Unregulated simple all glass vape

[highvaper]

Inspired by work on the regulated version on this thread

BaKx (heating principle) inspired desktop vape

Hi. Now that I'm the happy owner of a BaKx, the functionality, simplicity, elegance and functional principle of it just won't let me go. As I announced in the BaKx thread, I am still trying to make a personal copy of the BaKx - unfortunately I have little time for it and material-finding...

fuckcombustion.com

I was messing about with some test tubes and 4mm nichrome and came up with a very simple unregulated design which works very very well - took me under a few hours to make and most of it was clearing up and glass cutting.

https://imgur.com/a/1p6Db96

Apart:

https://imgur.com/a/wmMCzHA

Close up of heater without inner liner tube

https://imgur.com/a/RHoKo3N

Not forgetting the switch

https://imgur.com/a/FuLvLwV

I am so happy with it - need to make a nice wood body to hold it all together.

Needs about 30-40 sec warm up and bang away you go - i tried with just one battery but just didnt get there with the length of nichrome - maybe with a bit less heater element it may work

 

[highvaper]

Been testing a fair bit - has a nice heat profile - the heaters outer layer of glass keeps the heat in much better than my regulated versions current design - i will be upgrading the regulated one with this new heater as i managed to squeeze a thermocouple in between the tubes with the nichrome so for desktop use will be nice not to chew through batteries.

Un-regulated it is actually very easy to adjust and use - just let it heat up for a bit and take a few test draws - once you start feeling it time to stop the power and let it coast for a while as the heat still builds at that point and you can get through a good few tokes.

It only needs a few secs of heat topping up once at a decent temp while vaping - a pair of batteries is giving me about 3-5 straws from cold starts and if you hit it with in a few minutes you can get through about 6-8 depending on how much im packing the staws. Going to relook at the 1 battery version with maybe just 3 turns of the coil to keep the resitance as low as possible.

As i do with the regulated one i find when a straw just about finished i blow the weed into the tube and give it a shake so its in direct contact with the inner heated glass so it gets a final vape and then suck it back up again before blowing out into the avb jar.

I have also played without the inner glass liner so more like a conventional vape with heater element like a TM2 so it can take a larger stem - its a bit more of a beast like this though

https://imgur.com/a/c7wRXB7

You just need to be careful not to push the heater coils together and short them out - also breathing over the nichrome isnt what i want to do but looking at the Nomad/Toad heater build info its nichrome but has been butane tourched so it has an oxidised layer (which would also stop the shorting out if using a larger straw when pushing it in and shorting the heater).

 

[Flotsam]

Thanks for the update

 

[Hippie Dickie]

Needs about 30-40 sec warm up and bang away you go - i tried with just one battery but just didnt get there with the length of nichrome - maybe with a bit less heater element it may work

i use slightly narrower nichrome ribbon - at 1/8" (3mm) - and it is about 0.3 ohm for 13" length. make sure the battery can deliver the amp demand. looks like you will pull >10 amps with shorter heater ribbon. could work with a single battery like LiFePO4 - mine can deliver 70 amps.

also, i like the switch - high current flow eats the switch, or a potentiometer.

 

[highvaper]

@Hippie Dickie - my regulated one is using the 3mm nichrome and has been working well - thank you for putting me on to the nichrome. I have to adjust the pwm so it only run at 60% of what it would draw fully as my mains adaptor can only handle 10 amps.

The 4mm resistance is so low it will destroy the power supply if i tried to use it without regulation - the resistance of the new heater is 0.6 ohms so will pull over 200W if i use the 12v power supply.

I think its resistance is low enough to use a normal mod with it - from previous experiments i think my geek vape mod topped out at about 0.8 omhs.

 

[Hippie Dickie]

@highvaper - is that nichrome60 or nichrome80 in the pictures?

 

[highvaper]

Its ‎Uxcell - nichrome 80

I rekon for a really cheap version you could use some old toaster element.

I havent got any hash or oil at the moment to try it with but suspect you could just pop some in the inner tube and let it come in direct contact with glass and once producing vapour just use the straw to suck it out rather than putting in the straw and sandwiching between some weed.

I tried this with the regulated version but made a mess of the tube but now can just easily replace it when un cleanable or swap out in between dabs so you can have a clean one for each - then just put a bit of qwiso in to clean - you can get 20 for about $20 so can rotate the inner tube as often as you want - im planning on making a mini portable version so will be cutting them in half so they are just above the outer tube and the whole thing should be about the height of the batteries.

I did have a look at the LiFePO4 battries but they are quite hard to get and all my other deivces use the standard molicell p28a so just have quite a few of them.

