Chest pains since only vaporizing, anyone?

[Skunkport]

Exhaling the vape from my nose also was a bit irritating but that might just be the expectorant effect.

Why are you exhaling through your nose?
Also it shouldn't be taking you more puffs of a vaporizer than it does of smoke to get high. Are you inhaling vapor differently than smoke?

Concentrates isn't the answer if you've already tried CO2 carts, distillate is the only thing purer.

 

[Truth Seeker]

Why are you exhaling through your nose?
Also it shouldn't be taking you more puffs of a vaporizer than it does of smoke to get high. Are you inhaling vapor differently than smoke?

Concentrates isn't the answer if you've already tried CO2 carts, distillate is the only thing purer.

Not exhaling through my nose all the time just tried it to see what vape felt like. yeah the distillate carts caused same problem....heated oil fumes most def isn't the answer even my canna doctor isn't too crazy about it.

Yes, I'm inhaling slower with vaping compared to smoke

 

[chant86k]

I've had similar experiences, with chest pain and discomfort, mostly when I first started vaping.


I think that there are several factors involved. Everyone's body is different, and everyone reacts differently, to different things.

Strains can act differently, depending on how they are consumed.

The type of vape, temp, method, session length, etc.


I also believe, however, more than anything, that it is in fact, your body's response to a lack of combustion. When we combust, we cause damage to the cilia of the lungs. (The cilia are like waving fingers, moving things along - getting the gunk up and out of there). When we continue to combust, the cilia don't have the opportunity to grow back / heal /regenerate, so the gunk builds up.

When we abstain from combustion, the healing process begins…and we all know that healing can be painful or uncomfortable. Our body is working over-time, to try to clean things up, and get you back to normal. Even though it's a physical/physiological issue, it's similar to a withdrawal, in that you often become 'sick before you get better'.



That being said, I have a very sensitive respiratory tract. If I take too many hits, use a crappy vape, let it get too hot, take the material too far, or vape too much in general, then it also doesn't feel great.



You may also consider down-regulating (consuming less, or even no material, for a while), so you're tolerance isn't as high.

 

[guipesa]

Hello, I tell you my experience with the vapes. I have had to stop vaping because of various side effects extreme dry mouth and throat, chest and back pain, shortness of breath. Vaporizers I've had Arizer Solo and Extreme Q, Volcano and Crafty, DaVinci IQ, Phoenix, Boundless CFX, VapCap M, Sticky Brick Junior The Junior, I still hurt the money I spent. Ways to vaporize all high and low temperatures, with water without water ... reviews of forums thousands. Conclusions unfortunately the vaporizers are not made for me, the taste of steam is a delight the Crafty loved me but it was him or me. I think that the vapor when it condenses the own sticky resin, when it is in the plant, it hardly dissolves in the body, it makes me funny when people say that when they vaporize clean the lungs.

 

[Truth Seeker]

Thank you guys for all your great ideas, I don't think there's any right or wrong ideas about this I've been combusting for a year and half I think I will continue to stop combusting for a while and use tinctures/edibles and try to find a vape method that can work for me and only intermittently.

I guess with any type of vape or combustion the idea of minimal usage and taking time off for the body to properly recover is important.

I've taken to heart the article here on Vaping Vs Combusting and to stop combusting entirely before making any decisions on whether vapes work for the individual or not.

Cannibis is different for each person as far as proper dosage goes and less is always more and it's far prudent to under do it than over do it. Same goes for coffee and foods....too much of anything will eventually cause issues.

 

[invertedisdead]

Hello, I tell you my experience with the vapes. I have had to stop vaping because of various side effects extreme dry mouth and throat, chest and back pain, shortness of breath.

If you can cure dry mouth by smoking all the power to you. But minus the back pain, those seem like pretty normal symptoms of inhaling hot air. That said, I'd be cautious inhaling anything foreign if you are having trouble breathing.

I think that the vapor when it condenses the own sticky resin, when it is in the plant, it hardly dissolves in the body, it makes me funny when people say that when they vaporize clean the lungs.

How long have you vaporized EXCLUSIVELY without combusting?
I know it's been nearly a decade since I coughed up anything black, my joint smoking family members are still coughing up tar on the daily, just as they've done for the last 40 years.

