uncanni
Well-Known Member
Except that most of those masks from your article have the recommended 95% level of protection... Not that one wants to gamble with who the manufacturer is.
Corona Vaping
- Thread starter MegaMan2k
- Start date
Except that most of those masks from your article have the recommended 95% level of protection... Not that one wants to gamble with who the manufacturer is.
Abysmal Vapor
Supersniffer 2000 - robot fart detection device
I meant it more like most of the certification is bullshit. They all sell as they are the same standart,but it is a gamble of what you get.
Just use masks that are american and european standarts(N95,FFP2/FFP3),the KN95 is not always reliable.
They just decided to call of masks in public here,which is a big mistake IMO,but they also might have a point. They say that in hot weather you can get a bacterial pnemonia if you wear a mask for prolonged period,also their efficiency when they become wet from your face decreases a lot.
There are also a lot of thing that can go wrong with mask,looking at they way most people are wearing them here,on their chins with their nose out and constantly touching them with their hands,or pull it to the side so they can have a cigarette...
So while a mask might be a good idea for the careful user,it might not be the best solution to the masses vastly uneducated in the matter.
Masks are still mandatory at closed spaces though. I for once would not feel confortable entering closed or space without a mask . They also also mandatory at open spaces when you are close to someone ,lol... you can imagine what kind of bias that introduces and results in noone wearing them outside,
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Oh another fact about masks is that they dont work if you have facial hair grown,as it ruins the way they seal.So for guys with beards and mustaches it is quite useless as far as it goes to protecting them from others.
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Polarbearboy
Tokin' Away Since 1968
RE: Maskwearing in US
From an article in today's Washington Post describing their most recent survey:
"Eight in 10 say it is necessary for people in their communities to wear a mask when outside the home, and more than 8 in 10 say it is important for people to stay at least six feet apart from one another in public. Three in 4 say people in their communities should avoid gatherings with friends with whom they do not live, and more than 3 in 4 say people should stay at home as much as possible."
Who are the 20% of won't wear masks? Republicans armed with assault rifles and red hats who see no contradiction in their devotion to "freedom" and "liberty" for themselves and the very real potential of the disease continuing its spread and more innocent people dying.
From an article in today's Washington Post describing their most recent survey:
"Eight in 10 say it is necessary for people in their communities to wear a mask when outside the home, and more than 8 in 10 say it is important for people to stay at least six feet apart from one another in public. Three in 4 say people in their communities should avoid gatherings with friends with whom they do not live, and more than 3 in 4 say people should stay at home as much as possible."
Who are the 20% of won't wear masks? Republicans armed with assault rifles and red hats who see no contradiction in their devotion to "freedom" and "liberty" for themselves and the very real potential of the disease continuing its spread and more innocent people dying.
hinglemccringleberry
Well-Known Member
If I bring up the liberals I see who aren't wearing masks or the conservatives who are, you'd probably get uncomfortable because it contradicts your cozy scapegoating. And that doesn't even begin to get into the discussion of the lack of standardization on these masks from a materials, fitment, and handling standpoint, which also effects safety and isn't a partisan issue.
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Siebter
Less soul, more mind
He doesn't say those armed protesters are the only ones who won't wear a mask. But I think it's pretty safe to say that most of them actually do not. And while I'm not living in the u.s. of a., I think it's those kind of guys who managed to make wearing a mask or not become a political statement in the first place.
I do agree though that overgeneralization is not always helpful.
hinglemccringleberry
Well-Known Member
The majority of conservatives are more silent and reasonable and closer to the middle. You just never hear from them, you only hear from the loudmouth fringe rednecks who proselytize up the ass which unfortunately shapes peoples' opinions of the right as a whole. I long for the good old days back when all repubs and dems were moderates on the spectrum and could engage in civil adult fucking discussion with each other without it turning into rage and polarization like it does today. FWIW, I know a staunch ex military redneck type dude who bitches constantly about our rights being taken away by all of this, yet he wears a mask when going into stores. This is why overgeneralization is bad, mkay.
