There's almost nothing left in the Herb after "low/medium" temp vaping with my vaporizer (E-Nano)

[WoodyWeedPecker]

Its not water. Look into the boiling points linked above, this is a factual matter. It simply doesn't work that way.

In my experience it does.

Have you tried it? Nothing speak like experience...

You must take the time to experiment with it with your device. Let's say you have an LSV. You must find and pin-point the right temp for it. What I'm telling you is what happens. It's not a theory or something like that. It's truly what happens in my experience (about one year of use). I was curious if other people experienced the same thing as me and the answer is yes, just not you.

 

[howie105]

High temp vs low, convection vs conduction, fine grind vs no grind, all that is good is often depended on the preferences and perception of the individual involved. Vapeing is very much what we make it and believe it to be in spite of empirical evidence.

 

[WoodyWeedPecker]

High temp vs low, convection vs conduction, fine grind vs no grind, all that is good is often depended on the preferences and perception of the individual involved. Vapeing is very much what we make it and believe it to be in spite of empirical evidence.

This thread is not about what is better.

This thread is about almost fully extracting the main cannabinoids at medium temp so no vapor can be seen even if you increase the temperature.

I don't think it's the best way to vape, I was just surprised to find no more vapor after vaping my bowl fully at medium temp. But vaping at high temp is great since it gives you quicker extraction and bigger clouds if that's what you're looking for.

 

[Winegums]

With my Herbalizer (arguably one of the most accurate temp controlled vapes), I can vape at 390 until I get a wispy bag. Then crank it to 430 and get a thick cloudy bag.

I'm not sure how accurately some vapes hold their temps but it appears the herbie doesn't vary by much and the higher temp Cannabinoids are all still waiting for me at 430.

I've found that letting ABV relax/cool for a bit a can improve the taste and vapour at high temps. The pop corn flavour dies down and it gains back a more regular flavour. I usually dump my bowl after 390, but sometimes will roast it at 430 to start a new session with what's left over.

So to answer your question op. At 390 I'm not extracting everything, 430 I'm getting pretty much all of the cannabinoids, and 445 offers little to nothing after being run at 430.

Edit: almost all the THC and CBD are gone after getting whispy at 390 btw. You're getting the sedative Cannabinoids at 430.

 

[howie105]

This thread is not about what is better.

This thread is about almost fully extracting the main cannabinoids at medium temp so no vapor can be seen even if you increase the temperature.

I don't think it's the best way to vape, I was just surprised to find no more vapor after vaping my bowl fully at medium temp. But vaping at high temp is great since it gives you quicker extraction and bigger clouds if that's what you're looking for.

Head for the lab then, that is the only way you are not going to get a divergent set of opinions based in anecdotal observations. Otherwise you can't factor out all the variables like opinions, expectations and perception. However I apologize if you feel like I stepped on your toes, it was not my intention.

 

[RUDE BOY]

i temp step with my vapes that have variable temp control all the time. Starting on low moving through medium temps up into high temp vaping to end a session/load and usually vape on any given temp until there's no more visible vapor then bump it up.

Bumping up through the temps always produces more vapor and stronger effects, for me at least.

 

[CarolKing]

@WoodyWeedPecker there are a lot of variables such as your cannabis and what effects you are looking for. There are many here that medicate for medical as well as rec. Depending on what vaporizer I'm using, I usually bump up my heat towards the end of my sesh.

I like having a ten min session. I vaporize for joint, muscle and nerve pain along with inflammation.

If I vaporize too high of temp my product gets spent too quickly. That's only natural. If my cannabis is too dry it gets spent quicker on a lower temp. Just my experience.

Some vaporizer have inconsistent heat from vaporizer to vaporizer.

I notice you are using an Enano. I go as high as 6.5 with my flowers. I go higher with concentrates. Some cannabis I need to go as low as 5.75 or even 5.5 if I'm using dry cannabis. My temp 6 might be 7 on your unit.

 

[WoodyWeedPecker]

until there's no more visible vapor then bump it up.

Maybe you think there's no more visible vapor, but there's still some vapor left. So bumping your temp would in your case provide you with more visible vapor, quicker. Which is something very good. Or maybe your med temp is below vaporization temp of all the main cannabinoids.

It is indeed like water in a pot on the stove. Put it at med temp or high temp, you will end up vaporizing all the content (either it be water or other molecules) at different speed depending on the temperature.

 

[KeroZen]

You can do what I do also with the LSV, Da Buddah, Grasshopper, etc. Most full convection vaporizer with full temp control.

This discussion is pointless because you are comparing apples to oranges (and other people followed) Your nano has no active (i.e. feedback based, closed loop) temperature control, it doesn't even have a sensor. What you have is just a power knob. The DBV and LSV you quoted above are the same.

