THC Isolates - are these the Holy Grail?
- Thread starter FlyingLow
- Start date
TwistedGray
Well-Known Member
I have never tried it myself, but if I understand the process correctly, to get such high THC levels you strip away everything else (ie: terpenes/flavor).
Sounds like it's going to hit you like a 2x4 to the face? Be that a good thing or bad, I don't know.
Sounds like it's going to hit you like a 2x4 to the face? Be that a good thing or bad, I don't know.
Vape Donkey 650
All vape, no smoke please.
Ive seen it, not too impressed. Would try, but probably wouldnt buy. These thc / thca crystallines tend to cost alot more than typical concentrates (almost 2x)
Ive been seeing this stuff for at least a couple years in local stores, also cbd crystalline.
Pure thc has no flavor, one of the main reasons i'm coo off the crystalline extracts. Myself, @herbivore21 and others have waxed on poetically many times on the benefits of terpenes, for flavor, synergistic psychoactive effects, and therapeutic effects.
Terpenes ARE flavor, so i dont want any concentrate that is devoid of terps. Mix in externally sourced terps, even if faithfully matched to your desired strain profile? Why bother if you can just get a good, properly extracted product that captures the full terp spectrum of the source material as gently and effectively as possible?
It is for those reasons ive been buying more live resin for the past year or so, and less dry crumbles.
No plans for purchasing the isolates or crystallines still.
Edit: i suppose the advantage of the isolate, with its 99.9% or so purity, could be cleaner dabbing on your banger/vape pen atty, since there is no chlorophyll, glycerides and other "plant stuff" to gunk up your gear, if you vape it just right at the proper low temp.
However, good co2 and live resin / hcfse already leaves very little residue on my donuts when i vape around 400f or so, so ill take a tiny bit of reclaim residue with my terpy oils, tyvm.
Ive been seeing this stuff for at least a couple years in local stores, also cbd crystalline.
Pure thc has no flavor, one of the main reasons i'm coo off the crystalline extracts. Myself, @herbivore21 and others have waxed on poetically many times on the benefits of terpenes, for flavor, synergistic psychoactive effects, and therapeutic effects.
Terpenes ARE flavor, so i dont want any concentrate that is devoid of terps. Mix in externally sourced terps, even if faithfully matched to your desired strain profile? Why bother if you can just get a good, properly extracted product that captures the full terp spectrum of the source material as gently and effectively as possible?
It is for those reasons ive been buying more live resin for the past year or so, and less dry crumbles.
No plans for purchasing the isolates or crystallines still.Edit: i suppose the advantage of the isolate, with its 99.9% or so purity, could be cleaner dabbing on your banger/vape pen atty, since there is no chlorophyll, glycerides and other "plant stuff" to gunk up your gear, if you vape it just right at the proper low temp.
However, good co2 and live resin / hcfse already leaves very little residue on my donuts when i vape around 400f or so, so ill take a tiny bit of reclaim residue with my terpy oils, tyvm.
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Baron23
Well-Known Member
Folks I know who have used them seem to generally think that the high is not well rounded....kind of thin and flat due to lack of entourage effect from the terps. I don't know first hand so take it with a grain of salt.
Bet that they would be great to make a tincture out of, though?
TwistedGray
Well-Known Member
Or sprinkle on top of whatever else you're using? That'll bump up the THC content pretty substantially I imagine.
Vape Donkey 650
All vape, no smoke please.
From talking to the staff at dispensaries, this is what many users are doing with their crystalline, can make your mid grade oils more potent.
Still seems like it makes more sense, and cheaper, to just buy the highest quality extracts, but i am aware than not all vapers have access to so much good stuff like some of us in CA.
Still seems like it makes more sense, and cheaper, to just buy the highest quality extracts, but i am aware than not all vapers have access to so much good stuff like some of us in CA.
There are basically 2 different versions
THC crystalline 99%+ ~$200g
THC isolate- off white powder/ crumble 90%+ ~$60g
Have not tried either but my money would be on the powder form at 1/3 the price. A nice novelty but could not picture using it regularly.
Edit...
Would probably be good for terp dipping. Very neutral base flavor.
THC crystalline 99%+ ~$200g
THC isolate- off white powder/ crumble 90%+ ~$60g
Have not tried either but my money would be on the powder form at 1/3 the price. A nice novelty but could not picture using it regularly.
Edit...
Would probably be good for terp dipping. Very neutral base flavor.
Hedonismbot
Well-Known Member
I've been vaping ~90% THC powder for a few months now almost exclusively. I bought 10 grams of Guild Extracts THCa Powder that were made from 4 different strains. I am currently vaping this in a Hercules 510 74z on a SMOK Alien mod set to 35 watts. It was very expensive at $100/gram.
