Things aren't looking good for us herb users?

[luchiano]

I'll just give the links and samples of the articles.
http://cannabisculture.com/v2/content/2011/10/07/Feds-Escalate-Efforts-Close-California-Pot-Shops

Feds Escalate Efforts to Close California Pot Shops

"Federal prosecutors are threatening to shut down medical marijuana dispensaries throughout California, sending letters that warn landlords to stop sales of the drug within 45 days or face the possibility that their property will be seized and they will be charged with a crime."

http://cannabisculture.com/v2/conte...licy-Would-Be-Imposed-Globally-New-House-Bill

U.S. Drug Policy Would Be Imposed Globally By New House Bill

"The House Judiciary Committee passed a bill yesterday that would make it a federal crime for U.S. residents to discuss or plan activities on foreign soil that, if carried out in the U.S., would violate the Controlled Substances Act (CSA) -- even if the planned activities are legal in the countries where they're carried out. "

 

[Ripbongs420]

What the hell? Didn't our president say that he would put an end to this DEA bullshit? Ah another disappointment. Change... yeah right, in my dreams.

 

[Hippie Dickie]

It's the law, eh? The executive branch is obligated to enforce the law. ergo, we must force the congress to pass mmj friendly law, or better yet, legalize the personal use of the herb. so what's wrong with euphoria anyway? i want a bit of euphoria before i die.

 

[Vicki]

What the hell? Didn't our president say that he would put an end to this DEA bullshit? Ah another disappointment. Change... yeah right, in my dreams.

He didn't mean it. He only said it to get elected.

 

[jackmormon]

Remember Seinfeld? Specifically the "Do The Opposite" episode?

Obama has proven himself over and over again as being the "Do The Opposite" President.

If he promises to do something, you can bet the bank he will turn around and do the exact opposite.

Constitutionally, Federal Law Enforcement is only supposed to get involved when something effects interstate commerce. Technically, grown and sold in California doesn't meet this. Doesn't really matter though, as we have not had a constitutional government in place since before 1913.

 

[AGBeer]

Remember Seinfeld? Specifically the "Do The Opposite" episode?

Obama has proven himself over and over again as being the "Do The Opposite" President.

If he promises to do something, you can bet the bank he will turn around and do the exact opposite.

Constitutionally, Federal Law Enforcement is only supposed to get involved when something effects interstate commerce. Technically, grown and sold in California doesn't meet this. Doesn't really matter though, as we have not had a constitutional government in place since before 1913.

I think their big argument here is quite a bit of their product is in fact exported out of the state.

My solution to this, is make it legal everywhere and it wont be an issue any longer

 

[tranceporter]

This issue is way bigger than Obama so I think diverting this thread with "I hate the president" sentiments is rather pointless.

The Feds always win.

 

[luchiano]

The thing that is really scary is the second article which can mean that websites dealing with cannabis can be illegal for u.s. citizens even though the server is in another country where it's not seriously enforced and can get arrested for it. It is basically building a case on conspiracy. This means if someone goes to canada or the netherlands and partake in herb and they knew they were going to do this they can get arrested in the country or when they come home. They can easily slick someone into admitting they planned to take herb while in the said country. THIS IS CRAZY.

 

[Purple-Days]

Funny, nobody here said, "I hate the President".

What is being said is, he was a typical politician (of any party) promising things that he either could not do (lack of authority), or had no intention to do. Remember everything is about winning the election (any election, any politician). (yeah there a a couple of exceptions, good guys, but not many of them win)

Calling a politician (in America) a liar, is like calling a kettle black (excuse me, that's the saying, nothing to do with race). Politicians are (have been) liars by nature. Politicians get blamed for lying, after they are elected, don't do what they promise. Voters get upset that they elected a liar, beat their chest about the rotten system, then go out and do it all over again.

Who is to blame? We the sheep...

+++

'The IRS is attempting to drive dispensaries out of business by denying them standard business expense deductions -- Oakland's Harborside Health center was just this week hit with a $2.5 million tax bill after the IRS disallowed its standard business deductions.'

So don't just think gettiing busted for weed is the only worry. Remember they didn't put Alphonse Capone away for murder, it was taxes...

+++

Oh, AG, you are onto something, in AZ it's very common to hear some version of the phrase, " straight from a California Dispensary, this is called 'xyz' " ... Not that I believe it really is, but the cops hear that same lingo and assume it is true. And if you say something enough times it is true...

 

[VaporNation]

It's all very unfortunate that the Federal government doesn't just back off and allow the States to carry out the laws as they see best for the citizens of that state.

