Whether those many things happen to me or a gift recipient, or someone the recipient sells it to should make no difference. Lifetime means lifetime, nothing about the unit itself changes with ownership transfer.
Fucking lifetime warranties, how do they work?
- Thread starter NajaNaja
- Start date
syrupy
Authorized Buyer
Hey I agree with you completely. I just don't know of any vape that has that kind of transferable lifetime warranty. If anyone does, chime in, because that will be the next vape I purchase.
Jared
Cannabis Enthusiast
Not lifetime I don't think but I remember an enano recently in the classifieds that was cracked. Epic Vape said the new owner could take over the warranty and get it fixed.Hey I agree with you completely. I just don't know of any vape that has that kind of transferable lifetime warranty. If anyone does, chime in, because that will be the next vape I purchase.
Kalessin
Well-Known Member
Personally I feel it would be a bit unreasonable to expect them to transfer a lifetime warranty for such a niche device. It's already a lifetime warranty on what will hopefully be a very reasonably priced vape, can't that be enough?... But I suppose I might feel that way because I don't tend to get rid of things, and because I'd be perfectly happy to help someone out with the warranty if I did happen to get rid of it eventually.
OF
Well-Known Member
But actually it very much does change. We've discussed this in several other vape threads. The warranty is part of the purchase contract. You gave your money in exchange for a new vape with warranty. It's in the contract.
If you sell it to me, we have a contract, I give you my money in exchange for a used vape. All quite legal and enforceable. However, I have no contract with GH. I have no claim legally since they had no 'quid pro quo' with me.
The example from school is ' say I offer to loan you the use of my car for your vacation. You rent a place on the beach, buy some new clothes, get the kids and wife all worked up, and I change my mind. You're SOL.' That's why PIs in old movies ask you for a dollar, and why so many agreements involve a dollar from one party. It satisfies the quid pro quo requirement and makes the contract enforceable.
When Stanley or MF give you free warranty service without a contract (you can't document purchase from them) they do so voluntarily. You have no recourse if they refuse.
That's the way the law works, it seems they know that? Lawyers I bet.......
Hey I agree with you completely. I just don't know of any vape that has that kind of transferable lifetime warranty. If anyone does, chime in, because that will be the next vape I purchase.
You're right, nobody has rights under such conditions. There are some few exceptions (smog control components on cars come to mind), but they are called out elsewhere in regulations. Even if the original deal was specifically 'spelled out' as transferable it's not without the original purchaser (who laid his money down and therefore has a contract that can be enforced).
Warranty to second hand owners is strictly voluntary. Such a second hand owner has no "standing". Or so they tell me.
OF
IAmKrazy2
Darth Vapor
@OF To piggyback your statement
Warranty transfer. I previously worked for a very high end internationl production company. A name you would be very familiar with. Each "product" cost roughly between $80,000 and $750,000 when purchased new. I was in charge of customer service for central US and Canada. The product carried a 4 year limited warranty. I had the power to help people outside of warranty in the event of issues occuring or when something failed that was not covered by warranty. I was always much more inclined to cut a check when the individual who i was helping either bought or serviced with our network of certified dealers across the country. That's where our money came from. If you buy second hand, the manufacturer has no skin on that game. You're not really their customer. Sometimes people would complain they were a loyalist to the brand, and that they had spent upwards of $500,000 on the product but had always bought used, and didn't buy the product used from out certified dealer network. I would basically politely explain from a business prospective they weren't really my customer, and the first time they reached out to the brand they were basically asking for a handout. Usually these conversations didn't go well, but it was part of the business... a damn stressful business.
Sorry to derail but just some perspective from the business standpoint on warranty transfer after second hand private sale purchases or purchases from non certified dealers. Cheers.