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Siebter
Less soul, more mind
I know that Trump and his friends are not typical for the conservative / republican movement at all and I also know that those militant protesters are a minority. However, there's a much stronger connection between those groups and the current administration than under the Bushes and Reagan.
Let's please minimize refrain from political generalizations. You can discuss what the current administration has done/not done without broadly criticizing the political party associated with it. I don't want to have to close this thread down, but broad-based political commentary will likely lead to personal attacks, name-calling and the like, so let's not go there.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Polarbearboy
Tokin' Away Since 1968
Its been almost eight weeks since we've been sequestering here. Thank god I had the intuition to stock up on vaporizables the day before Mass closed its adult use stores. For a couple of years I'd been doing mostly sativas during the day and indicas in the evening, believing that sats give some energy and inds help me to sleep. But this Staying Home for the pandemic has scrambled things.[Yah, I know that the genetics and chemistry folks say that sativa vs. indica is meaningless.] Now I find myself craving an indica to calm me down after reading the news in the morning. And by evening I'm sometimes so bored that I want the sativa to keep me awake. I also miss sharing and laughing with friends. Anyone else having their cannabis routines thrown into similar confusion?
Siebter
Less soul, more mind
@Polarbearboy – I used to have pretty much the same routine as you, indicas for evening time & watching movies, sativa for daytime, outdoors & job interviews. I prefer sativas more than usual now, being focused and a bit giggly at the same time seems to be the perfect mindset at pretty much any time of the day. :-)
TommyDee
Vaporitor
Sometimes the human constitution needs to be shook. I understand and appreciate your observation completely.
Polarbearboy
Tokin' Away Since 1968
I live in the mountains, which I moved to when I retired. There are stunningly beautiful empty places all around here to ride my bike--after a couple of tokes. The three--wildness, reefer, and physical exertion--give me a break not only from home but from thinking about politics. I always have my Crafty or Fury 2 in my daypack, well equipped with dosing caps so I can easily refill in wind or mist.
To get out, I've been riding every even partly decent day since this all started in mid-March and getting on the exercise bike in the basement on bad days, always with some toking before hand. I especially like riding up long moderate hills, as I no longer can get my heart or breathing rates up on the flats. This last week I had my bi-annual physical, which I was surprised that the doctor wanted to do. In spite of eating like a pig because I stocked up on and stored or froze all my favorite goodies--ribs, wings, cookies, chips, strong ales, etc.--and I'm stoned a lot so have weak self control, I've just had the lowest blood sugar(diabetes in family) and lowest cholesterol in 25 years. It can only be due to the methodical exercise. Or could it be the daily infusion of cannabinoids?
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ginolicious
Well-Known Member
This was the high light to my morning. WHO who we all love. Lol!!!! Just said it may never go away.
https://apple.news/ADJK5r6gdQP2laEFbnD-rfQ
https://apple.news/ADJK5r6gdQP2laEFbnD-rfQ
His_Highness
In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king
Good advice! We've been taking Vit D supplements along with a multi for quite awhile. I've been working from home for years and the wife is retired. Our primary doctor noticed a drop in our vitamin D levels once we started spending so much more time in the home.
ginolicious
Well-Known Member
I read something that said those who have vitamin D deficiency have a higher risk of getting a heavy infection from Covid. I know the sun beaming on my face through my sunroof feels great every evening on my drive home from work. Just love the feeling. And plenty of sun on the weekends in the backyard. I need my sun.
His_Highness
In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king
A cytokine storm is an excessive immune response by the body when reacting to the virus that can cause, among other things, inflammation that damages the lungs. Some experts believe that a vitamin D deficiency is one of the primary causes of this excessive response.
When my primary care doc found that the wife and I had a vitamin D deficiency we were already taking a multi vitamin with vitamin D and were getting plenty of sun on the weekends. We spend a lot of time in the backyard in Florida "staycation" on the weekends but we didn't get out much during the day during the work week. We do jog/walk/run after the sun goes down. We've had good vitamin D levels for years now according to the yearly physical exams since adding the recommended separate vitamin D supplement.
uncanni
Well-Known Member
Well, viruses are some nasty ass shit: measles, smallpox (which has been around for over 2,500 years), chickenpox, herpes, etc.--viruses never completely disappear. Why shouldn't it happen with covid19?
ginolicious
Well-Known Member
I agree. But a lot of those such as smallpox and measles have a vaccine. Creating a vaccine for a corona virus is very difficult to do. Covid has created a new scenario for humanity that will change how we live.
