Vaping based on where you live

[duh]

This thread is based on a reply from my "The Hype is Real" PD blog post where a user questioned if the PD was really better than the Volcano (it is, in terms of efficiency). The more I weighed on the answer I realized that there is a missing nuance to what we think of as "the best" because it is really a regional thing and/or a quantity/available thing - legality aside.

For example:

A major grower would only 'break out' the PD when a very special blend was low.

Someone in the midwest w/little access would 'break out' the Volcano/SSV/DB/Extreme/Larger Vape Here when they wanted to drill through the duff out in out of temps PD range.

In places like California, the larger capacity vapes will likely get more popular and prices will continue to bottom out as legalization nears.

If the 'gourmet' culture continues, scarcity in material actually increases again because all the best strains that are hard to care for and things like kief and other concentrates like in Europe start to become popular.

Whatya think?

 

[max]

I agree to a large extent. But personal likes/dislikes for particular vapes also have to be considered, despite the quantity and quality available. If I were in the "major grower" catagory (I wish ), or just had access to an unlimited supply of all the best strains, I would definitely break out my 'big hitter' a lot more often, but I'd still be using a PD a large part of the time. For me it's wanting to limit my hit size (at least sometimes) due to using very high quality herb (my goal isn't always to get totally wasted), and my lungs aren't as happy when I use a big hitter all the time.

 

[Beezleb]

I would not categorize a PD/Myrtlezap/Arozap type vapes and the Volcano together. Keep in mind, the remains of the PD/Myrtlezap/Arozap type vapes are often reported to be reused, I wouldnt get all to confident in the best definition of efficiency with a PD/Myrtlezap/Arozap type vape.

While those vapes are very good at vaping small amounts of weed per tube most people I see report consume two or more stems/tubes per session which puts general usage on par with many whip based vaporizers so I would not say it deserves a medal of absolute efficiency vaporizer in the world.

If one tube is enough for a person than for that individual the vape they are using is extremely efficient but for those who are using the equivalent amount of herb as other similar vapes use per session than its on par. This makes the efficiency definition subjective now if you was compare that to the volcano you have to take into account the volcano's temp can be adjusted to reflect the desired degree vaporization per the users preference and quality/condition of the weed. For those reason in my opinion I would not compare a PD/Myrtlezap/Arozap type vape to a volcano in terms of efficiency. Simply too subjective.

When I assist people with selecting a vaporizer I stress that a person select a vaporizer that best suits their needs and then their wants. My reason for being active in the vaporizer community is to promote vaporizing. I came to vaping due to health issues and it has opened my eyes greatly and has made a very positive impact on my health by simply not smoking. So I am concerned about a person selecting a vaporizer based on hype and wants and to have that person go back to smoking viewing the vaporizer concept as a neat gimmick but not for them when in reality they just did not select a vaporizer that better fits into their smoking style.

For example, I am confident I would not have stuck with a bag vaporizer though that concept initially appealed to me but a whip vaporizer more closely matched my usage style.

To help someone I suggest they learn about the general types of vaporizers and think on their usage and select a vaporizer on those findings. It does much to successfully integrate vaping into a smokers lifestyle.

I always recommend new people to view the following videos:
General Vaporizer information
http://www.marijuanatv.com/watch_video.php?v=9de84f56fc1d506

Vaporizers 101
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a9luN...layer_embedded

New Buyer Tips
http://www.marijuanatv.com/watch_video.php?v=eab390c0ef1f36c

 

[Durden]

I agree to a large extent. But personal likes/dislikes for particular vapes also have to be considered, despite the quantity and quality available. If I were in the "major grower" catagory (I wish ), or just had access to an unlimited supply of all the best strains, I would definitely break out my 'big hitter' a lot more often, but I'd still be using a PD a large part of the time. For me it's wanting to limit my hit size (at least sometimes) due to using very high quality herb (my goal isn't always to get totally wasted), and my lungs aren't as happy when I use a big hitter all the time.

I'm with max on this one. For all intents and purposes I have an unlimited supply of material and concentrates available to me, but a lot of times I'll cruise around my house with the Iolite (I'm now on the waitlist for a PD to fill this purpose) for the convenience. There are also many times when after I've done an elbow or wand (Extreme/SSV) I want to refresh myself an hour or so later, but don't need/want another full load. As I've said before on another thread one reason I use is to help me sleep, so on nights when I'm waking up a lot a smaller and faster hit is preferable to minimize the time I'm up. Currently I'm using the Iolite to fill this duty and while it works alright, I feel kind of wasteful taking a few hits then turning it off and leaving it sit since the material never tastes/feels the same and I generally end up tossing it in with my ABV.