 

[Abysmal Vapor]

Hey @Truth Seeker ! I am really bugged by respiratory discomforts caused by vaping. I only vape trough water.I hate restricted airflow.. Imo the biggest problem for me are the herb particles,also the airpath of the vaporizers i use. I get heavyness in chest from X-max and other similar ceramic chamber vaporizers ,even if i vape trough water and also getting this almost from any direct draw vaporizer. They all have clapton tape,wires and toilet paper in the airpath or at least most of them.There are many companies that claim isolated airpath from electronics but i have gutted out more than a few and concluded that every time for the shitty feeling i get in my lungs there is a reason easily seen in the insides.
Also the purity of the vaporizables is another big thing. You want only the cleanest and you try to preserve it at best,avoiding environmental dirt and hairs(oh man, the hairs (puke)..isnt hard,but avoiding residual nutritionals ,pesticides ,irradiation - not easy but probably possible if you are lucky enough to live somewhere where they list the ingredients .
I know i am not the only one with sensetivity issues,maybe you should shoot @Alexis a pm. He had quite a journey going trough different vaporizer setups,until he founds a couple that work for him. Cartridges are not holly heaven ,there are additives,those ceramic coils can create particles,etc..
Imo you should figure out a setup which features a vaporizer made out of high quality parts and clean airpath ,and possibly some sort of water filtration which fits your lungpower and habbits.
I have mostly won my battle withAcid Reflux but it comes from time to time. So if you have any problems with your stomach of similar kind i suggest avoid drinking a lot of liquid and eating prior vaping. Alkaline water and diet helps a lot.

 

[Truth Seeker]

Hey @Truth Seeker ! I am really bugged by respiratory discomforts cause by vaping. I only vape trough water.I hate restricted airflow.. Imo the biggest problem for me are the herb particles,also the airpath of the vaporizers i use. I get heavyness in chest from X-max and other similar ceramic chamber vaporizers ,even if i vape from water and almost from any direct draw vaporizer. They all have clapton tape,wires and toilet paper in the airpath or at least most of them.There are many companies that claim isolated airpath from electronics but i have gutted out more than a few and concluded that every time for the shitty feeling i get in my lungs there is a reason easily seen in the insides.
I know i am not the only one with sensetivity issues,maybe you should shoot @Alexis a pm. He had quite a journey going trough different vaporizer setups,until he founds a couple that work for him. Cartridges are not holly heaven ,there are additives,those ceramic coils can create particles,etc..
Imo you should figure out a setup which features a vaporizer made out of high quality parts and clean airpath ,and possibly some sort of water filtration which fits your lungpower and habbits.
I have a won mostly won my battle with my Acid Reflux but it comes from time to time. So if you have any problems with your stomach of similar kind i suggest avoid drinking a lot of liquid and eating prior vaping. Alkaline water and diet helps a lot.

Water in nature is acidic (spring water) I drink some alkaline water but not by choice because it's trendy for the purified water people to raise the PH.....IMO over drinking alkaline water could possibly dilute stomach acid in the long term. My personal theory but food for thought non the less.

I've heard that acid reflux could possibly be an under acid symptom.......this really goes against the grain but the older we get the less HCL our stomach produced....just my 2 cents and it might not even be worth that! But it might help view things in a different light and help someone out here? Peace

Thanks for the heads up! Glad that there's so many like minded health conscious people on this forum!

 

[invertedisdead]

Imo the biggest problem for me are the herb particles,also the airpath of the vaporizers i use.

That's why I dab rosin (essentially a cleaner version of traditional hashish. Like a cross between Moroccan and Afghani.) All glass air path. None of that vaporized degraded plant material.

Most cannabis using cultures across the world have been removing plant material from cannabis for thousands of years. Plant material promotes combustion, the removal of it supports more proper vaporization. Even with a flame you can vaporize good hash, but cellulose plant material will quickly singe.