 

[AGBeer]

It's all very unfortunate that the Federal government doesn't just back off and allow the States to carry out the laws as they see best for the citizens of that state.

But they do to a degree -

They do it just enough to keep us 'in the red' to also help keep themselves employed. Today seems to be a day of epiphanies for me as it 'clicked' more than once today.

First - Go to any convenience store and look behind the counter. Plenty of tobacco, but now they have the 'cigar sleeves' with no tobacco in them. "Should be loaded with premium Zig-Zag tobacco" Should be my ass. We all know good and God damned well what the fuck these are for. The glass roses sitting next to the chore boys? Sure...

Then, I was sitting here watching a mini-documentary on Gangsters (like the immigrant ones that the movies are based on today) and they had a pretty profound statement. Something along the lines of the OG gangsters and how from like the 20's through the 60's (cant remember the exact time frame) or so there were only 2 known 'rats'. Reason being is because they mostly dealt in gambling, racketeering, prostitution - crimes that netted a couple to a handful of years in jail.
Introduce the drug market, and now, you are looking at 10-20 year minimums, all of a sudden people are gonna roll and help crumble these criminal empires.

The same people who help craft some of our drug laws (at least in my prohibitionist state) all have one of 2 things behind them - A criminal defense firm or a city prosecutor. Either way they make $$$ off of drugs continuing to be illegal.

 

[tranceporter]

Funny, nobody here said, "I hate the President".

What is being said is, he was a typical politician (of any party) promising things that he either could not do (lack of authority), or had no intention to do. Remember everything is about winning the election (any election, any politician). (yeah there a a couple of exceptions, good guys, but not many of them win)

Calling a politician (in America) a liar, is like calling a kettle black (excuse me, that's the saying, nothing to do with race). Politicians are (have been) liars by nature. Politicians get blamed for lying, after they are elected, don't do what they promise. Voters get upset that they elected a liar, beat their chest about the rotten system, then go out and do it all over again.

Who is to blame? We the sheep...

+++

'The IRS is attempting to drive dispensaries out of business by denying them standard business expense deductions -- Oakland's Harborside Health center was just this week hit with a $2.5 million tax bill after the IRS disallowed its standard business deductions.'

So don't just think gettiing busted for weed is the only worry. Remember they didn't put Alphonse Capone away for murder, it was taxes...

+++

Oh, AG, you are onto something, in AZ it's very common to hear some version of the phrase, " straight from a California Dispensary, this is called 'xyz' " ... Not that I believe it really is, but the cops hear that same lingo and assume it is true. And if you say something enough times it is true...

I agree 100%. They all lie. It just seems like Obama is the blame for everything wrong in America, it's rather silly.

 

[AgentofChaos]

And it continues....
Justice Department Targets Banks

 

[VWFringe]

Four Stages to Truth

Stage 1- Non-Confront.
It does not exist, it cannot exist, dont talk about it.

Stage 2- Aggression.
It exists and is a threat to our way of life. It must be eradicated.

Stage 3- Trivialization.
It is growing but it will go away eventually. Its not a threat, its really nothing.

Stage 4- Integration and Co-option.
Its here to stay. How can we manipulate the idea for our own ends?

-----------------------------
Now, I heard it a different way, with violent repression coming third, followed by acceptance, but can't find a reference...basically, I'm trying to say I believe they're in a state of violent repression since repression of the facts/dominating the narrative hasn't worked effectively enough to stop the States from legalizing MMJ.

 

[wilf789]

Good op-ed piece in the NY Times about all this from that Drug Policy Alliance's Executive Director, Ethan Nadelmann: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/07/opinion/reefer-madness.html?_r=3&src=tp

None of this makes any sense in terms of public safety, health or fiscal policy. Apart from its value to patients, medical marijuana plays an increasingly important role in local economies, transforming previously illegal jobs into legal ones and creating many new jobs as well, contributing to local tax bases and stimulating new economic activity. Federal crackdowns will not stop the trade in marijuana; they will only push it back underground and hurt those patients least able to navigate illicit markets.

 

[AGBeer]

I hate to add another nail to the coffin...

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-pot-ban-20111111,0,1943997.story

In a decision that could have immediate fallout for medical marijuana dispensaries, a state appeals court has ruled that California law allows cities and counties to ban the stores.

