Fixed temp vapes, max temp to low for CBN and CBD

[deathduck]

From Wikipedia:

bio-active cannabidiol (CBD), Cannabinol (CBN), and delta-9-tetrahydrocannabinol (THC) do not vaporize until near their respective flash points: CBD 206.3 C[6], CBN 212.7 C[7], THC 149.3 C[8]

CBD's and CBN's are very important for an enjoyable high, many argue they are MOST important. Purple days vaporizer heats up to 190-200C max which falls short of the flash points of CBD and CBN. I'm sure other vaporizers share this flaw as well.

So if you are going to get a vaporizer make sure it heats up to 415F (212.7C) if you want all of the important CBD and CBN's.

 

[fidget]

From Wikipedia:

bio-active cannabidiol (CBD), Cannabinol (CBN), and delta-9-tetrahydrocannabinol (THC) do not vaporize until near their respective flash points: CBD 206.3 C[6], CBN 212.7 C[7], THC 149.3 C[8]

CBD's and CBN's are very important for an enjoyable high, many argue they are MOST important. Purple days vaporizer heats up to 190-200C max which falls short of the flash points of CBD and CBN. I'm sure other vaporizers share this flaw as well.

So if you are going to get a vaporizer make sure it heats up to 415F (212.7C) if you want all of the important CBD and CBN's.

In before pitchfork posse.

 

[DeepFried]

I have been saying that for years

 

[AGBeer]

While I agree with you, I disagree that this would cast the log vapes (or otherwise non variable temp vapes) into a negative light. What this vape 'lacks' in extraction translates to some better brownies or swampwater later. These actives arent 'lost' by any means.

And thats why I have a plethora of vapes with different purposes. Some I can get the temp higher (and usually at a higher quantity of meds) And I have my log vape that more than does the trick at half the cost. Besides, I like to gauge my level of medication. The Zap doesnt lock me down and make me as stupid as say my supreme would. Sometimes thats a good thing

 

[vapormonkey]

Log vapes are for people who have to buy their herbage. It's nice when the supply us so large as to make the method irrelevant.

 

[AGBeer]

Bullshit.

Even if I DIDNT have to buy my herb, I would still use my log vape depending on my mood. If I wanted to get floored every time, I would be using edibles.

Its not just about 'getting high' there are different levels that suit the given situation, and each vape has the ability to let me experience it differently if I choose.

 

[vapormonkey]

BS, you just take one hit then. What you don't do is keep hitting half hits.

 

[lwien]

While I totally understand why "some" would want to vape at 415F, to suggest that "most" would find this enjoyable is total bullshit. For me, I hate to vape at anything above 400 because it starts tasting like shit. It begins to take on that smoke taste. And regarding the high, 95% of the time, I don't want to have that narcotic stoned couch lock feeling. Most of the time, I much prefer the clear headed high that the mid temp vape ranges provide. On those rare occasions that I do want to get couch lock stoned, I smoke it.

I've had variable temp vapes and personally, for me, I found that once I found a temp that I liked, I kept it there 99% of the time and that temp was around 370 to 375F. A fixed temp vape that operates within 370 to 390 is perfect for me and considering how popular some of the fixed temp vapes are, to say that "most" would prefer to go to 415 degrees is not an accurate statement.

 

[max]

I've had variable temp vapes and personally, for me, I found that once I found a temp that I liked, I kept it there 99% of the time and that temp was around 370 to 375F. A fixed temp vape that operates within 370 to 390 is perfect for me and considering how popular some of the fixed temp vapes are, to say that "most" would prefer to go to 415 degrees is not an accurate statement.

Didn't see your post before I composed mine, but I'll leave mine as it is. My sentiments exactly though.

CBD's and CBN's are very important for an enjoyable high

This is your opinion, not a fact. Fixed temp vapor is is perfectly acceptable for an enjoyable high for me and many others. It's not all that often that I feel the need for higher temps.

So if you are going to get a vaporizer make sure it heats up to 415F (212.7C) if you want all of the important CBD and CBN's.

Actually, there are a few sedative or analgesic compounds that release above that temp, and any variable temp model should heat to a high enough temp to cover the bases. Whether high temp compounds are important or not depends on the needs (medical users) or wants (couch lock high or functional high) of the individual user.

