Most efficient bud to bloodstream?

[MinnBobber]

Looking for most efficient method for buds to bloodstream???
And something that's not too cumbersome?

Primary goal is for medical use of CBD/CBDa, probably with rosin as first step???

I went with rosin as a starter since I was leaning towards bud: rosin: sublingual
direct intake.

Is there any reason you can't just " dip the Ti tip " and slip it under the tongue?
Rosin on dab tool and let it rest under the tongue...

Squished pucks would steep in hot cream....I don't like messing with alcohol soak type
extraction...

Rosin would serve as a direct link to sublingual or vaping or edibles or caps.
But buds to rosin to sublingual would seem to yield a fantastic overall efficiency??

Comments appreciated.
Looking for purest meds and most efficient uptake = lowest cost for medical benefits

 

[invertedisdead]

Vaporization has the fastest effect on the bloodstream outside of intravenous administration.

Edibles reportedly have the lowest efficiency of all, but the unique 11-hydroxy conversion allows them to have a much higher perceived potency.

Vaping is the easy and efficient but probably not the best source for acidic cannabinoids.

 

[MinnBobber]

Vaping is very fast uptake but I don't think it is as efficient as sublingual.

Although no really good studies on lung vaping efficiency, there are excellent studies on
lungs and oxygen absorption rates.
Lungs have evolved to absorb oxygen so I can't believe that cannabinoid absorption is higher
than for oxygen.

Lung oxygen absorbing rate is about 1/4 (27% ). Air comes in at just under 21% oxygen and is exhaled
at about 16%.
What is absorption rate for vaping????? I would think less than 27% ???

Sublingual absorption rate is ???? It is known to be very efficient, so probably more than 27% ???

Inquiring minds want to know

 

[sickmanfraud]

Squished pucks would steep in hot cream....I don't like messing with alcohol soak type
extraction...

If you want oral/sublingual absorption you need to decarb your cannabis/concentrate at some point in the process. I am unaware of any tests performed on Rosin to see THCA to THC conversion. If you are going to dab the rosin than a decarb step is not necessary.

IIRC using cannabis suppositories is supposed to be very efficient.

 

[invertedisdead]

Vaping is very fast uptake but I don't think it is as efficient as sublingual.

Although no really good studies on lung vaping efficiency, there are excellent studies on
lungs and oxygen absorption rates.
Lungs have evolved to absorb oxygen so I can't believe that cannabinoid absorption is higher
than for oxygen.

Lung oxygen absorbing rate is about 1/4 (27% ). Air comes in at just under 21% oxygen and is exhaled
at about 16%.
What is absorption rate for vaping????? I would think less than 27% ???

Sublingual absorption rate is ???? It is known to be very efficient, so probably more than 27% ???

Inquiring minds want to know

I'm referencing this article, I might have posted this before in your cream extraction thread.
https://medium.com/@ericgeisterfer/the-bioavailability-of-medical-marijuana-6d05b712baa0

 

[hafalump]

a friend I know heats his “squish” then eats it, so it does need a decarb

 

[Baron23]

Suppositories.

 

[C No Ego]

@MinnBobber making an alcohol tincture ( green dragon) makes the dose more ROS ( reative oxygen species ) like vaporizing does it... just ingesting a puddle of oil will not make it into the blood as well because of the blood brain barrier ETC,... bile acids start to break down the phytocannabinoid instantly and adding that ROS alcohol makes it happen lots faster... maybe even using more volatile terpenes could help the process

 

[MinnBobber]

I will likely not decarb, focusing on getting CBDa as that has great potential.
R Mechoulam has developed a synthetic CBDa which is stable, vs the natural but unstable CBDa.

He says:
"The naturally occurring but unstable CBD acid (CBDA) is a thousand times more potent than CBD in binding to a particular serotonin receptor thought to be responsible for alleviating nausea and anxiety."

So CBDa has some very intriguing possibilities.... besides nausea and anxiety, would CBDa also be much more effective
for general pain and inflammation issues???

Until we get legal adult cannabis here in MN, my focus is on legal CBD flower as a starting point.
I'd like to maximize CBDa extraction and bioavailability, for best medical bang for your $$.
This would be as the most cost effective option VS our obscenely priced MN Medical Cannabis Program.

 

[Deleted Member 1643]

Is there any reason you can't just " dip the Ti tip " and slip it under the tongue?
Rosin on dab tool and let it rest under the tongue...

Just thinking the same thing! Well, more or less... Second run QWET produces a significant volume of concentrate, but it's not fit for dabbing. (The same is true of trim as a starting material, IME.) The effects are very appealing, a calm body stone. Might try decarbing and taking a drop under the tongue. (Read that the inside of the cheeks are actually better sites for sublingual absorption.)

just ingesting a puddle of oil will not make it into the blood as well

A vehicle might help speed absorption or distribution. Alcohol burns under the tongue, but a drop might be alright.

A prescription Marinol oral solution is already marketed under the name Syndros. Its inactive ingredients are: dehydrated alcohol, polyethylene glycol 400, propylene glycol, sucralose, methyl paraben, propyl paraben, butylated hydroxyanisole, and water. Mostly familiar - the parabens are probably preservatives and the hydroxyanisole, an antioxidant. So, glycols might be suitable as well, in addition to or instead of alcohol.

 

[C No Ego]

Just thinking the same thing! Well, more or less... Second run QWET produces a significant volume of concentrate, but it's not fit for dabbing. (The same is true of trim as a starting material, IME.) The effects are very appealing, a calm body stone. Might try decarbing and taking a drop under the tongue. (Read that the inside of the cheeks are actually better sites for sublingual absorption.)



A vehicle might help speed absorption or distribution. Alcohol burns under the tongue, but a drop might be alright.