 

[Flotsam]

a quick calculation for that power supply 200w doesn't sound reasonable . that would imply 200w /12 v yields 16.66 A . that's a hell of a lot of current. Now i know that is initial current (peak) and quiescent is less but still. Are you putting a fuse on this? I didn't see one on your proof of concept you have shown above.
https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/71UhdoTCzLL._AC_SX679_PIbundle-10,TopRight,0,0_SH20_.jpg

I just bought a variable supply for a project i am doing and that one is only rated for 3 A max. of course there is much bigger available but I think you should have some circuit protection in there as you work things out.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B08K3MVX21/?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_plhdr=t&aaxitk=9c3ea9cf12ecf8d0c949596756d02761&hsa_cr_id=5457021790001&qid=1737310182&sr=1-3-9e67e56a-6f64-441f-a281-df67fc737124&ref_=sbx_be_s_sparkle_lsi4d_asin_2_title&pd_rd_w=xksYe&content-id=amzn1.sym.8591358d-1345-4efd-9d50-5bd4e69cd942%3Aamzn1.sym.8591358d-1345-4efd-9d50-5bd4e69cd942&pf_rd_p=8591358d-1345-4efd-9d50-5bd4e69cd942&pf_rd_r=RXPNYBJWT425HVNVANR3&pd_rd_wg=uaG5T&pd_rd_r=3dd0cc75-eca2-4dfb-bcc2-94d487fbcd2b&th=1

What are the specs on this power supply? or at least the model
Maybe i misinterpreted something you said but just so you know my intent. Liking what you are doing just want you to be safe. I have seen in lab setting what happens when a Lithium battery explodes. I have mostly messed with lithium batteries doing power tool hacks and the big concern with Lithium batteries is if you run the batteries too low. An additional battery management system (BMS) would need to be incorporated if the battery has no internal BMS.

Not that i do e-cigs or anything but this issue of Sub-ohm is commonly discussed on their e-cig hacking forums or here is a link from a coil material manufacturer. https://www.innokin.com/blog/sub-ohm-vaping-explained

 

[highvaper]

@Flotsam thanks for the concern - i am keeping an eye on the min voltage after a session to make sure they dont drop too low - i have messed with these batteries a fair bit so have prior experience - also i am keeping a close eye on their temp as well.

Pi Pico battery tester

I have been working on a little pi pico based pid project https://fuckcombustion.com/threads/bakx-heating-principle-inspired-desktop-vape.54964/ and wanted to power it by some Molicel P28A lipo batteries I have. The problem is I have bought the batteries over the years and dont know which have...

fuckcombustion.com

With the 2 battery setup so about 7v im getting about 12 amps so about 80w which is well in their working range.

For my mains power supply i am using a power supply which can output 12v at 10 amps so for the regulated vape which is a similar design but uses 0.3mm nichrome and a bit more than 1 ohm resistance so would pull over the 140w if i let it - hence putting a limiter on the pwm to max of 60%.

Check out the other thread at the first post as it has more info on power stuff and the regulated version - i have one of those power meters you plug into the wall and plug your device which was useful for checking the actual power being drawn was what i was expecting from calculations.

 

[Flotsam]

@Flotsam thanks for the concern - i am keeping an eye on the min voltage after a session to make sure they dont drop too low - i have messed with these batteries a fair bit so have prior experience - also i am keeping a close eye on their temp as well.

Good idea. That's what i ended up doing with a small Milwaukee circular saw i had. It was originally NiCd but of course no one wants to use those now. I had been able to wire in Ridgid batteries w an adapter but i added in these cheap (~ $ 1.50 ) voltmeters off ebay to monitor the voltage level. I would still add a fuse to that set up, but happy you are having success. Yes those numbers you just posted should be ok.

 

[highvaper]

Literally ordered some of those mini volt meters earlier today

 

[highvaper]

Well i am really struggling to make the same piece again and it seems the first one was a bit of a fluke.

No matter what tool or cut i do i seem to get a hairline fracture which eventually spreads - i got through about 6 tubes trying.

I did manage to make this little version

https://imgur.com/a/jddVcSE

Actually got a brief vape from it just using my mod

https://imgur.com/a/Ppt5i8f

But it now has a crack.

https://imgur.com/a/LnyzrIC

I was about to give up when i thought why does the tube need a bottom? Ok for when you want to use a large straw but still...

So made these from the top parts of the tubes I had left over

https://imgur.com/a/FzVFvV4

https://imgur.com/a/MZz7v1L

So much simpler to make and no part which gets stressed and be the start of a crack.

I spotted these:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/thermocouple-Protection-Insulating-Temperature-Resistance/dp/B0DNRXCFJT/

Which may be a good for the outer tube instead of glass but they are quite pricey and hard to tell if it will be too narrow.

I have seen some quartz test tubes but again they are super pricey and are sealed at one end and dont think i have the tools to drill a hole in quartz and dont seem to be able to find just plain a quartz tube of 2mm wall or so.

I do have an old cmh bulb with a quartz inner liner but its still in use - i do have some hps bulbs too but they are too big.

I may use a larger thicker tube and fill any space between the outer and inner tube with glass balls but that would be more for desktop leave switched on all the time type of device.

 

[Flotsam]

I really like this latest addition you just posted. I especially liked that the connections were all mechanical (screw terminals) rather than any type of solder. We sometimes tend to be paranoid about materials used (rightly or wrongly) but try looking up what materials are in typical electrical solder and especially what the melting point of solder is and then you can see why i say that.