Your opinion is that fixed temp in a vape is a flaw. Since fixed temp vapes provide a cleaner high, with fewer toxins, it really depends on what the individual is looking for. Fixed temp is certainly not a flaw for me.

From the rules page- Do not state opinion as fact. We don't want to spread bad information.

The way your post is presented, you're breaking that rule. Please adjust your posting style for our forum.

 

[reece]

Log vapes are for people who have to buy their herbage. It's nice when the supply us so large as to make the method irrelevant.

Who doesn't have to buy theirs? Do growers get everything they need for free? Electricity is free? A large supply, and paying less than street costs, doesn't translate to, "I don't care how quickly I go through my stash," for everyone.

Both you and the thread starter are projecting your opinions and attitudes upon everyone else. The OP is telling log vape owners, who state their enjoyment repeatedly, that it's all in their minds. You presume to tell us what our motivations are. Marijuana users, and vapor enthusiasts are not monolithic.

And you are both ignorant of, or ignoring, the fact that log vape owners who want higher temps can achieve them with their log vapes quite easily. Also, over time, the log vapes temperature increases a bit.

And do we even know how correct the wikipedia numbers are?

 

[lwien]

From Wikipedia:

bio-active cannabidiol (CBD), Cannabinol (CBN), and delta-9-tetrahydrocannabinol (THC) do not vaporize until near their respective flash points: CBD 206.3 C[6], CBN 212.7 C[7], THC 149.3 C[8]

CBD's and CBN's are very important for an enjoyable high, many argue they are MOST important. Purple days vaporizer heats up to 190-200C max which falls short of the flash points of CBD and CBN. I'm sure other vaporizers share this flaw as well.

So if you are going to get a vaporizer make sure it heats up to 415F (212.7C) if you want all of the important CBD and CBN's.

What's also kind of interesting is your post that you posted just previous to this one in the Pandora thread.

"My goodness this purple days is amazing. I just had 1 bowl tonight and I've been blazed for 2 hrs and am still nice and good. I worried about how well it would work an account of building it myself. I'm happy to say it works QUITE well, TY Tom and Pammy"
-----deathduck

 

[reece]

From Wikipedia:

bio-active cannabidiol (CBD), Cannabinol (CBN), and delta-9-tetrahydrocannabinol (THC) do not vaporize until near their respective flash points: CBD 206.3 C[6], CBN 212.7 C[7], THC 149.3 C[8]

CBD's and CBN's are very important for an enjoyable high, many argue they are MOST important. Purple days vaporizer heats up to 190-200C max which falls short of the flash points of CBD and CBN. I'm sure other vaporizers share this flaw as well.

So if you are going to get a vaporizer make sure it heats up to 415F (212.7C) if you want all of the important CBD and CBN's.

What's also kind of interesting is your post that you posted just previous to this one in the Pandora thread.

"My goodness this purple days is amazing. I just had 1 bowl tonight and I've been blazed for 2 hrs and am still nice and good. I worried about how well it would work an account of building it myself. I'm happy to say it works QUITE well, TY Tom and Pammy"
-----deathduck

It almost seems as if the wikipedia article convinced him he wasn't enjoying his high. Damn those wiki mind tricks.

 

[lwien]

Damn those wiki mind tricks.

Wiki mind tricks all started with those frakin Vulcans with their fucking mind melds. FUCK THEM !!

(lol, just read what I wrote and I sound like Lewis Black at a Star Trek convention)

 

[reece]

I'm not racist or anything, some of my best friends are Vulcans. I've even let one into my home. But most of them can't be trusted with their melding minds and whatnot. Fuckin' Vulcans are the cause of all the wars over how enjoyable log vapes are for centuries now.

 

[biojuggernaut]

THC combusts at 400 so wouldn't it be psuedo combusting Sorry I'll get high off of vapor if I wanna combust Ill hit my bong.

 

[max]

THC combusts at 400 so wouldn't it be psuedo combusting Sorry I'll get high off of vapor if I wanna combust Ill hit my bong.

Combustion is around 450 F. A lot of vaporists don't even consider 400 to be high temp vaping.

