Starting vaping for pain and PTSD

[Indigo]

*waves* Hello everyone, nice to meet you. I have recently started vaping for medical purposes. Initially I tried smoking it, with a non-tobacco smoking mix, but that lasted for only a few days before it drove both myself and my partner up the wall, so I bought a nice Arizer Solo. It's a bit early to say what it's helping with. I have a laundry list of medical conditions, so the main ones here are chronic pain (especially fibromyalgia) and PTSD.

Pain, no, not noticeably helping as yet.
Anxiety, yes, that one has been very obvious. I think it also helps with the breathlessness and chest pain I can get when I'm anxious (don't worry, the chest pain has been checked out, it's nothing alarming). The breathlessness is largely caused by dysautonomia, but anxiety definitely ramps it up.
Sleep, not sure yet. I've been having a lot of problems with nightmares, including waking up really breathless and with chest pain. Since coming off one med I suspected of causing this a few weeks ago, I'm still having nightmares, but they're not as bad, and I don't get the nighttime breathlessness. I have an activity tracker which assesses my sleep, so that can give me some idea of what's helping.

I don't seem to get high from it, thankfully. I don't want to, though I can cope if it's just at bedtime (although then what about sex?). My vision goes funny, and I slow down somewhat. If I'm taking it at bedtime, this isn't a big deal. I have more problems with feeling stoned from my current painkillers, tramadol plus diazepam, which I take on an occasional basis. They're going to try me on lyrica (pregabalin) next, which I'm rather nervous about as I had a hellish time coming off gabapentin.

I'm trying to get a decent dose into me before bedtime, preferably to last through the night. Last night the pain pounced shortly before bed, and I can't take tramadol at night, it'll give me insomnia. So my sleep was pretty broken by pain. Anyway, I'm going to try using it nightly for a week or so, before I start the lyrica, and see what it does. Any tips on fine-tuning the dose for this? How do I get it to last through the night?

Last night I had the Arizer on 4, as setting 5 makes me cough. Only this time 4 was going for my throat a bit, and I had to stop maybe a couple of minutes early due to coughing. Will 3 do much good, if I have to go for that? After having a Strepsil to soothe my throat, I took the ABV from that use and put it in an impromptu brownie in a mug, which you microwave briefly. I have no idea if that made any difference or not. It's occurred to me that a combination of vaping and edibles might help with sustained release, so to speak. Will the ABV from a single dose give me anything useful if eaten? I also need to find a low-calorie and especially low-sugar way of doing so, I'm a bit overweight as it is.

 

[killick]

Howdy - you are in the right place to get started! I've been on MM for chronic pain and arthritis for about 2 years now, but only seriously for the past 9 months, after several hospitalizations related to NSAID and Narcotic painkiller allergic reactions.

My doctor told me about vaporizers. I knew nothing. It's been 35+ years, in high school, when I was last a dabbler. Now I'm on about 3.5 grams per day, or about an ounce per week. I have a collection of vaporizers for various situations, and also a couple of water tools - you will really like these when you get to higher temp vaping!

When I first started we called it my 'garage meds' and I would sit in the cold garage, hunkered over some vape that I didn't really know how to use. I was a bit woozy, which I also got from the narcs, plus I was cold sitting outside, so I decided to start experimenting.

I'm now big into medibles, or cooking and/or eating cannabis. My faves include infused coconut butter, infused MCT oil, and Everclear tincture, which is very strong and can be added to everything in a couple of droppers. I went to a dispensary for the first time and got some 'shatter' to see what it looked like, before trying to make my own. The first time I tried it the pain in my back simply disappeared! So now I try to maintain at a certain level all the time, and then vaporize with either flower or hash when a flareup happens.

You will learn lots of great new things like 'qwet', 'qwiso' and 'shatter', and you'll be overwhelmed by the jargon and terminology in here. Learn it - there is a section in the forums on 'terminology' which will be very helpful. Ask questions when you don't quite understand a concept. Look through the thread titles for something you don't understand - jump in and try learn - it's great fun, and all the members were brand new once themselves (although a few seemed to be born with a silver vape in the mouths

Enjoy! Learn! Share! Make friends


PS - I'm building a bit of a collection of low calorie and reduced/no sugar recipes. Ask away and you'll get a billion answers. And one thought - If I were starting all over again I'd look up the why's and how's of decarbing. That is the basis for a whole bunch of things you will want to know.