The contentious issue has bounced through the state courts for years, but the opinion issued Wednesday is the first published one that directly tackles it and does so in unambiguous language. The decision, which upholds Riverside's ban, could embolden more cities and counties to enact their own. It also could spur those that have bans to be more aggressive about seeking court orders to close defiant dispensaries.

"I think its impact will be significant throughout the state," said Jeffrey Dunn, an attorney who argued the case for Riverside. "It's not wishy-washy. It squarely addresses it. And it makes it very clear."

In the case, a three-judge panel in the 4th District Court of Appeal in Riverside rejected an appeal from Inland Empire Patient's Health and Wellness Center and concluded that the state's medical marijuana laws do not prevent cities and counties from passing regulations on dispensaries, including bans. The judges also issued a nearly identical unpublished opinion Wednesday, upholding Upland's ban.

The decisions closely follow another appellate court ruling that said Long Beach could not adopt any regulations that amount to authorizing dispensaries because marijuana remains illegal under federal law. That decision has left officials throughout the state puzzled about what rules they can impose. Together, the two decisions could lead more cities and counties to put bans in place.

Joe Elford, chief counsel for Americans for Safe Access, said he fears that could happen, but added, "I would hope that they would do the responsible thing and continue to regulate dispensaries."

Long Beach, which had used a lottery to select the dispensaries it would allow, will now consider a ban.

Paul Chabot, founder of the Coalition for a Drug Free California, said he hoped that the decision would spell the end for pot shops.

"This really puts the green light out to all city attorneys that they can take action immediately to shut them down," he said. "The tide is turning against so-called medical marijuana in California."

Americans for Safe Access says 168 cities and 17 counties ban dispensaries, while Chabot's group puts it at 225 and 15. Both organizations say that more than 80 cities and about 10 counties have moratoriums, while a few more than 40 cities and about 10 counties have ordinances that allow dispensaries.

The recent decisions could give the state Supreme Court an opportunity to address critical issues that remain unsettled 15 years after voters made California the first state to allow medical use of marijuana. Despite the state's groundbreaking status, its medical marijuana program is the most tumultuous. The state's four federal prosecutors have ramped up enforcement to shut down dispensaries and growers.

Long Beach City Atty. Robert Shannon said the city filed its appeal to the Supreme Court on Thursday. "The law is in total disarray," he said. "There is no clarity and consistency."

And the founder of the Riverside dispensary, Lanny Swerdlow, said he expects the collective will also appeal.

"We think that it's wrong that a city can ban a state-permitted activity by zoning it out of existence," he said. "By allowing cities to ban, it just makes a crazy-quilt pattern across the state."

Riverside now plans to take action against an estimated 15 dispensaries violating its ban. "We will be immediately moving to shut them down," City Atty. Gregory Priamos said. "We're extremely pleased that the court recognized and respected local land use and zoning authority."

 

[lesvape]

It's kind of funny the feds are going after California cause according to CNBC, California doesn't even have the most mmj patients, that records goes to Oregon, with Colorado being in the number 2 spot, and California in the number 3 spot.

As for the cities, and counties trying to ban it, that bs, since the voters approved for the state to have the whole MMJ business in the first place. Now this just makes it harder for patients to get their meds, as they either have to drive far to get it, or go to the black/gray market.

 

[wilf789]

Good article from the Guardian: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/nov/14/medical-marijuana-crackdown-california

Washington insiders who have discussed the issue with Obama's staff say the real impetus for the crackdown is coming from career prosecutors, not political appointees, and that the White House is afraid to challenge the prosecutors too openly for fear of falling into another Bush-era trap by interfering with their right to exercise independent judgement.

In other words, the prevailing problem in the White House is absence of leadership, not an excess of it. The Obama people "have painted themselves into a corner," said Aaron Houston of the group Students for a Sensible Drug Policy, "where now people expect... that he can enforce the policy his Justice Department originally set out. But it's not enforceable... He's massively overpromised."

Then referring to the owner of the Harborside Health Centre, Steve DeAngelo, and the legal challenges facing his dispensary:

It will be far from a simple battle. Aaron Houston and other pro-marijuana lobbyists in Washington are urging the Obama administration to address the issue more openly in public and acknowledge the groundswell of public opinion in their favour. The federal prosecutors in California, meanwhile, appear to be taken aback by the vehemence of the reaction to their announced crackdown.

One federal prosecutor during the Bush years, Joseph Russoniello of San Francisco, eventually pulled back from his own campaign to fight the medical marijuana movement, saying it was like "shovelling sand against the tide". DeAngelo and his friends are hoping the Obama-era establishment will quickly come to the same conclusion.