 

[Truth Seeker]

It seems like flower might be inferior to vape due to those reasons and the oils, terpenes and such might be an irritant when vaped even with water bubblers it does seem excessively dry

 

[guipesa]

The truth is that there are several factors, but I still think that the main one is the cannabis resin, once it is evaporated with the vaporizer it returns to condense inside our body in its initial state sticky resin hardly soluble in our organism. With the bags of the Volcano you can let them cool for 30 minutes and the sensation of dryness is the same with the filtration with equal water.

 

[invertedisdead]

The truth is that there are several factors, but I still think that the main one is the cannabis resin, once it is evaporated with the vaporizer it returns to condense inside our body in its initial state sticky resin hardly soluble in our organism.

I don't recall members here coughing up vapor resin though. Only stuff caused by combustion. The only thing I get from vaporizing is mucus production, which could stem from a number of things.

Do you believe the sticky tar that accumulates from combustion is better?

With the bags of the Volcano you can let them cool for 30 minutes and the sensation of dryness is the same with the filtration with equal water.

The Volcano is the driest vaporizer I've ever used. It is a good vaporizer but it would not win any smooth vapor awards in 2018.

 

[Abysmal Vapor]

@invertedisdead I am recently getting into rosin. For sure i will say i dont want silicone paper at the pressure point ,after inspection with a microscope at the pressing area. The new driptech presses seems really nice though,i kind got around it with using the Slug with mounted temp read ,handle and SS foil as a pressing surface.I can for sure tell the difference between rosin pressed on paper and on metal.. i dont know if it because of the silicone particles or other shit involved in the parchment.
Also even the lightest color rosin is less tasty than real good QWET(40 second wash at -27 celsius),but it has its own niche. I like your comparison to traditional hash. To me hash also feels degraded in taste ,although is still good and different,the same is with rosin but to a much less extent.I can say that with rosin i get 70-80% of taste i would get if i vape the herb,but with QWET i do get like 500% the taste..
Probably wasting those terpenes in the making further attributes the smoothness as some of them can get itchy on the throat,but i still prefer having them compared to not having them ,i am a flavour whore..

 

[guipesa]

Not at all the tar of combustion is chemically much worse for the organism that nobody questions, now I do not think it is more viscous than oil and sticky. Seriously you do not remember anyone coughing after a steam hit, you just have to see on YouTube any revision of vape after each hit there is the corresponding cough. Why do you think the Volcano is drier? In my case, the combustion produces a thousand times more mucus, while the opposite vapor dries me up to the mucus.

 

[chant86k]

It seems like flower might be inferior to vape due to those reasons and the oils, terpenes and such might be an irritant when vaped even with water bubblers it does seem excessively dry

I will say that I only use flower, but I am VERY picky, about which strains I use. I only use the best that I can find, almost always organic…just well-grown, high-quality product. And I LOVE every session. It tastes amazing, and my lungs and throat feel better than they ever have. And as a prior-combuster, I too had the black tar, which I no longer have.

But, I actually don't enjoy it as much, when the flower is not up to par. I've found myself giving flower away, for this reason.

I am also interested in moving to more concentrated methods…but I have a hard time wrapping my head around the idea that it's better to change the plant from it's natural form.

Water in nature is acidic (spring water) I drink some alkaline water but not by choice because it's trendy for the purified water people to raise the PH.....IMO over drinking alkaline water could possibly dilute stomach acid in the long term. My personal theory but food for thought non the less.

I've heard that acid reflux could possibly be an under acid symptom.......this really goes against the grain but the older we get the less HCL our stomach produced....just my 2 cents and it might not even be worth that! But it might help view things in a different light and help someone out here? Peace

Thanks for the heads up! Glad that there's so many like minded health conscious people on this forum!

As for Acid Reflux, it most definitely can be caused by insufficient HCL. (BTW, if anyone has been on an H2 blocker for an extended period of time, please see your doctor and switch to something else, so you don't end up deficient in Calcium, and thereby losses in bone density.)



According to all my chemistry and biology professors, the body is too well-regulated for alkaline water to make any type of a difference.

What you can do, though, is consume high amounts of alkaline foods (such as leafy green vegetables - which are amazing for you, anyway), and this can slowly, over time, alkalize your body.


...Sorry for getting so off-topic! I'm done now.

Happy Vaping, All!

