everyone! Our latest review at OceanStateCannabis.com is the HerbalAire! As always, please let me know if there is anything in the review that is incorrect.

http://oceanstatecannabis.com/?p=568

 

[max]

cds:

I've never used a log vape, but suffice it to say the HA is famous for extremely thorough extraction, but is also infamous in my view for having such a very hot bowl which causes always-on conduction vaporization. No one else seems to bitch about it. All that considered, you can still drop in very little and get what seems like quite alot.

i think that vapes that use both conduction and convection heat are better at producing efficient clouds. lets look at four popular vapes, the pd, sv, ha, and the vxc. i would suggest that all of these vapes use conduction and convection heat in order to be as efficient as they are. the pd stem, ha crucible, the sv 'load tube', and the vxc ez bowl, are all metal. i am sure that this helps keep the vaping material at a constant temp so that when the air is drawn over it, the vape will be able maintain temp better (react quicker to temp changes, in order to stabilize to the desired temp).

i don't think you will ever be able to eliminate the conduction aspect from these vapes, so if it really bothers you then i think you will need to go back to your dbv, where you can manually remove the bowl in between hits. but then you will have to deal with other negatives like whips, stirring and repacking your bowl. as far as i can tell the only negative to having a conduction style vape is that you should finish the bowl in one sitting - otherwise it can be wasteful. but in the end this could be a benefit as you should only pack what you need anyways.

egozet:

How do we know the HerbalAire really extracted all of the goodies out of that ABV???

i have tried to do a qwiso wash with my abv, and it was not good. therefore, i would have to assume that there is nothing good left in it. to know for sure i would think that you would need to do a gas chromotography test.

E. G., could it be dark-brown just because whatever won't leave gets deeply baked?...

this is an interesting idea, i will need some time to think about it. hwoever, if you are constantly moving air through the crucible aka blowing bags, then wouldn't all the medicine get caught up in the moving air? i am assuming that the medicine weighs less than the air... therefore, the left over plant material will be browned due to the conduction heating of the crucible.

I've used the herbalAire a lot and I would agree with these answers. If the HA crucible was not aluminum and didn't get hot, what would the design be and how efficiently would it work? Is this a vape to load up large and hit via whip over a long time period, like an hour? Probably not. But as it is, it works great for bags, which was the primary design, and works fine for direct draw unless you load a really big bowl. If leisurely direct draw is what you want, then get a whip vape, where the load stays cooler unless you're hitting it. Different vaping styles is the reason we have so many different models. You decide how you want to use a vape, then find the one that suits. There isn't one that works well with every single vaping method.

As for questioning the HA's efficiency, I've emptied many a crucible, and with bag use the ABV color is always a 100% uniform medium brown (temp dependent of course). Those 18 little inlet holes, combined with the steady air flow, do a great job. With direct draw, you're on your own, since it's your own lungs you have to depend on.

could it be dark-brown just because whatever won't leave gets deeply baked?

I don't know why you'd ask this about the herbalAire. Why would "whatever" NOT get vaporized just with this particular model? Vaporization is a simple process. Apply the correct heat, in a uniform manner, and vaporization happens. The main variable is how the vapor gets delivered. When a constant stream of hot air is flowing through the bowl, you can't get any more uniform in manner, and the path is straight up into the bag.

 

[charliedontsurf]

IMHO, 99% convection vapes are where it's at. With a strong, even enough current of well regulated air, conduction is unnecessary to achieving efficient, satisfying hits. To draw up two camps for examples sake, we'll have the Herbalaire and the Iolite in camp A, and the Magickwand, glass vapobowl and glass vaporgenie in camp B.

Camp A's residents have hot enough bowl surfaces to fry an egg. Even at 355 degrees, where most of us seem to begin, the Herbalaire's chamber is very, very hot, and will cause water to sizzle and sublimate instantly if you let it touch the surface. The Iolite takes this even further, being far hotter and using its conduction as virtually 100% of its heating method. Again, I bet you that the same heat replicated from either would be enough to fry an egg!

Camp B vaporizers' bowls never get that hot, or even close to that hot. Their bowls never get too hot to handle with bare hands (unless you're nutty with your torch) and do not seem to get hot enough to provide any conduction vaporization - they simply get hot enough to the point where they don't steal away and soak up heat provided in each case by a stream of hot air. They all provide far superior flavor than Camp A vapes, IMO, due to their 99% convection nature. I imagine the VXC will be far more in camp B than A, that the mesh bowls won't get all that hot.

Drop some herbal material in the herbalaire at 360 degrees, and just put your schnoz over the top - instant aroma of whatever you dropped in, beginning to react to the high heat. You enjoy that aroma and flavor, don't you? Do you want it going up in smoke? Same as the Iolite, just to a lesser degree, with convection thrown in or dominating the vaporization ratio depending on how you use it.

