What are the pros and cons with flower, oil and wax?

[Baron23]

Why? My dabs are about 0.03g, which is equivalent to less than 1/4g of flower. What's the difference between my dab off of a ruby surface, and say an Invertedisdead rip through the FlowerPot? Other than flavour , smoothness, and effects of course! Talk to my doc? Curious on the Dr Sulak as i'm a big fan, but I haven't come across him saying that. I've been on high quality extracts exclusively for well over a year now, and my health is much better than when trying to inhale 2.5g of flower vapour a day. Much prefer my <.2g extract (and that's on a big day).

Like I said:

this is just me and I have absolutely no desire to debate anyone on this. We all do what we find OUR brains/bodies like best.

 

[biohacker]

@Baron23 That's cool and all but if you do come across that Dr. Sulak reference I would greatly appreciate it.

Adjusted for yield, concentrates/extracts aren't going to do anything "special" to your receptors that THC in flower isn't already doing. Of course, not everyone has the ability to moderate their consumption.

 

[psychonaut]

I find vaporizing flower exclusively to be a chore and quite a toll on my lungs. I grew up like most of us smoking joints and brass bowls with metal screens, upgraded to glass bowls, found vaporizer for dry herb, found shatter, found titanium nail, found enail, found quartz nail, found dnail, discovered low temp dabbing, discovered rosin thanks to @invertedisdead.

Consumption is down, lungs are in better shape, high is not the same, but it's preferable IMO, like @PPN flower seems to suit that spot where you wanna wrap up the night. I save my indica flower for that, or indica sift. A lot of us have been on this journey for quite some time and no doubt some old hippies. Well put @shredder old dogs can learn new tricks =)

I personally dont like using my concentrates in portable devices so much, I love a quartz banger and torch or enail with my sic halo, effects are $

 

[vapirtoo]

I tried some really tasty shatter that a friend brought up from his Florida dispensary.
After using this for two days, my left chest muscles started hurting, and I remembered this was the same discomfort that I experienced the last time he came through.
We were using my Errlectric herb nail, and the effects were amazing as well as the taste.
When the shatter ran out, so did my chest pain. Flowers never do this to me!?

 

[Madri-Gal]

IMO this is likely due to the same reasons why some combusters don't like transitioning to vapour, because they don't feel as "stoned".



I used to think the same thing, for well over a decade, until I became allergic!



Clever! I wonder just how many of those are actually UNdesirable? Like phytoestrogens? Isn't ALL the medicine in the actual trichs and not the plant? And if so, why wouldn't sift/kief/hash be the holy grail?







This, big time! I simply can't handle flower vapour anymore. And i've tried every vaporizer on the market, several times.



Why? My dabs are about 0.03g, which is equivalent to less than 1/4g of flower. What's the difference between my dab off of a ruby surface, and say an Invertedisdead rip through the FlowerPot? Other than flavour , smoothness, and effects of course! Talk to my doc? Curious on the Dr Sulak as i'm a big fan, but I haven't come across him saying that. I've been on high quality extracts exclusively for well over a year now, and my health is much better than when trying to inhale 2.5g of flower vapour a day. Much prefer my <.2g extract (and that's on a big day).



Not down with the HTE either.... always go for the HCE!!!

I'm fortunate to not be allergic to flower. If I become allergic, then I would switch to just rosin, or edibles, tinctures. Being able to grow and press enough would be a concern, of course. I'm not interested in buying meds, in any form, on a regular basis. I'm happy for you, of course, that you have found what you like and what works for you. I love concentrates. I love flower. Less than two weeks ago I had pulmonary functioning tests done, and my lungs are the best they've been in twenty years. Vaping as much flower as I want hasn't bothered my lungs at all, and seems to have improved them. My asthma meds have been reduced dramatically, and I haven't been hospitalized with pulmonary issues since I started vaping. I'm content that my flowers are clean and healthful. Again, I like both, and can use both. I have no reason to drop either flower or concentrate. It's a funny thing about personal preference, but people like what they like, and I like both flower and concentrate.

 

[biohacker]

I find vaporizing flower exclusively to be a chore and quite a toll on my lungs.

^^^^ THIS!!

We've lost one of our biggest resources on this topic... so I wanted to dig up a quote from the Doctor!

I don't use bud if I can access concentrates. Concentrates are what I need - flower vaping is too time consuming and harsh on the throat for my dosage requirements.

Not very long ago, I was left without access to concentrates for a while. I found that in that scenario, I was vaping 3.5-5 grams of flower in a day. I'd use 25-50% of that weight of flower in the same timeframe if I could process it into concentrates.

That definitely resonates with me!

 

[Baron23]

@Baron23 That's cool and all but if you do come across that Dr. Sulak reference I would greatly appreciate it.

Adjusted for yield, concentrates/extracts aren't going to do anything "special" to your receptors that THC in flower isn't already doing. Of course, not everyone has the ability to moderate their consumption.

