BigDaddyVapor
@BigDogJunction
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regulated vs unregulated power supplies for "log vapes"
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BUZZHEAD
JEFF
Hi guys, just a quick question. I have a VVPS hooked up to my CRZ ( read out on VVPS just flickers on and off. i also plugged it into a old style MZ with the little purple power light on it at bottom, seams to heat up but purple light doesn't light up.. I also plugged it my new UD, a PD and it seems to work fine. Power supply that comes with units are either a 12vac or 12vdc. What makes these different. Can I use a power supply that says 12vac with a vape that came with a 12vdc? Any help is greatly appreciated.
Thanks guys
BUZZHEAD.
UD, CRZ, PD, MZ
Thanks guys
BUZZHEAD.
UD, CRZ, PD, MZ
BigDaddyVapor
@BigDogJunction
No, you can not interchange them. Alternating Current vs Direct Current (omni directional).
You will most likely fry something.
You will most likely fry something.
OKcomputer
Kid A
Any consensus on the Hildbrandt Spartan vs. the TPN-023? Which would be better/last longer for 24/7 operation?
BUZZHEAD
JEFF
Thanks Bigdaddy, I didn't think so but why won't the VVPS work with the CRZ ? I thought most of these log vapes use the same resistor, Ohmite 25w and was wired the same to power connector. That part I don't understand. But I'm not a electrician either. Don't know shit from apple butter bout it. Just trying to learn a little.
BUZZHEAD
UD, CRZ , PD, MZ
BUZZHEAD
UD, CRZ , PD, MZ
placetime
Well-Known Member
I don't have the electronics background BDV has, but I'm pretty sure that for any "log vapes" that use the same 20 ohm resistor as a heater (PD, UD, CRZ/MZ, HI, TT), it's fine to use either an AC adapter or a DC adapter (you may notice a minor difference, but probably negligible). 
My opinion (which I think several others would agree with) is that the Hildbrandt Spartan is superior to the TPN-023 in pretty much every way except cost and physical size. again,
My opinion (which I think several others would agree with) is that the Hildbrandt Spartan is superior to the TPN-023 in pretty much every way except cost and physical size. again,
BigDaddyVapor
@BigDogJunction
Its a simple enough circuit, that a log... I don't see what it would harm, but I wouldn't expect consistent performance from an AC input.
OKcomputer
Kid A
My opinion (which I think several others would agree with) is that the Hildbrandt Spartan is superior to the TPN-023 in pretty much every way except cost and physical size. again,
Thanks Placetime, I went ahead and ordered the Spartan yesterday, along with a cord from UD. Looking forward to having variable voltage for my HI again after using fixed voltage for months.
BUZZHEAD
JEFF
I bought a VVPS (tattoo ps), it works on all my log vapes except the CRZ. The digital numbers flicker on and off. Oh and the old style MZ with purple light doesn't come on, I think it's heating tho,I was afraid to leave it plugged in because the read out was flickering. The CRZ come with a PS 12vdc out w/1200 ma, the MZ come with a power supply that's a 12vac output w/1000 ma. What's the difference? Anybody????
BUZZHEAD
UD,PD, CRZ, MZ
BUZZHEAD
UD,PD, CRZ, MZ
BigDaddyVapor
@BigDogJunction
The DC input is not going to power an AC circuit (MZ).
The CRZ should work. In fact, act standard 12vdc adaptor should be able to power it. While they may not provide the amperage. Most of the ones I find around the house provide at least 1.5amps. I don't know the CRZ... but while the HI comes with a 2A... it doesn't draw that much.
The CRZ should work. In fact, act standard 12vdc adaptor should be able to power it. While they may not provide the amperage. Most of the ones I find around the house provide at least 1.5amps. I don't know the CRZ... but while the HI comes with a 2A... it doesn't draw that much.
BUZZHEAD
JEFF
The CRZ come with a PS 12vdc out w/1200 ma and I said it does work, but not with the tattoo ps. ?????????
Always why?? Why is it that all these log vapes uses the Ohmite 25w resistors, all same, but yet one uses ac and the others use dc ? What determines that? The PS. ?
Yes I think their all 2.0 amps Bigdaddy. The 1.5 will work just not as hot
Always why?? Why is it that all these log vapes uses the Ohmite 25w resistors, all same, but yet one uses ac and the others use dc ? What determines that? The PS. ?
