Discontinued Zion vaporizer

[IAmKrazy2]

I cannot understand that only some people get a lifetime warranty at least all FC customers should. I did not know about it until after the first of January. The real problem is me getting involved with start-ups that play games getting their vapes rolling. Like lifetime warranties to some and not others. I just do not think it is fair to charge more money and give less to later customers that are paying a higher retail price. I am done this playing the pre-order game. On another note looking at this vape over the last few weeks I have come to think it is one of the most ugly vapes I have ever seen.

You say you can't understand why only some people get the lifetime warranty. It is because they ordered in time, before a predetermined cut off. That was later extended. That's why.

Everything else there is your opinion. You don't like them apples? Feel free to cancel your order. It is not at all uncommon for companies to give perks to early adaptors. This is no diffrent.

BTW i have got a lifetime warranty from multiple vape companies before. The only one still in business is MFLB. The rest have folded for various reasons. Plus there is grasshopper, and everyone knows how their business is being handled. The good and the bad.

 

[Mulehead]

So the nug method has become my go to.
It's lip smackin' good!

I've also found my sweet spot on the power dial at 85% I'd guess.
I was temp stepping to finish bowls, but prefer setting temp and forget it.
It gives me a few more hits/bowl this way.
Flavor is amazing from start to finish, never really tastes cashed, just stops giving up the goods.
Abv is pretty dark and fine at this point.

This heater tech has a very strong stoney signature.
The higher the power, the stonier it becomes.
Which should appeal to conduction fans as well, but without flavor loss.

So who else is smackin' on the nug method?
I know Sticks is, thanks for the idea brother!

Another refund?
@steama?
Y'all that are asking for refunds out of spite, are not affecting RBT.
You are however missing out on one of the best vaporizers that I've ever tried.
It outperforms a vape that cost me four times as much!
So paying more to get less is all relative, depending how you break it down.

 

[Copacetic]

...or nothing at all. I choose nothing.

You're being a little unfair no?
Startups offer these limited incentives to attract customers get the ball rolling.
Latecomers (like ME for instance) have the benefit of some sort of feedback from previous customers to quell our uncertainty and take the plunge.

I have missed out on the earliest price (and lifetime warranty) too, but it doesn't worry me, as if the vape is good, and RBT survives the marketplace I'm certain that he won't gouge his customers with high repair prices.
Our vapes can still be fixed, it'll just cost us a little.

BTW, since I just couldn't raise enough dough to afford the Zion I went with the Milaana instead, and it's even simpler than the Zion, so EVEN less likely to go wrong.

I'm sure a standard warranty will serve for most?

A lifetime can be a looooong time, and other vapes will eventually eclipse EVERYTHING that's currently on the market, so why worry about the distant future?

 

[tblast]

The way I see it, my money is as good as the next guys

For a young company, this is just not true. If someone paid 6 months earlier than you did, their money is worth more to RBT. That's why he offered perks to people who paid earlier. It's a common thing.

 

[Farkas]

For that reason I am seeking a refund.

Yay! My order moves up one spot (I hope).

 

[MrPeanut]

I have no problem understanding how the lifetime warranty is working. The way I see it, my money is as good as the next guys, in fact I paid more. So yeah, if they can't be more fair to everyone why get this vape at all? That is the way I see it. I can't give them my money when I do not think the warranty situation is fair.

No one is bending your arm to buy this vape. We get it you do not like the pricing/warranty for people that were late to the game. I am sure you can find a company/vape you like elsewhere. I hope you find it and it serves you well. No reason to go any further down this rabbit hole.

 

[IAmKrazy2]

I have no problem understanding how the lifetime warranty is working. The way I see it, my money is as good as the next guys, in fact I paid more. So yeah, if they can't be more fair to everyone why get this vape at all? That is the way I see it. I can't give them my money when I do not think the warranty situation is fair.

So you have said in multiple posts this morning, you are jumping ship, and in your estimate everyone from FC should get a lifetime warranty. Duly noted.

Now that your opinion is out there, and you are withdrawing your preorder, move along. Your point is received, and seems like there is no more reason to continue with it over and over. Your comments and approach aren't going to change anything as far as policy. So please, find another thread.

 

[jim-bob]

How accurate is the 5-10 day thing on refunds? I'm at 7 days and not seeing anything.

 

[IAmKrazy2]

The Zion screens are super versatile. You can take them out and reshape them. Recently i have been using one screen basket style almost all the way to the tip of the tube. Making a bowl barely bigger than the basket itself. With the load a little closer, i put in the smallest little nug chunk and just blast away. Lots of fun off a tiny amount of material. I could probably do this with the screen deeper down, but i end up filling more every damn time when the room is there.