 

[Indigo]

What a nice welcome! *peers at user name* So should we be discussing medibles with the phrase "Wittles is up"?

Nice to know I'm not the only person with that concern re. medibles. I'm vegan, and fond of chocolate, so after that, fire away with recipes.

I haven't looked up what "shatter" is yet, but we don't have dispensaries, it's not legal here.

The friend who is helping me with this, and getting hold of the herbs for me, is actually thinking of vaping too. Budget will be a consideration for them, vapers seem to be pricey. Right now they are trying to give up smoking, they've started mixing a herbal non-smoking mix with tobacco.

 

[killick]

Nice catch on the user name - not many outside of an RxN would get it. A very good friend is a retired RN stoker in Aberdeen

Shatter is a type of hash, or concentrate 'conc' you can make at home, using 91+ % alcohol. There is a ton of info in the forums here. Youtube is also a great reference.

I'm not sure what herb availability is like in the UK, but there are some great vaporizer review vids that were shot in the UK, so I'm guessing it's not too hard to get. Hopefully it gets better. Canada is getting better all the time, in spite of our backwards gubmint.

I can tell you how to make your chocolate healthier, by 'extending' it with cannabis-infused coconut oil. When you figure out how to make tinctures you can make each piece of chocolate equivalent to a dose of MM. Thats when medicating becomes a reward, right? I also put infused coconut oil in coffee and tea for a great mocha taste that is, again, a medicated reward! I like rewards

 

[Indigo]

I have no idea what RxN is! I'm just a Patrick O'Brian fan.

I think I'd need to hide the taste, I remember not liking it when it was obvious. I also tried decarbing at first, set the oven too high due to a misunderstanding about F and C, and made the entire stairwell reek. The oil it produced was useless, but we were all very relaxed that evening, including the cat, so I think we accidentally inhaled it. The second time I skipped decarbing and simmered it for ages over a bain marie, and I think I got something usable that time, but again I didn't like the smell, and to be honest I don't think I got on too well with the oil either. I can't for the life of me remember what I baked it into, it was a few months ago. I wonder if anyone's ever put it into a bread machine? Although considering how bland bread is, the taste would stand out a mile, wouldn't it. (I do like making bread, it's a nice easy hobby when you're disabled if you use a machine, and am very fond of sourdough.)

Any tips on how to work out vaping dosage etc. at night? How many hours is it likely to be affecting me for?

 

[killick]

RN is Royal Navy. I was in the RCN for a good chunk of time Patrick O'Brian is very well read around here, and I'm working on a beard that would make Flashman blush in envy

I decarb by firstly wrapping my buds in a foil packet, then giving them an hour at 220, although the oven is preheated to 300, and turned down to 220 when I put the packet in. When it's done I leave it to cool before opening. It will still be skunky, My wife takes the dog for walkies when I'm doing this.

Remember that you need either fat or alcohol to extract good stuff from. You can simmer some bud in full fat milk (or coconut milk) and use that in tea or hot choccie if thats your thing for bedtime. Bread would be great - make something Med-inspired, like an herb or olive loaf, and the results might make it hard to keep away from the non-MMJers in the house... If you convert to something like MCT oil you can use it for everything short of deep-frying. It's great on it's own, in salad dressing, or baked into muffins, along with the leftover herb from making the oil - it's still active *and* a great source of fibre! Remember that if you use 10 grams of herb to make, say, bread, that if you have 10 slices then each will contain roughly 1 gram per slice. Please, think of the sandwiches!

Dosing is a whole different matter. It depends on strains, temperatures, and how your own body reacts. I'm at 3.5 grams per day, but I'm probably only vaping 1 gram or less for the past while, getting the rest of it through tincture. I also have a strain I use at bedtime that is quite high in THC and helps keep me out. You likely can't be that specific with the sources you are dealing with, but there is a lot of info out there about the different strains, what their CBD and THC levels are, and how best to access the ones of most benefit to your own circumstances.

Edit - here's a vid I found awhile ago. It shows 4 different methods for extracting your actives. Remember to always keep your sludge - it goes great in most everything

 

[Indigo]

Current problem: it's irritating my throat and making me cough. People usually say 4 or 5 are the good settings on the Arizer Solo. I was already down to 4, and now I seem to be down to 3 and still not coping all that well. Is this likely to improve or to get worse?