The MFLB is kinda camp C: a conduction vaporizer with very rapid heat-up and cool-down, so that the negative always-on effects we were talking about are largely avoided. The 10-20 hits we get out of a nice MFLB trench would likely be sliced in half if it worked along the Iolite lines of thinking, with an appropriately reduced temperature so that herb didn't burn.
Rant rant rant

The ability to do nugs is probably indeed related to having material in contact with a hot-ass surface combined with convection. ABV nugs out of the HA have a huge similarity to the ABV nugs out of my Vapolution - foul smelling, thoroughly dessicated dried masses which go completely to powder when crumbled.

 

[Egzoset]

Hi Hippie Dickie,
Hi NMRUN,
Hi Max,
Hi CDS,

Somehow you made me aware of the fact that i've been mistakenly interpreting the brown colour as a sign of "depletion". This is not always accurate, i must have forgot my own experiments with "doped" ABV where colour and potency were two totally independant parameters!

I believe a 3rd important parameter would be texture: a sticky brown nugget can be one which isn't done yet, or one that has re-absorbed noble molecules as the vapor started to condense. One that's brown and dry though would really happen to be depleted, on the contrary...

Hummm...

Maybe i need a convincing explanation for my HerbalAire's "No Grinding"/"No Stirring" feature i guess, one showing how the psycho-active molecules migrate outside of its crucible exactly! It would have to be based on experiments using some standardized load with a well defined psycho-active "charge", then comparative tests with the Volcano, etc., would become possible...

As Max points out, the HerbalAire works best when filling bags. Lucky me that's all i need - but i'm still curious.

CDS, when it comes to taste i must say i'd like your views to include the Herborizer, the Verdamper and similar (if any)! Other than the PVC/rubber smell when my HA was brand new i don't recall it "tasting" much anything after a couple sessions.

 

[sua]

so

I received it today

now, it's quite good. though I find I must use a pretty large amount to get a satisfactory state. that is, when I feel it. I used to be able to take tiny bowls in my bubbler and

I made something with a bong that is missing a downstem. I used an empty pen cone, thickened it with aluminum foil then isolated it with saran foil. then I took a straw and also did that to it. to put a balloon on it. in the carb hole. and I covered top of bong with foil and put my grinder on it for some weight,

I have made video of it

you can watch it here, I know light is poor it's 11:50 pm here. maybe later better lighting and maybe a better construction because well I made this in like 20 minutes with no proper planning or thinking ahead. just finding a new solution for every new problem as they arose. wow .
sorry I am very high

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v96jDZ9Mkkc

 

[Learner]

finer screens

Where are said finer screens procured?

I got mine from ebay. Like $6 for 100 stainless steel. Search "pipe screens". 5/8 fit into the bowl perfectly. I had to clip a little piece to fit into bottom of mouthpiece.

It was from this guy. He's got many sizes, brass or SS.

http://cgi.ebay.com/100-Stainless-S...418?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item51986caeb2


Also, what can I do with the ABV? I know there is a thread on this, but the HA is a special beast. Is there anything left after vaping at 375? If so, What do I need to do and how much do I need?

5/8" that's the size screen in the HA cruc?

 

[max]

Is there anything left after vaping at 375?

Absolutely. A few cannabinoids don't release until the temp is well above 400.

5/8" that's the size screen in the HA cruc?

Yes. It's the typical screen size for a lot of vapes.

 

[Learner]

5/8" that's the size screen in the HA cruc?

Yes. It's the typical screen size for a lot of vapes.

cool. thanks.

check these, Titanium Screen 5/8 Inch - 60 Wire

 

[Purpl3_Haz3]

so

I received it today

now, it's quite good. though I find I must use a pretty large amount to get a satisfactory state. that is, when I feel it. I used to be able to take tiny bowls in my bubbler and

I made something with a bong that is missing a downstem. I used an empty pen cone, thickened it with aluminum foil then isolated it with saran foil. then I took a straw and also did that to it. to put a balloon on it. in the carb hole. and I covered top of bong with foil and put my grinder on it for some weight,

I have made video of it

you can watch it here, I know light is poor it's 11:50 pm here. maybe later better lighting and maybe a better construction because well I made this in like 20 minutes with no proper planning or thinking ahead. just finding a new solution for every new problem as they arose. wow .
sorry I am very high

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v96jDZ9Mkkc

sorry that my comment doesnt have much to do with your post, but, is the lighting you used for your video a multi color remote controlled LED light bulb that screws into a light socket? I have one (eaglelight.com) and one of the modes makes the same colors that you had in your video...

