Tips on dealing with Pain long-term?

[Quetzalcoatl]

Careful with the Nucyncta, it's got some SNRI (selective norepinephrine reuptake inhibitor) effecs like tramadol does, and also carries a similar seizure risk IIRC, as well as the possibility of serotonin syndrome when mixed with drugs such as DXM, etc. Though if by RC's you mean research stuff... then you probably already know that?

 

[SunnyHours]

I finally saw a great doctor today! Finally! She said it was probably anxiety, which I know I do have, and my ADD. Gave me a prescription to help with sleep and told me to stop taking Cannabis and Tobacco (I Snus and snuff, I don't smoke). And she wants to start me on an anti-depressant, which I had very bad experiences with...
I'm just not sure stopping Cannabis would help as I know it's not the source of my Anxiety. Of course, it's been I while since I should of taken a break so I guess I could try stopping for a month or 2.

Quetzalcoatl, I do use ever ounce of precaution available to me, mg scale, interaction verrification, research and allergy tests, so no worries here

 

[Quetzalcoatl]

Nicotine is a stimulant which might cause a tiny bit of anxiety, maybe compounding preexisting conditions? Did your doctor mention what antidepressant they want you to try?

 

[SunnyHours]

The few I've tried made everything worse. Also the ADD meds I was taking, Dexedrine increased the anxiety and sleeping issues.
No she didn't mention one in particular. But she said the pain was in reaction to my anxiety, so it's psychosomatic, which I'm having lots of trouble believing since even when I am relaxed and completely imbibed in a funny movie, far away from anxiety and problems, I still experience the widespread and moving pains.

I guess I have to stay positive, at least if I get rid in part of the anxiety and depression, it'll be easier to deal with pain...IDK it's weird, and now that I found a doctor willing to help me, I think I should to her and at the very least try it out.

Also she gave me a sick leave of a month so now I'm stressing about money. But I didn't lose my job!
Those antidepressants are some expensive meds!

 

[Quetzalcoatl]

Tell me about it... Was paying like $130-140USD for a months supply of mine before my insurance deductibles brought it down to $40/mo. It seems to be helping me with my pain, kinda dulls it A bit guess?

 

[grokit]

Buddy, check me out I'm a member (SunnyHours) hehe

On another note went on my 5th appointment today...I guess those doctors don't give a flying fuck if I'm in pain...I asked them for more NSAID's and those Lidocaine patches, the doctor just kept going "go to PT" over and over and I'm like, "I'm doing some exercises and it really hurts so I can't really do them", "I'd need something to help with the pain"...nothing to do...I felt like literally crying when I left the docs office.

I actually got a membership at another clinic (I have to pay, it's a coop).
Hopefully I get an appointment soon and the doctors are helpful...
Shit! Even asking for non-narcotics they just kick me out...what is this world coming to?

I feel ya but at least you guys have codeine over the counter right? My local Dr. died recently, he used to stock robitussin dac for my copd (cold turns to pneumonia if I can't get at least the ac yecch). Now it's $60 instead of $20 or less at costco because the usa just put even more restrictions on it.

And even though costco only stocks generic those fucking lidoderm patches are still over $10 each but I would dearly like to try one. Even better would be a trigger-point acupuncturist, working on it.

All I can say is they better not mess with my tylenol #3's

 

[Campers Crumpet]

I am not sure about your state, but here you have to see a pain specialist if you need long term narcotics. While some do, most drs will not prescribe narcs long term.

I have cluster headaches, ankylosing spondylitis, a trashed L4 and chronic pancreatitis - so I know pain. Can't you get 222's over the counter in Canada?

I can't stand icy hot/ben gay/etc type stuff. It just tries to burn you enough to mask the other pain. I make an mj salve w/ comfrey, calendula and other herbs which works great - if the problem is muscular. Enough beeswax takes away the greasiness of the coconut oil.

I probably get the most relief from my tens unit (transcutaneous electrical nerve stimulation). While you are supposed to have a rx, I ordered one off of the net no prob. It was around $70 and was comparable to what a small PT office would have. Some days, I'll wake up hunched over and barely able to walk. After an hour on the tens unit, I am fine and heading to work at a very physically demanding job. While tens units have many uses/methods, I use it to interrupt the pain signals being sent to my brain - kinda like jamming electronics. If you go this route, make sure and get a 2 channel unit (2 cords, 4pads) as they are way more efficient. I got mine here:

http://www.otcwholesale.com/

If you have the means, they have many cool items which help w/ long term pain. I have also had good effects w/ electosound as well - just like what pregnant women use, but w/ the juice cranked up.