Beezleb while I wouldn't think of categorizing those 2 classes of vapes together personally, I think that it's possible to compare the efficiency of ANY two vapes regardless of type, just have to focus on the long term instead of the short term. While comparing the efficiency of one session with the PD and volcano would be extremely subjective, comparing their relative efficiency over a week or month period of regular use is informative, though potentially deceiving.
Over a long time frame the frequency of use is mostly based on the individual, so for a comparison to be meaningful to an individual they have to find a comparison of the units by someone with similar use patterns. (Which could possibly be regional?)
I agree 100% that it is necessary to pick the vaporizer that best suits the individual, I'm currently in the process of converting my friends etc. to vaping, and I find that convincing them is simply a matter of putting the right vape in their hands.

As far as my preference, I guess I side with where I live (CA) and say I like the big hitters more as do most of the people I show. Not to mention that everyone loves the portable units for stealth of course From the medical end of it however, I couldn't stick to vaping without using the whole spectrum of devices.

And since were talking about preference, any females here on the board that stand up for the big hitters? Most that I know prefer the Iolite over my whip to bong setup (which kinda hurts my feelings I'm not gonna lie )

 

[Hippie Dickie]

i would think (correct me if i'm wrong) that efficiency of the various vapes is very easily determined. Just use the vapor poop (ABV?) from one vape in different vape (for you guys with more than one), and see how much vapor is still left.

i only have a 60x-100x pocket microscope to examine the vapor poop, and i don't see any left over trichomes, so i feel my Bud Toaster is pretty damn efficient.

or you could Everclear Wash the vapor poop from each vape and see how much hash is extracted, eh?

Q.E.D.

p.s. i'm only referring to the THC, other cannabinoids may be extracted via the wash, and they don't count for this efficiency test.

 

[Durden]

We would need to define the term efficiency if we were going to make attempts to quantify the difference between units in absolute terms. Efficiency for some people is getting complete extraction, while for others it means the effect from that extraction; efficiency could also be defined as the amount vaped per unit time for people with higher tolerances.

I don't even think that after that's done you could figure out an answer beyond one of us spending a few days exclusively with a single type of vape over and over with the same supply and the same environment, since the air temperature/environment is reported to effect the working of some units (I'm in CA but I ran into this problem in a particularly cold apartment by the beach) and the starting material could also greatly affect the outcome.

In the end, for me, anything that keeps me from smoking is efficient enough

Back to the thread topic, can you guys tell us what region you're from and if you have a preference for a certain type of vaporizer? I'm actually pretty curious about this

 

[owin]

Well I'm from Florida. I use my PD right now pretty much exclusively. The main reason I do this is because I'm poor as shit and I have to split all my weed with my gf. With the DBV we were vaping over a quarter a week between the two of us. Now with the PD we are vaping just about an 8th a week between the two of us. They both get us to where we want to be.

The last vape I will purchase for a long time will probably be the VHW. The reason I don't have one now is it seems to chew through the weed pretty fast and I can't afford that right now. Also, i don't have any decent glass pieces(yet) worth teaming up with the VHW.

 

[hedgewitch]

Well Tyler, I'll provide you some data to work with. I live in the midwest, we have a wide variety of weather, bitter cold in winter and humid, muggy, sticky hot in the summer. I've only had my Iolite and Extreme for about a month, Vapir one about a month before that. So I can't say much about that yet. But, I am female, old, and after smoking cigs for 35 years and pot for 30 my lungs can't take big strong hits like they used to. I quit cigs a year and a half ago and haven't smoked pot in about a month. I think my lungs are getting better, but I still prefer to vape at lower temps. With the Iolite when it really gets going is about when I shut it down! But I don't feel like I'm wasting anything as I cook with the ABV. I usually like to do bags but that is what I like about the Extreme and the Vapir one is that I have a choice, so once in a while I use the whip. I like portability, thats where the Iolite shines! I take it with me outdoors puttering around the yard and garden and on bike rides.

 

[tuttle]

California and a SSV, although my reasons for choosing the SSV may not be entirely location specific. I have small children, so I needed something that can be put away for most of the time but heat up quickly when I need it. I also use to alleviate migraines, so for me that means vaping at a pretty high temp, which is something that the SSV offered. With that said, having good supply did make overall small load efficiency not a top priority (not that in my opinion the SSV can't be efficient with small loads, it just isn't its strong suit)

 

[duh]

i would think (correct me if i'm wrong) that efficiency of the various vapes is very easily determined. Just use the vapor poop (ABV?) from one vape in different vape (for you guys with more than one), and see how much vapor is still left.