Hi Bio - I did take a kind of quick look but couldn't lay my hands on it. It was one of his earlier vids on tolerance break. In it I remember him going on a bit about how 'trates overwhelm your receptors and we know its a scientific fact that your brain will retract receptors if exposed to enough cannabinoids. And this is exactly where rising tolerance comes from (base line tolerance seems to be very genetically determined as people have greater and lesser amounts of receptors naturally).

If I come across it again, I will def tag you.

And please, I was not trying to come off smarmy or anything. Often when I post I'm kind of in a rush and don't take the time to be fully explanatory. For you and your allergies...well, you don't need me to tell you that 'trates are the way to go and indeed you are a fairly low consumer who does pretty dang small dabs.

Me.....I take one of the dab rigs out maybe once a week and do a few dabs....dunno how big they are but I'm betting they are well more than .03 g.

But really, the reason I tend to not want to debate these kinds of issues very much is that we are really...no shit...different in ourselves and our desired outcome from MJ use. So, that kind of makes it all pretty moot to me.

Have a great day.

 

[C No Ego]

@biohacker jucing, or eating raw cannabis tends to lend more to benefiting from the flavinoids and other plant constituents... heating - vaping, smoking ETC will mostly be the cannabinoids only as the other compounds succumb to heat and wither away but we still absorb/ ingest many phenol;ic and esterified waxes

 

[stinkytofus]

I think flowers are fine, everything else too strong, "might" be bad for brain if u take it too strong on a daily basis, too little or too much is always a bad thing imo

 

[audiodelic]

Well i strongly prefer flowers, its the well rounded high im after, and the potent top shelf herbs is way better for me than concentrates. Concentrates are potent no doubt, but the high is single dimensional pure thc high , flower high is multi dimensional thanks to other things apart from thc in the plant material.

I keep trying to mix it up to keep on tricking the tolerance.

 

[invertedisdead]

I wonder just how many of those are actually UNdesirable? Like phytoestrogens? Isn't ALL the medicine in the actual trichs and not the plant? And if so, why wouldn't sift/kief/hash be the holy grail?

I'm surprised FC has not adopted to vaping kief over flower. It provides the same "spectrum" experience, while requiring considerably less inhalations to reach effect, and most importantly, no grinding necessary which bursts those delicate trichome heads and oxidizes the essential oil constituents, which causes rapid loss of flavor and potency in my experience.

Also I can't believe I forgot to note one of the most important benefits of concentrate vaping... you can have an all glass vapor path for under $50. For us FCOG's who still care about getting a clean hit, it's very hard to achieve a comparable experience with flower vapes as there is almost always some sort of plastic or metal in the pathway.

 

[hafalump]

I love keif, I wish the dispensary had this or old school hash instead of the shatter crap.
A dispensary near me has stopped selling more than an 1/8 of flower at a time. Its all concentrate, up to 5g per visit. I’m thinking they make more $ by turning it all into wax, crumble, etc.

 

[shredder]

I love keif, I wish the dispensary had this or old school hash instead of the shatter crap.
A dispensary near me has stopped selling more than an 1/8 of flower at a time. Its all concentrate, up to 5g per visit. I’m thinking they make more $ by turning it all into wax, crumble, etc.

Not proof of anything, but a dispensary worker told me everyone under 30yr old uses concentrates and the majority of older users buy herb. It may be a generational thing or a lack of knowledge. Or maybe just what ones comfort zone is.

 

[hafalump]

Ha ha, I never see anyone younger that 40 when I go. In Mass, usually a line so I see a range of folks.
Mostly 50 and older, I was wondering if it was even cool with the youngsters.

 

[invertedisdead]

Not proof of anything, but a dispensary worker told me everyone under 30yr old uses concentrates and the majority of older users but herb. It may be a generational thing or a lack of knowledge. Or maybe just what ones comfort zone is.

I've actually been very surprised at how many people I've meet under 30 that don't really like dabs. I'm in the same demographic and notice that many of my peers just want to smoke a bong hit like they did in their golden era of cannabis.

I tend to notice concentrate use being more prevalent among older generations who value a smoother hit and want to reach desired effects in less inhalations. Also largely for discretion reasons, just a lot quicker to snap a dab down and get back to the family then do a 3 bag volcano session anymore.

 

[pxl_jockey]

I really like this thread and appreciate the mutual respect going around, a proper FCOG conversation! Lots of thoughtful (and valid) reasoning for the various positions, even though some of the anecdotal evidence is contradictory, I’m quite sure there’s some truth in all. We are indeed all different! But yet the same!

For me, I still want to keep enjoying flower even when I get the dabpress and start squishing. I don’t have access to dispensary meds or a caring care-giver at this moment, in some ways I feel fortunate to have missed out on the Wild West of questionable products but sad that I don’t know the good quality top-shelf stuff either. Now that rosin is within the reach of pretty much everyone, I feel pathetic for lagging behind while I wait for buds worth pressing. I’m pushing a bit over fifty, so I guess that bud tender knows sumpin, @shredder .

So for those who feel like all of the concentrates they’ve done have been one-dimensional and lacking the lovely full-spectrum embrace of the entourage: are you guys talking about the many concentrates other than rosin? Or does rosin fall into that category as well?

And another thing for everyone: Aren’t all the full-spectrum extracts only made with hash rosin? There’s just so much in this arena that I’m bloody ignorant about...