Vaping this powder in a Hercules requires that I prime it with a heat gun each time I load (about 1/6 gram at a time), heating the powder so that it melts into the Ti sponge inside the Herc. Compared to conventional wax the Herc stays cleaner. I just finished the seventh gram and the Herc's flavor is still fine.
The downside is that it is almost flavorless. All 4 strains that I obtained all taste the same. BUT... the upside is that this is the best medicine that I've ever had! It is incredibly strong. Much more than the difference between 80% (my usual wax) and 90% would seem to indicate. Plus the vapor is very mild considering its strength. I can easily take 2 big hits in seconds and be fully medicated. The effect from this extract is a strong, clear, cerebral high that last for hours. I don't want to come across as a isolate snob but vaping any flower now in one of my other vapes seems a bit lame in comparison.
I'd be real interested in hearing others experience with these isolates. My dispensary also carries their 99%+ crystalline isolate at $200/gram. Even at that price I'm tempted to try a gram.
Edit: That's one gram of the Candyland on the mat. A sixth of a gram in each pile.
Edit2: The light-saber Persei has been replaced with the SMOK Alien mod.
Vaping this powder in a Hercules requires that I prime it with a heat gun each time I load (about 1/6 gram at a time), heating the powder so that it melts into the Ti sponge inside the Herc. Compared to conventional wax the Herc stays cleaner. I just finished the seventh gram and the Herc's flavor is still fine.
The downside is that it is almost flavorless. All 4 strains that I obtained all taste the same. BUT... the upside is that this is the best medicine that I've ever had! It is incredibly strong. Much more than the difference between 80% (my usual wax) and 90% would seem to indicate. Plus the vapor is very mild considering its strength. I can easily take 2 big hits in seconds and be fully medicated. The effect from this extract is a strong, clear, cerebral high that last for hours. I don't want to come across as a isolate snob but vaping any flower now in one of my other vapes seems a bit lame in comparison.
I'd be real interested in hearing others experience with these isolates. My dispensary also carries their 99%+ crystalline isolate at $200/gram. Even at that price I'm tempted to try a gram.
Edit: That's one gram of the Candyland on the mat. A sixth of a gram in each pile.
Edit2: The light-saber Persei has been replaced with the SMOK Alien mod.
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herbivore21
Well-Known Member
Lol man all of this is not to mention full melt, whose residue IME swabs off sapphire and quartz leaving it looking brand new. I could without exaggerating take 20 dabs of full melt on any one of my nails and if I qtip every time, the dish will look unused!However, good co2 and live resin / hcfse already leaves very little residue on my donuts when i vape around 400f or so, so ill take a tiny bit of reclaim residue with my terpy oils, tyvm.
The non-melting powder left by the non-resin fraction of the trichome gland seems to act as a great abrasive/sponge/something to pick up any stains right off of a vitreous (polished so as to be 'glassy') surface when you qtip. Full melt may leave more residue on a nail than other extracts, but it cleans up much better than anything else IME and if you only use full melt and qtip, you'll never have to clean your dish (I am not embellishing here, I seriously have never cleaned my liger bucket except for when I have dabbed 'oil' extracts rather than full melt!).
In response to the question in the title of this thread - No. In my experience, as somebody who knows how to make all of the above, full melt hash (whole resin glands with intact membranes) is the holy grail
t-dub
Vapor Sloth
The cannabis experience is defined by the ratio of cannabinoids to each other as well as terpenes. So as mentioned earlier in this thread it is not just THC and terpenes that make up the entourage effect. Its the ratios of the cannabinoids to one another that determines how your medicine will effect your endocannabinoid system.
I will post, yet again, this lab video of a person getting pure THC VS THC and CBD. The difference is amazing. I am going to try CBD isolate but I would never try pure THC. Also, I think Marinol was a pure THC pill that big pharma tried to create and it ended up being lethal in some situations, and not helping with pain or ailments either.
I will post, yet again, this lab video of a person getting pure THC VS THC and CBD. The difference is amazing. I am going to try CBD isolate but I would never try pure THC. Also, I think Marinol was a pure THC pill that big pharma tried to create and it ended up being lethal in some situations, and not helping with pain or ailments either.
TeeJay1952
Well-Known Member
That is sort of why I like flowers over concentrates.
The healing is in the synergistic properties of the plant, not isolation. Playing with nature never works. One day when humans are as smart as they think they are it will all make sense.
Baron23
Well-Known Member
Sorry, mate, but the razor blade and piles of powder just bring back too many bad memories of the 80's in Fla.I've been vaping ~90% THC powder for a few months now almost exclusively. I bought 10 grams of Guild Extracts THCa Powder that were made from 4 different strains. I am currently vaping this in a Hercules 510 74z on a SMOK Alien mod set to 35 watts. It was very expensive at $100/gram.