With a precise digitally controled vape like the Herbalizer mentionned above, or the Ascent for instance, you can effectively deplete a given temperature level "fully" and vapor production will stop (ok it's wispy and maybe if you keep insisting one hour or two you might extract the rest, because vaporization is not binary but rather bell-like in its curve), then if you raise the temperature production restarts.

Without temperature control, the heat soaking time (preheat), draw speed and draw time will vary (consciously or not) and you will be able to extract pretty much everything without touching the power knob. This is how it works with my Zion, I just preheat for longer and draw longer over time, and whatever the power knob setting I will end up at the same point. It just affects the time it takes to get there.

 

[RUDE BOY]

Maybe you think there's no more visible vapor, but there's still some vapor left. So bumping your temp would in your case provide you with more visible vapor, quicker. Which is something very good. Or maybe your med temp is below vaporization temp of all the main cannabinoids.

It is indeed like water in a pot on the stove. Put it at med temp or high temp, you will end up vaporizing all the content (either it be water or other molecules) at different speed depending on the temperature.

Your water analogy sounds nice and all but doesn't hold up in practice... It's just not applicable to getting the temp specific ratios of cannabinoids I need from my meds in anyway I can see.

I use low temps for nausea and as an appetite stimulant and higher temps for pain.

If i only take longer on low temps I still hurt, If I only vape on high temps I can't eat.

Different temps seem to provide different results so what you think works best for you would never work for me... still it may be best for you.

 

[Winegums]

This discussion is pointless because you are comparing apples to oranges (and other people followed) Your nano has no active (i.e. feedback based, closed loop) temperature control, it doesn't even have a sensor. What you have is just a power knob. The DBV and LSV you quoted above are the same.

With a precise digitally controled vape like the Herbalizer mentionned above, or the Ascent for instance, you can effectively deplete a given temperature level "fully" and vapor production will stop (ok it's wispy and maybe if you keep insisting one hour or two you might extract the rest, because vaporization is not binary but rather bell-like in its curve), then if you raise the temperature production restarts.

Without temperature control, the heat soaking time (preheat), draw speed and draw time will vary (consciously or not) and you will be able to extract pretty much everything without touching the power knob. This is how it works with my Zion, I just preheat for longer and draw longer over time, and whatever the power knob setting I will end up at the same point. It just affects the time it takes to get there.

Totally agree

I mentioned my Herbalizer only because I can remove a lot of variables. Using a balloon with a freshly cleaned vapour path means that I'm not influencing the vapour production besides packing the bowl.

I can visibly see the difference in vapour production when I bump my temp to the next step. 330>350>375>390>430, I can feel different effects with each step and even target certain cannabinoids that I want for that session.

So all that being said. I think that if you're getting your ABV to a dark coffee brown, no combustion and wispy hits, you're extracting pretty much everything. IME once you're getting to medium brown, that's the point of diminishing returns.

-----------

As for the water analogy, it's not exactly like that. It's more like distilling a mash. You have alcohol, ethers, and water in the mix. As you start to warm up the solution the ethers will boil first, followed by the alcohol, and finally the water as the temperature rises. So if we take that and apply it to bud, the Terpines will boil first, followed by the THC and CBD, and finally the CBN/ higher temp cannabinoids.

What this all means is that if you want to get everything from your bud in the least amount of time. You should chase the highest temps right from the beginning. This way you're capturing the full range of cannabinoids rather than a few at a time. The flavour will dimish faster, but you will leave a smaller portion of the high temp cannabinoids in the material by the end.

 

[WoodyWeedPecker]

you will be able to extract pretty much everything without touching the power knob.

I wouldn't say that. If I put my nano at 5.5, it will NOT extract everything. Even if there's absolutely no vapor left in my ABV at 5.5, when I bump it up to lets say 6.1 or 6.4 from 5.5, there's still vapor left.

At around 5.5, the ABV are light brown and there's obviously a lot of cannabinoids and other stuff left in the herb. That's not the case at 6.2!


You must pin-point the right temperature for this to work on your device. The temperature must be high enough. If the temp is low it wont work. Of course, then everything above that temperature (max temp) will also work the same.

 

[flotntoke]

I wouldn't say that. If I put my nano at 5.5, it will NOT extract everything. Even if there's absolutely no vapor left in my ABV at 5.5, when I bump it up to lets say 6.1 or 6.4 from 5.5, there's still vapor left.

At around 5.5, the ABV are light brown and there's obviously a lot of cannabinoids and other stuff left in the herb. That's not the case at 6.2!


You must pin-point the right temperature for this to work on your device. The temperature must be high enough. If the temp is low it wont work. Of course, then everything above that temperature (max temp) will also work the same.