 

[stardustsailor]

After having read all the posts of this thread ,
i think i 've gathered enough indications of what may actually is happening with irritation from vaping .

Osmosis .

Vapor in contrast with smoke is an aerosol .
While smoke does contain some water ,the vapor is actually water molecules that carry other substances .
That means that the vapor could be hypertonic .Thus dehydrating the cells that do come in contact with .

Just a hypothesis ...

 

[guipesa]

[QUOTE = "stardustsailor, post: 1318444, miembro: 30314"] Después de haber leído todas las publicaciones de este hilo,
Creo que he reunido suficientes indicaciones de lo que realmente está sucediendo con la irritación de vapear.

Osmosis .

El vapor en contraste con el humo es un aerosol.
Mientras que el humo contiene algo de agua, el vapor es en realidad moléculas de agua que transportan otras sustancias.
Eso significa que el vapor podría ser hipertónico. Así deshidratar las células con las que entra en contacto.

Solo una hipótesis ...
: 2c:[/CITAR]
At first that was my thought, and it is true as long as the vapor next to the air is hot because as we know the humidity is relative to more heat, more water can contain the air, once the humidity in the air returns to the initial temperature It is the same as at the beginning. The herb vapor is cannabis oil and water, but they are not mixed since the oil and water are not homogenized. With this I mean for many water molecules that you put in the system you will always resect the mucosa of the body because oil and water "mucous" do not mix.

 

[jardri]

I have another theory. I am a grower and I vape my own buds. I only feed my plants with natural fertilizers, never the industrial ones. When I vape my plants everything is smooth. When I vape some dealer buds I get pains and a headache. I think it is because of the products the growers use. When you smoke all this shit burns but when you vape you may be inhaling massive amounts of heavy metals and nitrogen derivates.

 

[invertedisdead]

@invertedisdead I am recently getting into rosin. For sure i will say i dont want silicone paper at the pressure point ,after inspection with a microscope at the pressing area. The new driptech presses seems really nice though,i kind got around it with using the Slug with mounted temp read ,handle and SS foil as a pressing surface.I can for sure tell the difference between rosin pressed on paper and on metal.. i dont know if it because of the silicone particles or other shit involved in the parchment.
Also even the lightest color rosin is less tasty than real good QWET(40 second wash at -27 celsius),but it has its own niche. I like your comparison to traditional hash. To me hash also feels degraded in taste ,although is still good and different,the same is with rosin but to a much less extent.I can say that with rosin i get 70-80% of taste i would get if i vape the herb,but with QWET i do get like 500% the taste..
Probably wasting those terpenes in the making further attributes the smoothness as some of them can get itchy on the throat,but i still prefer having them compared to not having them ,i am a flavour whore..

I squish drip tech with parchment paper, you can press with no paper if you want. I would be interested in seeing photos from your microscope experiment. I don't have a microscope so I have not examined anything like that. Honestly I would recommend a hair straightener over the Slug if you haven't tried one, the rosin I've seen in the Slug thread always looks more degraded than any other pressing method.

IMO that is a very bold claim to state that you can tell when something has been squished on paper, I'm curious what vaporization gear you are using to note such findings?

IMO more terpenes are lost in the purge process of an ethanol extract than rosin pressing but it's subjective. The boiling point of ethanol is one of the highest of any commonly used solvent though, it's generally used for winterizing or extracting crude oil for distillation here since ethanol is not a good solvent for terpenes. Even when pulling a vacuum, the amount of time required to purge is just so much longer than pressing, I feel the flavors are just continually degrading that whole time under vac.

Ethanol is polar so in a chemical extraction it can only pick up that fraction of the terpenes when compared to non selective mechanical separation. Cannabis is predominantly non polar monoterpenes. Personally I've never had an alcohol extract on par with hydrocarbon or solventless, I'd really like to try your hash if you note 500% flavor. Kinda curious why you still vape dried herb with hash that good? It should have almost no plant lipids with your extraction temperature which makes for a smooth vapor experience.

As a fellow flavor snob, in my experience, flower always have more smell and aroma than concentrate, the challenge is getting all the flavor out before ABV flavors occur. The closest I have found to eliminating that is single, one hit flower bowls. It works well, though the stone from flower is more sedative than concentrate, kind of like going from smoking to vaping.