Tranquility
Well-Known Member
I see this site is dying soon (Or, like Easter, the mods may have created a 4/20 miracle. Didn't take three days either.) and wanted to make a last post.
What of the flu?
While we have a vaccine, it is not completely effective. A large part of the efficacy problem is the flu is not the flu is not the flu. That's why they include three or four guesses in the seasonal vaccine--they're making an attempt to target the virii/viruses that might infect us that year. And, SARS-CoV-2 is already a little like that. While still causing COVID-19, it seems there are at least two different mutations of the virus affecting the U.S. One seems to have come directly from China and infected the western states and the other came from Europe and infected the eastern states. Of course, it is not so 1 or 0, but the point is there are at least two variations of the SARS-CoV-2 out there. We don't need a vaccine, we need two. (That's if there is no more mutations in the virus and we're talking basic vaccine theory. There are some other potential vaccine paths out there.)
Further, with the flu vaccine, even if the virus is properly targeted, not everyone becomes immune.
Containment was an early hope. The ability to diagnose/test, track and trace each incidence until we get rid of it. Once containment failed and community spread occurred, mitigation is the only thing that can be done. If we mitigate it hard enough for long enough we might kill the virus in humanity--like the claim against smallpox. But, that is decades of focused effort away.
We should change our lives for a risk that seems the exact same as we have taken since the "flu" was first diagnosed? We're not going to be safe from COVID-19 or from disease in general no matter what mitigation measures we can reasonably take. Safety theater is not going to save us. We're still going to lose about the same number year after year to disease. That might be more of an issue of the health of the patient than the virulence of the disease. This is not the pandemic we've been fearing.
Here's the key. Do everything you can to keep from infecting others. That's what you can control; the risk you present to others. Masks, social distancing, not going out with a fever, coughing into your elbow, not spitting all over, don't lick other's ice cream and put it back in the freezer, things like that. For yourself? Wash your hands, don't touch your face, go outside and play more. I add Vitamin D, Zinc, Vitamin C and have scored a doctor that will treat aggressively if I catch it, but, that's more Astrology and less Astronomy.
On a different topic, what is the difference in incidence of respiratory-disease in trained medical professionals in a health care setting between using surgical masks or N95 masks? No difference. Well, a slight, non-significant difference. But, both groups pretty much got just as sick just as often. Theory was, these trained professionals didn't use the N95 right or that the N95 was so uncomfortable they didn't use it as much. That's the theory. If you read the discussion in the study and not just the article, there did not even seem to be much of a difference between the mask wearers and non-wearers, let alone between the types of masks. (Since the hypothesis of the study had to do with difference between the mask types, the data between those who did and did not wear a mask at all could not be a part of the results.)
As I wrote in Random Thoughts in January just before My-my-my-my-Corona became a political differentiation:
A mask is, generally, a mask.
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/09/190903134732.htm
Researchers may finally have an answer in the long-running controversy over whether the common surgical mask is as effective as more expensive respirator-type masks in protecting health care workers from flu and other respiratory viruses.
A study published today in JAMA compared the ubiquitous surgical (or medical) mask, which costs about a dime, to a less commonly used respirator called an N95, which costs around $1. The study reported "no significant difference in the effectiveness" of medical masks vs. N95 respirators for prevention of influenza or other viral respiratory illness.
"This study showed there is no difference in incidence of viral respiratory transmission among health care workers wearing the two types of protection," said Dr. Trish Perl, Chief of UT Southwestern's Division of Infectious Diseases and Geographic Medicine and the report's senior author. "This finding is important from a public policy standpoint because it informs about what should be recommended and what kind of protective apparel should be kept available for outbreaks."...
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/09/190903134732.htm
Researchers may finally have an answer in the long-running controversy over whether the common surgical mask is as effective as more expensive respirator-type masks in protecting health care workers from flu and other respiratory viruses.