I think you're leaving at least one thing out of the equation as far as vapor production. There is usually some moisture in your load. That gets vaporized with the "lower" temps and creates steam which is easier to see. Lower temp released actives also have more of a "steam" component (resin heads contain moisture themselves).

If you were to burn your abv, I'm sure you weed see smoke. And, as someone who saves AVB to extract for other uses, I can tell you there are still actives in it even if you aren't seeing visible vapor.

Plus, if you're looking at the stem while hitting a nano, you're probably not at the best perspective to see all vapor, only the most visible.

 

[nondarb]

The temperature must be high enough. If the temp is low it wont work.

The premise of your thread is extracting fully or near fully at "low/medium" temps. Stating the temp must be high enough is what we have saying the whole time.

At any rate you seem to think we are simply arguing or disagreeing, but that's not the case.. It simply doesn't work the way you've suggested.

Here's some data from a legitimate source, not conjecture or opinions: www.cannabis-med.org/data/pdf/2001-03-04-7.pdf

 

[WoodyWeedPecker]

The premise of your thread is extracting fully or near fully at "low/medium" temps. Stating the temp must be high enough is what we have saying the whole time.

You must not only read the title, but read the messages to understand the title. It doesn't work if the temperature is too low. If the temperature is below the vaporization point of most cannabinoids and others stuff, it won't work.

 

[nondarb]

You must not only read the title, but read the messages to understand the title. It doesn't work if the temperature is too low. If the temperature is below the vaporization point of most cannabinoids and others stuff, it won't work.

Then that's NOT low/medium.. That's called HIGH temp vaporizing.

I read and comprehended everything just fine.

 

[MinnBobber]

Your primary question was, is there any point in vaping at high temp as your experience was after medium temp vaping, there didn't seem to be much vapor left at high temp?
Many have responded that high temp vaping DOES yield vapor, DOES yield effects yet you seem to not believe the experience of many.
I temp step almost every load like, 350, 375, 400, 420, and finish at 445. I can finish one day at 420 F and the next day come back at 445 and ..... it has goodies left to give.

And all my ABV has seen 445 yet....for medibles it still has more to give!!

 

[WoodyWeedPecker]

Then that's NOT low/medium.. That's called HIGH temp vaporizing.

I read and comprehended everything just fine.

I said low/med temp in the title because people using their Nano often go much higher, I used 6.2 and some users go up to 8 (or higher) with water, and my abv are med brown not dark brown as it was with my mflb or how it is when I bump up the temp to 7.5. But I should have used only med temp in the title.

 

[flotntoke]

I said low/med temp in the title because people using their Nano often go much higher, I used 6.2 and some users go up to 8 (or higher) with water, and my abv are med brown not dark brown as it was with my mflb or how it is when I bump up the temp to 7.5. But I should have used only med temp in the title.

Yes, but as you know nanos vary from unit to unit, as do cord dimmers and power in has an effect also. I have 2 (one for 3 years now) and they require settings about .75 different if plugged into the same outlet to vape the same. Put one on a surge protector, extension cord or weak outlet and that setting can vary 1.5. So, 6.2 could be the exact same heat/vapor production as 7.7 on the other unit.

Don't get me wrong.... I'm not saying this is necessarily a bad thing. Both are very consistent with their settings if on the same power source, and I know where those settings are. But, you can't really compare one to the next with any accuracy unless you know the two of them happen to be exactly the same at whatever setting, or what their "base" differences are.

Try taking your AVB that was vaped out at 6.2 and vape it at 8.5 or so (just below combustion whatever that setting is for you) after letting your nano warm at that setting for 1/2 hour. You should still get vapor, though not as thick and probably not nearly as "blue". And, certainly not as tasty!

 

[shredder]

I've had a vape since 09, and exclusively vaped almost two years now. I might have been 50/50 before I f'ed combustion.

At first I used to bump up temps on my volcano for each bag off a load. After a few years I just settled on a medium temp and stay there. Same on my enano and ssv. The only vape I temp bump now is the mighty. Mostly because it only takes seconds. But I ussually just stay in the 350-380F degree range.

Maybe I'm spoiled (i grow) maybe because i have asthma, or maybe because we do utilize the abv, but when the hits diminish or the flavor leaves, I'm done trying to get every last thing out of my herb. I think the best flavors come at the lower temps, and the type of effects can be more uplifting. And I prefer uplifting over sedating.

Just my perspective after vaping for 7 years now. I'm quite sure other methods are perfectly valid.

 

[WoodyWeedPecker]

Try taking your AVB that was vaped out at 6.2 and vape it at 8.5 or so (just below combustion whatever that setting is for you) after letting your nano warm at that setting for 1/2 hour. You should still get vapor, though not as thick and probably not nearly as "blue". And, certainly not as tasty!