 

[killick]

My throat didn't tolerate heat for several months when I first started vaping. Find yourself a cheap watertool at a local shop, or online, and you'll enjoy it a lot more. Check the 'for sale' forums. There are things in there from the UK and EU often, so you may find just the thing.

There is also a thread on here dedicated to the Arizer Solo. You will find loads of tips and helpful info in there, as well. I don't have one so not much help with specifics..

 

[Indigo]

At the moment I'm using it on 3, and alternating taking a sip from the vaper with sipping water. That seems to help a certain amount. I was very wobbly after vaping last night, I was swaying on my way to the loo, though that was all I had to do before going to bed. I don't know if I'd had a bit too much, or whether the lower setting made that more likely.

My friend who's been helping me with this tried my vaper last night, and was very taken with it!

 

[CarolKing]

Welcome aboard @Indigo. I would go also with the water tool suggestion mentioned. Try looking for a small bubbler like the D020 bubbler from DHgate. It's $30 shipped to U.S from China. You will need an 18mm GonG with that, a you can get a GonG from Planetvape a FC sponsor.

 

[Indigo]

Thanks! Any suggestions for the UK?

 

[killick]

China ships everywhere

 

[Indigo]

I'd have to pay a lot in customs charges if I bought something that expensive abroad, though. Hmm.

After comparing Vaporising Effects By Temperature [vaporpedia link removed due to malware] and Solo Temperatures [vaporpedia link removed due to malware] (mine is a M107, which I hear should be like the M105 in this respect), surely 3 would be the best to use for pain anyway? Not sure about how the different temperatures will affect sleep.

 

[C No Ego]

want to jump in here and comment. I do not have direct experience with it but have read where people with pain issues using an edible right before going to bed and not letting the effects kick in before sleeping. this allows your metabolism to slowly break down the medibles while you sleep and you should still have the effects when you awake. once you awake though you could have a big high as your metabolism jumps into gear and starts to use those cannabinoids. get a high CBD tincture if that is an issue and take a few drops upon awaking. I have read that that is one of the best ways to get good sleep when dealing with pain though the trick is to get to sleep before the effects kick in.

 

[Indigo]

I forgot to mention that I tried some medibles the other week, and did the classic thing of having too many. I felt fine that day, just a bit relaxed, but the next day I felt utterly dire, especially psychologically. So I'm not touching those again, I'll give my ABV to the friend who supplies me instead. The good thing is that I felt rather like I did when I was withdrawing from gabapentin, which reminded me just how hellish that was, and made me realise that going on lyrica would be a very, very bad idea. (The pain doctor I saw was crap and should never have suggested it.) I gave it a few days off, then went back to vaping straight before bed, where it doesn't really matter if I get wobbly vision and walking. I'm currently on a pretty small amount, on setting 3 with alternating sips of water, and am logging my sleep quality. I have an activity tracker which tells me what my sleep was like, so I'm keeping a chart of that plus which meds I've been on. So far I think it helps a bit, and I think I also get to sleep faster. One odd thing is sometimes my muscles feel a bit more tense and I really have to make an effort to relax them. I thought it was a muscle relaxant! Not for long, though, I drop off quickly.

As far as I can tell, it doesn't help pain, and I couldn't function during the daytime with my vision that affected anyway. But if it's improving my sleep, that'll help my health overall.

 

[Indigo]

To be honest, I'm not sure it's doing anything much for me, and I hate being all wobbly and unable to see straight. Is there a point to hanging onto the vaper, or should I flog it to a friend who's interested?

 

[Beezleb]

Unfortunately its not a magic bullet.

I was not able to read what type of herb your using. Using the right strain for your medical issues will do much more than if your just able to get what you can get herb wise. For pain I like the more narcotic knock you out kind of thing for nighttime.

With pain relief for when your awake I feel you have to do more than just vape to get its pain relieving effects the most and be normal. I suggest vaping and maybe doing some light exercise to open up joints and the like if this an issue. Also, get your mind involved in something distracting like vaping a daytime smoke that helps with creativity and work it that way. Unfortunately, if your only able to vape and just sit and not do much, you will not likely find relief from any source.

I hope you find freedom from your pains.

