I was wondering about tar and vaping. After reading about it the main carcinogen in cigarette smoke and cannabis smoke is benzopyrene (maybe not main carcinogen but i think is what produces the tar in your lungs). So assuming that a flame burns at the temperature of about 1000-1500 degrees Fahrenheit and the boiling point of benzopyrene is 923°F so it will turn into vapor at this point, that being said the melting point of it is 354 degrees Fahrenheit (or the temp at which it turns into a liquid). Assuming your vaping at 390 why cant you see the liquid tar or whatever are the particles small and will it go into your lungs or can you feel it in your throat?
Tar from herb in vapor?
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CarolKing
Singer of songs and a vapor connoisseur
Many physicians recommend a vaporizer to administer medicinal cannabis, because it eliminates the harm to the lungs that occurs when cannabis is smoked. Another reason is that cannabis is easier to dose with help of a vaporizer compared to smoking or oral ingestion.
With vaporizing there is no smoke. Temperatures range anywhere from 340 - 420 degrees. We usually vape the higher temps with a water tool or if we are vaporizing wax or shatter. You don't get tar, that's why it's way healthier than smoking.
The optimal vaporization temperature for cannabis varies between 365°F and 450 °F (185–210 °C). Preferred temperature settings can vary from person to person, as different temperatures can affect the medicinal properties. Note that not all vaporizers can be temperature controlled and that some (inexpensive) units don’t always accurately display the current vaporization temperature.
In general, lower vaporization temperatures (under 374°F/190°C) give a more psychoactive high, whereas higher temperatures (428°F/230°C) allow for a more sedative body high (or rather, a stoned/couch lock effect).
Of course, both the quality and variety of cannabis that is used also have a great impact on the effects from vaporizing it.
Your ABV (already been vaped) is what is left over after vaporizing. You vaporized most all the goodies out of your cannabis if there is no more vapor left. You've extracted the THC, CBD etc...from your herb. Your ABV is usually dark to a medium to a light brown depending on the cannabis and it feels relatively dry and crunchy. It shouldn't be black. No combustion happens if you are truly vaporizing and no tar.
Folks use the ABV to make edibles, they may decide to leave a little life in their leftovers for future use in food such as butter or oils. You can also add ABV directly to food that are high in fat such as peanut butter. IMO it's hard to control the effects of edibles, there are so many variables. Sometimes or should I say often I don't feel results or it hits me like a brick and is too potent.
EDIT
I kept thinking of extras to add, so this post continued to grow.
With vaporizing there is no smoke. Temperatures range anywhere from 340 - 420 degrees. We usually vape the higher temps with a water tool or if we are vaporizing wax or shatter. You don't get tar, that's why it's way healthier than smoking.
The optimal vaporization temperature for cannabis varies between 365°F and 450 °F (185–210 °C). Preferred temperature settings can vary from person to person, as different temperatures can affect the medicinal properties. Note that not all vaporizers can be temperature controlled and that some (inexpensive) units don’t always accurately display the current vaporization temperature.
In general, lower vaporization temperatures (under 374°F/190°C) give a more psychoactive high, whereas higher temperatures (428°F/230°C) allow for a more sedative body high (or rather, a stoned/couch lock effect).
Of course, both the quality and variety of cannabis that is used also have a great impact on the effects from vaporizing it.
Your ABV (already been vaped) is what is left over after vaporizing. You vaporized most all the goodies out of your cannabis if there is no more vapor left. You've extracted the THC, CBD etc...from your herb. Your ABV is usually dark to a medium to a light brown depending on the cannabis and it feels relatively dry and crunchy. It shouldn't be black. No combustion happens if you are truly vaporizing and no tar.
Folks use the ABV to make edibles, they may decide to leave a little life in their leftovers for future use in food such as butter or oils. You can also add ABV directly to food that are high in fat such as peanut butter. IMO it's hard to control the effects of edibles, there are so many variables. Sometimes or should I say often I don't feel results or it hits me like a brick and is too potent.
EDIT
I kept thinking of extras to add, so this post continued to grow.
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Exactly what she said. The benzopyrene you're worried about falls under a class of chemicals known as polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons, a byproduct of combustion. And you're right in that they're carcinogenic as hell! But they're not present with vaporization.