 

[vap999]

Regarding vaporization temperatures, why the fixation with being at or above boiling/flash point? To use an analogy, if you heat a pot of water to 200?F/93?C or blast moist herbal material with air at this temperature, you will get a good amount of vapor (steam), not that much less than if you went up to 212?F/100?C.

Keep in mind that evaporation/vaporization is just part of the physical processes involved with vaporizers. The process is more accurately thermal desorption -- using heat to drive-off/remove/evaporate desired plant essential oil molecules tightly bound (adsorbed) to plant structural material (cellulose; remaining plant cell walls).

Also, theoretical, laboratory measurements of vaporization-related physical parameters, e.g., boiling point, may have little relevance to real-world herbal vaporization. In the lab., they are using purified liquid materials and often measure at non-normal pressures and then calculate the vaporization/boiling point at normal atmospheric pressure, while herbal materials involve complex mixtures with the desired molecules sticking, adsorbed to the herbal material (cellulose) and each other. To use an analogy, compare measuring the temperature/energy needed to evaporate/vaporize the same amount of pure water in a vial vs. the same amount soaked-up by a super-adsorbent paper towel, a dessicant (e.g., silica gel), etc.

 

[luchiano]

If you use hash or oils you want to go to a higher temperature to get the higher oils like carophyllene and maybe others unkown about now because new cannabinoids are still being discovered. You also don't want sit and puff all day just to use as much of the hash as possible. Using bud might not be needed to go higher because the oils are so little that you might not notice their affects but with a concentrate you will definitely notice the difference in using temperature under 400f and temperatures higher than that. Plus 451f is combustion temperature for bud because of cellulose. High quality concentrates don't have cellulose.

 

[luchiano]

Regarding vaporization temperatures, why the fixation with being at or above boiling/flash point? To use an analogy, if you heat a pot of water to 200?F/93?C or blast moist herbal material with air at this temperature, you will get a good amount of vapor (steam), not that much less than if you went up to 212?F/100?C.

Keep in mind that evaporation/vaporization is just part of the physical processes involved with vaporizers. The process is more accurately thermal desorption -- using heat to drive-off/remove/evaporate desired plant essential oil molecules tightly bound (adsorbed) to plant structural material (cellulose; remaining plant cell walls).

Also, theoretical, laboratory measurements of vaporization-related physical parameters, e.g., boiling point, may have little relevance to real-world herbal vaporization. In the lab., they are using purified liquid materials and often measure at non-normal pressures and then calculate the vaporization/boiling point at normal atmospheric pressure, while herbal materials involve complex mixtures with the desired molecules sticking, adsorbed to the herbal material (cellulose) and each other. To use an analogy, compare measuring the temperature/energy needed to evaporate/vaporize the same amount of pure water in a vial vs. the same amount soaked-up by a super-adsorbent paper towel, a dessicant (e.g., silica gel), etc.

You don't have to keep the temperature exact to vape herb but it will take longer than if you were to use the right temperature or one very close to it. Plus by knowing the temperatures of different molecules you can manipulate what you want to vape when you want to. This what makes vaporizing so special and is something that people aren't taking advantage of. They just find a temperature to vape and that's it but using the temperature to release different chemicals when you want is actually better if you really want to enjoy the herb and get high because you aren't losing anything to exhale due to concentrating each chemical through separation from using different temperatures and you are also releasing lighter oils first which make the cells more fluid which help absorb more of the thc and other heavy cannabinoids. You also aren't burning anything which means a healthy and pure product because you aren't mixing anything with the herb to experience it which can't be done any other way. Not to say mixing is bad because that adds to the effects and health potential of herb but sometimes you want to just experience the herb without any smoke byproducts or food being eaten with the bud.

Also, the cannabinoids that most people want are not in the plant matter but on top of it in liquid form encapsulated with a waxy coating. They are called the trichomes or resin glands which is what hash is, just the resin glands without the plant matter. I do understand what you're saying though but that only applies to using bud but if you use high quality concentrates(bubblehash, essential oils)) than knowing and using temperatures is a good thing.

 

[deathduck]

I have not been wiki mind tricked, I just notice my own thought patterns and came to some realizations about the PD. Yes when I first got it I was very impressed, but it is difficult for my mind to handle high THC with low CBN and CBD every day even when I only use 1/2 of one PD bowl.

