WTF Is Wrong With America And Gun Control?

[florduh]

I have to answer for my freedoms? I must convince others I deserve liberty?

He asked a simple question. Why not just answer it instead of replying with dramatics? We already infringe on your freedoms. You can't park an F-15 in your driveway. We're just arguing over degrees here.

I'm actually fine with people owning AR-15's. After going through a comprehensive training period, mental health screening, and background check. It should be akin to obtaining a pilot's license. That seems like more of a "well regulated militia" to me.

Don't want to go through all that? Defend yourself with a shotgun.

 

[lazylathe]

After going through a comprehensive training period, mental health screening, and background check. It should be akin to obtaining a pilot's license.

This should be mandatory for any type of firearm.
Pick your weapon, go through the training and screening and if you pass, buy the gun and go and be happy! There should also be check ups though as situations with people can change rather rapidly.

If the NRA would agree to this regulation, a lot of issues would disappear.

 

[florduh]

If the NRA would agree to this regulation, a lot of issues would disappear.

They won't go for it because the NRA and their collaborators are extremists who oppose every common sense gun control measure.

We currently have more qualifications to own and operate a Hyundai than a weapon of war. That's insanity and we look like fools to the world.

 

[lwien]

I have to answer for my freedoms? I must convince others I deserve liberty?

That's not my understanding of how it works. But, how about self defense?

Do you think that it would be ok to own a bazooka? Yeah, a bazooka is a bit over the top for self defense but then, so is an AR-15 with high-cap mags, imho. Aren't there better options for self-defense than what we're talking about here.

Ok, let's not ban the AR-15's. How 'bout just banning high cap mags? Doing that would sure as hell cut down on the amount of people that can be killed within 10 to 20 seconds or less, eh? Why isn't anyone talking about high cap mags?

There isn't one answer to this. But ALL of these things, from mental health screenings to hardening our schools, to background checks, to gun show loopholes, to getting our agencies talking to one another, to guns, to mags.................all of it. It should ALL be on the table for discussion.

 

[lazylathe]

They won't go for it because the NRA and their collaborators are extremists who oppose every common sense gun control measure.

We currently have more qualifications to own and operate a Hyundai than a weapon of war. That's insanity and we look like fools to the world.

That is exactly why my first comment was that the NRA is the problem...
They are all through the government and parliament, no bill will pass that does not benefit them.

 

[Dustydurban]

What If you arn't so good of a shot do I have to Muzzle load?
My wife and girls can handle one easier than a shotgun
Why do I have to do what YOU think is best for my situation?
I don't tell anyone how to defend themselves

 

[lwien]

What If you arn't so good of a shot do I have to Muzzle load?
My wife and girls can handle one easier than a shotgun
Why do I have to do what YOU think is best for my situation?
I don't tell anyone how to defend themselves

It all boils down to the risk reward ratio. How many more innocent kids are killed with an AR-15 versus how many kids are saved by using one for self defense. That would be an interesting stat that I'd like to see.

And would your wife and girls find an AR-15, with it's length, easier to handle than a snub-nosed 38 working in close range, like in your house?

I just can't wrap my head around the need to have one.

 

[florduh]

What If you arn't so good of a shot do I have to Muzzle load?
My wife and girls can handle one easier than a shotgun
Why do I have to do what YOU think is best for my situation?
I don't tell anyone how to defend themselves

WE ALREADY TELL YOU HOW TO DEFEND YOURSELF.

You can't lace your property with land mines. You can't launch Hellfire missiles from drones at intruders.

Sorry, but your "feeling" safe isn't worth a mass shooting every other week. That having been said, I support your wife owning an AR-15. After she goes through a training course, licensing (with re-certs), and a mental health screening. I only want qualified people wielding weapons of war. How is that not reasonable?

 

[CarolKing]

When the constitution was written America was very different. I don’t think our founding fathers were talking about AR-15s. We were trying to protect ourselves against other countries like England. Folks had to protect themselves in their homes as they do now but times were different.