So kick back, relax, grab your vape, and don't worry about those nasty chemicals like benzopyrene! And spread the word: FUCK COMBUSTION!
Oh and nice editing, @CarolKing! I think I noticed it change like 3 times while my slow ass tried to finish my one short post!
Then again, I'm typing this on my phone, so...
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psycro
Hippo Lungz
I remember from my combustion days, when my water tools would be getting dirty from all the tar build up from 1 or 2 hits. Now i can vape for days with the same water and i dont see any build up at all (except for resin). No yellow water or anything, which leads to the assumption that vaporizing is really eliminating/reducing (most) harmful byproducts of combustion. However we need more empirical studies to safely state that vaporizing is harmless. Up until now it is only logical reasoning and personal experience for me, which kind of assures me that vaporizing is for the most part harmless. I vaporize all day long with relatively high temperatures (rangin from 190 C up to 220 C depending on the effects i want) and i have significantly less irritations in my respiratory system and also significantly less mucus (which is always clear) as compared to my combustion days.
I think we are exposed to various toxins everyday, just think about how much benzene you inhale when stuck in traffic or something like that. Stick to temperatures below 200 C (392 F) and you are on the safe side in my opinion. Happy vaping!
I think we are exposed to various toxins everyday, just think about how much benzene you inhale when stuck in traffic or something like that. Stick to temperatures below 200 C (392 F) and you are on the safe side in my opinion. Happy vaping!
C No Ego
Well-Known Member
I use a plastic water bottle to dump the bubbler vape water and it is a lite greenish color after dumping for a while so the chlorophyll gets in there . as long as your cannabis is clean and free of chemicals that can be transferred during vaping you are good to go for health. if you vape weed that has been soaked in formaldehyde or pesticides then it is not healthy to vape.
I have a hypothesis that burning/smoking improperly flushed weed will destroy some of the petro chems used in growing where vaping would more easily send the not flushed petro chems into your respiratory system without destroying them. even the burned versions from smoking could be a mutated burnt form of the chemicals though.
@Shit Snacks @Cheebsy @mosh @derrppp @psycro @C No Ego Hi guys, this is a really interesting thread! As you know I've recently bought a TM but as in the UK now worried as I can not verify if the herb used has not got pesticides or other chemicals and most likely does have? Is it still safer to vape? Then combust? Due to the by products etc?? Would the positives outweigh the negatives? Anyone on the UK who can shed light on this at all... Is there any ways around this at all? Please let me know, interested thoughts around this?
ginolicious
Well-Known Member
You run a risk as to what is used to grow your cannabis unless you 1, grow it yourself. 2, know who has been growing it. Those are the only two ways you will truly know if the weed is clean. The rest is all speculation.
@Cheebsy I see what you and @C No Ego and @ginolicious are getting at, unfortunately as I'm in the UK and don't know some growers well then all sorts could be used it it?? Which poses a very important question... Is it better to smoke it then?! As then everything is getting burned off the highest temp! rather then inhaling poisonous gases at a lower temp, so would minimise pesticides risks etc?
ginolicious
Well-Known Member
No. Would not be better to smoke it. You will be releasing even more chemicals from the combustion.
I see, but if high temps destroy the pesticides then is that not better, I get that you will be getting carcogenics, but than you're not inhaling pesticides which could be worse at a low temp?
ginolicious
Well-Known Member
I don’t see high temps destroying pesticides without going into your lungs to be honest. But I am not a scientist.
Gunky
Well-Known Member
I would think a low-temp vape would be better. Typically vaporizers subject the flower to a stream of heated air. The first things to be driven off are very volatile terpenes, then come lighter ingredients like THC. Keeping the temp relatively low will help. But like Gino said: to ensure quality grow your own or know your grower. As time goes on it will become legal and testing will remove some of your doubts. Meanwhile find a hippie grower who doesn't like chemicals (or become one).
hinglemccringleberry
Well-Known Member
What physician recommends cannabis other than maybe the doctor from the Simpsons? I would like to travel to the planet where real doctors are recommending it.
Gunky
Well-Known Member
California, Oregon, Washington, Colorado, etc all have medical marijuana programs which require a letter of recommendation from a real medical doctor. I've had several letters from docs like that in California. The first one I went to recommended vaporizing and that evening I discovered FC.
