Discontinued Zion vaporizer

[TheDudeNextDoor]

Some of it depends also on ambient temp and whether the Zion has been warmed recently or not. At room temp, using my water tower, I like a 10-15 second preheat at full power, and then I back off to 75 percent and get some nice tasty hits. Then I stir and bump to full power for some lung-busters. I'm finding one stir, two at most, is all that's necessary for full extraction and even heating.

If the ambient temp is cold -- hence a chilly ZionNextDoor -- I find a 20-30 second preheat provides a much more satisfying first hit. Once she's warmed up, though, it's on. On like Zion.

 

[VegNVape]

You got different batteries from RBT than I did. This is all mine say on them. The 2 is me...

Nope, we've got the same batteries my good man. & yep, an internet search throws up 2500mAH, but, the original label definitely says 2900mAH . . . however I shall concede to 2500.

BUT, my Panasonic's are definitely 2900's!

Ahhh... No worries.

Now come on, you know me better than that! There was never any chance of me NOT posting a little a piccy . . .

(you may have to zoom-in for battery info)

Oh well, bugger it! I figure that if I'm posting one pic I may as well indulge myself and the goode Johnny Zion just a little bit more . . .
(Apologies in advance!)

Yeah yeah yeah . . . I know I get a bit carried away . . .

Just a few snaps from a little outing

Sorry to bore you guys!


ZiOnLife.


PeaceLoveUnityRespect

 

[gtvck]

So everyone is having to stir the bowl? I figured since it was 100% convection there would be no stirring needed. I would prefer not having to stir if possible.

 

[MrPeanut]

It is not necessary to stir, some people just prefer it. Zion is pretty versatile. Grind, don't grid, full bud, stir, don't stir, water, no water etc etc. When you get your Zion you will find your own method.

I sip and rip. I stir the full buds to break them up 2-3 hits in. Ground, lightly packed I do not stir. Ground, tight pack I give it one stir midway through the session.

VERSATILE TO THE EXTREME

 

[Shit Snacks]

So everyone is having to stir the bowl? I figured since it was 100% convection there would be no stirring needed. I would prefer not having to stir if possible.

You do not have to stir, I've done entire car rides of extended length without stirring a bowl. It depends on how you grind pack and hit it as MrP said, there are many variables, crazy versatile. (Also btw, in my experience with mine, nearly all pure convection vapes require plenty of regular stirring, the reverse, Zion is unique for being able to get away with less)

Likewise with preheat, the production units will be tuned hotter than ours, (Dude's in particular is less than me and Veg even), so more of the dial to use fill spectrum and preheat less at higher voltage. Also less preheat when sessioning, back to back hits allow it to heat soak. Best to wait til we have the production units to discuss specifics like this really, bc its just going to change slightly anyway...

 

[gtvck]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought conduction vapes required much more stirring since the material closest to the heater gets cooked more than the top. Convection cooks by hot air coming through the material for a more even extraction. As far as I know that's one of the benefits of the hopper is no stirring. Not trying to start an argument, just trying to get a better understanding of the two types of vaping.

Also, I don't even stir my solo, not because I don't need to, but because it's a pain l since the bowl is so small and bud always falls out. From what I've heard the Zion is leaps and bounds better with extraction so I'll be good for sure.

 

[MrPeanut]

Like I said you do not have to stir the Zion and the ABV is nice and even. It is more a personal preference than a necessity. Yes, in my limited previous experiences with other vapes, all conduction, you had to stir with every hit.

 

[Shit Snacks]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought conduction vapes required much more stirring since the material closest to the heater gets cooked more than the top. Convection cooks by hot air coming through the material for a more even extraction. As far as I know that's one of the benefits of the hopper is no stirring. Not trying to start an argument, just trying to get a better understanding of the two types of vaping.

All of my conduction vapes and the ones Ive used do not need to be stirred (maybe with chunky grind/loose pack? only an issue in FM/Imag/xmax really), just ground finely and packed tightly, then the whole load can conduct heat through the hot walls as one unit, this includes the Solo (though there is some convection mixed in there too, its conduction provides the more even extraction). Comparing just one hit though, any pure convection extracts worlds better than conduction imo

The reason the Hopper is more even, is because of its spiral airpath, sends hot air to mix through herb, provided it is packed loosely enough (conduction- tight pack, convection- loose pack, courser grind too), also its tubular chamber. Zion also has that tubular shape for its chamber with the glass stem and wide open airflow, that along with the massive surface area of its heater help it remain more consistent and even extraction without stirring than others, but there are other variables at play as well. So far it requires the least stirring of all my pure convection vapes though (someday there will be a Hopper on the way...)