Also, haven't been using hemp fiber. Just a second screen inserted dome side out. So both dome screens face eachother. Easy place to store hemp fiber if you want to use some. I show this with hemp fiber in one of my early videos for anyone wondering what the hell im talking about

 

[DocGonzo]

Just take the refund. I think everyone else is well aware of the warranty and don't mind. You could have added the lifetime warranty when you pre-ordered, it was one of the items on the RBT store. I doubt that will be an option for any orders going forward, although I could be wrong.

The Zion will still be here if you change your mind once we're all puffing vapor from our ears. It's an inclusive group, as cults go.

 

[IAmKrazy2]

So the nug method has become my go to.
It's lip smackin' good!

I've also found my sweet spot on the power dial at 85% I'd guess.
I was temp stepping to finish bowls, but prefer setting temp and forget it.
It gives me a few more hits/bowl this way.
Flavor is amazing from start to finish, never really tastes cashed, just stops giving up the goods.
Abv is pretty dark and fine at this point.

This heater tech has a very strong stoney signature.
The higher the power, the stonier it becomes.
Which should appeal to conduction fans as well, but without flavor loss.

So who else is smackin' on the nug method?
I know Sticks is, thanks for the idea brother!

Another refund?
@steama?
Y'all that are asking for refunds out of spite, are not affecting RBT.
You are however missing out on one of the best vaporizers that I've ever tried.
It outperforms a vape that cost me four times as much!
So paying more to get less is all relative, depending how you break it down.

Sorry. Missed your post earliar in the shuffle. I use the nug method too. Awesome stuff. Even with a tiny little piece. I only use ground material for speed and less experienced users.

 

[thekarmawhore]

Recently i have been using one screen basket style almost all the way to the tip of the tube. Making a bowl barely bigger than the basket itself. With the load a little closer, i put in the smallest little nug chunk and just blast away. Lots of fun off a tiny amount of material.

This is where I'm at too, Krazy, screen sized basket bowl, no grinding. Dee-licious start to end!

Looking forward to this weekend. Hoping to do some comparison testing.

Ahem ... Hmmmm?

 

[Shit Snacks]

I cannot understand that only some people get a lifetime warranty at least all FC customers should. I did not know about it until after the first of January. The real problem is me getting involved with start-ups that play games getting their vapes rolling. Like lifetime warranties to some and not others. I just do not think it is fair to charge more money and give less to later customers that are paying a higher retail price. I am done this playing the pre-order game. On another note looking at this vape over the last few weeks I have come to think it is one of the most ugly vapes I have ever seen.

I have no problem understanding how the lifetime warranty is working. The way I see it, my money is as good as the next guys, in fact I paid more. So yeah, if they can't be more fair to everyone why get this vape at all? That is the way I see it. I can't give them my money when I do not think the warranty situation is fair.

Right. I don't like it when people are 'STILL' in pre-orders and waiting do not get the lifetime warranty. I mean they are still fixing problems with manufacturing the Zion. If it were a perfected device ready to ship things would be different.

I'm out --- the fairness factor in my mind is sounding the alarm


I would call paypal and explain the problem. There is no excuse to wait that long. You need some help to get their attention.

Sorry to keep this going, feel free to pm me steama, but firstly not all orders are from FC, anyone can order from the store, merely being a registered FC member shouldn't entitle you to a lifetime warranty, now that would be unfair...

The higher cost was literally due to the lack of demand at the lower price, had you ordered early you wouldve paid $200 or less and gotten the lifetime warranty, those deals were extended month after month to encourage people to take advantage. To make it possible with fewer orders, the price had to be raised, and it was publicized very well here, and us users agreed that it could command a higher price based on performance and that a lifetime warranty is not necessary for this product (3 year standard is plenty) but a bonus for early adopters, or rather investors perhaps

People who ordered way before you would feel the opposite, it wouldn't fair for you to jump in much later an expect the same treatment as those who supported RBT from the start. It's like GH on indiegogo for $99, it became $135 for pre orders like me, and will likely be higher at retail. Backers get the benefits of trying it sooner and paying less bc they supported the company from the get go. I would've done this but didn't know about the campaign until it ended, that doesn't then entitle me to the same treatment... It is a business

That's fine if you feel you are owed a lifetime warranty, but when you ordered the situation was very clear, so to treat it as a new surprise development seems odd to me personally.