Vaping this powder in a Hercules requires that I prime it with a heat gun each time I load (about 1/6 gram at a time), heating the powder so that it melts into the Ti sponge inside the Herc. Compared to conventional wax the Herc stays cleaner. I just finished the seventh gram and the Herc's flavor is still fine.
The downside is that it is almost flavorless. All 4 strains that I obtained all taste the same. BUT... the upside is that this is the best medicine that I've ever had! It is incredibly strong. Much more than the difference between 80% (my usual wax) and 90% would seem to indicate. Plus the vapor is very mild considering its strength. I can easily take 2 big hits in seconds and be fully medicated. The effect from this extract is a strong, clear, cerebral high that last for hours. I don't want to come across as a isolate snob but vaping any flower now in one of my other vapes seems a bit lame in comparison.
I'd be real interested in hearing others experience with these isolates. My dispensary also carries their 99%+ crystalline isolate at $200/gram. Even at that price I'm tempted to try a gram.
Edit: That's one gram of the Candyland on the mat. A sixth of a gram in each pile.
Edit2: The light-saber Persei has been replaced with the SMOK Alien mod.
HippieHitman
HotBoxin' My Wheelchair
Marinol Works bro its just synthetic THC so without cannabinoids its medically different. I have cerebral palsy, so I need THC for spasms and CBD/hybrids help with my bone and back pain. Marinol isn't totally useless but its like comparing fast food to gourmet burgers.
t-dub
Vapor Sloth
Really? Then why has Marinol killed people taking it? If you find it therapeutic thats great . . .
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MoltenTiger
Well-Known Member
As far as I can see, it's because they overdosed on 100s of pills, or had some other condition during the drug trial that got the better of them.Really? Then why has Marinol killed people taking it? If you find it therapeutic thats great . . .
There have been 4 cases, and all of them have been poorly documented (probably because there should be 0 direcly associated with Marinol (apart from at least one overdose, the LD50 is within reach if you isolate THC and serve it in close to raw form)) I'm struggling to find a link, but there is some discussion about this here
http://www.bluelight.org/vb/archive/index.php/t-631236.html
Marinol is designed to offer the cannabis efficacy in a form that negates the natural plant and easy production. If Marinol (pure THC) was effective, there wouldn't be a medicinal marijuana movement in the states.
THC still has some medicinal benefit, although the full spectrum and synergism within the raw plant is where the secrets are found.
It's the same with opiates, but big pharma has that locked down tight.
t-dub
Vapor Sloth
Dr.Miyagi
New Member
The guys at Fli have a 99.9 % syringe and vape. Looks like they achieved it through distillation. It’s possible since they are using cryogenic ethanol to extract. I got some ethanol shatter from Fli and it had a flavor similar to live resin. The cartridges that were 99.9% probably don’t have terps. One thing that was different about it is that it was totally clear not even a hint of yellow. Next time I’m there I’ll post some images. Funny how everyone keeps telling me shatter is BHO only but my experience is that BHO shatter is inferior to cryogenic ethanol. I haven’t found anything like it in California yet hope Fli makes it to Cali
Mulchmaker
Veni Vidi Vapi
Thanks but no thanks. I could shoot straight ethanol into my jugular, but I'd rather drink champagne. Even if the destination is the same, one journey is much more pleasant than the other.
Silver420Surfer
Downward spiral
Can't say I'd recommend either pure cbd crystalline or thc. I honestly don't have a use for either. I got a deal on the cbd(think 99.6% or 96.9%) at a local dispendsary, so figured to try it out on the bad pain days. Meh, I honestly didn't feel much effects for pain relief or any calming. Looked kinda pretty i guess, like a chunk of very light yellow hue to white, moonrock/crumble. Same color like @Hedonismbot posted above.
The thc isolate, my buddy wanted to try, so I picked some up when he visited. After one or two tasteless dabs, we had enough. Little bit racy, like how a good "Ghost Train Haze", or "Durban Poison" hits me. I always equate those type of highs with feeling like your scatter brained a bit. Did you ever have one of those times where you can't find your glasses(sun or vision), and after frantically searching for 15 minutes, you come to grips that you fucked up and lost them. But then you walk by a mirror and realize that you just shifted them up on top of your head and they were there the whole time? Well thats how I felt when using the thc crystalline. I could get those same effects from good flower like the aforementioned "Durban" or "Ghost Train", plus ALOT cheaper.
**Also, i remember Clear Concentrates having some distillate test at like 92ish or so %. Now they flavor their distillate with terps, so it wasn't lacking flavor. But I couldn't imagine being able to tell the difference between 92% and 99%. I'd have to call out the person who thinks they could do that. So I guess my point is, Clear Concentrates 92% tested distillate(before cali went rec you could find grams for anywhere between $25 and $60) is WAAAY cheaper than the $200 per gram price for the crystalline that was listed above. I am not advocating for Clear Concentrates, but pound for pound, that crystalline is hype and way overpriced, when compared to similar testing product. Lets please not get into an argument over the potential "dirtiness" of Clear Concentrates, my point wasnt they are better. I can find other products to make my point if you insist though lol.
