Cannabis Hardware (formerly NewVape) FlowerPot Twax Vaporizer

[Square4Life]

I do agree if multiple people report similar issues will create validity. That's not what happened here. This video is with the new bowl in question. Do you see anything wrong here?

Hi guys - so, I used my Pan Head last night.

Now, this is important (well, at least to me haha). I have only used the Pan Head for three each, approx .15 gr loads, so this not a mature opinion and is really only very first impressions, which I find are very often wrong with the passing of time.

Also, I recently retired from a lifetime of being a project/program manager of technical projects. I have sat on proposal evaluation boards, proposal prep teams, design reviews, test reviews teams, did flight test planning and conduction for a while, etc, etc, etc. What I'm saying is that by profession I'm trained to be critical. Not critical as in putting someone down, but critical as in looking at all of the details, large and small. In my professional world, we didn't huzzah for things that met the spec....the damn thing was supposed to meet the spec, our interest was in ferreting out discrepancies. I'm just saying this because I do tend to highlight the negative and not accentuate the positive but I also don't want anyone to think that any individual criticism constitutes an overall impression of the device. That and I must come off as very negative because I'm the only one to whom Edwyn feels he needs to tell that unused items are returnable! HAHAHAHA

Alright, a lot of preface now on to my impressions:

Nothing stuck into the glass at all during any of these three sessions. No sticking whatsoever. That was the intent and the goal was accomplished as far as I can tell

First load was with the 14 mm stem in a stevenlmz70, FC-188, Mobius Ion knockoff (14 mm dewar type joint in the middle of the top of the can with a sidecar MP). I used a drop down that I recently got and posted about some pages back. I got them off of Amazon and the quality is total shit. Also, although I do like my FC-188, I'm not sure how accurately the joint was made as I do have some adapters that are a bit loose in there (or the adapters are crap...either way). Further, I don't think the FC-188 type joint is good for the Pan Head as I think the stem will drop down too far (below the level of the can) before engaging the joint.

I mention all of this because when I ran my first load at my normal, capped, 620-625 F, the vapor was very respectable but definitely thinner, more watered down, than with my OG SH.

IMO, this 'thinner' vapor comes from a number of source; 1) small bit of 'air leakage'...contributed by the FC-188, the shitty drop down, AND the gap between the outside wall of the stem and the inside wall of the bowl (there is one, certainly). Now, the bottom of the bowl does indeed sit flat on the top of the joint, but not all joints are perfectly flat, I don't think that would be air tight even if the joint was perfect, and I do think a bit of air was getting in there from that source and; 2) the bowl is 2.5 mm deeper than my OG SH which I think was a contributor to the change in vapor.

I switched from the FC-188 to my C2, 65 mm stemless can with an 18 mm joint and fuck the drop down. I put the Pan Head right on the joint as I had no sticking before....meaning no expansion, so I took the chance. No problem with that, it turns out.

I also bumped my temp up to 645 F from 620 F to to compensate for the deeper bowl.

Much, much better. Very satisfactory. Still not sure its quite as thick as my OG at same temp, but I think this is bowl depth again...but very respectable performance and NO STICKING!! :-)

Ran two loads this way while drinking a Tito's Martini and at that point it was bed time. HA

I think, with the Pan Head, I will try to bump my temp up yet a bit again and see what that does.

But I'm also thinking about asking @NewVape710 (Edwyn) if he would, as a custom job, either mill the bowl on my current Pan Head back down to the SH OG depth or perhaps just ask if he would make me another with the shallower bowl.

Guys, I'm a lightweight compared to many. But even when I do consume more than normal, I do like that around .15 g bowl and just do multiple sessions if I want more. I understand that the bowl as made deeper (like the OG FP) by popular demand and I concede that my desires may not be the majority (and who the F can satisfy everybody..yeah?). But it would seem to be a very easy customization to just mill the top of the bowl down a bit and put the bevel back on. I'm going to think about it.

So, I'm still very happy with my OG SH and now my Pan Head but there is more to explore.

Best regards

On mobile so short replies.



Because it fits on the new stand and my first one has an issue with some dabbers. Not the end of the world or anything and I made it work.





I noticed that as well with the slightly more whispy vapor in the new panhead. I think the air gap contributes more to it but that's going to require more testing.

I noticed some lighter vapor than I was accustomed to with the final adjustabowl and I have been semi messing around with it for a day or two. What I have found corrects this issue well enough for me is if I apply a little pressure when I place the shower head to the body/bowl during a draw.

I noticed the same thing during my beta testing. I finally isolated it to the groove that the handle "point" rides in... it creates a small air leak that goes around the point and up the stem. If you place the bottom of the bowl flush with the top of the taper inlet, it stops the leak, it can't continue around the "L" of the lip with the glass and bowl-bottom metal in contact.

