Wahhh Help ..Dry ice hash to concentrate

witka

Member
OK i think i have TO much info on the brain
I have just made a pile of 73 DIH i'm looking to make wax/shatter for my APX Wax vape ( triple coil)

I'm not interested in BHO

i've tried the QWISO filter and reduce, but not happy with the return
Rosin is even worse (and i seem to fuck it up LOL).

When I made the batch of DIH I assumed that it would be simple to 'whip up into wax'
due to how fine it is..

HALLLPPP ?
 
witka,

herbivore21

Well-Known Member
OK i think i have TO much info on the brain
I have just made a pile of 73 DIH i'm looking to make wax/shatter for my APX Wax vape ( triple coil)

I'm not interested in BHO

i've tried the QWISO filter and reduce, but not happy with the return
Rosin is even worse (and i seem to fuck it up LOL).

When I made the batch of DIH I assumed that it would be simple to 'whip up into wax'
due to how fine it is..

HALLLPPP ?
The trick with dry ice is that your flowers get super brittle and fragile super quickly - not just the trichome glands! Your first few seconds of agitation with dry ice is your melty headstash (not likely to be full melt!). The reason I say this is that even gentle shaking will obliterate your flowers/trim into powder due to the abovementioned brittleness.

Rosin squishing from crude dry sift (especially dry ice sift!) is not usually fruitful IMO. No moisture in the material means it doesn't squish very well or at all. You need more moisture in that starting material. The very melty sift is much easier to squish rosin out of but even so bubble hash and flower squish much better.

How much starting material did you sift? We need to get you a realistic idea of returns/yields for the methods you've used first of all!

I do not recommend sifting with dry ice before a solvent extraction - it is simply going to smash up all of the plant contaminant and get it through your sifting screens. You're basically running the risk of ending up effectively just grinding up your flower before extraction (rather than sifting away trichomes) this way.

So to start: How much flower/trim did you sift to begin with?
 
herbivore21,

witka

Member
I started with an ounce and got half a cup of sift, about 250ml of 73 and 250ml of 160
Yah i was going to do bubble hash but was in a rush lol
trying to stay away from solvent but that seems inevitable
 
witka,

herbivore21

Well-Known Member
I started with an ounce and got half a cup of sift, about 250ml of 73 and 250ml of 160
Yah i was going to do bubble hash but was in a rush lol
trying to stay away from solvent but that seems inevitable
Cheers for the info! Now we can get to the bottom of things!

Unfortunately, it is time for a home truth that I once had to learn myself:

1 ounce is a negligible amount of cannabis to make into hash of any kind, assuming you are looking for melty, high quality hash. Full melt is not going to be usable in your vape cart (LAYG vape pens are just no substitute for a good nail setup - especially where full melt is concerned).

When making super high quality hash like you can see in my avatar, you are getting a maximum of ~10% of your total weight back from the highest quality flowers (this 10% will comprise all of the various grades of material that you make and will not necessarily all be full melt).

We need to clarify too that you have a full 250ml (which I believe is 8-9 fluid ounces of volume for those of us who do not work with metric standards!) of your 73 and 160 collections? By the way, it is always best to weigh your yield by weight, not volume. Weight will be in ounces/pounds etc or grams/kg etc if you are using metric. Volume (fluid oz/ml etc) is not such a useful measure in this scenario.

If you have two full 250ml containers, the amount of hash you would have to fill them could conceivably account for more than 50% of the total weight of your starting flowers! This means what you have is likely to be less of a hash and more of a finely ground herb - the yield is just way too high!

The 160 collection should be expected to be mostly contaminant at the best of times, even the first shake and your 73 collection should be better quality with a little bit of melt - however, only the first minute or so of your 73 sift will be of this reasonable quality. I find that after not much time at all herb in contact with dry ice smashes to powder and most of the contaminant comes through into the hash. Even if the herb wasn't being pulverised, the most mature capitate stalked trichome glands (which are what we are aiming to extract with hashmaking methods) are like ripe fruit, they fall from the tree with the most minimal of agitation so will be sifted off your material very quickly!

