Mean World Syndrome

VWFringe

Naruto Fan
i kept trying to avoid this because i didn't like the name, it sounds old or something, but it makes a good point many of us are already familiar with...that the news paints a blacker picture than exists in the real world, and they do it knowingly to manipulate us and our behavior.

decide for yourself, please let me know what you think

Mean World Syndrome clip
 
VWFringe,

Nycdeisel

Well-Known Member
I enjoyed watching that, and it makes a lot of sense. Thanks for posting :)

I personally try to avoid watching news or even tv when I dont have a strong desire, like when I see someone else watching the news, its even worse, and you know whats going through their head when they see a story about something violent or victimizing, they think that this is what is always happening around them.

People have to wonder why they dont actually see all of this violent crime in the real world all of the damn time :rolleyes:
 
Nycdeisel,

lwien

Well-Known Member
VWFringe said:
......that the news paints a blacker picture than exists in the real world, and they do it knowingly to manipulate us and our behavior.

I don't agree with this. I don't think that network news, cable news or radio news paints a blacker picture to manipulate us at all, but rather they paint a blacker picture simply because a blacker picture sells better. It's all about the money, and in the news business, money is all about the ratings because good ratings allows them to sell airtime to their sponsors.
 
lwien,

Purpl3_Haz3

On a Permanent Vakation
Yeah, while what the op says and the video says makes good sense, the only big thing in my local news is the epidemic of MDPV AKA "Bath Salts." Someone is in the hospital at least a few times a week, people are attacking each other, crashing cars, robbing others, etc. Most days, the local news paper headline is something to do with MDPV...and the story isn't always as dark as the truth recently.
 
Purpl3_Haz3,

Nycdeisel

Well-Known Member
I dont think that was referring as much to local news stations...

and lwien that also has soemthing to do with it lol
 
Nycdeisel,

Purpl3_Haz3

On a Permanent Vakation
Nycdeisel said:
I dont think that was referring as much to local news stations...

and lwien that also has soemthing to do with it lol


Yeah your right, Im medicated and just saw the local news, lol.

I guess thats kind of the reason i have always subconsciously avoided big nation wide news broadcasts. They're like a movie, in that they are somewhat accurate, but over exaggerated, etc.
 
Purpl3_Haz3,

Nosferatu

Well-Known Member
lwien said:
VWFringe said:
......that the news paints a blacker picture than exists in the real world, and they do it knowingly to manipulate us and our behavior.

I don't agree with this. I don't think that network news, cable news or radio news paints a blacker picture to manipulate us at all, but rather they paint a blacker picture simply because a blacker picture sells better. It's all about the money, and in the news business, money is all about the ratings because good ratings allows them to sell airtime to their sponsors.

Your right that the TV networks aren't trying to paint a blacker picture to manipulate us, the medias only agenda is max profits. The media isnt dangerous but rather the corporations behind them paying them to displays things in a way that furthers along their agenda, they are the more dangerous ones. An example, the use of TV to promote MILK as a healthy substance to drink everyday, of course payed ALOT by the dairy industry, all these got milk adds. While in the dark, something you cant find on our censored network channels, using the internet you realize the situation is much like cannabis. Hundreds of independant scientists and schools like Harvard are pushing out studies cleary showing not only does it NOT give you calcium, its actually UNHEALTHY to drink. Any normal pwerson who gets their news from the TV, have a completely skewed idea of reality. We are a nation ran by corporations, they hold more power than the government, and all the products we use, and food we eat, and commercials we watch, are made by them and then peddled down to the TV networks that need TV space to stay in business. Stations like FOX and even CNN are bogus propaganda stations mostly. Not to say TV and news doesnt have true stuff, alot of it is fair reporting. But alot is also just to futher a corporations agenda.
 
Nosferatu,

VWFringe

Naruto Fan
lwien said:
VWFringe said:
......that the news paints a blacker picture than exists in the real world, and they do it knowingly to manipulate us and our behavior.

I don't agree with this. I don't think that network news, cable news or radio news paints a blacker picture to manipulate us at all, but rather they paint a blacker picture simply because a blacker picture sells better. It's all about the money, and in the news business, money is all about the ratings because good ratings allows them to sell airtime to their sponsors.

I think you will agree with me on these points...

they use Modern PR to help them decide how to portray stories, to pull emotion out of us.

And, at the same time they use Political Analysts to help with content selection, and the best ways to frame things, and to try to work-in the government talking points and those of their other clients.