 

[Madri-Gal]

I really like this thread and appreciate the mutual respect going around, a proper FCOG conversation! Lots of thoughtful (and valid) reasoning for the various positions, even though some of the anecdotal evidence is contradictory, I’m quite sure there’s some truth in all. We are indeed all different! But yet the same!

For me, I still want to keep enjoying flower even when I get the dabpress and start squishing. I don’t have access to dispensary meds or a caring care-giver at this moment, in some ways I feel fortunate to have missed out on the Wild West of questionable products but sad that I don’t know the good quality top-shelf stuff either. Now that rosin is within the reach of pretty much everyone, I feel pathetic for lagging behind while I wait for buds worth pressing. I’m pushing a bit over fifty, so I guess that bud tender knows sumpin, @shredder .

So for those who feel like all of the concentrates they’ve done have been one-dimensional and lacking the lovely full-spectrum embrace of the entourage: are you guys talking about the many concentrates other than rosin? Or does rosin fall into that category as well?

And another thing for everyone: Aren’t all the full-spectrum extracts only made with hash rosin? There’s just so much in this arena that I’m bloody ignorant about...

I mostly use rosin if I'm using concentrates, and I don't feel at all as if they are one dimensional, @pxl_jockey . I love the stuff, and it does what I want and need it to. For me, still enjoying flower as well has nothing to do with any lack in rosin. I just also enjoy flower. I'd hate to have to pick only one, and am happy I don't have to. I'd love to have a Dab Press, and intend to get one when I can, and I imagine that I'd use dabs more than I do now once that happy event takes place. I just don't have the intention to give up flower. Every one is different, I know, and I don't enjoy edibles, for example. That doesn't mean I think there is anything wrong with edibles, or the people that enjoy them. I wish I did enjoy them. It's just how it is. I like flower and concentrate. I have never found concentrate lacking in breadth or depth of dimension.

 

[biohacker]

Or does rosin fall into that category as well?

Depends on who you ask! I personally think that all of this "full spectrum" talk is silly, and a tolerance break will create the fullest spectrum of effects even possible! Otherwise, it's just simply and most likely due to contaminant (plant material). Kinda how like some prefer combustion effects over vaping. Vaping has something "missing" is what's common, until you fully make the transition and get used to its cleaner effects. Although some people never do.

I mostly use rosin if I'm using concentrates, and I don't feel at all as if they are one dimensional,

I have never found concentrate lacking in breadth or depth of dimension.

Couldn't agree more... heck, even an isolated THC like distillate can absolutely FLOOR someone!

 

[audiodelic]

I also seem to feel heavier burnout after herb as compared to concentrates, the concentrates are purer so less burn out ? If that makes sense, any ways my opinion only.

Rosin does seem to offer more well rounded than shatter or crumble.
I seem to also like bubble hash, iceolater hashes whenever rarely available.

 

[Brewervapesalot]

Consuming whole flower is certainly an anomaly on the cannabis timeline, mostly practiced in North America.

Sweet! That's a cool American story. All I like is really nice flower. Taste. Smell. Feel. Come on, there's no equal, not even close.

 

[invertedisdead]

Sweet! That's a cool American story. All I like is really nice flower. Taste. Smell. Feel. Come on, there's no equal, not even close.

Come hit a dab of this GMO live rosin off my sapphire insert and I'll show ya what's good with smell, taste, and feel

 

[Tranquility]

What do you know? Here's a study:
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/08/190826092256.htm

It's about teens who use a "highly potent form of marijuana" called "marijuana concentrate". Apparently, when teens use this "marijuana concentrate" risk factors may increase. That's for a future study, of course. Today, we know some teens are using a highly potent form of marijuana known as marijuana concentrate.

 

[invertedisdead]

What do you know? Here's a study:
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/08/190826092256.htm

It's about teens who use a "highly potent form of marijuana" called "marijuana concentrate". Apparently, when teens use this "marijuana concentrate" risk factors may increase. That's for a future study, of course. Today, we know some teens are using a highly potent form of marijuana known as marijuana concentrate.

I'd like to get a hold of Professor Meier so I can teach her that THC percentage is based on WEIGHT. Those inflated THC numbers stem from the refinement of exogenous plant material, such concentration has little to no effect on perceived potency. THC doesn't actually "get stronger" when concentrated.

That's by far the most misunderstood myth in the cannabis industry right now.

 

[shredder]

What do you know? Here's a study:
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/08/190826092256.htm

It's about teens who use a "highly potent form of marijuana" called "marijuana concentrate". Apparently, when teens use this "marijuana concentrate" risk factors may increase. That's for a future study, of course. Today, we know some teens are using a highly potent form of marijuana known as marijuana concentrate.

To me it confirms that flowers are more suited to the junior varsity crowd, younger kids.

And concentrates for the varsity.

Go team! Rah rah rah.....

 

[invertedisdead]

To me it confirms that flowers are more suited to the junior varsity crowd, younger kids.

And concentrates for the varsity.

Go team! Rah rah rah.....

@shredder I found your old Letterman jacket!