***Don't mean to derail the thread with my yammerings but cbd alone for me never cut it. IDK if the cbd crystalline would be worth it for anyone else either. My main use for cbd(not just cbd but hi-cbd and lower thc) is to relieve pain that has already started. Very few times do I "know" the pain is about to come.
My GO-TO for pain related symptoms is, and has been since I first tried it, "Syner G nectar", which is Lemon G crossed with Bodhi Seeds, "Good Medicine". I believe it is Green Dot Labs(out of Boulder, CO) bred, but not 100% sure. I haven't seen it by any other grower/extract manufacturer. Tihis folks, for me, is truly medicinal. I can't stave off 100% of my pain with this strain, but I can damn near hit high 80's low 90%. I am one of those, like many of you, who believes in the entourage effect. Cbd alone or thc alone doesn't offer the spectrum of cannabinoids available. Maybe cbd has its use as a daily supplement or for pets but, by itself, its not for me.
The thc isolate, my buddy wanted to try, so I picked some up when he visited. After one or two tasteless dabs, we had enough. Little bit racy, like how a good "Ghost Train Haze", or "Durban Poison" hits me. I always equate those type of highs with feeling like your scatter brained a bit. Did you ever have one of those times where you can't find your glasses(sun or vision), and after frantically searching for 15 minutes, you come to grips that you fucked up and lost them. But then you walk by a mirror and realize that you just shifted them up on top of your head and they were there the whole time? Well thats how I felt when using the thc crystalline. I could get those same effects from good flower like the aforementioned "Durban" or "Ghost Train", plus ALOT cheaper.
**Also, i remember Clear Concentrates having some distillate test at like 92ish or so %. Now they flavor their distillate with terps, so it wasn't lacking flavor. But I couldn't imagine being able to tell the difference between 92% and 99%. I'd have to call out the person who thinks they could do that. So I guess my point is, Clear Concentrates 92% tested distillate(before cali went rec you could find grams for anywhere between $25 and $60) is WAAAY cheaper than the $200 per gram price for the crystalline that was listed above. I am not advocating for Clear Concentrates, but pound for pound, that crystalline is hype and way overpriced, when compared to similar testing product. Lets please not get into an argument over the potential "dirtiness" of Clear Concentrates, my point wasnt they are better. I can find other products to make my point if you insist though lol.
***Don't mean to derail the thread with my yammerings but cbd alone for me never cut it. IDK if the cbd crystalline would be worth it for anyone else either. My main use for cbd(not just cbd but hi-cbd and lower thc) is to relieve pain that has already started. Very few times do I "know" the pain is about to come.
My GO-TO for pain related symptoms is, and has been since I first tried it, "Syner G nectar", which is Lemon G crossed with Bodhi Seeds, "Good Medicine". I believe it is Green Dot Labs(out of Boulder, CO) bred, but not 100% sure. I haven't seen it by any other grower/extract manufacturer. Tihis folks, for me, is truly medicinal. I can't stave off 100% of my pain with this strain, but I can damn near hit high 80's low 90%. I am one of those, like many of you, who believes in the entourage effect. Cbd alone or thc alone doesn't offer the spectrum of cannabinoids available. Maybe cbd has its use as a daily supplement or for pets but, by itself, its not for me.
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Dr.Miyagi
New Member
Yeah there is no ethanol left in the end product. Funny cause if your extraction is CO2 or Butane you still dissolve the crude in ethanol to winterize so I don’t see the objection. Real quickly the entire industry is gonna dump Co2. Takes 8 hours to make nasty crude with all kinds of lipids in it. As far as shatter it’s definitely better than butane or mixed gas don’t knock it till you try it, your probably on some hot ethanol aka Rick Simpson oil. All the pros are going cold ethanol and god forbid you ever get cancer your gonna want cold ethanol extracted CBD. Co2 denatures CBD and kills it’s binding affinity to the CB2 receptor. Trust me I worked on a phase 3 FDA trial for pancreatic cancer, we had the MCA (Mono colonal antibody for CBD) which means I can measure bioactivity not to be confused with bioavailability which measures speed into the body. We compared it to immuno therapy drugs. Also if you ever try a sample a pro made ask for the labs way more terps left when compared to standard shatter. Live resin has slightly more on avaerage. In case you don’t know I’m a pro, I have every type of extraction equipment out there. I’m trying to get one of the guys at Fli to tell their secrets.
sickmanfraud
Well-Known Member
I have been making cold ethanol Green Dragon Tinctures for 5+ years. RSO type concentrations 2 + years.
Anyone interested please pm me so we don't go further off topic.