That and the fact that the narrative or dialog they go with is echoed throughout their family of companies, because they need to save money, and re-use resources, like any company.

they can't report on everything, so they have to pick and choose, and if reporting on Wisconsin is going to alienate all of their Republican advertisers, and generally disrespect the product, they'll show Charlie Sheen instead.

If the government asks them to do a drive-along during a high-profile bust, an exclusive story, and all they need to do is work in the talking points, they'll do it... it's free content, and it suits their over-arching objectives to show it. (I guess they just passed a law that they can't just show clips sent in by the federal government, but they can still use content provided by political parties and other sources (hey, free content)

it's a big business, they've cut budgets and workforce with each merger and each wave of off-shoring, and were also hit hard by the economic downturn: they don't have the time or the interest to do hard-hitting investigative reporting, everybody's satisfied finding the content that suits them on TV, some watch Dateline, some 60 Minutes, but it's all highly scripted, watered down propaganda (whether intentional or just out of respect for the product)

they're main clients are the corporations and news providers, like our government.

#1 rule of journalism: don't disrespect the product

you may not agree with these points tho...

If doctors and scientists said eating meat/diary/eggs is bad for you[it is and they have], TV is not going to report it, not like that at least, they'd frame it differently

If England said eating baby aspirin is a cure for cancer[it is and they have], TV is not going to race to get you to start taking it, there's no money in aspirin, and Pharmaceutical advertisers probably won't like it.

There are a lot of people who say Ruppert Murdoch intentionally frames the news to create a sense of fear, and that he has a reason for doing it. I know Fox news gets a lot of air-play on other networks, and i believe everyone is so willing to echo his content because it saves money, keeps a sense of continuity across the networks, and actually suits the other network's agendas and political interests as well.

Station Owners get to voice their political opinions thru their local stations, we see it all the time, Channel 7 trashed this or that because he's a Republican. just shrug it off i guess, nothing we can do if he asks his reporters to make it sound bad.

Networks want to cultivate an environment that is friendly to their clients and their own interests, I believe. And I think that means softening us up on certain topics, like Tort reform, corporations have wanted Tort reform for many years, so television networks have shone a negative light on court cases where people sue corporations & doctors, and take excessive settlements (or that's the way they frame it).

They have us convinced we need milk for calcium, and that meat is concentrated veggies, and that we should and need to eat meat (my mouth just watered).

in the filtering, and the 'painting in a certain light' they are a political machine, able and willing to sway public opinion. no wonder they could not (and would not) do anything to stop the Iraq war.

I don't think we can trust them for news anymore, and they get their digs in even between commercial breaks

It all just seems so politicized to me now....they should really do something about this. ?we?

if you read all that, thanks, Now what do you think?
 
VWFringe,

WatTyler

Revolting Peasant
I've only visited your country twice and so have a very limited perspective, although we do still get fed a lot of US media over here. And even if not the US news, it's still the Murdoch empire that has a massive share of our news market (both TV and tabloid newspaper).

But I am under the definate impression that the US is actually a relatively dangerous place, at least comparative to many European nations. Is this due to media manipulation? I don't know; maybe not if the Murdoch agenda would be better served if I was more afraid in my own country, instead of these aspects of US society? I know statistics can lie, but the USA does statistially have pretty high murder and violent crime rates. Social and economic inequality, poverty, limited social security and guns don't really tend to go too well together, and the US has a lot of all. So as a visitor to the US, I was intentionally very aware of my surroundings in this regard if exploring a city.

:lol: I was also afraid of getting shot for trespassing- in rural Delaware (I think it was) driving through I noted loads of signs on fences saying 'No Trespassing' every few metres, like loads of these signs. I concluded that such signage was the minimum legal requirement if you wanted to shoot a trespasser ? Maybe I was well wide of the mark! lol Anyway, it was pretty foreign to me as here in Scotland we have a legally established 'right to roam' across the land. As long as you are not causing damage and respecting privacy, there's no such thing as trespassing on open land. In a land where the old aristocracy and wealthy still own massive estates that they would love just use as their own hunting playground I really treasure this right to be able to access my countryside.

So, that's bit of an aside really, and I hope it's not taken as an offensive critique at all by my US friends here; it's not meant to be. But it shows that I do have some fear of some aspects of the American society, instilled from somewhere. I'm a product mainly of what I've seen on TV and read elsewhere, and so do query if/why Murdoch & the UK media would influence me to think like this? I actually think it's the difference in gun culture is perhaps the biggest driver of my 'fear'.

