Eek..... do people actually use that ceramic for anything you inhale?!?!?! Might sleep with the fishies with that stuff....
T
Discontinued Thermovape Luna
- Thread starter Rocco
- Start date
Eek..... do people actually use that ceramic for anything you inhale?!?!?! Might sleep with the fishies with that stuff....
T
Soflo
Only birdshit and fools
This is a common use in the ecig world. I don't work for the fda so I can't give their approval. I would torch it first. Then iso wash. From what I've read, lots of folks do this. If that scares you then you could always just order some ceramic wick like w9 uses in their newer kiss carts and shape it to fit.
http://www.kidneypuncher.com/fc-2000-ceramic-wick-7-64th-3-pack/
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OF
Well-Known Member
IIRC Cera (and Revolution/DART)) gets to about 1400F, worst case. How hot do e-cigs go?
Yeah, it scares me. I know people that do lots of dodgy things I can't recommend, but this one stands out to me, the ceramic seems a much better idea. Not taking the cart apart in the first place seems best of all.
Keeping ahead of fouling for ever is not going to work. For now, I think I'm leaning to torching the unit intact as opposed to stripping it down since there are no replacement parts for the most part.
OF
OF
Well-Known Member
Now how, exactly, would you know how dodgy the folks I know are?
Thanks for the recommendation, I'm fairly confident of the facts I relate here and the folks I know........
OF
kernal6500
Well-Known Member
Well i dismantled my cart only to find the middle ceramic was falling to pieces. The top ceramic wafer was a split into 2 before i dismantled it and was holding fine but when i pulled it all down it just fell into pieces. To my surprise, nothing else looked dirty or gummy so i just torched what was left of the ceramic a bit and tested it out. it glowed up nicely without any issues. I put some wax in it and it produced massive vapor a lot more than before so i am happy for now. I am thinking about replacing the top ceramic wafer with some wick will that work?
OF is 100% correct to be leary of that kind of ceramic. While it may be used a lot in Ecig products, that is a very different application than a concentrate vape. The temperatures seen in the EO core are much higher than any EO or other ecig cores.
Cheers,
Tim
OF
Well-Known Member
Is it even ceramic? The only airstone I have sure looks like (the traditional) bonded sand to me. If it's quartz sand (most likely IMO) I think that should be OK (basically glass.....) but the bonder gives me pause as does coloring agents.
We're no doubt talking a low cost product from China here? A place famous for it's inability to keep lead paint off kids toys and poison out of pet foods (or even some drugs for human consumption). I doubt anybody can say with certainly what's waiting at the local pet store.
As long as there's any alternative available I'd avoid this one, but that's just free advice on Al Gore's Internet from a guy not even using his real name. The risk is all the owner's; therefore the choice should be.......but IMO it should be an informed choice. IMO this is not without risks. Even if e-cig owners, goldfish, and guppies everywhere swear by them.
OF
Severmore
Well-Known Member
F-2000 = fish air stones or a higher grade (ie safer) ceramic? Just curious if the F-2000 ceramic wick I purchased for other devices (KISS carts) should be concerning with respect to my health as well? Is red hot nichrome 80 at temps significantly less than 1400F?
Genuinely curious...TIA!
OF
Well-Known Member
As true ceramic it will have been "fired" to something well over 1600F in order for the individual particles of the clay to "sinter" together into a single piece. This is past red into orange heat wise. Nichrome definitely gets this hot, it's what makes the heaters in the kilns for heaven's sake....... As I understand it, low firings typically got over 2000F for that reason. Glazed parts even higher:
http://www.ceramicartdaily.net/PMI/KilnFiringChart.pdf
Normally, unless you burn it off or fry the oil, it doesn't get much past 400 of course in e-cigs, but the Cera cart is different since it doesn't heat the goods by conduction like e-cigs do. The heater gets much hotter, about 1400F IIRC. This can happen in places in the core while other places are still under working temperature (400F).