That seems like multiple reports of a similar issue to me...

Also, in reference to the video you posted...while the video doesn't show some apparent air leak, without a direct comparison using one of the other NV FP bowls, on the SAME piece, the video is moot. No one said it was unusable (in fact, they said quite the opposite, that while there was a noticeable leak, it wasn't bad). Just that in comparison to the previous bowls, the vapor was more whispy which presented the idea of an air leak causing dilution.

 

[muunch]

That seems like multiple reports of a similar issue to me...

yes - but look at the lost post you quoted, which offers a solution (requiring no extra materials):

If you place the bottom of the bowl flush with the top of the taper inlet, it stops the leak, it can't continue around the "L" of the lip with the glass and bowl-bottom metal in contact.

 

[Square4Life]

yes - but look at the lost post you quoted, which offers a solution (requiring no extra materials):

Ok? I'm not sure what your point is....

Edwyn stated there wasn't multiple reports. There are multiple reports.


EDIT: I'm going to be honest, I read the 'fix' again, and I feel more confused now lol

EDIT: I still think the issue is the top of the glass joints can vary and are not all going to be level and smooth. Hence why some pieces seem to milk up better/easier and others do not. If someone had a flat high temp rubber washer to use between top of the glass joint and the bowl, and setting the adjustment so the bottom isn't touching the inner taper, I'd be very interested to see how it'd affect those that saw slight more whisp. lol just my thoughts...I do not have the adjustabowl, I just can't imagine that area being THAT consistent from glass piece to glass piece. Or maybe there isn't an airleak at all who knows anymore

 

[muunch]

idk man. i shouldn't have posted cos i have no idea what's going on and why everyone's all huffed up(and frankly I don't care.... how do they say it? I don't have a horse in this race? ... or rather I just don't give a shit) ...but between this and the tubo thread I felt I had to poke myself in somewhere somehow

edit: @Square4Life same bro - I think the "fix" is maybe him stating a problem... and not a fix? lmao. Either he worded it odd or I missed the context and am just fuckin ript.

I'm too fucking high for this shit. Y'all can go on with your ego wars I'm out

 

[Square4Life]

I hear ya @muunch ...I guess I just hate to see something go down the drain over nothing. This thread solely pushed me to get the FP. Once I subscribed, the sheer amount of conversation was almost overwhelming. I mean, if it had this kind of following, that fast, it had to be something special, right? It was cool reading through the thread when I first starting looking at the FP and seeing how members were actually being listened to and influencing the product NV was building. How they were making revisions because of the input received and how gracious both parties were for it. Who wouldn't want to be apart of it? (not to mention the FP kicks all other vape's ass)

And then this happened. Will my FP not function as good as it was because of this? No.

Doesn't change the fact that all of this a huge let down and, on some level, taints the experience.

 

[PoopMachine]

I believe the issue may be variances in the different joints. You can really see that on drop downs. They all seem to be a little different and Im sure blowers are using those same joints on their pieces. Hardly any glass blowers do hand made joints because theyre very difficult to get right.

 

[invertedisdead]

Damn I just noticed with these new bowls, the SH sits on the bowls lip now instead of directly on the handle. I like that a lot!

 

[ParanoidAndroid998]

Damn I just noticed with these new bowls, the SH sits on the bowls lip now instead of directly on the handle. I like that a lot!

On the OG bowls the FP sat on the handle?!...

 

[invertedisdead]

On the OG bowls the FP sat on the handle?!...

 

[ParanoidAndroid998]

Woah, never realized that before.
Definitely prefer the new design.

 

[Cannabis-Hardware-Ed]

Ok? I'm not sure what your point is....

Edwyn stated there wasn't multiple reports. There are multiple reports.


EDIT: I'm going to be honest, I read the 'fix' again, and I feel more confused now lol

@Square4Life I'd like to edit that statement.

Here's the logic I'd like to think I use when receiving a complaint about a product that newVape has sold.

First time issues appears.
1) request the customer submit the complaint to sales@newvape.com we usually suggest they send photos or video if possible.
2) Immediately attempt to duplicate the complaint.

3) Try and decide if the complaint is either pilot error, lack of proper instructions, incompatible selection of interfacing parts, buyer remorse, or a combination.
5) suggest a solution to the customer. ​

4) If necessary offer the customer a refund. If I feel I'm to blame I will automatically refund and allow the customer to either keep the parts or send return shipping label with the replacement parts. Each case varies.

When multiple complaints appear similar in nature.
1) repeat above process.
2) Have our testers try and reproduce the problem.
3) Revise the part's design or manufacturing process.
4) Disclose short coming, add, modify, or create the website's part verbiage, or instructions so others won't have similar problems.
5) Reduce price or discontinue the part.