It's an extremely popular wheeze for doctors - they can crank out these letters for 50 - 100 bux and cannabis is so dang non-toxic that they basically never get any blowback.
Cheebsy
Microbe minion
I would think you would still get some of the low temp toxins with smoking as the hot smoke travels down the joint it vaporises material that hasn't yet burned.
I believe, correctly or otherwise, that I can taste or feel in my throat contaminated weed, but badly cured bud can be quite harsh even if it hasn't seen any chemicals. If you're suspicious, try a different supplier and a different strain and compare.
I believe, correctly or otherwise, that I can taste or feel in my throat contaminated weed, but badly cured bud can be quite harsh even if it hasn't seen any chemicals. If you're suspicious, try a different supplier and a different strain and compare.
C No Ego
Well-Known Member
as to smoking destroying more off teh chemicals is/ was my hypothesis not an actual fact ... I still believe that now but in the end the damages from the direct smoke inhalation will over ride the amount of pesticides in vapor in terms of harms ... plus too- smoke disfigures the medical compounds and covers them with soot and could do that with pesticides as well ... becuase this is all illegal do not expect any type o truth in our current research ... the last thing I read about the difference in smoke and vapor the test stipulated that vaping was worse forthe person ... how did they come to that conclusion ? it was deemed apperent that vaoping deliverd way more phytocannabinoids ( THC) ... in the mindset of the testers THC is Bad so more bad is being delivered... if they actullay vaped it for health purposes ( the researchers that is) they would have put the joint down and stuck with the vape for sure
Well if you're in the US we already have a history of cannabis products being used as medicine, Upjohn of Kalamazoo Michigan had over 30 cannabis preparations, you can still purchase the vintage bottles these medicines came in, so cannabis coming from a doctor certainly isn't unheard of, but people weren't really smoking or vaporizing it.
You can blame the lapse in time on the Marijuana Tax Act and the Controlled Substances Act, which effectively demonized cannabis products and research from the pharmaceutical industry entirely.
staircase slight of hand
Well-Known Member
Try the west coast of the U.S.? I work for a Catholic health organization and we have plenty of doctors that are happy to file medical MJ paperwork for established patients. It’s not controversial at all.
C No Ego
Well-Known Member
were any of those doctors taught to treat conditions via plant medications ? what school is teaching this ?
Farid
Well-Known Member
Not sure which school, but I know there are continuing education courses doctors can take specific to medical cannabis, because my neurologist specifically said that he cannot prescribe it until he has taken those courses. But he did refer me to a medical cannabis specialist, and supports it's use in treating epilepsy.
staircase slight of hand
Well-Known Member
The majority of the younger doctors have received training in school, and those that didn’t have to take CE coursework for it. In the Portland area Oregon Health Science University is our major school for this, but I’m not aware of any public med school on this coast that doesn’t have at least some coursework on the topic. It’s kind of necessary if you want a state MMJ program that isn’t just Dr. Nick signing off on cards for $50 from his Venice Beach kiosk, you know?
Vaporware
Well-Known Member
Edit: Seriously though, as a medical user who had never tried any recreational drug (including alcohol, nicotine, even high dose caffeine), there is no pharmaceutical drug that has helped me as much as cannabis.
...except maybe the stuff they knocked me out with during surgery...that would have been pretty horrific to be awake through.
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C No Ego
Well-Known Member
as I've found the only reason whatsoever to have a doctor involved with cannabis is to monitor how dosages of cannabis effects the medcations the person is already taking from said doc . for direct plant access , welll that is Folly - Stupid ETC.... the plant is still being treated like it needs to be dolled out sparingly to the sickest of all of us . after having gone through the pharma med nightmare and suviving then you are allowed plants ... oh how great
Farid
Well-Known Member
For many conditions pharma meds are not a nightmare but a life saver. There is no plant that could replace the anticonvulsant meds I take.
Cannabis helps quite a bit, but it is does not have nearly a long enough half-life to be a primary medication for seizure prevention.
Cannabis helps quite a bit, but it is does not have nearly a long enough half-life to be a primary medication for seizure prevention.