No AR-15s or other high powered war weapons
Age 21 to buy a gun
No arming teachers!
Strict background checks and revise if needed every couple years
Nobody on the no fly list allowed to get a gun
No wife beaters allowed to get a gun
Mental check list - not sure what that would be?

 

[Newcastle]

Two questions to your perfect answer to the problem. First who is going to pay for all of this liscensing training and mental back ground check? Not that you care it wont affect you. Second is do you really believe for a second that if we confiscated every AR15 that they wont just use something else. I feel we need more training and certification to breed! It might stop some of the problems of the world right there!

 

[florduh]

Two questions to your perfect answer to the problem. First who is going to pay for all of this liscensing training and mental back ground check? Not that you care it wont affect you. Second is do you really believe for a second that if we confiscated every AR15 that they wont just use something else. I feel we need more training and certification to breed! It might stop some of the problems of the world right there!

Gun owners will pay for all of that. Just like car owners pay administrative fees.

To your second question, I simply want to stop weapons of war from being freely available at fucking stores. Will it stop every nut? No. But it will make mass murder more difficult to pull off.

And we’ve run this experiment. Countries with stricter gun laws don’t have a mass shooting every other week.

Most of these countries consume the same mass media and have the same mental health challenges. The only variable here is America’s free-for-all gun laws.

 

[CarolKing]

Folks should have to get their gun registration updated every couple years. I’m assuming there would be a fee to gun owners. Kinda like getting your drivers lisence renewed - along with a background check. Making sure they can read an eye chart as well possibly. This will cost money.

Americans need to help to remove the grip the NRA has on our lawmakers. We need some common sense gun laws along with training. There should be similar laws throughout the U.S. Yes gun laws vary from state to state.

Edit
I don’t think they can confiscate every war weapon out there but stop selling them would be a start.

The opiate problem is a different issue and very important. Folks can always open a new thread for opiate problem in the world.

 

[Krazy]

I do have concerns on the "OMG, crazy person?!?!?" restrictions. Who defines this? How would it actually be applied?

 

[lwien]

I feel we need more training and certification to breed!

Now you've finally said something that I can agree with. I think training and certification to become a parent is a damn good idea. It'll never happen but I like it.

 

[Newcastle]

@CarolKing I said confiscation knowing its impossible. But the thing you said that almost makes me as crazy as when you say machine gun. That is "Common Sense gun laws" So those that dont agree with you dont have common sense? Liberal word play like Assault Rifle.... The weapon of war... It may be based on the M16 but I have much more powerful and dangetous guns than a semi automatic .223 which is what caliber the AR is. The whole BAN ARs. is just a start to ban much more. I have said it and I will say it again. Columbine halpened in the middle of an assault rifle ban which banned ARs and high cap mags. I worked at the Home Depot next to the High School when it happened....hard day! Bad people set on doing bad things will still do them with or without the AR. It wont decline the cassualty count either like someone said. There was also bombs at Columbine. They didnt work but they had them.

 

[florduh]

I do have concerns on the "OMG, crazy person?!?!?" restrictions. Who defines this? How would it actually be applied?

We have had Psychiatric medicine for over a century. I'm pretty confident no psychiatrist would've signed off on the Parkland shooter as being of sound enough mind to own an AR-15 responsibly.

@CarolKing I said confiscation knowing its impossible. But the thing you said that almost makes me as crazy as when you say machine gun. That is "Common Sense gun laws" So those that dont agree with you dont have common sense? Liberal word play like Assault Rifle.... The weapon of war... It may be based on the M16 but I have much more powerful and dangetous guns than a semi automatic .223 which is what caliber the AR is. The whole BAN ARs. is just a start to ban much more. I have said it and I will say it again. Columbine halpened in the middle of an assault rifle ban which banned ARs and high cap mags. I worked at the Home Depot next to the High School when it happened....hard day! Bad people set on doing bad things will still do them with or without the AR. It wont decline the cassualty count either like someone said. There was also bombs at Columbine. They didnt work but they had them.