 

[CarolKing]

When you have a chronic illness sleep is essential to healing and feeling better overal. So if your sleep has improved that is a big plus. Just use cannabis before sleep, unless it makes you too tired in the morning. Make sure you are not low in vitamin D too.

Maybe cannabis isn't for you. That's OK too. Good luck in you quest to be healthy.

 

[TNT_error]

You should try CBD tinctures. I also have a chronic illness (nf2), and in the morning right when I wake up I take 3 drops of my preferred cbd brand, and I feel instant relief. I usually do drops and then vape thc. The effects of the cbd cancel out the thc so you don't really feel anything, but,medically, it's a lot of relief. Those nerves can be a bitch to deal with! Welcome btw

 

[Indigo]

Unfortunately its not a magic bullet.

I was not able to read what type of herb your using. Using the right strain for your medical issues will do much more than if your just able to get what you can get herb wise. For pain I like the more narcotic knock you out kind of thing for nighttime.

With pain relief for when your awake I feel you have to do more than just vape to get its pain relieving effects the most and be normal. I suggest vaping and maybe doing some light exercise to open up joints and the like if this an issue. Also, get your mind involved in something distracting like vaping a daytime smoke that helps with creativity and work it that way. Unfortunately, if your only able to vape and just sit and not do much, you will not likely find relief from any source.

I hope you find freedom from your pains.

Thank you! Interesting to know. I can't really do anything when I'm vaping as it makes me all wobbly and messes up my vision. Although maybe some really basic stretching, like the Miracle Ball Method, would work. But generally I would vape just before bed, so that the most I would have to do was weave my way to the toilet and back. (I don't like sex on it either, it makes me feel disconnected.) I'm using the Solo on setting three, interspersed with sips of water, as otherwise I end up coughing. Might I get different results if I used it on a higher heat with a water thingy?

Distraction methods for pain management: hah, I think I really annoyed the neighbours one evening by playing the piano and singing to take my mind off it. At gone 10, and I have a lovely grand piano. It was Bach at low speed, as I recall, as I was rather stoned from the painkillers.

My sleep is a mess right now, and yep, getting that improved will have a knock-on effect on lots of things, so I am going to get back the Solo that I lent to my friend and give it another try. They've been absolutely loving it, so I should try to make up my mind whether I'm selling it to them or not fairly soon.

Folks recommending tinctures: it's not legal here, and I'm not aware of anyone selling it. Can I make it? If so, how, and does it affect you differently? I really can't function during the daytime with vaping as I've been using it so far.

Strain: I'll ask my friend if they can help with that, as so far I've been taking what I can get. Any tips, specifically for what's around in Scotland?

Does anyone know what cannabis does to the adrenals? I reckon my cortisol is too high. This is common with PTSD, especially with the adrenaline surges involved in nightmares, and screwy cortisol is also common with ME. I read somewhere that cannabis raises your cortisol, which is not what I want. Right now I'm on a herbal blend called Adrenal Health by Gaia Herbs, which seemed promising at first but may not be working well for me now. Hard to tell, I'm still messing around with dosage.

 

[Beezleb]

I am no expert but if your trying to free yourself from ptsd you need to also address that issue in addition to trying to lighten the load of it with a bandaid such as herb and the like or you will always find yourself slave to it.

Herb is a good tool to assist in your healing but it is not magically going to make you ok or "normal" as some may say.

It seems to me you are trying to be overly complicated in your thinking. Just relax and let doctors worry about the cortisol or what have you. You are not a doctor and you trying to read to the tea leaves without professional input is a foolish action that may harm you than help you as the aspect of what you do not know is likely great thus the potential to misunderstand what is really happening arises.

Vaping at different temps gives off different vapors that may or may not affect more than others. Generically just going higher temp may not equate to the outcome your looking for. [vaporpedia link removed due to malware]

Actually experiment on those temps and just do not think one temp is better than another based on any other aspect than what your tried. All anyone else can do is just give a recommendation. I would start at 356 and go up about every 10 degrees until you get to 385. After that, depending on what vaporizer your using it may be more problematic for your vaporizer to operate well at those temps. Such as bags and seals will tend to wear out faster but I am also not as well versed on the newest vaporizers in the market as I once was a handful of years ago so perhaps some are better suited for the higher temps.

If I need a heavy draw. I will go to 428 but this is rare and hard on seals. The higher the temp, the harsher it will typically be so if this is an issue, perhaps running through an ice chamber or something to chill it might help you.

