Should Assisted Suicide be Legal ???

[mestizo]

It's not? Please explain.

If it is normal, how come we don't get used to it?
Every time a person dies a household is destroyed.
If it is normal, why do we cry when a loved one dies?
millions of people die every year and we are still not used to it, that doesn't make sense to me.

Edit: the fact that so many people avoid talking about is another reason.

 

[lwien]

Definition of "normal"
normal |ˈnôrməl|
adjective
1. conforming to a standard; usual, typical, or expected:
-----------------------------------------------------------
Death conforms to a standard because everything that lives eventually dies.
Death is usual, typical and expected for the very same reasons.

How can death not be normal if that is what we are ALL born to eventually do?

 

[Caligula]

I'd also like to point out that people can become rather indifferent to death if they are around it enough.

 

[mestizo]

Definition of "normal"
normal |ˈnôrməl|
adjective
1. conforming to a standard; usual, typical, or expected:
-----------------------------------------------------------
Death conforms to a standard because everything that lives eventually dies.
Death is usual, typical and expected for the very same reasons.

How can death not be normal if that is what we are ALL born to eventually do?

So if death fits the description of normal, where can I find answer to my questions?
Because death sure don't feel normal to me, or those feelings I described are part of human nature, but why haven't we gotten used to it? Except the people @Caligula described.
That definition of normal is too vague to me that I can thing of a few things that were normal in the past but they are not anymore, because people has chose to change laws, so something that was normal no longer is.

Edit: So if nobody died, that would be normal, by that definition.

 

[Caligula]

feeling normal and being normal aren't always the same.

 

[farscaper]

normal is a perspective...

 

[gangababa]

Assisted suicide is legal in this country.

It is called...
...suicide by cop.
And it is a virtually foolproof method for a quick exit.

 

[Caligula]

There's a different thread for that.

 

[mestizo]

normal is a perspective...

Agree, and by that definition death is normal now.
Just like the story of the king who ruled over this kingdom where everybody was drinking water from a poisoned well, and everybody was mad, except for the king, who drank his water from a different source.
Everybody thought the king was not normal because he wasn't like them, until he drank of the poisoned well, became mad, and then everybody started saying that he had become sane and normal like them.

 

[Magic9]

@mestizo I think the 1 answer to all your questions about death, is FEAR. Also the basis for all religions.

Normal is probably one of the most subjective words in existence. Death is the only thing all beings have in common. So why it may not be normal to some, it is common for all.

Are we not all terminal?

 

[mestizo]

@mestizo I think the 1 answer to all your questions about death, is FEAR. Also the basis for all religions.

Normal is probably one of the most subjective words in existence. Death is the only thing all beings have in common. So why it may not be normal to some, it is common for all.

Are we not all terminal?

Yes we are.
I just can't reconcile the fact that life is so attractive, while death is so opposite, but somehow I have to accept one with the other the same.
If we all were born to die, which I know I'm too, and this is all there is, then it is a cruel joke, specially if your last days are going to be in a hospital bed with a stranger changing your diapers. Then I can understand why people commit suicide, because they feel it is not worth living?

 

[Stu]

But once we can't...well.....

RIP Charles Bukowski

 

[Magic9]

I just can't reconcile the fact that life is so attractive, while death is so opposite, but somehow I have to accept one with the other the same.

Can't have one without the other. Circle of life and all.

If we all were born to die, which I know I'm too, and this is all there is, then it is a cruel joke, specially if your last days are going to be in a hospital bed with a stranger changing your diapers. Then I can understand why people commit suicide, because they feel it is not worth living?

As a human being, if your last days are spent in a hospital bed with a stranger changing your diaper, you should have the option to "safe, pain-free passage" if you choose.

 

[tuk]

I think the question is fantastically complicated on a moral level....& I don't mean religion.

It's part of a bigger issue which Mestizo has touched on by mentioning abortion which most rational people do accept, any worthwhile conclusion/answer has to consider the abortion aspect it's certainty not a different subject/thread ..at the end of the day it's still taking a human life, a perfectly healthy human life in most cases.

What about cases were people are just tired of living, there is big culture of this in northern Europe & a special/private clinic setup to accommodate anyone who can pay for it.

There is debate raging at the moment because it's been suggested its immoral to not abort down syndrome babies.

The reason it's illegal has nothing to do with religion, I listened to a debate recently between a bunch of doctors and religion wasn't even mentioned amongst the issues.

What are the implications for families green lighting suicides so they can inherit or hospitals taking decisions where a patient has no family or more importantly medical insurance.

What if Robin Williams or another depressed person asks for assisted suicide & the given reason is being tired of the pain, fighting depression and wants to die in peace?

 

[lwien]

Agree, and by that definition death is normal now.
Just like the story of the king who ruled over this kingdom where everybody was drinking water from a poisoned well, and everybody was mad, except for the king, who drank his water from a different source.
Everybody thought the king was not normal because he wasn't like them, until he drank of the poisoned well, became mad, and then everybody started saying that he had become sane and normal like them.

The first thing I though about after reading that is this..........