 

[Learner]

just replacing the cruc screen or the mouthpiece screen as well?

 

[max]

5/8" that's the size screen in the HA cruc?

Yes. It's the typical screen size for a lot of vapes.

cool. thanks.

check these, Titanium Screen 5/8 Inch - 60 Wire

Titanium is overkill for a vape screen. Stainless steel is fine. Good thing too- $6 for one screen, + $5.95 for shipping, is way too much for me.

 

[steiner666]

just replacing the cruc screen or the mouthpiece screen as well?

i think most people do both. its easy to just plop a finer screen inside of the crucible, but you have to cut some off of a screen to get it to fit in the mouthpiece. IMO, the most important one to replace is the mouthpiece screen, especially if you're blowing bags. neither really NEED replaced if you plan to just vape whole chunks, but if you vape ground bud, or ground abv from another vape, its a good idea.

 

[budballer]

Hi, quick question, I'm kind of skeptical about the air path on the HA. It passes through quite a bit of plastic. They advertise the Mellon coating but that scares me even more. When Mellon is heated to certain temps it breaks down and becomes toxic. Ever heard of teflon flu? How can we be sure this unit is safe the breathe through?

 

[steiner666]

Hi, quick question, I'm kind of skeptical about the air path on the HA. It passes through quite a bit of plastic. They advertise the Mellon coating but that scares me even more. When Mellon is heated to certain temps it breaks down and becomes toxic. Ever heard of teflon flu? How can we be sure this unit is safe the breathe through?

I guess short of capturing and analyzing air thats been pumped through the HA at vaping temps, with really expensive equipment that i have no access to, would be the only definite way. but i guess the best evidence we have is that there are ppl who have been using the HA pretty much daily, for a few years with no reported side effects.

I also think that with the intelligence that went into designing the HA (judging by its performance), that they would have definitely made sure that it is safe to use. i mean, this isnt exactly some $50 chinese vape.

If you anyones seriously concerned or just curious, you could email HA about it and/or dissect and examine a HA, and provide lots of pictures

 

[Learner]

Yes. It's the typical screen size for a lot of vapes.

cool. thanks.

check these, Titanium Screen 5/8 Inch - 60 Wire

Titanium is overkill for a vape screen. Stainless steel is fine. Good thing too- $6 for one screen, + $5.95 for shipping, is way too much for me.

right right. makes sense. the screen won't have flame in contact with it.

 

[sua]

sorry that my comment doesnt have much to do with your post, but, is the lighting you used for your video a multi color remote controlled LED light bulb that screws into a light socket? I have one (eaglelight.com) and one of the modes makes the same colors that you had in your video...

haha, I understand, the video is of pretty low quality content wise anyway.

no, it's a philips livingcolours lamp, http://www.usa.philips.com/c/lighting-systems/livingcolors-clear-080044248/prd/en/


it's pretty good combined with white walls, though too expensive for its practicality.

 

[Purpl3_Haz3]

sorry that my comment doesnt have much to do with your post, but, is the lighting you used for your video a multi color remote controlled LED light bulb that screws into a light socket? I have one (eaglelight.com) and one of the modes makes the same colors that you had in your video...

haha, I understand, the video is of pretty low quality content wise anyway.

no, it's a philips livingcolours lamp, http://www.usa.philips.com/c/lighting-systems/livingcolors-clear-080044248/prd/en/


it's pretty good combined with white walls, though too expensive for its practicality.

Ah I see...This is what I have

 

[darco]

Hello everyone,

I'd just like to chime in here to say that I bought the herbal aire a year ago, thanks to this forum. It was my second vape after the Vapir Mini (which sucked cuz of how much you had to suck at it to get anything )

Over the year of usage, I have developed a love hate relationship with it, but it still is my default vape. I havent used the balloons since I first bought it and tried a few balloons, the vape from the balloons is awesome but its too messy. Dirties the pipes and the mouthpiece like hell and cleaning is a huge exercise. After trying most of the accessories I finally resorted to drawing directly from the main mouth piece. It hits well and is very very efficient in sucking everything out of the herbs. Seriously never smoke the ABV from an HA, there is nothing left to smoke.

What I hate is that it really is hard on the throat and throws everyone who tried it into a coughing frenzy. So much, that my wife hates it and has restored to joints. This causes me to switch between the HA and joints on and off too, which sucks.

I know a lot of you are using it with bubblers and bongs and maybe I will look into doing the same as I was considering buying a cool glass bubbler. Though I dont see me using it for everyday use. I recently tried a couple of portable vapes but dont like em either. So am back with my HA (sucking on it while I write this) and my quest to find the best vape for me continues ....