So I think it's a much better choice than random airstones. It's designed for the temperature ranges involved, and is intended for human use (fish seldom vape and almost never sue......).
OF
kernal6500
Well-Known Member
Will the ceramic wick work wth the thermovape luna cart and how would u mold it to fit? And how do you attach it to the top? My wafer is crumble and needs replacement
OF
Well-Known Member
As a material I think it has a good chance, but since I've never seen it I can't guess how you'd use it. Perhaps the fellow who suggested it might? Seems to me off hand it's too thick and narrow for the job? That is you'd have to grind flats on it (not at all easy if fired, generally done 'green'....as TV does) and then laid down in several strips to cover the opening?
The top plate is not attached, it's trapped in a well in the body. It has to be free to expand and contract or it will shatter so it can't really be attached.
Bummer about your ceramic falling apart, another reason for not disassembling IMO. Broken pieces still work fine if they're in position, but once they get out of place it's not going to be easy to get Humpty Dumpty together again. Fun idea: How about gluing the pieces in place with say sugar and water, assembling the cart then boiling it to remove the sugar?
OF
Soflo
Only birdshit and fools
Dremel tool with a diamond wheel for cutting the fc2000, You can go on YouTube and watch videos where people cut them down.
Anyone have opinions on a fine ss/ti screen cut to fit instead of the top wafer? I realize this could drop down and cause the heater wire to short out. Just throwing ideas around since no one has a fix YET.
Anyone have opinions on a fine ss/ti screen cut to fit instead of the top wafer? I realize this could drop down and cause the heater wire to short out. Just throwing ideas around since no one has a fix YET.
kernal6500
Well-Known Member
kernal6500
Well-Known Member
I'm going to order the ceramic wick and see what I can do with it.
I will keep everyone updated.
And did the owners of tet sell their company??? Or is it gone forever!!?
I will keep everyone updated.
And did the owners of tet sell their company??? Or is it gone forever!!?
OF
Well-Known Member
Excellent! That's the spirit, please do let us know what you find. TIA
I think the story is while there were some discussions, a right buyer/conditions didn't happen. Which I take to mean that there is still a slim chance, but getting slimmer over time?
Bummer, but it's the sharp part of 'cutting edge' stuff.......
OF
They tried selling it but know buyers is what I'm hearing. I talked to Zeki a week before they closed I wish I asked him for ceramic wafers as My Luna's ceramic fell apart.
Tim you wouldn't know how to get the ceramic wafers by chance, would you?
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coffinoff
Well-Known Member
I always kind of wondered about the ceramic wafers. I mean, when you first get them, they have very crisp edges but over a period of regular use mine would gradually become slightly deformed, more rounded, and generally just worn down. All those little pieces of material have to go somewhere.
kernal6500
Well-Known Member
Well im holding off on the ceramic wicks because of all the cutting involved and purchase of a dremal tool with a diamond wheel which i have no idea how to use. For now i purchased a ceramic donut atty from devine tribe. i cant wait!
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MileHighLife
Blower of glass, grower of grass
I have a block of this ...
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00849ZSV0?pc_redir=1408525144&robot_redir=1
Seems almost identical to the ceramic used in the Luna. A bit hard to shape and mold a piece but it seems like it'd be a good option for replacement ceramic in the Luna but I have no idea how innert aluminum oxide is at the temps we're working with. Some e cig guys use it though ...
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00849ZSV0?pc_redir=1408525144&robot_redir=1
Seems almost identical to the ceramic used in the Luna. A bit hard to shape and mold a piece but it seems like it'd be a good option for replacement ceramic in the Luna but I have no idea how innert aluminum oxide is at the temps we're working with. Some e cig guys use it though ...
OF
Well-Known Member
While it might appear similar, chemically it's an entirely different thing than the porous ceramic used in Cera and other TV products. It's basically a grindstone made of abrasive particles glued together with resin binder. Like a cut off saw blade, but without the fibers. The Alumina part is OK, but I'd fear the binder.