AR-15's seem to be the weapon of choice for mass murder in America. We should at the very least make them more difficult to obtain. And this whole NRA meme that since we can't prevent every murder, we should take no steps to prevent SOME murder is bullshit.

 

[lwien]

The whole BAN ARs. is just a start to ban much more.

Just when I started agreeing with you, ya have to go and say something I disagree with. Killjoy !!

That whole "slippery slope" argument can be used to justify just about anything. It's an argument based on fear. Could doing anything lead to something else? Sure, but then again, it doesn't have to.

 

[Newcastle]

If they did ban the ARs I guarantee it would include hi cap mags and a list of other rifles. It wont do any good. It will just make people....yall.....feel better.

 

[florduh]

If they did ban the ARs I guarantee it would include hi cap mags and a list of other rifles. It wont do any good. It will just make people....yall.....feel better.

Making weapons of war more difficult to obtain absolutely does good. Again, look at every other civilized country where mass casualty events don't happen every other week.

 

[pakalolo]

TOTAL KILLED BY NRA.....0

TOTAL KILLED BY PLANNED PARENTHOOD....50,000,000+

The NRA exists to support the gun INDUSTRY. Not you. They want more guns in America. That is their sole goal. We already have more than enough guns in this country. Guns outnumber people. And the result? We are the only big boy country where multiple children get murdered every other week, in school.



Please tell me this is a joke.

And that quote was from someone who labeled my post as "liberal dribble". Talk about calling the kettle black.

ps: I'm sorry Stu. I just couldn't resist.

I didn't say abortions is most of what Planned Parenthood does, I said they are so large so as to be almost all of the U.S. abortion industry. Are you saying Planned Parenthood does not support itself?

Of the about 893,000 abortions in the U.S. last year (2017), Planned Parenthood performed about 328,348 of them. Having over a 1/3 of the multi-million dollar a year industry certainly gives it a leg up on discovering its reason for being. But, I admit I was wrong when I said they were "most" of the industry. They are just the largest profiteer in it.

HOWEVER, the point is not to argue abortion. (At least from me.) The point is that, if we arbitrarily assign an value on a civil right of zero to those who want to keep and bear arms, why can't people on the other side of the political spectrum assign zero value to the civil right of keeping the government out of our personal, reproductive decisions? It is easy to come to a solution when you think the other side has no point.


The majority of NRA spending is for newsletters, event organizing (shooting sport), and gun training and safety courses. The revenue, in 2016, was $163.5 million from dues, $171 million from donations, $69 million from program fees (entry to events or classes) and $30 million from all that sweet, sweet blood money investment. Even if we were to assume ALL of the donation category was from gun manufacturers (Which, it is not. There are lists of large non-industry contributors out there but I'm not going to go through and total up those donations.) we have the majority of the revenue from individual sources.

This topic is inflammatory enough without introducing abortion. The next person to mention abortion or Planned Parenthood or anything along that line gets a thread ban.

 

[Newcastle]

If you keep saying it florduh it must be true.

 

[florduh]

If you keep saying it florduh it must be true.

You don't have to take my word for it. Like I've said ad nauseum, humanity has already run the experiment. Every other civilized country has stricter gun laws... and they don't have a mass shooting every other week. The evidence speaks for itself.

 

[Newcastle]

Thats where we differ. You blame the gun and I blame society.

 

[florduh]

Thats where we differ. You blame the gun and I blame society.

European Countries, Canada, New Zealand, Australia all consume the same mass media as Americans. Those countries all face the same mental health challenges. The only variable at play here is America's lax gun laws.


Sorry. It's the guns.

 

[Newcastle]

2014 Russia had their first school shooting. It happens every where. Guess what.....mental illness is the link....not the type of weapon. You can also google knife attacks. Tons in other countrys which inforces what I said about them finding a tool of destruction if guns were banned.