It's not just me, see this experiment on high doses of just THC vs THC + CBD and CBN

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2cAFRAX3Gs

I've also done other research, CBN and CBD have strong ant-psychotic properties as well as anti cancer and many other healing positive effects. There is even a new movement to produce higher CBN and CBD % cannabis as many people are discovering the effects are more enjoyable.

Read a discussion on GC forum about the importance of other cannaboids other than THC.

http://forum.grasscity.com/seasoned-tokers/617082-importance-cannabinoids-other-than-thc.html

I know everyone is different and if you like high concentration of THC then your good and you don't need to worry about all of this. However, I know this information will help some people who are like me.

 

[reece]

I have not been wiki mind tricked, I just notice my own thought patterns and came to some realizations about the PD. Yes when I first got it I was very impressed, but it is difficult for my mind to handle high THC with low CBN and CBD every day even when I only use 1/2 of one PD bowl.

It's not just me, see this experiment on high doses of just THC vs THC + CBD and CBN

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2cAFRAX3Gs

I've also done other research, CBN and CBD have strong ant-psychotic properties as well as anti cancer and many other healing positive effects. There is even a new movement to produce higher CBN and CBD % cannabis as many people are discovering the effects are more enjoyable.

Read a discussion on GC forum about the importance of other cannaboids other than THC.

http://forum.grasscity.com/seasoned-tokers/617082-importance-cannabinoids-other-than-thc.html

I know everyone is different and if you like high concentration of THC then your good and you don't need to worry about all of this. However, I know this information will help some people who are like me.

No one is doubting the effects of THC, CBD, and CBN. I'm pretty sure similar information has been posted here before.

Again, if you are after the higher temperature actives, you can raise the temperature of your log vape to achieve this (coozie or use of higher voltage transformer during a session). Over time, your PD will probably run warmer (if similar to other users) than at first thereby negating the need for raising the temp through other means.

 

[Shiz]

And thats why I have a plethora of vapes with different purposes. Some I can get the temp higher (and usually at a higher quantity of meds) And I have my log vape that more than does the trick at half the cost.

Most of these comments defending the log seem to be personal and not logical.

Bottom line is a log vape is rendered obsolete if you own another vape that delivers the same temps as the log as well as much higher temps. Why would you NEED it in your plethora? After you have a high temp home vape, low temp vapes are just a collector's item.

 

[hemp;)goofy8cheerio]

And thats why I have a plethora of vapes with different purposes. Some I can get the temp higher (and usually at a higher quantity of meds) And I have my log vape that more than does the trick at half the cost.

Most of these comments defending the log seem to be personal and not logical.

Bottom line is a log vape is rendered obsolete if you own another vape that delivers the same temps as the log as well as much higher temps. Why would you NEED it in your plethora? After you have a high temp home vape, low temp vapes are just a collector's item.

shiz, the log type vape is ez , ready now, efficient, & like AGBeer said, "meds) And I have my log vape that more than does the trick at half the cost." i myself only wish i tried the myrtlezap or WDZ first & then compared the rest ; werks 4 me just gud gr8 then so u may not like it i guess if u tried it & didn't like, dunno

 

[lwien]

Most of these comments defending the log seem to be personal and not logical.

Bottom line is a log vape is rendered obsolete if you own another vape that delivers the same temps as the log as well as much higher temps. Why would you NEED it in your plethora? After you have a high temp home vape, low temp vapes are just a collector's item.

Nope. Totally logical.

Rendered obsolete? Nope, not at all. Why? Because these types of vapes offer a few things that other vapes don't offer. One, is their efficiency in encouraging the use of small measured doses and the taste and thickness of hits when using those small measured doses. The other is stealth being that you can leave it out in the open and no one would suspect that it is something that you inhale anything out of. Third is their simplicity and ease of use and ease of maintenance.

So to me, having a Purple Days or a MyrtleZap in your arsenal of vapes makes perfect sense. Hell, there are many here including myself who have other vapes that do have variable temps and yet, the PD/MZ is still their daily driver.

(ok, going back into hiding....... :/ )

 

[champ3185]

@lwien
Good to see you are back.. you better stay

champ