 

[gtvck]

Thanks for the explanation!

 

[TheDudeNextDoor]

I agree with everything posted. Stirring is not necessary -- I have depleted many stems without stirring for a number of reasons. With that said, I have found any vape, convection or conduction, benefits from at least one mid-session stir. I find this especially true when using a water piece. Air will follow the path of least resistance, so it just makes sense to alter the path so that the "hidden bits" get full exposure. Not necessary but effective.

 

[RastaBuddhaTao]

I believe there to be two primary phenomena in convection that cause temperature variation within the load and therefore in in inconsistent ABV. The first is that much of air streams energy gets transferred more to the upstream side of the load. This is simply due to it being hotter closer to the heater and loosing heat as it passes through the load leaving the screen side of the load cooler than the heater side. The second phenomena is the effects of laminar and to some degree turbulent flow. That is the air flow experiences drag on the walls of the load chamber slowing down the flow and delivering less energy and heat to the outside annulus of the load. In contrast, the center of the load experiences the most flow rate and gets hottest therefore the classic "charred center closest to the bowl". There are ways to configure load chambers that counter react these defects and @pakalolo and I have spoken on a few occasions on ways to optimize geometry and flow conditions in order to make more consistent ABV. Some in the current Zion technology and some in our back pocket.

Long story short there are some temperature gradients in pure convection that can lead to inconsistent ABV that may cause folks to stir depending on there "char tolerance"

Of course the above is based on an ideal heater. All heaters have hot spots in them caused by the airflow in contact with the heater being hotter than the surrounding air. So many variables and things to consider and to be honest although we have a very solid technology and consistent ABV there is still room for improvement in future models. That said, this IS disruptive patented technology and it will tear your face off. You can read about our patented technology on the www.

 

[Stu]

In contrast, the center of the load experiences the most flow rate and gets hottest therefore the classic "charred center closest to the bowl"

Any convection vaporizer that has no mechanism to create a turbulent air flow will inevitably leave a dark spot in the center and stirring is required for optimal subsequent hits.

To view the laminar airflow, take a look at this video I took of a candle using my thermal camera. The flame is only about an inch long, but you can see that the heated air that is rising, is spiraling up like an inverted tornado that narrows as it climbs. This is basically what is also happening in many convection vape designs.

 

[gtvck]

Wow, thanks RBT for the detailed explanation, sounds amazing!

 

[Jherst]

I just talked my buddy who has really only ever used an MFLB (aside from hitting my LSV once or twice) into ordering one of these. I don't think he understands what he's in for.

 

[thekarmawhore]

I'll start off by saying I want a GH but I'll wait and pay more for one with the bugs worked out. I love the aesthetic and the stealth potential.

For me the main difference, besides the obvious difference in looks, is that the Zion is more friend friendly. It's meant to be passed around and enjoyed repeatedly by everyone, after all there is a lot of love needing spread around this world these days. It's truly a grand session vape in that regard.

In contrast, the GH has been described more as a 'personal' unit, and is better suited in situations where everyone has one of their own, as it will need more time between hits to become a comfortable temp again.

I think there's a place in the stable for both!

 

[Mr. Whitewall]

So do I! With sole difference that, since I'm one impatient fool, I have one GH on order already ...

Even with the whole Zion lineup on order and a few other portables, I still believe there is room for it: The mega-stealth/personal unit is a very important slot to fill!

...Then again I have always had trouble in promoting vaping, even with my trusty Solo or the fearsome MiniVap, for some reason or another; flat batteries, planets not ligned up, too much previous combustion... Therefore I trust the Zion family to be the ultimate noob/group friendly vape.

 

[VegNVape]

Sunday people

I have come to the conclusion that this is not just a vaporizer. It is in fact, imo, a piece of test equipment.

And working in conjunction with your senses it is a finely tuned herbal analyzer.

When used correctly, this device can provide you with the ability to make benchmark assessments of your herb and botanicals for flavour, vapor output & medicinal benefit.

I use my other vaporizers, but I am always happy to come back to Zion.

LevelUpVaping

ZionTime

 

[DieHard]

@cybrguy what setting do you run this pre-heat at and could it be cut down if you set it higher and then backed off again?