HD, you can no more measure the efficiency of a vaporizer through it's poop than you can for an elephant or a person. I mean, no matter how 'great' the action is in the chamber where the material is giving off vapor, it's all a matter of how much of the 'good stuff' gets into the airway and into the user - not what comes out the other end.

Tons of great comments in this thread! I especially appreciate hedgewitch chiming in. Like max says, efficiency is also really about how much you need, some people can take that 1 tiny hit and walk away. Sadly, I'm not one of them.

Whenever do I try to take monster hits and monster retention w/loads o'stash I get a massive headache. I guess this breaks the rules of the universe, some kind of vapor-paradox.

Beezleb, I know no one likes to compare direct draw vs. bag vapes around here, however, I do feel bags are a kind of luxury item. tuttle's SSV makes me really think about that and the VHW, 2 vapes I haven't tried yet - the Volcano is also damn loud.

Regardless of vape type, taking monster hits and monster air retention (in a dry city, state) = having loads o' stash and taking casual but frequent hits w/low air retention (in a vapor lounge).

,
duh

 

[Hippie Dickie]

i was working from the definition that "efficiency" means how much THC is released from the trichomes versus how much THC is left in the vapor poop. That is, if you can extract THC from the poop, then the vape is NOT very efficient.

This has nothing to do with the "effectiveness" of the vapor, which is totally independent of the action of the vaporizer. Effectiveness is dependent on the genetics of the strain of cannabis being vaped.

 

[owin]

i was working from the definition that "efficiency" means how much THC is released from the trichomes versus how much THC is left in the vapor poop. That is, if you can extract THC from the poop, then the vape is NOT very efficient.

This has nothing to do with the "effectiveness" of the vapor, which is totally independent of the action of the vaporizer. Effectiveness is dependent on the genetics of the strain of cannabis being vaped.

My definition of efficiency would be how much weed I use to get me to where I want to be. Wouldn't using half the amount of weed compared to another vape be more efficient? I don't see how having THC left over in your ABV is less efficient? That sounds like more efficient to me. Especially if you use your ABV to cook or make hash/tincture/whatever.

Also does everyone hold in their hits until nothing can be seen when you exhale? That affects efficiency. So wouldn't these vapes that give you huge hits with tons of vapor be wasteful?

 

[max]

So wouldn't these vapes that give you huge hits with tons of vapor be wasteful?

I call it getting more vapor than you can process. You can certainly load a 'one hit' amount in a big hitter and be efficient, although lots of glass/tubing/bag material for condensation area is an efficiency factor. But unless all you have is the big hitter, and you're trying to stretch/maximize your herb, who really does one hitters from an SSV/VHW/whatever? So IMO the big hitters encourage inefficiency. It's not required, just invited. This is why I like the PD with high quality herb. I can get big enough hits to be satisfying (for me anyway), yet small enough so that I don't have to immediately exhale, or get a red face or watery eyes from trying to hold 'em in.

 

[owin]

So wouldn't these vapes that give you huge hits with tons of vapor be wasteful?

I call it getting more vapor than you can process. You can certainly load a 'one hit' amount in a big hitter and be efficient, although lots of glass/tubing/bag material for condensation area is an efficiency factor. But unless all you have is the big hitter, and you're trying to stretch/maximize your herb, who really does one hitters from an SSV/VHW/whatever? So IMO the big hitters encourage inefficiency. It's not required, just invited. This is why I like the PD with high quality herb. I can get big enough hits to be satisfying (for me anyway), yet small enough so that I don't have to immediately exhale, or get a red face or watery eyes from trying to hold 'em in.

Exactly. That's the point I was trying to make.

 

[Hippie Dickie]

Okay. i was looking for a purely objective measure of efficiency. Maybe there's a better term for that.

 

[duh]

I take the blame when it comes to poor definition. Really, I am trying to look at efficiency in terms of effect which is why I am highly resistant to Beezleb trying to split vapes up into categories again. With the lights off and you are inhaling from whatever device, what are the effects you get?

What I was indicating before is that breathing technique more than GonG and all that is king. If you have no supply issues, breathing becomes more casual and thus whatever technique or vape you are using becomes less efficient. The debate on vapes is really around the edges.

To extend max's point w/an analogy, if 3 PD/LB/VG/M-A'Zap hits = 1 Big Hitter (SSV, Volcano, Extreme, VHW, etc) hit, but the Big Hitter hit uses 20% more material but does so in 1 hit, is that a trade off worth having? That 20% is wasted because you can't absorb it anyway but end up filling the chamber w/it. I realize w/most of the big hitters, they are capable of smaller hits but the efficiency is so much lower (not direct draw), it is rarely done.

BTW: Strain also is no indicator as plants give off different yields plant to plant.