This same formula has been used successfully for selling 10 of thousands of pax accessories over the past 5 years.

 

[Square4Life]

@Square4Life I'd like to edit that statement.

Here's the logic I'd like to think I use when receiving a complaint about a product that newVape has sold.

First time issues appears.
1) request the customer submit the complaint to sales@newvape.com we usually suggest they send photos or video if possible.
2) Immediately attempt to duplicate the complaint.

3) Try and decide if the complaint is either pilot error, lack of proper instructions, incompatible selection of interfacing parts, buyer remorse, or a combination.
5) suggest a solution to the customer. ​

4) If necessary offer the customer a refund. If I feel I'm to blame I will automatically refund and allow the customer to either keep the parts or send return shipping label with the replacement parts. Each case varies.

When multiple complaints appear similar in nature.
1) repeat above process.
2) Have our testers try and reproduce the problem.
3) Revise the part's design or manufacturing process.
4) Disclose short coming, add, modify, or create the website's part verbiage, or instructions so others won't have similar problems.
5) Reduce price or discontinue the part.

This same formula has been used successfully for selling 10 of thousands of pax accessories over the past 5 years.

I totally get what you are saying ALTHOUGH that hasn't necessarily been the premise for this product/thread. Up to this point, at least from a member's perspective that was never on the 'inside' of any beta testing, the communication was always completely open and public, which again, was part of the allure to the FP.

I sincerely believe there was never any ill intent towards you or NV. No one was trying to drag you or your company through the mud nor show you up. A symptom was noticed, reported, and others chimed in confirming. It's basically your process above, just through the forum rather than private email. Hell, others even were finding way to help troubleshoot, isolate the problem, provide fixes they found, etc.

Everyone has an opinion. This is simply mine and I mean no offense with any of it.

EDIT: Cheers all. I'm just going to go ahead and sink like Homer into the bushes on this one. Sorry for all of the posts...guess I should've got in on the FP fun earlier
http://gph.is/13pwkMS

 

[lazylathe]

My new adjust-a-bowl should be here early next week and i will report my findings.
Also ordered a stubby bowl to try!

In other news i am back to the ShowerHead today!
Temp at 680F with a faster draw and using different WT's i am starting to get the hang of it!
Still absolutely love my OGFP!

I need another 2 controllers so i can have them all running at the same time!
And a triple Claisen adapter would be wicked!

The FP is still running as my DD and on for around 12 hours a day!

I love that @NewVape710 is here to share his ideas and brain storm with us. At the end of the day, what he does with his company is his decision. I know we all have our complaints about some issues but feel that this is the cost to be on the forefront of design technology. Other vape manufacturers take years to redesign a part and sometimes it is worse and sometimes better, as a buyer we have a choice to accept it or not. While other manufacturers never change their designs...
I read of an offer to return for full refund, that's a sweet deal!
All my experiences with New Vape and his staff have been positive and i love using their products.

I also have to agree with the order of communication.
Sometimes i see members first post on the forum and get everyone riled up instead of following correct protocol and doing this via e mail first.
If you are not happy once all the communication has gone down privately, then come and let us know what happened.

I am also not sure how many bowls have been sold to happy customers, reminds me a lot of the grasshopper fiasco...
Actually is there 1 perfect vape for anyone out there? I know i am still looking but the FP series has me very satisfied right now!

Let's all take a deep breath and agree that we ALL look at things differently, are affected by comments differently and ultimately we all came here to talk about the FlowerPot!

I am rambling now and losing my train of thought, courtesy of the Showerhead...
I hate to see a lot of good people leave this thread due to one area of the FlowerPot system!
This thread has been so busy it is difficult to keep up and i hope to see it continue with past, present and future members joining in and sharing their experiences!

 

[Baron23]

I read of an offer to return for full refund, that's a sweet deal!

Did you read the part where multiple times it was noted "refund for UNUSED parts". Which, by the by, I noted was a perfectly understandable position. If not, search back in the thread and you will find it.

Oh, and did you read my Pan Head initial session review post.....?? Do you really think that was an inappropriate post??

Cheers

 

[Cannabis-Hardware-Ed]

The following disclaimer has been added to the panhead, and shovelhead product listing.

"Fits may vary due to the nature of hand blown glass. Feel free to return any unused parts."

Collaborative engineering certainly has it's challenges.

 

[lazylathe]

Did you read the part where multiple times it was noted "refund for UNUSED parts". Which, by the by, I noted was a perfectly understandable position. If not, search back in the thread and you will find it.

Oh, and did you read my Pan Head initial session review post.....?? Do you really think that was an inappropriate post??

Cheers

I understand unused parts.
Name one manufacturer that let's you try a vape part with cannabis that allows you to send it back?
You always get to keep the accessories and send the main part of the vape (the brains) back.
Seems pretty normal to me.