 

[highvaper]

Yes i have avoided solder from day 1 of the builds - i suppose pure silver may be an option if i needed to join stuff near high temp areas and couldnt get away with crimps or screw terms.

 

[Hippie Dickie]

dont think i have the tools to drill a hole in quartz and dont seem to be able to find just plain a quartz tube of 2mm wall or so.

i use a dremel tool with a 0.7mm diamond bit to drill borosilicate - just submerged under water. there is a physical property/effect that allows drilling or cutting glass underwater without fracturing. videos on YT show drilling through the bottom of a ceramic mug under a water film.

 

[highvaper]

I have been able to drill the boro but isnt quartz that much tougher?


Just gave the new longer open tube heater a go with some new batteries - i think i need to be a bit careful after about 10 secs i could see the coil start to glow.

 

[Flotsam]

hey just wondering what your final vision was going to be for how you were going to use it. Up above I saw Big Straw but with both ends open how will that work.

I suppose you could have a large glass bowl and run everything under there with maybe a whip for the end user. What did you have in mind?

 

[highvaper]

what your final vision was going to be for how you were going to use it

Take a read of the other thread about a regulated version there is no end goal

As mentioned the large tube version wont work with the open ended version but that wasnt actually part of the original idea as i wanted a pure glass air path and the larger straw needs to draw air over the nichrome which im not overly happy about. I suppose it is possible to use the open ended version with a large staw in a more convection based way - perhaps some kind of ceramic bung to seal it may work.

I do have larger tubes so could just make a bigger version for the bigger straws - one thing i have noticed is the smaller straw in the larger tube with more space between it and the outer tube is not as nice as the same straw in the smaller heater. This was also the case when i made a much larger version with a 20mm tube and larger stem. So the less gap there is between the inner glass heater and straw the better it is.


I tried to make a hole in a test tube just now using a butane torch which i have been using for polishing the cuts - @Cheebsy ta for that tip

The glass gets pretty hot so thought maybe with a stanley knife blade i could bore a hole through - nope managed to make a dimple in it but not a hole.

Dropped the stanley knife blade and had to pick it up so it didnt burn the surface it landed on so burnt my finger instead. First proper burn for a while since messing with the induction ideas tight on center of right index finger so really bad spot.

 

[Hippie Dickie]

burnt my finger instead

i feel for you. i save most of my injuries for the wood shop - tried to remove three finger tips when a dull 1/4" drill bit seized a piece of metal shim and pulled out of my hand and then sliced it. severed a non-essential tendon and some nerves - been several years now and the nerves still tingle. i always keep lots of H2O2 at the ready.

 

[highvaper]

Thanks it was a bit sore earlier when typing but is ok now - tbh i have got used to the minor burns - in the vape building game it helps to have asbestos fingers

https://imgur.com/a/6mSzlUa

Have got an update to the build but not the unregulated one at the moment - im heading back to the other regulated thread for it

Some stuff on order so once arrives will be updating the unregulated one.

 

[Hippie Dickie]

DMSO is supposed to deal very effectively with burns or other skin conditions. A Midwestern Doctor on substack has been covering it a lot recently. Amandah Vollmer also. Mercola reposts AMD. i got some DMSO and still reading the instructions/recommendations for use - but i would put it on a burn.

 

[highvaper]

Bits arrived.

https://imgur.com/a/SeDzofc

The batteries are mounted the wrong way and you cant really hold it in one hand with the momentary toggle switch - i want to make it hand held so you have to touch the batteries when in switching on so you can feel how hot they are getting - most people will realise 50C is hot and let things cool off at that point i hope - im expecting whoever uses it to have some common sense.

I suppose i could use a mosfet as with the induction heater - the 400w one should do it with just a normal little switch but this is just more retro and fun - i have blown a few of those mosfets doing other stuff.

https://imgur.com/a/wc4ZSXW

The little volt meters are so cute and just work perfectly - i will attach it to a 2 way switch so one way you get one batteries reading and the other way for the other battery and off in the center. So its nice and simple to check that each battery voltage so you dont overload one if they are too different.

Example what it does

https://imgur.com/a/56RPfBO

 

[highvaper]

Looked at the 510 threaded version again

https://imgur.com/a/exgjATt

It just about works with my mod but it gets too hot as in battery i think when trying to push the 70w it needs to get up to heat.

With one of the fancy dna two battery ones it should be fine and possibly be able to use tcr and regulate it - but suppose the pid regulation is probably better than tcr.

I am still leaning towards the nice and simple just batteries version rather than a mod on wattage mode to power a non regulated device.

edit: I had a thought - if you had a strip of metal with a hole in it to hold the tube and at the other end another hole which the 510 thread fits through - you can use the mod as a handle to hold the tube arrangement aligned vertically next to it. I may make it if i have the right bit of metal but have already got sketches/idea in mind for the next manual version i want to make.