Can I ask you where you place your tens patches ? I've got AS in my thoracic spine and can't find a good spot to attach the patches. Thanks in advance for your advice and merry Xmas

 

[tiukauleh]

Sunny Hours & others in pain,

i don't claim to understand the pain you are going thru and i do not have a medical background but have you guys heard of paida/lajin, an eastern self healing technique that doesn't require meds?

http://hubpages.com/hub/Self-healing-techniques check out the last 3 vids about intro to Paida/lajin, and master xiao.

my aunt goes for these buddhist gatherings and there's where she heard about this paida/lajin technique which she uses for her aching knees. i started believing that this stuff may have some basis when my dad used paida for some unexplainable (midnight) itchy calf syndrome that he had (that he could not seem to be cured by diet change, medical potions or what not).

i cannot compare their condition to anyone here but the theory of the paida/lajin technique is very interesting, as well as the background of master xiao
http://www.paidalajin.com/en/home/m_getpage.asp?page=about

and a pdf copy http://upload.paidalajin.com/pdf/Paida & Lajin Self-Healing, Best Gift For Yourself and Your Loved Ones (English version).pdf

I do not want to speak too much as there are many sceptics when it comes to non-conventional treatment but this could be a (relatively inexpensive) option for those of you who wish explore on prescription-free treatment for pain related conditions.

good luck.

 

[Campers Crumpet]

Sunny Hours & others in pain,

i don't claim to understand the pain you are going thru and i do not have a medical background but have you guys heard of paida/lajin, an eastern self healing technique that doesn't require meds?

http://hubpages.com/hub/Self-healing-techniques check out the last 3 vids about intro to Paida/lajin, and master xiao.

my aunt goes for these buddhist gatherings and there's where she heard about this paida/lajin technique which she uses for her aching knees. i started believing that this stuff may have some basis when my dad used paida for some unexplainable (midnight) itchy calf syndrome that he had (that he could not seem to be cured by diet change, medical potions or what not).

i cannot compare their condition to anyone here but the theory of the paida/lajin technique is very interesting, as well as the background of master xiao
http://www.paidalajin.com/en/home/m_getpage.asp?page=about

and a pdf copy http://upload.paidalajin.com/pdf/Paida & Lajin Self-Healing, Best Gift For Yourself and Your Loved Ones (English version).pdf

I do not want to speak too much as there are many sceptics when it comes to non-conventional treatment but this could be a (relatively inexpensive) option for those of you who wish explore on prescription-free treatment for pain related conditions.

good luck.

Thanks for sharing this, I am looking forward to others opinion on this.
I will be upfront in saying that I practice Qi Gong and mindfulness for pain management. Both I find very effective.
Paida seems similar to Qi Gong in a few ways and I would encourage anyone to explore the world of Qi Gong, for me it's such a huge huge understanding, lifestyle and something I've not practiced enough is lifestyle.
I think any person with chronic health diseases are inclined to shy away from anything that promotes healing from its practice because we do get to know and accept that we have to co habitate together and the biggest issue I find is acceptance of both the disease, symptoms and the balance it makes you find.
I'm not sure how anything could make my daughters pancreas work again or unfuse my thoracic spine where I have Ankylosing Spondylitis, but, I will commit to learning this practice and hopefully gaining some benefit.
I will share my outcome in a few weeks. Thanks for sharing and merry Xmas you and your family

 

[Snake Plissken]

Can I ask you where you place your tens patches ? I've got AS in my thoracic spine and can't find a good spot to attach the patches. Thanks in advance for your advice and merry Xmas

I attempt to place electrodes on the outside of the pain area. A longer arc is more effective than a shorter one. For my lower back pain, I'll place a pad on either side of my spine under my waistline and one on either side of my spine (a little more off center) about midback. I have the current run top to bottom instead of side to side. I also place the black leads closer to the affected area as they seem to conduct more current? Sometimes I'll turn it on to see how it feels, turn it off, and reposition as needed. NEVER move pads while machine is on - I learned this the fun way. Here are a couple of good links that discuss electrode placement for different ailments:

http://www.medi-stim.com/overview/epc.html
http://www.ib3health.com/products/TensandEMS/Literature/ApplicationChart.shtml

Good luck.