Warranty transfer. I previously worked for a very high end internationl production company. A name you would be very familiar with. Each "product" cost roughly between $80,000 and $750,000 when purchased new. I was in charge of customer service for central US and Canada. The product carried a 4 year limited warranty. I had the power to help people outside of warranty in the event of issues occuring or when something failed that was not covered by warranty. I was always much more inclined to cut a check when the individual who i was helping either bought or serviced with our network of certified dealers across the country. That's where our money came from. If you buy second hand, the manufacturer has no skin on that game. You're not really their customer. Sometimes people would complain they were a loyalist to the brand, and that they had spent upwards of $500,000 on the product but had always bought used, and didn't buy the product used from out certified dealer network. I would basically politely explain from a business prospective they weren't really my customer, and the first time they reached out to the brand they were basically asking for a handout. Usually these conversations didn't go well, but it was part of the business... a damn stressful business.
Sorry to derail but just some perspective from the business standpoint on warranty transfer after second hand private sale purchases or purchases from non certified dealers. Cheers.
Nothing I said even remotely suggests otherwise.
What I said was that it's weasely of them to say they stand proudly behind their product for a lifetime, and then to disavow any such pride of product if I were to buy one as a gift.
On the topic of the second-hand sale having carried no profit, so the fuck what? You got your profit, you expect me to have any feelings about the fact that you didn't get to sell it twice? If I buy a product at a price point that allows you to insure the product against defect, then it makes no difference to your bottom line if I use that warranty or the second owner does.
I make a product. I warranty my products for repair or replacement for a lifetime. Full stop. I don't care whether you bought it directly from me, received it as a gift, won it in a raffle, bought it from Craigslist, or found it in a park. Lifetime means lifetime. I guarantee the quality of my product, that has nothing whatsoever to do with who holds ownership.
Last edited:
In my experience, a very rare industry practice: Craftsman hand tools are?/were covered by what the company calls/called a "Forever Lifetime Warranty". I have, on numerous occasions, bought Craftsman metal hand tools at garage sales, and then gone to Sears Roebuck and had them all exchanged for brand new - no readily apparent defects other than scratches and normal wear & tear - no questions asked. Now this was some years ago, so their warranty coverage policies may have changed since then.
According to U.S. regulatory and Federal agency rules governing warranty practices, companies are free to define a lifetime any way they wish, but they have to be clear about their rules and their exclusions. Some issue the warranty to just the first owner of the product. Others qualify it with words such as reasonable or useful. And some high-tech companies spell out a policy under which the warranty's lifetime will end after sales cease and spare parts run out. There really aren't that many statutory requirements for manufacturers to worry about. They can make whatever warranty promises they want, but can't make them to be misleading, inherently contradictory, or illusory.
The question is simple: what's a lifetime? Is it the lifetime of the business, the lifetime of the owner (original or otherwise), or is the lifetime something else: a period that's not exactly defined but is probably so lengthy that a product is expected to either wear out or become obsolete long before it becomes defective? The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, which establishes warranty rules at the U.S. federal level, designates all written warranties as either "full" or "limited." A "full" lifetime warranty would be one that says a product will be repaired or replaced forever, no matter who owns it (transferability) or how it was broken. There would be no limit on the number of repair attempts for a recurring problem. If the warranty isn't transferable to a second owner, it's effectively limited by the lifetime of the original buyer. If it is transferable, then it may still be limited by the reasonably expected useful life of the product itself. As I see it, then, Grasshopper Labs, Inc., must be specific in their written language to specify whether or not their product and/or service warranty falls under the "Full" designation which implies transferability of ownership, or "Limited" which may not.
According to U.S. regulatory and Federal agency rules governing warranty practices, companies are free to define a lifetime any way they wish, but they have to be clear about their rules and their exclusions. Some issue the warranty to just the first owner of the product. Others qualify it with words such as reasonable or useful. And some high-tech companies spell out a policy under which the warranty's lifetime will end after sales cease and spare parts run out. There really aren't that many statutory requirements for manufacturers to worry about. They can make whatever warranty promises they want, but can't make them to be misleading, inherently contradictory, or illusory.