It sounds like you have rosin equipment on hand. My suggestion is this:

Don't bother with hash methods. They are not helpful or efficient for your needs. You want something vapable in your pen cart. No hash is useful for this purpose. However you could just squish your flowers straight into rosin and use that instead! Check out the rosin thread in the concentrates section of FC for more info!

Don't bother with solvents IMO, there is just no need. Your flower rosin will be much better than a solvent extract from very, very crude kief and will take you less time to produce.
 
herbivore21,

witka

Member
Sorry aboot the Metric , Yah I realized after I did the DIH that it wasn't right for what i was trying to make.

Ok well i think i will just dissolve this DIH into some oil for topical/sublingual.. which ultimately i want to get away from smoking any cannabis (i know i'm a baaad pothead :p )
 

herbivore21

Well-Known Member
Sorry aboot the Metric , Yah I realized after I did the DIH that it wasn't right for what i was trying to make.

Ok well i think i will just dissolve this DIH into some oil for topical/sublingual.. which ultimately i want to get away from smoking any cannabis (i know i'm a baaad pothead :p )
By smoking do your mean vaporizing? Because I don't smoke at all, but vaporize plenty! Most of us are all about that way of doing things around these parts ;)
 
herbivore21,

witka

Member
Yah Vaping is better, but still hurts my throat.. im hoping to try a nasal spray as my main on the go methods as it's probably 2nd fastest response.
 
witka,

herbivore21

Well-Known Member
Yah Vaping is better, but still hurts my throat.. im hoping to try a nasal spray as my main on the go methods as it's probably 2nd fastest response.

I hear you man, I minimize this by using solventless concentrates at low temp rather than vaping a bunch of flower - much less vapor inhalation and much less throat irritation is required to get the same effect. I don't get problems with throat irritation unless I vape a lot of flower. I never vape enough concentrates to irritate my throat. Probably because the requisite volume of inhaled vapor would be more than I'd usually consume in one day. YMMV.

Interesting to hear you intend to try a nasal spray though! How do you intend to achieve a nasal spray preparation?
 
herbivore21,
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witka

Member
Well I figured i'd try decarb the cannabis then mix it with sesame oil.. apparently it's one of the oils that gets absorbed in the mucous membranes in the nasal area. there are a bunch of 'natural' nasal sprays like this.. http://pendopharm.com/product/rhinaris-nozoil/


which solventless way do you vape? rosin tech?
 
witka,

herbivore21

Well-Known Member
Well I figured i'd try decarb the cannabis then mix it with sesame oil.. apparently it's one of the oils that gets absorbed in the mucous membranes in the nasal area. there are a bunch of 'natural' nasal sprays like this.. http://pendopharm.com/product/rhinaris-nozoil/


which solventless way do you vape? rosin tech?
I use full melt bubble hash on a sapphire enail myself! That is very interesting stuff man! Let me know how the spray works out! I do suggest getting your hands on a sonicator to get the most even possible emulsion :)
 
herbivore21,

witka

Member
Yah i think i will need to use lechtin for bond them.. but we will see.. I am using my DIH with my vape, it seems ok.
 

witka

Member
well here goes, i just made my sesame oil nasal spray infused with cannabis.. took 2 squirts up each hole, lol gimme 20 mins :) ..
 

herbivore21

Well-Known Member
well here goes, i just made my sesame oil nasal spray infused with cannabis.. took 2 squirts up each hole, lol gimme 20 mins :) ..
I'll be sure to keep an eye out here for your results brother! Very interested to hear! Please do note any sense of irritation or congestion if there is any too :)
 
herbivore21,

witka

Member
First Impression , smells like toasted sesame in mah nose.. hehe, The DIH that i had was a mix of 2thc/18cbd and 5thc/9cbd medical grade flowers.. it was 73 micron so it was pretty buttery, I decarbed in a mason jar the oven at 220 for 30ish minutes, looked nice and golden brown, let stand for 20 mins while it cooled off,

i don't have a scale, but it was about 3 tablespoons of DIH i mixed in to unrefined sesame oil i got from a DIY skin/beauty/soap hippy store, they carry like 1000 types of oils.. I notice most oil receipes are about 2 to 1 to dry herb, so i did about a half a cup of oil to my 3ish tablespoons, double boiled on medium for 10-15 and sieved through a 160 micron bubble bag..