 

[stardustsailor]

I have another theory. I am a grower and I vape my own buds. I only feed my plants with natural fertilizers, never the industrial ones. When I vape my plants everything is smooth. When I vape some dealer buds I get pains and a headache. I think it is because of the products the growers use. When you smoke all this shit burns but when you vape you may be inhaling massive amounts of heavy metals and nitrogen derivates.

Most heavy metals do not evaporate at the temperature range used .
But there are many stuff that can be POSSIBLY inhaled while vaping :
Bacteria , fungi spores ,insect eggs or larvae ,dust particles ,pollen coming from various plant species (cannabis resin glands -amongst others -serve as " pollen traps " ) ,cystolith trichomes /hairs,just to name a few .
Some of them are strong allergens .
But also the list goes on with toxic /hazardous evaporated substances : Possibly applied or wind -driven systemic fungicides / insecticides / pesticides ,ammonia , possible NOx & SOx gas compounds , etc.
Still ,I seriously doubt that is a matter of what kind of fert (mineral or organic ) was used .
Maybe it can be an issue of fert quality (you can find organic ferts that actually are made from pure sewage sludge... ) .

 

[Abysmal Vapor]

@invertedisdead I think you are a bit confused about ethanol,it evaporates at roomtemp. You dont need to boil something in order to evaporate it. You need to reach its evaporation temp.
My microscope is oldschool it doesnt have a usb or any way to attach a cammera to it sry,but you can get a USB microscope from CHina for cheap and check how is it with your squishes.
http://physicsexperiments.eu/1941/evaporation-of-water-and-ethanol-(with-thermal-imaging-camera)

Ethanol extraction is also known as an Absolute and it is widely popular in the Perfume industry escpecially because it preserves the terpenes,but they do it at insanely low temps and massive pressure. I was briefly an accountant for a Rose flower oil factory,i've seen various techs. They are actually cold pressing it ,then refine that to an absolute.

 

[invertedisdead]

@invertedisdead I think you are a bit confused about ethanol,it evaporates at roomtemp. You dont need to boil something in order to evaporate it. You need to reach its evaporation temp.
My microscope is oldschool it doesnt have a usb or any way to attach a cammera to it sry,but you can get a USB microscope from CHina for cheap and check how is it with your squishes.
http://physicsexperiments.eu/1941/evaporation-of-water-and-ethanol-(with-thermal-imaging-camera)

Ethanol extraction is also known as an Absolute and it is widely popular in the Perfume industry escpecially because it preserves the terpenes,but they do it at insanely low temps and massive pressure. I was briefly an accountant for a Rose flower oil factory,i've seen various techs. They are actually cold pressing it ,then refine that to an absolute.

I'm familiar with absolutes and have made them when I had more access to vacuum equipment. Alcohol does not fully purge at room temperature when dissolving a solute though. Sorry I was stoned and said boil versus evaporate, I just got done boiling a few dabs.

I like ethanol extracts a lot for vanilla!

 

[DOOM]

i noticed the coughs were pretty harsh, almost more than combustion when first starting. i thought i had chest pain but it was anxiety when i started vaping. i even went to ER.

 

[Truth Seeker]

After having read all the posts of this thread ,
i think i 've gathered enough indications of what may actually is happening with irritation from vaping .

Osmosis .

Vapor in contrast with smoke is an aerosol .
While smoke does contain some water ,the vapor is actually water molecules that carry other substances .
That means that the vapor could be hypertonic .Thus dehydrating the cells that do come in contact with .

Just a hypothesis ...

Brother or sister that sounds right on because my cotton mouth is very intense after vaping and it seems dehydrating on the body for hours afterwards. Edibles seem to dehydrate me too quite a bit and I always consume fluids especially purified water.

 

[vapirtoo]

Warm water hits are really nice and gentle on the lungs and body. No other pains? Just your chest?
Decades ago my crew was getting arthritic pain in our sternums. We chalked it up to some really sketchy awful tasting bootleg weed. We all got better in a few weeks after switching suppliers.