I think I agree with lwein that overall mean/violent news just sells more easily. Like violent movies. But on the other hand, to be fair, the worlds actually full of awful events, and instead they choose to pepper the news with inane and irrelevant stories. If the news was actually a true representation of the worlds most significant and serious events, really worthy of our knowing and attention, it would be pretty depressing and wouldn't really attract many TV viewers at all. That's pretty depressing in itself.

VW, I'm sure you already know about them, but in case you don't, I think that you would be quite interested in; Reporters without Borders- http://en.rsf.org/united-states.html
 
WatTyler,

wilf789

Non-combustion-convert
Agree with our fear of US 'gun-culture'.
If there's a single shooting here in England it usually makes national news, depending on where the shooting took place I suppose, but still it's a big deal. Knife crime is our big issue but even that pales in comparison to experiences in the US.
When I was living in Brooklyn, NY, I noticed the differences in news coverage, for example a shooting would be relegated to local news reporting, not even always headline news there either.

Some of the coverage back here really does make me sad though. Newspapers, one in particular as any UK resident will know, make it seem as if there's a knife-wielding, gun-toting, crack-smoking, benefit-cheating, NHS-draining illegal immigrant around every street corner.

I actually dream of owning a newspaper/news tv channel some day and reporting nothing but 'good news' (ala Russel Howard at the end of his show), see if that makes people start thinking the world is full of butterflies and daisies and all that guff instead.
 
wilf789,

VWFringe

Naruto Fan
WatTyler said:
....I am under the definate impression that the US is actually a relatively dangerous place, at least comparative to many European nations. Is this due to media manipulation?

....I was also afraid of getting shot for trespassing- in rural Delaware (I think it was) driving through I noted loads of signs on fences saying 'No Trespassing' every few metres

....I actually think it's the difference in gun culture is perhaps the biggest driver of my 'fear'.

from wikipedia:
According to BJS figures, the rate of violent crime victimization in the United States declined by more than two thirds between the years 1994 and 2009.
7.9% of sentenced prisoners in federal prisons on September 30, 2009 were in for violent crimes.
52.4% of sentenced prisoners in state prisons at yearend 2008 were in for violent crimes.
21.6% of convicted inmates in jails in 2002 (latest available data by type of offense) were in for violent crimes.

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the "no trespassing" signs are a legal thing to keep people from wandering, not entitling to shoot (tho there are exceptions among different types of people, but those people are rare i believe)
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i had to look this up, because i think in Arizona it's legal to carry a gun in your purse on a public bus for protection, so i wondered how they're doing on gun violence rates, and they're very much in line with everyone else...
from wikipedia:
State|Homicide rate|Gun homicides|Homicides|% Gun|% Knife|% Other Weapons|Population
/100k /100k

Louisiana 12.74 10.13 574 79.5 7.9 12.6 4506685
Maryland 9.37 6.95 521 74.2 11 14.8 5561332
Mississippi 7.83 5.55 227 70.9 12.6 16.6 2900768
California 6.67 4.82 2392 72.2 11.8 16.1 35842038
Nevada 7.37 4.72 172 64 14 22.1 2332898
South Caro 6.86 4.64 288 67.7 13.2 19.1 4197892
Illinois 6.1 4.59 776 75.2 8.3 16.5 12712016
Michigan 6.36 4.55 643 71.5 10.7 17.9 10104206
Arizona 6.28 4.54 414 72.4 10.8 16.9 6595778
New Mexic 8.88 4.44 169 50 18 32 1903006
Georgia 6.87 4.43 613 64.5 13.2 22.3 8918129
Missouri 6.15 4.23 354 68.8 10.5 20.7 5759532
Arkansas 6.4 4.91 176 62.7 12.4 24.8 2750000
Texas 6.07 3.93 1364 64.8 15.5 19.7 22471549

4 or 5 people get shot out of 100,000 each year.

how does that compare with over there?

and is this lower than people would have guessed here?

it seems lower than i'd expect, but i've only watched tv for that news so far (and have been consuming it for a long time)
 
VWFringe,

WatTyler

Revolting Peasant
VWFringe said:
the "no trespassing" signs are a legal thing to keep people from wandering, not entitling to shoot (tho there are exceptions among different types of people, but those people are rare i believe)

:lol: I had hoped that was the case!

