Adhesives, Insulation and Vape Safety

[OhTheAgony]

You bought yours in France, so it is possible you bought one of the last few older models. They have ordered new ones with insulated cores too but I'm not sure they're there yet and I'm not sure if they've send their old units back to Dave or that they still sell the last few they have left. I can tell you which one you have if you post a photo of the top side though (with the top of the heater core visible), but so can Underdog-Dave or the guys who sold it to you.

I don't know about that cloth though. All I can think of is that it is the insulating ceramic cloth, which would mean you have a newer UD. Again, ask Dave if you want a definitive answer.

I think there has been enough talk about the red silicon paste in this thread, read back a little for all the details please. It's located outside of the air-path anyway, but if that isn't good enough you can always order a custom 'vegan' UD without it.

 

[LeTchen]

I read all the thread (not so easy for a french !) and I don't see where Dave gives the name and ref of this silicone paste.... but I think Dave will read the thread and answers to my questions

 

[OhTheAgony]

I don't think he will, he barely has time to keep up with the UD thread as it is. But here's the link to the data sheet for the silicon that Dave posted on page 2.

Cheers

 

[LeTchen]

Thank you very much Oh !
I read it but I don't see nothing about food contact quality.... but I read this :
Chemical Stability: Stable under normal temperatures and pressures.
Hazardous Polymerization: Not reported.
Conditions to Avoid: Extreme heat, sparks, and open flame. Incompatible materials, oxidizers and oxidizing conditions.
What do you think of that ?
People thinks that this silicone paste is ok ?

 

[HighlyEducatedScholar]

People thinks that this silicone paste is ok ?

Some people believe it is ok while others do not. it is basically up to your own standards and beliefs whether or not this vaporizer is for YOU. however, like OTA stated above, Dave does offer 'vegan' Dogs which does not have adhesives.

 

[OhTheAgony]

I feel completely safe using my non-vegan insulated UD since I'm convinced it's outside the air-path, but still find it a tough one when it comes to purely the silicon itself. Just reading that sheet it doesn't seem like a safe material at all to me, but I believe that write-up was done testing the material in it liquid state (as you buy it), and not in it's cured state as it is when applied already or how it gets to us in our UDs.

I would like to see the tests to be done on the cured material to be honest.

 

[LeTchen]

Dave does offer 'vegan' Dogs which does not have adhesives.

Why ? He thinks that this silicone is unsafe ??! This is very strange for me.... This product (silicone) is safe or not... it's not a problem of thinking or opinion !
I think I don't vape more with this unit until I will know more about this product, or until I put another good product with food contact quality by myself (I'm plumber ! I will ask to my suppliers)

I would like to see the tests to be done on the cured material to be honest.

+ 1
The manufacturer MUST give this information, I think it's the Dave's job to ask this to his supplier or manufacturer..... and give it us !

 

[Frederick McGuire]

My understanding is that Dave feels the construction of a UD is safe as is.

Some customers (possibly with different needs than a more general consumer) are uncomfortable with some of the materials (like that red silicone for instance), so Dave is willing to make a product up to their standards.

It's not so much that Dave isn't confident with the safety of his design, he's just willing to go the extra mile for potential customers that aren't completely satisfied with the current design.

 

[LeTchen]

My understanding is that Dave feels the construction of a UD is safe as is.

Feels ??....... I prefer "knows" !!!

 

[underdog]

LeTchen - that vape is the same older style that was shown in the first post of this thread so I think most of your questions will have already been answered. The MSDS for the high-temp silicone (red paste) is linked somewhere in the first few pages I believe. The stringy cloth is ceramic fiber (heat insulation) and the flat cloth cotton canvas (used as a filler). We found no need to insulate the wires as they are rigid and do not move (so no risk of touching each other) unless physically pushed into different positions, just make sure you don't smash them together when you put the ceramic back in and all will be fine.

 

[LeTchen]

Thanks for your answers, Dave
But like OTA says :

I would like to see the tests to be done on the cured material to be honest.

Can't you have the sheet for the same cured silicone ? Everybody have cured silicone in the log vape (fortunately ! ) and I think the link of the sheet you gave us concerns only "fresh" silicone...

 

[OhTheAgony]

I'm sure we'd use that link instead if such a sheet was available LeTchen, but I don't think it will be easy to get the manufacturer of the stuff or whoever is responsible for doing these tests to do them

 

[underdog]

There isn't any MSDS (to the best of my knowledge) issued for RTV silicone in it's cured state. As I've stated previously the prevailing industry opinion is that, used within spec (ie, temp, PH, etc), it is inert.

We use the highest temp rated stuff available, rated at 600 degrees (higher than it needs to be), like what is used in silicone bake-ware such as this. http://www.amazon.com/HIC-Brands-th...=1354129529&sr=8-1&keywords=silicone+bakeware (note the cupcake pan also does not come with an MSDS )

 

[LeTchen]

There isn't any MSDS (to the best of my knowledge) issued for RTV silicone in it's cured state. As I've stated previously the prevailing industry opinion is that, used within spec (ie, temp, PH, etc), it is inert.

We use the highest temp rated stuff available, rated at 600 degrees (higher than it needs to be), like what is used in silicone bake-ware such as this. http://www.amazon.com/HIC-Brands-that-Cook-Essentials/dp/B00428M7ES/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1354129529&sr=8-1&keywords=silicone bakeware (note the cupcake pan also does not come with an MSDS )

I think you're right Dave, I had looking for information too , and it seems that cured silicone is inert (and my wife has silicone bakeware too !) So for me the case is closed
I will rebuild my UD and plug it asap

 

[underdog]

Glad to hear LeTchen, hope you get it all reassembled and enjoy it.

Hey, while I'm here.. as I mentioned earlier that piece is a pretty old style that we have improved on in the past year, both in increased/improved insulation and a better method of mounting and securing the core. The type of mounting in that piece tends quite often to lead to a loose core after some months of use. We offer to retrofit them to the newest revision core for people free of charge and while I know the shipping expense is not insignificant I would be more than happy to do that retrofit for you if you like.

No great rush on this but I just wanted to put it out there so if you have any problems with it loosening you know we can take care of it for you.

Thanks dude!

 

[LeTchen]

 

[ACE OF VAPE]

My opinion of course.

If we as business people try to please everybody with every concern, we will go broke. We have to do our best to make a safe product and live with that. If we need to change, fine, but that change better come from a consensus of opinion, not one or two people wondering about whatever. It does seem you have gone to much effort to find out about the safety of copper, J.R.R. Good for you and good job on your new log vape.

I agree, you can't please everybody. Some safety concerns are valid, some maybe not so much, but it’s these forums and discussions that keep pushing manufacturers to make better/safer products or they will go out of business. Let the market decide, there are other alternatives out there.