The question is simple: what's a lifetime? Is it the lifetime of the business, the lifetime of the owner (original or otherwise), or is the lifetime something else: a period that's not exactly defined but is probably so lengthy that a product is expected to either wear out or become obsolete long before it becomes defective? The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, which establishes warranty rules at the U.S. federal level, designates all written warranties as either "full" or "limited." A "full" lifetime warranty would be one that says a product will be repaired or replaced forever, no matter who owns it (transferability) or how it was broken. There would be no limit on the number of repair attempts for a recurring problem. If the warranty isn't transferable to a second owner, it's effectively limited by the lifetime of the original buyer. If it is transferable, then it may still be limited by the reasonably expected useful life of the product itself. As I see it, then, Grasshopper Labs, Inc., must be specific in their written language to specify whether or not their product and/or service warranty falls under the "Full" designation which implies transferability of ownership, or "Limited" which may not.
Last edited:
OF
Well-Known Member
In that case it's your call, and more power to you. But that's not what contract law says. To expect your view of how it should be to dominate over that is a bit naive perhaps?
AFAIK they are on solid ground. If you think otherwise, you can surely try to sue them......... I've watched this one play out before, a second hand customer for our product wanted us to fix it but since he'd stiffed the original buyer he was not getting support from him. His lawyer sent us a nastygram on long paper demanding service, our lawyer told us to stand fast.....which we did. We ultimately fixed it for a fee, which the lawyer suggested we 'get up front'. It wasn't cheap, the Old Man wanted to cover some of the lawyer fees on our end......ironic kinda.
I'm sorry you find it distressing, but those are, I believe, the hard facts of the matter. And as I said before, I suspect GH knows it?
Interesting. As I understand it it doesn't count there. It has to be 'a condition of sale', part of the transaction, to be binding? For instance, I can legally sell you the same product 'as is' under different contract with no warranty.
OF
OF
Well-Known Member
That, I think, ends the discussion?
And even without that restraint, a second hand buyer still can't demand service. Under law he 'has no skin in the game'.
Thanks.
OF
Frederick McGuire
Aggressively Loungey
Up front apologies that this isn't exactly 100% on topic for the GH...
It is technically true to say 2nd hand buyers aren't your customers...
But if that equipment is known for holding decent resale value, then that will be part of the value to buyers.
So in effect, those people may not be your customers, but they are a feature of the device.
By maintaining a happy secondary market, the primary market now has a better value proposition, and may be more likely to buy.
It also allows your primary customers to free up more capital to invest in your newer products...
It's not like all 2nd hand purchasers are leeches on every system...
I see it all the time in the gaming industry - publishers are continually trying to stifle used game sales, forgetting that for many people, they cannot buy a new game without selling their old one...
syrupy
Authorized Buyer
How would that work, practically? If I buy a hopper on the secondary market, say on ebay, can I really expect five years from now the original owner will be interested in helping with the warranty? If so, I'd have to send the hopper to the original owner, who would mail it in and receive the new/fixed unit and mail it back to me? Please explain, I'm failing to see how this would work in the real world.
It may not always be convenient, practical, or doable, but if it can be arranged through good communication and cooperation, then the option will benefit the 2nd user.
IAmKrazy2
Darth Vapor
This would make the most sense if you gift a GH to a friend you could act as their warranty contact point and they would retain the warranty vs. When you sell one on ebay trying to jack up the price while there is still supply and demand issues and an affordable price point that person is shit out of luck.
OF
Well-Known Member
Yes, it would be your responsibility to 'stay in contact' with the seller if you expect him to honor HIS WARRANTY TO YOU. That's where your contract is, with him not GH. While it would probably be impossible to enforce, if he sold it to you with a warranty your case is with him. This is, of course, why many wisely want to check if the maker will honor warranty claims from EBay sales and the like. But that is only an agreement, not a legal contract with recourse through the courts.
No, it is not necessary for you to send it to him to mail to them. He has to make the claim, you can be his agent and send and receive it on his behalf. But he has to contact them and make the demand for service as I understand it.
OF