VWFringe said:
i had to look this up, because i think in Arizona it's legal to carry a gun in your purse on a public bus for protection, so i wondered how they're doing on gun violence rates, and they're very much in line with everyone else...
from wikipedia:

4 or 5 people get shot out of 100,000 each year.

how does that compare with over there?

and is this lower than people would have guessed here?

it seems lower than i'd expect, but i've only watched tv for that news so far (and have been consuming it for a long time)

I just had a quick look and our gun homicides for 2005/6 was 0.1 per 100,000 - 50 times less!!! :lol:
wikipedia
But only 6.6% of homicides involved a firearm; we prefer stabbing :uhoh: , but it's also illegal for us to carry knives on us in public, or anything that could be used as an offesive weapon (including those kubotan key rings) even for protection, which I expect is an odd concept in the US.

Old statistics might be part of the issue in this debate. One comparison on wikipedia between the US and UK is from 1999 data where there were 4.5 homicides in the US and 1.45 in the UK (regardless of weapon type). So it's 3 times more likehood of being murdered in the US, or at least it was then- don't know how it's changed since, and not got time now to research beyond wiki.....
 
WatTyler,

VWFringe

Naruto Fan
if you're not already getting an earfull about it, the Ruppert Murdoch empire in the UK is under storm over the illegal wire-tapping of peoples' phones and complicity with the police, one high ranking executive going to work as an aid for the Prime Minister (he's now under arrest).
A field day for some in being able to take a legitimate swipe at the journalistic climate he's helped produce

something like 4,000 victims of the phone hacking

safe to say he has a lot of political clout, and there's heavy spin there like here - he owns a lot of the television and newspapers there.
 
VWFringe,

VWFringe

Naruto Fan
here's a chart showing the US has 6.5 intentional killings per 100,000
Europe had 5.4
West and Central Europe 1.5
World 7.6


Intentional homicide rates per 100,000 population by region and subregion, 2004[6] Rate
Southern Africa 37.3
Central America 29.3
South America 25.9
West and Central Africa 21.6
East Africa 20.8
Africa 20
Caribbean 18.1
Americas 16.2
East Europe 15.7
North Africa 7.6
World 7.6
North America 6.5
Central Asia and Transcaucasian countries 6.6
Europe 5.4
Near and Middle East/South-west Asia 4.4
Oceania 4
South Asia 3.4
Asia 3.2
South-east Europe 3.2
East and South-east Asia 2.8
West and Central Europe 1.5

I have to wonder how much we've helped and hurt in South America, after seeing Appology of An Economic Hitman
 
VWFringe,

WatTyler

Revolting Peasant
VWFringe said:
if you're not already getting an earfull about it, the Ruppert Murdoch empire in the UK is under storm over the illegal wire-tapping of peoples' phones and complicity with the police, one high ranking executive going to work as an aid for the Prime Minister (he's now under arrest).
A field day for some in being able to take a legitimate swipe at the journalistic climate he's helped produce

something like 4,000 victims of the phone hacking

safe to say he has a lot of political clout, and there's heavy spin there like here - he owns a lot of the television and newspapers there.

Indeed, it's the headlines here. Plenty of an earful! It's spelled the end of one 160 year old newspaper (I use that term loosely- it was often trash and scandal, rather than news) 'The News of the World'. Unfortunately it won't quite spell the end of murdoch.

I don't have such a problem with hacking celebrity's and politicians voice mail- they make their living manipulating the media and should be more careful- but it was also the families of dead soldiers, victims of the terrorist bombings in 2007 and other victims in the public eye. They even deleted the messages from a missing schoolgirls phone because the mailbox was full and couldn't receive any new messages. So they deleted some to make space so they could hear any new ones, which gave the family false hope that the girl was still alive. Unbelievable.

The upside is that Murdoch is trying to take over another major media player here- BSkyB- which would give him a massive share of the news market here, and this should make things harder, or even stop it. The regulator has a duty to ensure that the firm doing the take over is 'fit and proper' and that's being questioned right now. Rightly so. I'm not sure if they will resist his influence though. It will change the UK news media forever and for the worse if he succeeds.
 
WatTyler,

WatTyler

Revolting Peasant
VWFringe said:
here's a chart showing the US has 6.5 intentional killings per 100,000
Europe had 5.4
West and Central Europe 1.5
World 7.6
Wow, SA is bad.

But I noticed that the US figure is up on the 1999 figures I presented (from 4.5 to 6.5). Yet you also had figure claiming decreases. Could just be variation between two given years though, rather than reflecting the trend? The trouble is crime figures are the most politically powerful statistics open to manipulation.
 
WatTyler,
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