You can always dry test parts.

Not trying to start an argument here and would love to go back to our regularly scheduled program....

 

[Grifo]

I understand unused parts.
Name one manufacturer that let's you try a vape part with cannabis that allows you to send it back?
You always get to keep the accessories and send the main part of the vape (the brains) back.
Seems pretty normal to me.

You can always dry test parts.

Not trying to start an argument here and would love to go back to our regularly scheduled program....

Trying a part and getting a product that isn't working properly isn't the same. He just added a disclaimer now after the fact.

 

[Baron23]

Name one manufacturer that let's you try a vape part with cannabis that allows you to send it back?

Is there some part of this that was not clear:

Did you read the part where multiple times it was noted "refund for UNUSED parts". Which, by the by, I noted was a perfectly understandable position.

And let me please ask yet again:

Oh, and did you read my Pan Head initial session review post.....?? Do you really think that was an inappropriate post??

If not, please read it.

 

[lazylathe]

Is there some part of this that was not clear:

My mistake, i apologize.
Could you link your pan head post? I ask because i am receiving this bowl next week sometime.

Trying a part and getting a product that isn't working properly isn't the same. He just added a disclaimer now after the fact.

I think it pretty much goes with the territory. Just my opinion though.

 

[b0]

Honestly, all this "order of comunication" thing sounds like BS to me. As I said before, the correct thing IMO if there's problems with a product is saying it public. If you go to the Zion thread for example, there has been problems with some units, everyone has been vocal and said it in public, no problems from Ryan. Units with issues gonna be fixed and he knows there is a problem. GH thread, same. Everyone know it's a faulty vape and at some point you gonna have to send it back,no one feeling attacked or GH saying they are being attacked. Fury 2 had loads of issues with the first unit, outgassing and smells. What they did? Being defensive? No they just improved they QC and launch Fury 2, and it seems to be a beast!! I could continue with loads of other examples that there has been issues made public without everyone having to send first an email to the creator or company.

Where I come from this is called censorship. If there is an issue I still think that is more beneficial for everyone to talk about it in open and that's why forums where created, to discuss and see different opinions. Just

Edit: Sorry for the off topic

 

[Baron23]

Could you link your pan head post? I ask because i am receiving this bowl next week sometime.

http://fuckcombustion.com/threads/newvape-flowerpot-twax-vaporizer.23162/page-247#post-1184516

Cheers, brother :-)

 

[Cannabis-Hardware-Ed]

With all due respect that gap is the photo is internal as indicated by the YELLOW arrow in my drawing below.

I'm failing to see how that gap effects performance. I will agree that if just those 2 parts are tested by themselves they will most defiantly leak. But that's not how the assembly is designed to function. The bowl must sit on top of the glass to form a seal. At least that was my design intent. From the looks of the size of the gap in your photo there may be additional tolerances that can be tightened up.

 

[Square4Life]

With all due respect that gap is the photo is internal as indicated by the YELLOW arrow in my drawing below.

I'm failing to see how that gap effects performance. I will agree that if just those 2 parts are tested by themselves they will most defiantly leak. But that's not how the assembly is designed to function. The bowl must sit on top of the glass to form a seal. At least that was my design intent. From the looks of the size of the gap in your photo there may be additional tolerances that can be tightened up.

It all goes back to my original concerns..., if the flat, bottom part of the bowl and the top, flat part of the glass joint is creating the seal...this isn't that crazy to understand how it has an air leak. Your titanium parts may be accurate and level but the glass will vary greatly. And then the internal leak you speak of wouldn't be internal as the two air paths (gap between the two bowls and gap between upper bowl and glass joint) connect allowing "unvaped air" in.

Unless I'm way off base...

 

[psychonaut]

@steama can you give us any comparisons to the OGFP vs adjustabowl when both are inserted into the glass piece and capped off to form a seal like with your thumb or something else suitable?

 

[Cannabis-Hardware-Ed]

It all goes back to my original concerns..., if the flat, bottom part of the bowl and the top, flat part of the glass joint is creating the seal...this isn't that crazy to understand how it has an air leak. Your titanium parts may be accurate and level but the glass will vary greatly. And then the internal leak you speak of wouldn't be internal as the two air paths (gap between the two bowls and gap between upper bowl and glass joint) connect allowing "unvaped air" in.

Unless I'm way off base...

I agree with you. Having the flat shutoff on the top of the joint is critical for this design. The same .01" clearance exists between the bowl and nut on all designs. @steama wins i apologize. This disclaimer was not more clear when he purchased. I've added this disclaimer to the website. I'll refund @stema and send a return label for both of his adjust a bowls. anyone else want a refund please let me know. Please don't expect a revision as there's just no way to predict the glass fit on the other end.