 

[arf777]

Well I'm pretty much not allowed to get any "Narcotics" because the doc says "I don't think it would help you" or another one she gave me "you are too young for pain meds".
Hell I'm 24 and I even brought my mother with me, just so she wouldn't think I was just drug seeking...sounds weird to say but I hope there's something wrong on my X-Rays.
This healthcare system is so stupid, when I broke some bones that would stop hurting in a week or 2 after being immobilized I got as much Painkillers I wanted (all narcotics) but this, I don't know how long it's going to keep hurting like this and I can't get anything? WTF?

I'm getting quite confused and frustrated with all this...

Dude, I feel for you. I started my unending parade of spinal surgeries and painkillers when I was your age (I'm 44 now) and spent the past three years getting off all the narcotic pain meds. And I am not in more pain than before I got off them. The narcotics do work, but if the pain is long-term they stop, and just make you sick and clouded.

I have spent years at a time unable to work due to the pain, but have been working full-time for a decade with bursts of short-term disability. Being at home with nothing but the pain to focus on is, for me, the absolute worst thing.

I strongly recommend trying acupuncture, but only if you can find an MD who does it - if your nerves or vertebra are already damaged, you don't want someone without solid medical training sticking needles in you. But if you find a good one, the difference can be big.

I also cannot stress enough how much you can get used to even the most intense pain over time(though it can take a year or more). That is how I have had to deal with most of my pain. Tried electrostim implants (which now cause pain), every known medication, herbs and tinctures, and a billion other things.

If your body tolerates them (mine doesn't) anti-seizure drugs like neurontin (gabapentin) can be a help, without narcotic effects. Be careful though - most people can take those meds, but neurontin almost killed me.

Lastly, you should check with an orthopedic or neural surgeon, though don't let anyone do any surgery without multiple second opinions. I have had surgeries that made things worse, but have had other surgeries that made a big difference for a few years.

 

[Campers Crumpet]

Re AIDA from @tiukauleh post on 24.12.2013
I have looked at the info linked above, through my reading of the information I can see tiny similarities to Qi Gong. I as others do I'm sure, appreciate the info but I won't go near anything that promotes self healing and cures of ailments. My opinion is that it's simply not possible.
I'm going to say this politely, and it's not directed to you, rather to those who try and cash grab for snake oil, it's offensive Polly waffle for any promotion of cures. It is offensive because many diseases can't ever be cured and snake oil salesmen that brainwash people out of their cash, or convince others to spruik their wears with no evidence just shows how gullible some people are and how desperate people will grab onto anything.
Qi Gong is based on meditation and specific movements to aid mobility. But no one promises a cure.
But it was kind of you to suggest it, we all should be open to researching alternatives to the pharmaceutical companies.
If there is any historical information on the practice I would like to read it.
But I can't bang on enough about MMJ for pain control, it's proven, the evidence is available and there's loads of historical info to back it up.
I think I will pass on patting myself on the head while chanting and just puff on a big fat spliff.

 

[grokit]

Mmj doesn't control pain, it just makes you okay with it.

 

[arf777]

Mmj doesn't control pain, it just makes you okay with it.

Don't know about you, but it definitely controls some of mine. Half the pain in my right leg literally vanishes most of the time I vape. Doesn't control a lot of the other pain, but it does something to my damaged nerves on the right side.

 

[Campers Crumpet]

Mmj doesn't control pain, it just makes you okay with it.

Disagree, it dulls nerve pain better than neuronton or gabapentin. It helps with arthritis aches better than opiates.
Im always ok with pain, I have good mental control over dealing with it.

 

[SuperVixen]

Disagree, it dulls nerve pain better than neuronton or gabapentin. It helps with arthritis aches better than opiates.
Im always ok with pain, I have good mental control over dealing with it.