Looks like your in an unfriendly area but if you are able to get some CBD herb or extracts I would suggest them. Though it seems this is easier said than done.

Remember, herb is a tool in the medical treatment, not a magic miracle plant that can cure all. It will not. I say this with genuine meaning to you. "Fear not what causes your issues for it is likely in that fear, that your issue gains power over you." Destroy that fear emotion to it and you will take a grand step forward to freedom.

Best of luck and Ja Bless!

 

[Indigo]

Don't worry, I'm not looking for a magic bullet, and I'm not sure where you're getting this fear stuff from but that's not an element in my illness. When I was so ill I nearly dieed, yep, that was scary, but that was years ago, and the rest of the time it's the same old, I know what it's like, I am fairly chirpy in how I deal with it. The nightmares aren't due to stress, as far as I can tell they're due to adrenaline spikes in my sleep or something along those lines, because I've only had them a couple of years and the PTSD (which started fifteen years ago) is mostly residual by now, with a bit of anxiety that comes and goes but not much in the way of daytime flashbacks or the other symptoms I had at first. I've tried counselling on and off, never really got anywhere with it, although I do have the name of a good therapist now for when my health improves enough to be up to going out weekly.

As for letting doctors worry about cortisol, hah. I am not going to get any medical care about that sort of thing at all. I could be in the terminal stage of ME/CFS and I wouldn't be getting anything useful. They don't treat it over here, not that they really know how to treat it in other countries, and any unusual symptoms are greeted with "oh well, you have ME" and not investigated. It took forever to get my ferritin tested and to be put on iron, which is something pretty basic, and meanwhile I was getting doctors earnestly telling me it was perfectly normal for my lips to be turning blue. I am lucky, I am on some meds for secondary conditions and those have made a difference, but there are no specialists in my area who deal with those conditions, so I could be taken off them at any time, at which point I'd be in real danger. And I'm saying that as someone who is mostly housebound and generally bedbound for about 22 hours a day, very severely disabled! So in short, it's a terrible and life-threatening condition, one of the most disabling out there, the research is still minimal and it's very poorly treated by doctors, and it's up to us to figure out what works and what doesn't.

Anyway, my friend S has been absolutely loving the Solo, and has been working out some ways to make it work better, such as putting gauze in to stop the bits climbing up the tube. They're going to show me their tips when they bring it back, and then I will decide whether or not to keep it. My activity tracker (Fitbit Charge HR) logs my sleep quality, so it's not too hard to see if something is helping my sleep. If I keep it, which I reckon I probably will (this last bad patch of sleep has made me appreciate how useful it was when I had it), it sounds like I should look into a water tool in order to try the higher temps. Is that markedly different from alternating with sips of water, so that the pipe feels cool?

And seriously, does anyone know how cannabis interacts with cortisol?

Anyway, I don't actually have to keep the Solo, I could flog it to S and get myself a different one. Considering that I use a tiny amount, is there another vape that would suit me better? Available in the UK, preferably from Amazon or somewhere else reliable.

P.S. Some friends are lending me a harp, so that is going to be very exciting! Actually, two harps! The teacher I saw briefly was very helpful with discussing how to avoid setting off pain, and I already use a stopwatch timer for activities which flare up the RSI.

I'm not quite sure how I'm getting on with the Gaia Herbs products, they are certainly strong. And more expensive than vaping, ironically.

 

[Rab]

I personally dont think you really need a watertool with the solo. It is suitable for small puffs that don't really get in your throat as much as they do from other vapes I've used, even at high setting.. It is definitely capable of getting all the goodies out though, it's a nice thorough vape, at the high temps. I never use a watertool with it

 

[CarolKing]

Doing a little experimenting with different vaporizers is excellent. Networking with others that vaporize, like here on FC. Being able to get with others and try out different units would be ideal. In some circles combusting still rules unfortunately.

@Vitolo is a great resource and full of knowledge.

It sounds like mobility is difficult for you, so you are limited. But coming here to FC was a good decision on your part.

Have you ever thought about acupuncture, also massage to help with some of the issues you are dealing with? Possibly someone could come to your home.

 

[t-dub]

I've tried counselling on and off, never really got anywhere with it,

Counseling identified my PTSD but could not help it. EMDR therapy is amazingly effective for PTSD however. I suggest you look into it.