After watching this episode of Twilight Zone, I couldn't stop thinking about it for days.

 

[RUDE BOY]

There sorta is a little assisted death already going on in my experience, It's called 'Hospice care' with their infamous morphine drips.

More then one of my friends with AIDS where eased out of life with that fucking drip and IMHO would have been alive today if they had just been allowed to be in pain just a little longer because pain don't actually Kill you but a hot shot will do the job every time. I can honestly say i was sicker then most of these people and suffered greatly through the '90s. I was directed toward hospice care more then once because you know back then 20 years ago i was pretty much a dead man walkin'. But I declined that type of care, telling my Doctor I wouldn't take that route no matter what.

I'm still here and a few of my good friends could also be here but they chose "end of life hospice care" instead.

Assisted Death happens every day under medical care. Legal or not !!!!!!

 

[Havelock Vetenari]

My creator sadly has a good reason to 'muse' about this subject :

Pretty hard stuff at times,but i also believe giving people respect in how they want to end their life is paramount,my personal opinion is that it should certainly not be illegal to take your own life and the only things to debate really are the safeguards against possible misuses of PAS.

 

[tuk]

Good point there RB, we have the same infinite morphine drip thing here as well, the patient has a clicker and self medicates for pain, in most causes death is by morphine OD.

To be brutally honest I'm kinda glad these things exist and hope I get the chance if I need to die in a hospital from cancer or something.

There is also a conspiracy here of certain sympathetic doctors if the morphine thing isn't possible & I know of a few ms patients that choose this route, usually involves the patient being moved to a special residential nursing location then they die a few weeks later. These doctors although well known to other doctors( who contact them for advice ) are generally unknown by the authorities.

 

[pakalolo]

It should be legal. Over 3,000 abortions take place everyday in the US. Its legal to stop a life from coming into this world and it should be legal to stop a life to make them leave this world.

This isn't the thread for this debate. I'm just going to say, exactly when a bunch of cells becomes a "baby" is in question. If you're going to cite statistics and include all abortions (including early ones), then you need to address that fact. Again, it's a poor argument but that's the last I'll say about it.

Carry on.

There is debate raging at the moment because it's been suggested its immoral to not abort down syndrome babies.

This thread is already on shaky ground. Please stick to the topic and leave other polarizing debates out of it.

I'll remind everyone that FC is a vapourizing forum and the Lounge exists to provide an outlet for off-topic discussion. Topics on which people have strongly held opinions based on morals and personal beliefs are always risky. We are under no obligation to host threads that cause friction among our members. On the contrary, under our rules the moderators are obliged to shut down any thread that results in a flame war or personal attacks. This thread is one post away from being shut down. Please don't be the one who makes that post.

 

[lwien]

Please guys. I started "The News Thread"..............twice.... and they both got shut down, which to many of us, is a real drag being that there was some VERY interesting things going on.

I started this one as well, and like the News Threads, I'd hate to have this one shut down for the same reasons.

There's absolutely no reason to bring abortions into this discussion.

I also see absolutely no reason that this thread, or the News Thread "should" have caused any flame wars or friction amongst our members. We "should" all be mature enough to be empathetic, especially with those whom we disagree with. If you don't know how or are incapable of employing this kind of empathy, and/or you don't have the insight to know when you are pushing someones else's buttons and when to back off, I suggest that you don't contribute anything here simply because you very well may ruin a very interesting, informative and knowledge-gaining venue that many of us really enjoy and find of value.

 

[TechnicalToker]

First of all, NO ONE has the right to tell me what to do with my body or mind. Its mine. I see a lot of religious objections and moral objections but have you actually been there? Have you had someone you wish you could have put down but been unable and watch them wither and die a horrible death? Have you ever been in "that" place where you and everyone around you would be better off without you on the planet? Or just knowing that it wont make a micro seconds difference if you weren't around? We started dieing the second you started living

 

[Caligula]

I don't know about the rest of you, but I plan to live forever.

 

[mestizo]

I don't know about the rest of you, but I plan to live forever.

I don't know if you are being serious , or being sarcastic. Either way, don't you think that throughout history people have tried just that, by building statues of themselves, writing a book that will immortalize them? etc. Like Sartre, if he really thinks life is meaningless, then why the heck did he waste his time writing about it? you know what? I think because deep down inside he wished people will remember him forever.

 

[Crohnie]

I believe it's a personal decision and should definitely be legal. There were times when my health was so bad, I actually prayed for death. The thing that kept me hanging on was knowing that I would most likely get better. Fortunately, each time I was in that place, I always got better. But Crohn's Disease isn't usually fatal, so I drew strength from that knowledge and hung on.

Unless you've been in that situation, or seen a loved one go through it, it's difficult to completely understand why someone would want to choose to end their life. I highly recommend the documentary "Choosing to Die" with British author Terry Pratchett. It's easily the best documentary I've seen on the subject. I'm not sure I'd have the courage to go through with it if my health got to that point.

 

[Magic9]

I don't know about the rest of you, but I plan to live forever.

.....or die trying.