A study published today in JAMA compared the ubiquitous surgical (or medical) mask, which costs about a dime, to a less commonly used respirator called an N95, which costs around $1. The study reported "no significant difference in the effectiveness" of medical masks vs. N95 respirators for prevention of influenza or other viral respiratory illness.
"This study showed there is no difference in incidence of viral respiratory transmission among health care workers wearing the two types of protection," said Dr. Trish Perl, Chief of UT Southwestern's Division of Infectious Diseases and Geographic Medicine and the report's senior author. "This finding is important from a public policy standpoint because it informs about what should be recommended and what kind of protective apparel should be kept available for outbreaks."...
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His_Highness
In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king
The approach we've been using since the start was meant to flatten the curve so that the medical establishments, medical equipment, PPE and those who we need working the front line wouldn't get completely overrun. Eradication via vaccine(s) would be nice but at this juncture we're still just trying to keep the curve flattened while looking for "something".
Anyone locate a study regarding the rate of transmission from the standpoint of a mask adding a layer of effectiveness to social distancing versus keeping the mask wearer safe? I have little to no faith in any mask protecting the wearer that isn't accompanied by a face shield. The eyes are an entry point too.
As @OldNewbie said "Do everything you can not to infect others".
Anyone locate a study regarding the rate of transmission from the standpoint of a mask adding a layer of effectiveness to social distancing versus keeping the mask wearer safe? I have little to no faith in any mask protecting the wearer that isn't accompanied by a face shield. The eyes are an entry point too.
As @OldNewbie said "Do everything you can not to infect others".
Siebter
Less soul, more mind
Very true, but again: we don't wear them for us anyway, we wear them to protect others in case we are infected (which we can't always know for sure, from what I remember we are most infectious right before we see the first symptoms). That's one of the major misunderstandings when it comes to the question which mask is right or if they can be effective at all.
virtualpurple
Well-Known Member
Just to speak on this a little bit, as a healthcare provider, yes healthcare workers wear masks to protect their patients as well as themselves.
Not specific to covid, but in most clinical settings if a healthcare worker has respiratory symptoms or suspicion for a viral illness they will wear a mask to protect their patients and to help minimize the chances of passing something along to others.
In this Covid crisis we are wearing masks regardless of whether we think that we are personally ill because of course we want to prevent ourselves from getting infected, but also because there is certainly a chance that some workers are asymptomatic but carrying the virus, and we want to prevent potentially passing that along to our patients.
At the hospital I’m doing Covid relief for we wear one of several types of medical masks for all patient interactions except for patients showing symptoms associated with Covid-19. If a patient has a complaint of fever, cough, diarrhea, shortness of air, or a handful of other symptoms then we swap to the n95 mask with eye protection, gloves, and a disposable gown.
This illustration isn’t perfect in its explanation, but it gets the point across.
uncanni
Well-Known Member
From the CDC:
https://blogs.cdc.gov/niosh-science-blog/2020/04/09/masks-v-respirators/
"FFRs are designed to protect the wearer (e.g., healthcare worker) by removing at least 95% of particles from inhaled air....Surgical masks, on the other hand, are not specifically designed to protect the wearer from airborne hazards. These devices limit the spread of infectious particles expelled by the wearer. "
Siebter your information is still at odds with what some of the experts are saying.
Clearly, the experts are not in agreement about numerous covid19-related issues. We can continue to quote the experts, but there is no consensus.
https://blogs.cdc.gov/niosh-science-blog/2020/04/09/masks-v-respirators/
"FFRs are designed to protect the wearer (e.g., healthcare worker) by removing at least 95% of particles from inhaled air....Surgical masks, on the other hand, are not specifically designed to protect the wearer from airborne hazards. These devices limit the spread of infectious particles expelled by the wearer. "
Siebter your information is still at odds with what some of the experts are saying.
Clearly, the experts are not in agreement about numerous covid19-related issues. We can continue to quote the experts, but there is no consensus.
Siebter
Less soul, more mind
Hm, unless you think the same about what @OldNewbie and @virtualpurple just wrote, I think you don't get my point.