I have been using tons of opiates for chronic internal pain and I constantly tell my Dr that I would give up every pill and just keep cannabis. That is even more true now with ABV oil. It absolutely helps with pain. I spend a lot of time each day sobbing in pain, when it is at its worse, I can take a dab or two of ABV oil and the pain instantly begins to calm. The opiates couldnt control the pain and I was on mega doses for what they will dole out in Australia. I had to have a license from the govt. for what I was taking.

I have learnt to be much better with pain from this journey but I dont like it and will do almost anything to make it stop.

 

[tiukauleh]

Re AIDA from @tiukauleh post on 24.12.2013...... but I won't go near anything that promotes self healing and cures of ailments. My opinion is that it's simply not possible.......many diseases can't ever be cured and snake oil salesmen that brainwash people out of their cash, or convince others to spruik their wears with no evidence just shows how gullible some people are and how desperate people will grab onto anything.....

hi man. while i agree that deep research should be done first on what great claims that these "healers" make, i have seen first hand evidence on how it worked for my aunt and me dad (though their medical conditions were not deadly, just physical pain/uncomfortableness). i commented as there may be some here who may wish to try something beyond pharma pills/operation. and the links, including background of the master xiao [He was exposed to medical classics in his childhood, as his uncle was a TraditionalChineseMedicine doctor, and his mother was a doctor of Western medicine] was so people can have look see themselves.

Since you have said earlier "I would encourage anyone to explore the world of Qi Gong" i find it surprising when you mention that "you won't go near anything that promotes self healing and cures of ailments" as Paida/lajin also involves dealing with meridian points & stuff.

As for snakeoil salesmen who peddle their wares to the desperate who would cling to any hope of recovery, bear in mind, unlike other methods, this paida/lajin cost absolutely nothing literally. it can be done pure DIY at home (maybe buy a nice bench for the lajin exercise for people who like accessories).

Of course not many may choose to slap/stretch themselves for 30 mins when they can have a nice hit, get high and feel good at the same time but those looking to 're-align' their body may be interested.

 

[darkrom]

I have been using tons of opiates for chronic internal pain and I constantly tell my Dr that I would give up every pill and just keep cannabis. That is even more true now with ABV oil. It absolutely helps with pain. I spend a lot of time each day sobbing in pain, when it is at its worse, I can take a dab or two of ABV oil and the pain instantly begins to calm. The opiates couldnt control the pain and I was on mega doses for what they will dole out in Australia. I had to have a license from the govt. for what I was taking.

I have learnt to be much better with pain from this journey but I dont like it and will do almost anything to make it stop.

Interesting. First of all how are you making your ABV oil? Everclear, or butane?

Do you think it helps more than oil from fresh buds?

I'd really like to know! I have a bunch of ABV I saved I think I might have to make some more ABV oil, as nasty as it looks and smells its so worth it if you find it helpful with pain.

 

[ataxian]

Dude, I feel for you. I started my unending parade of spinal surgeries and painkillers when I was your age (I'm 44 now) and spent the past three years getting off all the narcotic pain meds.
If your body tolerates them (mine doesn't) anti-seizure drugs like neurontin (gabapentin) can be a help, without narcotic effects. Be careful though - most people can take those meds, but neurontin almost killed me.
I have had surgeries that made things worse, but have had other surgeries that made a big difference for a few years.

What a journey!

Neronton, Prozac, Ambein C, Vicodin was doing more harm than good.

Cannabis seems to be milder however more effective.

Interesting. First of all how are you making your ABV oil? Everclear, or butane?

Do you think it helps more than oil from fresh buds?

I'd really like to know! I have a bunch of ABV I saved I think I might have to make some more ABV oil, as nasty as it looks and smells its so worth it if you find it helpful with pain.

ABV I use to save and make wax however maybe you will have more success with it. I use FLOWERS to make my medical SHATTER. I wish I could get over the taste factor! My pallet is way to complicated. BHO is what I use and always vacuum purge. I used ISO before however the BHO I found better. I even bought CO2 Oil that gave me a headache so I make my own medicine and lost my trust in concentrates made by random people! LAB TESTED is the best way to buy however very expensive.

 

[grokit]

I integrate abv into my edibles, by infusing it, along with some (decarbed) fresh duff, into a mixture of butter and coconut oil. This helps the flavor but dilutes the actives with trichromes so more full spectrum.

Just an observation, the effects you guys are describing from pure abv oil sounds similar to what I get from dabbing the sublimate oil generated by my sublimator.