Have you even read this thread. THIS IS THE WHOLE POINT OF MY POST. What you say is ******EXACTLY************ what I do. Did I say exactly?

THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT I DO. If you didn't get it, you didn't read my messages in this thread.

Said simply:
1) I vape at 6.2 or 6.1 or 6.0 or 6.4 or 6.8, absolutely no vapor must be left in the ABV (15+ tokes at 6.2 or 6.1 or ,,,). Even 20-25-100 tokes may be necessary. Yes, I'm joking with the 100 tokes.

1.1) at this point my ABV end up med brown (they are pretty dark but not black).

2) I put my nano at 8.5 or 8.0 or 7.5. I wait 20 minute or more (as usual since I like to spread my tokes)

3) I get 1-2 flimsy draw from my bowl. The ABV turn very dark, very very dark.

It doesn't mean you shouldn't vape at high temp for goddakes. Just that most cannabinoids were already spent, ALREADY VAPORIZED, at med temp which seems to be something above 6.0 on my device. It's not a big surprise since this med temp must be HIGHER THAN THEIR VAPORIZATION POINT.

I think my question, has already been answered, some people understand and experienced it and other people don't. Can we move this to ABV please. It was not mean as a ask FC anyway (I didn't post it here I think it was moved) but a vaporizer discussion. I wanted people to actually take the time to experiment what I'm saying (or to talk to those who already experience it) not feel bad because I seem to say that high temp vaping is not good. I take the responsibility, maybe the words I used were not the best starting with the title using the word low when I meant low but high enough. Yes, the temp must be high enough. The temperature must be higher (not equal, almost equal or lower) than the vaporization point of most cannabinoids. You must pinpoint the right temp for you and your device for this to work.

High temp vaping is great. It provides you with quick extraction and even larger/denser cloud of vapor.

 

[WoodyWeedPecker]

I've had a vape since 09, and exclusively vaped almost two years now. I might have been 50/50 before I f'ed combustion.

At first I used to bump up temps on my volcano for each bag off a load. After a few years I just settled on a medium temp and stay there. Same on my enano and ssv. The only vape I temp bump now is the mighty. Mostly because it only takes seconds. But I ussually just stay in the 350-380F degree range.

Maybe I'm spoiled (i grow) maybe because i have asthma, or maybe because we do utilize the abv, but when the hits diminish or the flavor leaves, I'm done trying to get every last thing out of my herb. I think the best flavors come at the lower temps, and the type of effects can be more uplifting. And I prefer uplifting over sedating.

Just my perspective after vaping for 7 years now. I'm quite sure other methods are perfectly valid.

I can see this thread turning into low vs high temp vaping which is certainly not what this thread was meant to be about. Not at all.

I'm done trying to get every last thing out of my herb.

But this is exactly what I try to do!!! I don't reuse my ABV as edible much, because I don't get high off them when I put them in milk. I don't have much experience with edible (the few times I did it, I didn't really get high off my ABV which are med brown not light brown). I'm trying to get every last thing out of my herb. Bump it to lets say 7.6, and there's only 2 flimsy draws of vapor left in them. Sometimes, I still do it anyway, even knowing that, just to be sure, but with this thread I begin to think it's unnecessary.

I'm sorry, I didn't make my messages and thread title clearer. It's my mistake.

 

[MinnBobber]

I'm trying to get every last thing out of my herb. Bump it to lets say 7.6, and there's only 2 flimsy draws of vapor left in them. Sometimes, I still do it anyway, even knowing that, just to be sure, but with this thread I begin to think it's unnecessary.

.........................................................................
To summarize:
1. there will be more goodies left up to 450 F and dark dark dark brown ABV BUT....
2. vapers need to decide if it's worth chasing them as daark dark brown ABV doesn't tend to taste as good as lighter ABV. And if you temp step, 445 F doesn't yield big ass clouds but still yields effects.

You said you're trying to get every last thing out of herb which points to vape at highest temps AND use ABV for edibles but you obviously don't seem to like either. Vapers choice

And if you decide to try edible ABV again, there are much more efficient methods than dumping in milk--again if you opt to try ABV and if you opt to explore the more efficient ways

 

[RUDE BOY]

my abv are med brown not dark brown as it was with my mflb

Comparing the AVB from a convection vape like the enano to a conduction vape like the mflb is rather pointless, in my experience conduction vapes always produce darker AVB then convection regardless of temps used.

 

[howie105]

At times communication breaks down, sometimes accidentally, sometimes on purpose, sometimes its just a difference in thought processes. Regardless of the cause watching it happen is interesting at times, to a certain point.