3 sprays in each nostrol ...Not bad i must say, feeling slightly buzzed, relaxed, pain relief is starting to kick in.

though I do not have a measurement of how potent my spray is, it does say the bottle is 30ml, and 50 sprays = 5ml

so i guess each spray is 0.1ml of liquid, i definitely feel it's stronger because i used DIH instead of flower...
 

witka

Member
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herbivore21

Well-Known Member
Fascinating brother! I'm gonna look into this method of delivery myself but might review the scholarly literature on acceptable carriers for the cannabis extract before going ahead. I don't wanna spray anything in my nose if it isn't 100% accepted as safe in the medical research. I'll be sure to report back.

BTW, do edit your posts rather than posting a number of posts in a row as you have here. The mods have always given me hell for this in the past. The edit button is at the bottom of your post next to the 'report' button :)

Noticing any congestion or stuffiness in the nose at all btw?

Remember also with dosage that volume (ml) is not a very accurate measure, especially if your bottle was measured with water or another liquid. The constituents in your cannabis preparation mean that 1ml by volume of your material vs the 1ml by volume of water (or whatever reference material was used to measure the sprayer), do not represent the same mass of medicine (that is the more accurate overall measure of the quantity of material).
 
herbivore21,

witka

Member
yah i mean anything in the nose feels a bit weird.. maybe a little irritation but it doesn't feel clogged, and definitely feels more comfortable then smoking of vaping of cannabis. I also suffer from dry mouth/nose due to psych meds I am on. so maybe this will help

https://aacijournal.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1710-1492-6-10

"use of sesame oil significantly improved mucosal dryness, nasal stuffiness, and nasal crusting when compared to an isotonic sodium chloride solution[95]. The measures are generally safe and can be used adjunctively with other treatments."

http://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaotolaryngology/fullarticle/482595

thanks for the edit advice, didn't even think of it.

So after 4 sprays in each nostril , and an hour after, had nice pain relief and had a nap..

with most "homebrew" cannabis projects, dosage is tough without proper testing.
 

herbivore21

Well-Known Member
yah i mean anything in the nose feels a bit weird.. maybe a little irritation but it doesn't feel clogged, and definitely feels more comfortable then smoking of vaping of cannabis. I also suffer from dry mouth/nose due to psych meds I am on. so maybe this will help

https://aacijournal.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1710-1492-6-10

"use of sesame oil significantly improved mucosal dryness, nasal stuffiness, and nasal crusting when compared to an isotonic sodium chloride solution[95]. The measures are generally safe and can be used adjunctively with other treatments."

http://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaotolaryngology/fullarticle/482595

thanks for the edit advice, didn't even think of it.

So after 4 sprays in each nostril , and an hour after, had nice pain relief and had a nap..

with most "homebrew" cannabis projects, dosage is tough without proper testing.
Great stuff man, thanks for the feedback on this one, very relevant for a lot of us!
 
herbivore21,

herbivore21

Well-Known Member
Interesting, I'm also wondering if a solventless preparation with less heat might be more effective still, due to additional terpene retention. Which state are you located in? You may be able to purchase concentrates that would lend themselves better to this kind of preparation cheaply (distillates, the concentrates that I am thinking of are not so practical for DIY home processing but will be much easier to mix into the sesame oil evenly) and I can easily walk you through the rest!
 
herbivore21,

witka

Member
I live in Canada, our cannabis system is a bit messed up atm, I have a government card, but the law says I can only buy flowers or cannabis oil , but oil is expensive 60ml for $120 and it's already infused in oil.... I also get compassionate pricing so i pay $5/grm for flower...

there are 'grey area' cannabis markets that sell concentrates, but no regulation on the quality /source
 

herbivore21

Well-Known Member
I live in Canada, our cannabis system is a bit messed up atm, I have a government card, but the law says I can only buy flowers or cannabis oil , but oil is expensive 60ml for $120 and it's already infused in oil.... I also get compassionate pricing so i pay $5/grm for flower...

there are 'grey area' cannabis markets that sell concentrates, but no regulation on the quality /source
Fair enough brother, well done on your work so far all the same! :)
 
herbivore21,
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