My ZION may be the hottest one of the Betas out there so far. I run it with the power cranked nearly all the way up. 3 second preheat, then rip. Away.
@gtvck what it does that the GH doesn't: it will actually arrive in your hand, rather than remain mythological.

 

[Tommy10]

This thing! I must have this thing! Realistically how many brains do you think developed the majority of the Zion technology? Sounds like a bit of a game changer!
I'm a sucker for some thing that seems simple, but delivers so much. Sounds like a portal harbalaire to me! Tough elegant yet unassuming, and hopefully they have performance as a similarity too! Looks like they do!
Just a thought, I recently posted in the hammer thread, and it have since researched and found a video of the same.

If there Zion is a straight single air intake, any thoughts on maybe some sort of screw in nipple for whip. Bag attachment for the top. Sorry if it has been mentioned (102 pages :/ )


Edit: No1 draft pick rookie right here! I do apologise. The video is Payton penny

@paytonpenn


Found a pic of the bottom air intake. How far away does the heat happen? As with the hammer I had to get food grade silicone obviously because the air intake area gets very hot! If it doesn't get too hot it looks like the HA whip tip might fit in well? If anyone can try. Be a giggle if this Beaty blow wicked bags!! With an efficient sized stem the main problem with all bag vapes I have used before, the big bowl. I like bags for a few people, but if I could load .1 and blow some bags I'd be wrapped!

I have been using this method a lot for the hammer lately, just for fun because although the bags certainly are milkier than my HA bags, and the bowl is relatively small. I don't see me doing this as a regular thing once the novelty wears off! But I think this may be due to the hammer being a bit of a pain in the ass! Probs my fav of my vapes, but sometimes I just can't be bothered. Zion looks a less troublesome.

 

[MichaelCompton]

it will actually arrive in your hand, rather than remain mythological.

Haha haha you had me rolling with that statement

 

[Shit Snacks]

This thing! I must have this thing! Realistically how many brains do you think developed the majority of the Zion technology? Sounds like a bit of a game changer!
I'm a sucker for some thing that seems simple, but delivers so much. Sounds like a portal harbalaire to me! Tough elegant yet unassuming, and hopefully they have performance as a similarity too! Looks like they do!
Just a thought, I recently posted in the hammer thread, and it have since researched and found a video of the same.

If there Zion is a straight single air intake, any thoughts on maybe some sort of screw in nipple for whip. Bag attachment for the top. Sorry if it has been mentioned (102 pages :/ )


Edit: No1 draft pick rookie right here! I do apologise. The video is Payton penny

@paytonpenn


Found a pic of the bottom air intake. How far away does the heat happen? As with the hammer I had to get food grade silicone obviously because the air intake area gets very hot! If it doesn't get too hot it looks like the HA whip tip might fit in well? If anyone can try. Be a giggle if this Beaty blow wicked bags!! With an efficient sized stem the main problem with all bag vapes I have used before, the big bowl. I like bags for a few people, but if I could load .1 and blow some bags I'd be wrapped!

I have been using this method a lot for the hammer lately, just for fun because although the bags certainly are milkier than my HA bags, and the bowl is relatively small. I don't see me doing this as a regular thing once the novelty wears off! But I think this may be due to the hammer being a bit of a pain in the ass! Probs my fav of my vapes, but sometimes I just can't be bothered. Zion looks a less troublesome.

Don't know about HerbalAire stuff, but I used an EQ elbow joint to attach a whip to Ziggy once, worked fine so you could conceivably do anything. The airintake does not get hot, but I dont know how full a bag would get in just 30sec or so? With that kind of pump probably fine actually, especially at high voltage too.

Aside from the group session vs personal on demand angle, GH also offers the complex fancy tech, whereas Zion offers the simple handcraft feel. Both pleny powerful, but still will offer a different experience overall regardless of precise vapor output (I love the way vaping with Zion feels, that big smooth block of wood in your hands, big solid trigger and dial...)

 

[gtvck]

Just bought one with 4 batteries and the digi charger! Pretty stoked about it, thanks for answering all my q's!

 

[doubledown]

Just bought one with 4 batteries and the digi charger! Pretty stoked about it, thanks for answering all my q's!

Sweet! Welcome to the club/waiting room

 

[Mr. Whitewall]

Then I was misinformed! If this isn't a cult, er... I'd like my money back!...Like in any good cults people do!

 

[DieHard]

Then I was misinformed! If this isn't a cult, er... I'd like my money back!...Like in any good cults people do!

It is a cult. Please leave all of your worldly vaporizers at the door.