 

[t-dub]

I have been using tons of opiates for chronic internal pain and I constantly tell my Dr that I would give up every pill and just keep cannabis. That is even more true now with ABV oil. It absolutely helps with pain. I spend a lot of time each day sobbing in pain, when it is at its worse, I can take a dab or two of ABV oil and the pain instantly begins to calm. The opiates couldnt control the pain and I was on mega doses for what they will dole out in Australia. I had to have a license from the govt. for what I was taking.

I have learnt to be much better with pain from this journey but I dont like it and will do almost anything to make it stop.

After 5 1/2 years on morphine sulfate I finally had to give up opiates, they just change you slowly over time. It was that or lose my wife and everything else. I was taking as prescribed . . . I feel opiates are great for short term pain like dental and surgery, or end of life care (EOL) but for long term pain management there are a whole lotta problems . . . Interestingly enough when I had my rear molar extracted, I was able to mix cannabis with vicodin and get better results with a smaller dose. It seems the opiates are a numbing force and the cannabis is more of a signal disruptive force.

 

[SuperVixen]

Interesting. First of all how are you making your ABV oil? Everclear, or butane?

Do you think it helps more than oil from fresh buds?

I'd really like to know! I have a bunch of ABV I saved I think I might have to make some more ABV oil, as nasty as it looks and smells its so worth it if you find it helpful with pain.

We have tried both QWISO and Butane. I didn't really see any difference between the two results in terms of taste or effect from the result. I am not sure if one or the other produced more etc

Pure ABV oil does look like thick dark sludge I don't mind the taste, I don't really taste anything, but opiates and withdrawals have complete messed with my senses overall. But it has provided me with unbelievable pain relief! I couldn't believe it once I tried it. I wont be without it if I can help it. It does for me what doses of Endone didn't do (which I haven't taken for a few months now. was taken off it after surgery) or Tramadol.

In the first run we just did QWISO with just ABV. The latest run we did is ABV mixed with some other scrap material which was run with butane. This produced a dark hard result. We've yet to do a run of Bud. We used to do that many years back. That was before there was any of this fancy stuff not even sure how much of it we were actually smoking. It was a far to up racy high and we lost interest. That was before pain so I cannot really give you an opinion on that.

If you have ABV and are inclined to do so, I would definitely give it a go and see if it helps. Its only going to waste anyway but I am so happy we have been talking about running the old Volcano just to be able to produce ABV to make oil.

I hope you have some luck with it

I was taking as prescribed . . . I feel opiates are great for short term pain like dental and surgery, or end of life care (EOL) but for long term pain management there are a whole lotta problems . . . Interestingly enough when I had my rear molar extracted, I was able to mix cannabis with vicodin and get better results with a smaller dose. It seems the opiates are a numbing force and the cannabis is more of a signal disruptive force.

My Doctor is slowly weaning me off them. I have been off Oxy for about two months and I still feel effects.... It was only ever supposed to be short term but waiting for surgery turned into a long wait... When I came out of surgery I found they had added Ketamine to the cocktail too.

Opiates end up just leaving you sitting in a pile barely able to form a sentence. It is no way to live.

SV

 

[ataxian]

But it has provided me with unbelievable pain relief! I couldn't believe it once I tried it. I wont be without it if I can help it. It does for me what doses of Endone didn't do (which I haven't taken for a few months now. was taken off it after surgery) or Tramadol.

Opiates end up just leaving you sitting in a pile barely able to form a sentence. It is no way to live.

SV

I love concentrates for that same reason.
I have to make my own from fresh cannabis colas.
ABV the wax comes out too dark to load into my carts & foul up.
Clean blonde or lighter color concentrates load better.
I'm all about managing my illness.




Sometimes I try anything and everything to maintain.
ABV products don't work well with my gear so clean concentrates are critical.
Maybe I bring up the taste factor to justify not saving my ABV?
I'll start saving it again and figure out to process it some how?
For now I just use fresh flower colas to make my medicine.

 

[darkrom]

I bet winterized ABV BHO would work much better in your persei if you were so inclined to give it a shot.

 

[ataxian]

I bet winterized ABV BHO would work much better in your persei if you were so inclined to give it a shot.

I need to try that!
Good Ideal!