A prescription Marinol oral solution is already marketed under the name Syndros. Its inactive ingredients are: dehydrated alcohol, polyethylene glycol 400, propylene glycol, sucralose, methyl paraben, propyl paraben, butylated hydroxyanisole, and water. Mostly familiar - the parabens are probably preservatives and the hydroxyanisole, an antioxidant. So, glycols might be suitable as well, in addition to or instead of alcohol.

not liking seeing PG used as opposed to VG.... it seems vegetable glycerin would be safer ????
any thing to add volatility to the oil would help it be avaialbe faster... ingesting it deeper with less bio availability up front would metabolize the oil in the liver ETC... but then how effective will it metabolize there? bio-avaialability of a psychoactive lipid... I've seen NIDA control board members claim the ingested FECO oil gets stuck in peoples bodies and does not metabolize... claiming a sticky resin will not be active @ all... What a Freaking Joke LOL

 

[sickmanfraud]

I will likely not decarb, focusing on getting CBDa as that has great potential.
R Mechoulam has developed a synthetic CBDa which is stable, vs the natural but unstable CBDa.

He says:
"The naturally occurring but unstable CBD acid (CBDA) is a thousand times more potent than CBD in binding to a particular serotonin receptor thought to be responsible for alleviating nausea and anxiety."

So CBDa has some very intriguing possibilities.... besides nausea and anxiety, would CBDa also be much more effective
for general pain and inflammation issues???

Until we get legal adult cannabis here in MN, my focus is on legal CBD flower as a starting point.
I'd like to maximize CBDa extraction and bioavailability, for best medical bang for your $$.
This would be as the most cost effective option VS our obscenely priced MN Medical Cannabis Program.

I suggest 3small batches of Green Dragon tincture (use freezer method) 1. No decarb, 2. Decarb 240F for 50 minutes, and 3 a batch with natural decarb (place finished GD in a closed dark cabinet for 4-5 months.

Compare the effects. Try also a mix of 1 & 2 and those effects.

This may be a bit of work, but I think it will save you a lot of aggravation.

 

[Schlumples]

not liking seeing PG used as opposed to VG.... it seems vegetable glycerin would be safer ????

PG has been used without ill-effect in vaping and inhalers for many years. We know less about VG than PG in that regard. Neither one has ever hurt me and I've been vaping both carriers heavily for over 6 years now. I don't understand the negative view that many in the MJ community hold towards PG. Where does that stem from, if you don't mind my asking?

 

[C No Ego]

PG has been used without ill-effect in vaping and inhalers for many years. We know less about VG than PG in that regard. Neither one has ever hurt me and I've been vaping both carriers heavily for over 6 years now. I don't understand the negative view that many in the MJ community hold towards PG. Where does that stem from, if you don't mind my asking?

PG is synthetic isn't it? even VG = vegetable glycerin was the First embalming fluid! the stuff can turn organs to mush in large amounts... small amounts are apparently safe

 

[Deleted Member 1643]

With e-cigarettes, early on, diethylene glycol was found as a contaminant in propylene glycol. Contaminants are cause for concern if present in significant amounts, but PG itself is generally recognized as safe for food and pharmaceutical use. If you read the ingredients in your food and personal care products, you will likely find many sources of PG. A drop under the tongue probably wouldn't even increase exposure appreciably.

 

[invertedisdead]

but PG itself is generally recognized as safe for food and pharmaceutical use.

The FDA's opinion of GRAS is extremely underwhelming, to say the least.

I reference the thousands of nasty chemical additives linings supermarket shelves, also GRAS.

 

[Deleted Member 1643]

The FDA's opinion of GRAS is extremely underwhelming, to say the least.

Agreed, GRAS status alone doesn't guarantee safety. But PG's use is very widespread. For a 160 lb. person, typical daily exposure from foods is 2.5g. If you use 0.1 ml of PG in a tincture, you've increased your exposure by about 4%. Difficult to imagine that's significant.

 

[Schlumples]

PG is synthetic isn't it? even VG = vegetable glycerin was the First embalming fluid! the stuff can turn organs to mush in large amounts... small amounts are apparently safe

The day you provide proof that the inhalation of PG is in any way significantly bad for me is the day I will give a damn. In the meantime, my personal experience with it along with numerous studies on vaping lead me to believe this is a silly thing to demonize.

 

[C No Ego]

The day you provide proof that the inhalation of PG is in any way significantly bad for me is the day I will give a damn. In the meantime, my personal experience with it along with numerous studies on vaping lead me to believe this is a silly thing to demonize.

yeah man , they are claiming it is safe for oral ingestion... how safe that is when you heat and vape it is up to your own safety parameters and findings... I'll stick with pure flower power , dry herb vape ETC

 

[JOHN GALT]

Cannabis Suppositories​

Alberta licensed cannabis producer Prairie Grass says its new line of cannabis suppositories are the first to hit Canada’s regulated marijuana market and the company hopes the niche products will address market demand from female consumers.

Canada's first regulated cannabis suppositories target female consumers

Alberta licensed cannabis producer Prairie Grass says its cannabis suppositories are the first to hit Canada's regulated marijuana market.

mjbizdaily.com

 

[C No Ego]

Cannabis Suppositories​

Alberta licensed cannabis producer Prairie Grass says its new line of cannabis suppositories are the first to hit Canada’s regulated marijuana market and the company hopes the niche products will address market demand from female consumers.

Canada's first regulated cannabis suppositories target female consumers

Alberta licensed cannabis producer Prairie Grass says its cannabis suppositories are the first to hit Canada's regulated marijuana market.

mjbizdaily.com

huge amounts of FECO/RSO can be ingested via suppository and not create as much euphoric effect in the person ... for serious treatment taking it from both ends is best