The STILL waiting doesn't have to do with manufacturing problems, it is the nature of upscaling production, it takes time to get rolling. The first units were all built one at a time by hand, a process that could take an entire day for just one Zion and the man has other things to do (job, house, family, etc), not very feasible so it would always take some time

The initial 3 month delay that led things to begin rolling out in 2016 was due to optimizing the heater and nothing more, that is well behind us. The few recent failures seem minor and will add to the QC process for said mass production. You may find it ugly but the design is as perfected as it can be right now. Ready to ship is dependent on parts and building em, so it's still in the midst of the slow roll out, which was also btw always part of the plan, to catch any potential QC issues in the wild...

Again if it feels unfair to you, and not what you wanted, by all means bow out. I just feel a lot of your reasoning is faulty considering what I mention above, and that other customers seem to be well aware of the situation when they purchased... Sorry again to everyone who wants to move on, but i just wanted to offer some more perspective for you @steama in case you're still contemplating your decision. Good luck with your next vapor journey man

 

[Mulehead]

Sorry. Missed your post earliar in the shuffle. I use the nug method too. Awesome stuff. Even with a tiny little piece. I only use ground material for speed and less experienced users.

No worries Krazy, I'm just bummed for the well known members here not getting a chance to try this heater tech, I don't care the reason.

Same here, grind for a speedy, stealthy, extraction.
Can kill a good size bowl in 2 hits.
But when I have the time to truly enjoy a bowl, nugs are the shit!
I break a little up with the stir stick every hit.
One strain I have LSD, gives up the goods until its literally powder, I lose track of how many hits, with crazy good flavor.
My poor grinder may get lonely!

I was starting to wonder if battery technology would ever allow a portable to keep up with me through the work day without charging.
Thank you @RastaBuddhaTao for pairing the proper batteries, with a more than proper heater!

 

[jim-bob]

No worries Krazy, I'm just bummed for the well known members here not getting a chance to try this heater tech, I don't care the reason.

In all honesty, brother, I'm pretty bummed about it as well. I tried to keep the faith as long as I could, but the one man with the ability to restore my faith didn't find it worth his time or effort and I feel that bodes very poorly for my future with the zion. If he'd spent several minutes over the course of the past five months making any sort of effort to respond to me I'd feel a lot better about the whole thing, but apparently not shipping units has been taking up the bulk of his time.

I'm hoping my refund processes within the ten day period so i don't have to involve anyone else, but this multi-month process has caused me some very real mental distress and I'd like very much to put it behind me.

 

[ragnorokk]

Sorry. Missed your post earliar in the shuffle. I use the nug method too. Awesome stuff. Even with a tiny little piece. I only use ground material for speed and less experienced users.

@Mulehead the only time I grind is with the stirstick, most of the way through my session
The first time I packed the Zion, I experimented by mashing a big chunk of nug in the bowl, like I would combusting in a bubbler or bong, and it had no problems. I've only packed ground material a time or two, because I like to streamline the paraphernalia on my coffee table (and the time and steps taken to get me vaked) and I found the whole nug method to be wholly satisfying. It seamlessly replaced my preferred method of combustion, and suddenly I wasn't combusting every day (not to take credit away from the other combustion killer, Daisy -- they tag-teamed my combustion cravings).

 

[Mulehead]

@jim-bob my encounters with RBT have been so much different then yours.
It's unfortunate that we don't all have the same experiences.
Still wish you and steama could try one!

Also, haven't been using hemp fiber. Just a second screen inserted dome side out. So both dome screens face eachother. Easy place to store hemp fiber if you want to use some. I show this with hemp fiber in one of my early videos for anyone wondering what the hell im talking about

I know what you're saying because this is sorta how I rig my stems.
Only I have the open end of the baskets facing each other. []
With a wisp of hemp fiber inside the baskets.
As many methods as there are Zion's eh?
Looking forward to reading all the new methods here and in the Milaana thread, as more units make their way out.

@Mulehead the only time I grind is with the stirstick, most of the way through my session

I think I've been stirring too much after trying this method.
I bet I get a few more days between cleanings, simply limiting stirs.
Thanks for sharing Ragnorokk.

 

[grokit]

Is this rbt's workbench?

 

[AJS]

Not that I'm noble or anything like that, but I did take one more for the team this morning.

I forgot to say that the load was ~.1 g in a Zion screen installed basket style in my new little friend that I brought home last night. I stopped by my LHS to look at their connectors, not hopeful but just in case. Wonder of wonders, I found an 18 mm male/male with a short joint and a small ID, almost exactly the specs of the new stems! You can see that it works nicely to connect to the WP-010, and I'm trying it out as a shorty stem at the moment.

Did someone mention something about blowing vapor out of every hole in the body?

 

[Bizkat]

us users agreed... that a lifetime warranty is not necessary for this product (3 year standard is plenty) but a bonus for early adopters, or rather investors perhaps

Didn't read this discussion when trying to catch up on this thread. Kinda wish I didn't purchase the lifetime warranty in the Store if that's the prevailing thought.