Have you tried torching it? I bet it doesn't fare all that well? I think the ceramic wick material (or even fiber glass???) is a better call. Unlike this abrasive and airstones there's no binder added we need to be concerned about. The original part is fused together at much higher temperature than we deal with, where as typical resin binders fail (and often decompose) at much lower temperatures. IIRC the classic binder is Phenol Resin, same as used to make circuit boards. I can hang in there (barely) at vaping temperatures but falls apart starting just above 400F and we have to make 1400.
OF
MileHighLife
Blower of glass, grower of grass
I have torched it several times ... I made a few little discs to try to make an imitation dart out of an RDA a while back and torched the discs clean a few times using a 2500° torch. It'll glow red hot and end up exactly how it was beforehand, after it cools off. If it's using a binding agent it can reach some insane temps without being affected.
I should mention that the pieces off the aluminum oxide brick feel much more hardy than the ceramic in the Luna to me. The top piece in my cart is also damaged but I've drop one of the aluminum oxide wafers I made from about 5 feet up to concrete and it just bounced around for a while and was undamaged. And it's a bitch to work with because it's so tough that diamond tipped tools even have a hard time cutting through it. I used a tiny diamond tip hole saw to start with for the wafers and I was sitting there for a couple minutes with my drill on full speed trying to get through the stuff and I think bit is about shot after the one go.
Edit: according to the msds the melting point for aluminum oxide is 2000°. I wonder if they use some sort of heat fusing process to make the bricks ...
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OF
Well-Known Member
Again, I think you'll find that alumina abrasives are ground and sieved to size (the numbers you get on sandpaper and grindstones, "mesh size") then are bonded together with an agent, traditionally Phenol Resin.
The only materials that can be 'fused under heat' the way ceramics sometimes are is when you go through the bisque process (aka 'low firing'). Such materials are pretty stable but kind of soft, sometimes called 'green'. This is where TV machines the parts used in the carts. Then the parts are high fired, where glass (silica) from the mix melts and truly cements the pieces together. Such materials tend to not be porous where bonded ones often are made so intentionally.
That is not all ceramic materials are the same. Some, like in Cera, are basically one piece. Others, like aluminum oxide stones and paper are small bits glued together with something.
I'm not saying it won't work or it's unsafe, just that while materials intended for use by people at the temperatures we're talking about I think that's the way to go. No matter what the e-cig guys do?
OF
So. Its been almost two weeks since TET closed. My phone calls and emails from Aug 27 - 29 went unanswered. I paid for a rebuild a month before they closed and I was issued a credit that I never got to use because i was not able to get in touch with anyone. I really dont care about the money, but I am very disappointed in how this all went down. I still can not believe that they are gone forever. Their website is still processing orders and is completely functional, there phone line is still in service and they still have their warehouse space. Why keep it all in tact if they really couldn't find a buyer and have no intention of re opening or even answering their customers cries for help? I am dumbfounded by all of this......the technology is amazing. the vaporizer is amazing. Am i to just accept the fact that this entire thing went under over night? The product is just too damn good to disappear.
Sorry for venting, but this is something that has really bothered me over the last few weeks. I really believed in what TET was doing. I am pretty sad because I feel like there is no one else in the market who cares about the medical aspect of the device like TET did.
Also I have been unable to find a suitable replacement for CERA. I have looked into UPTECH products specifically the Persei/Herc combination everyone is always talking about but I am very hesitant to get heavily invested in it because it seems to be a never ending journey.
THIS SUCKS I MISS TET!!!!
Sorry for venting, but this is something that has really bothered me over the last few weeks. I really believed in what TET was doing. I am pretty sad because I feel like there is no one else in the market who cares about the medical aspect of the device like TET did.
Also I have been unable to find a suitable replacement for CERA. I have looked into UPTECH products specifically the Persei/Herc combination everyone is always talking about but I am very hesitant to get heavily invested in it because it seems to be a never ending journey.
THIS SUCKS I MISS TET!!!!