Otherwise @Shit Snacks , I agree that people who ordered way before should get extra benefits.

 

[Shit Snacks]

Didn't read this discussion when trying to catch up on this thread. Kinda wish I didn't purchase the lifetime warranty in the Store if that's the prevailing thought.

Otherwise @Shit Snacks , I agree that people who ordered way before should get extra benefits.

Hey man, it doesn't hurt! I'd still a take a lifetime warranty over any lesss and am glad I have it. The reality is just that most users never need it at all, but it is nice and worth the small fee imo

 

[slatihe]

@steama

Buy the dang warranty or accept a refund.

You knew full well @ time of purchase what your warranty status was and how much a life time warranty "upgrade" would cost at that time...

AND you still bought it... AND you can still get a refund....

So, hopefully you understand why I ask...

If you are not purposely trolling then please accept my apologies and then please try to be a little more mature about it. It's part of life.

We made our choices... Now we live with them and try not to make the same bad ones a second or third time...

Sorry if that sounds harsh, but that's how life is.

Honestly doesn't make sense for you to be mad at any one... take your refund and buy some herb to chill with. Bet that's a lot of herb too... Or beer, or really nice shoes, or a cheap lap top... Maybe a new tv? Maybe that will make you happier?

You could always buy a zion later.

Why so mad?


@jim-bob contact PayPal if you need. They have always had A++ customer service.IME

Sorry to hear if your communication problems, have tried sending a new email through the system? Some times there are errors and they don't go threw. Like I had a terrible time trying to get my nano warrantied due to system errors from a recent system overhaul and my account being so old.

RBT is a one man show, that has a full time job as an engineer... So he working his job hours, building zions, repairing zions, sourcing parts and labour, sourcing stores for distribution, answering emails and taking care of all customer service, etc... By himself... So yeah, I can see how he might be busy...

Not that it's any excuse not to get back to you with in a couple days and/or take care of your refund with in stated time frame, if that's what you want.

Also his main focus is getting the Zion out the door as a genuine retail product... Not a small home business out of a shop out back...

So he is shipping and repairing as time permits, but building and repairing and all that is happening when he can as he can.

Building and shipping individual units NOT his main focus IMO, as it appears to be strait up getting this ready for production. As in production lines running, making them in large batches, automation and such...

While I don't necessarily agree with with all his choices, I think he's doing a great job of getting things done achieving those goals...

Edited.

 

[pakalolo]

@steama are you a troll?

Buy the dang warranty or accept a refund.

You knew full well @ time of purchase what your warranty status was and how much a life time warranty "upgrade" would cost at that time...

AND you still bought it... AND you can still get a refund....

So, hopefully you understand why I ask...

If you are not purposely trolling then please accept my apologies and then please grow up. It's part of life. We made our choices... Now we live with them and try not to make the same bad ones a second or third time...

Sorry if that sounds harsh, but that's how life is.

Honestly doesn't make sense for you to be mad at any one... take your refund and buy some herb to chill with. Bet that's a lot of herb too... Maybe that will make you happier? Or beer, or really nice shoes, or a cheap lap top... Maybe a new tv.

You could always buy a zion later.

Why so mad?

It is not acceptable under our rules to accuse another member of being a troll even if it's true. If someone is breaking the rules, report it and let a moderator handle the problem. If no rule is broken then your reply should be respectful. Telling steama to grow up does not meet that criterion. Please review the rules and try to keep them in mind when you post.

 

[little maggie]

It is not acceptable under our rules to accuse another member of being a troll even if it's true. If someone is breaking the rules, report it and let a moderator handle the problem. If no rule is broken then your reply should be respectful. Telling steama to grow up does not meet that criterion. Please review the rules and try to keep them in mind when you post.

Just wondering- it seems like in the past discussions like this get moved to their own thread. Is that possible since it really has nothing to do with the Zion itself?

Is there some trick to deleting posts? I can never figure it out.
Please delete- didn't know I was breaking rules.

 

[pakalolo]

Just wondering- it seems like in the past discussions like this get moved to their own thread. Is that possible since it really has nothing to do with the Zion itself?

Is there some trick to deleting posts? I can never figure it out.
Please delete- didn't know I was breaking rules.

I'll let this stay since it is worth explaining. We do make new threads or move posts but only when the derail persists and we consider the off-topic discussion is worth continuing. Sometimes we delete the posts too. It is done by moderator discretion, so you shouldn't expect perfect consistency.

You can't delete posts yourself. As long as the edit window is open you can remove the content. You can also report the post and ask us to delete it.