Yes I think their all 2.0 amps Bigdaddy. The 1.5 will work just not as hot
BigDaddyVapor
@BigDogJunction
Yes. I understood. I was commenting, that it should work. I don't know why.
I was saying, I'm not surprised it doesn't work with the MZ because you said it requires an AC input. I don't know anything else about that particular vape.
The CRZ, is a DC input, requiring 1200mA (or 1.2A). Most tattoo machines/VVPS supply between 15 and 18 VDC and up to 2A. So... from what I know about the CRZ, which is what you've told me. It should work. If it doesn't. I'd say its not what it says it is, or defective.
I was saying, I'm not surprised it doesn't work with the MZ because you said it requires an AC input. I don't know anything else about that particular vape.
The CRZ, is a DC input, requiring 1200mA (or 1.2A). Most tattoo machines/VVPS supply between 15 and 18 VDC and up to 2A. So... from what I know about the CRZ, which is what you've told me. It should work. If it doesn't. I'd say its not what it says it is, or defective.
placetime
Well-Known Member
CRZ, MZ, HI, and other similar log vapes (UD, WW, HP, etc) all use the same resistor inside. They can all use either a DC adapter or an AC adapter--doesn't make much difference in this simple circuit. I forget the exact numbers, but I'm pretty sure that 1.5 A (maybe even 1.2A?) is plenty enough beause the resistor draws less than that. An adapter having the ability to put out more amps than that neither helps nor hurts--it's just unused capacity.
If the same adapter works on one log vape but not another (with the *only* thing different being the log itself), then the problem is with the log. My understanding is that the most common form of failure for logs is a short developing in the cable.
If the same adapter works on one log vape but not another (with the *only* thing different being the log itself), then the problem is with the log. My understanding is that the most common form of failure for logs is a short developing in the cable.
BigDaddyVapor
@BigDogJunction
CRZ, MZ, HI, and other similar log vapes (UD, WW, HP, etc) all use the same resistor inside. They can all use either a DC adapter or an AC adapter--doesn't make much difference in this simple circuit. I forget the exact numbers, but I'm pretty sure that 1.5 A (maybe even 1.2A?) is plenty enough beause the resistor draws less than that. An adapter having the ability to put out more amps than that neither helps nor hurts--it's just unused capacity.
If the same adapter works on one log vape but not another (with the *only* thing different being the log itself), then the problem is with the log. My understanding is that the most common form of failure for logs is a short developing in the cable.
In theory, you are 100% correct. Well, mostly correct. Unfortunately, in all my years working on electronics, I've found they don't always do, what you think they will.
With AC/DC and a simple resistor circuit, I can't think of a reason why it won't work. Possibly the alternating current causes variable heat changes, but given there isn't any other circuitry, other than a heating element... I don't know why that would make a @#$% bit of difference. I really don't know... because like you said. It should work.
I would have to pull out like 30 volumes of Electronics and Electricity modules... and I'm too damn lazy for that. 20+ years of data dump, replaced by cobwebs.
EDIT: Your troubleshooting technique is correct, in narrowing it down to the unit. That is my belief also.
placetime
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the input BDV. I don't really know the hows or whys of the AC and DC adapters both working, but a while back there was some discussion about it on FC. IIRC, it was in the MZ/CRZ thread, and maybe in the PD thread too. I think (again iirc, lol) Zapman Rick (made CRZs and MZs) at first included DC adapters with his logs then at some point he switched to AC adapters because they worked a smidge better for some reason. A few people did comparisons and reported on it. I don't recall all the specifics, but both types of adapters work just fine for that particular type of log vape. A search of the MZ/CRZ thread should give more info.
NOTE: anyone trying this at home--please be aware that this is *only* for log vapes that use this specific type of heat source (resistor). using the incorrect adapter for most electronics is a *major* NO-NO.
NOTE: anyone trying this at home--please be aware that this is *only* for log vapes that use this specific type of heat source (resistor). using the incorrect adapter for most electronics is a *major* NO-NO.
BigDaddyVapor
@BigDogJunction
Don't know. Been too long.
Because of the simplicity of the circuit, both should work. Because of the simplicity of the circuit, I would expect decreased performance with alternating current, through something that is supposed to have a consistent input/output.
One thing I did learn, working on the crap all those years... is it doesn't always do, what you think it will. The theory probably backs up use of AC, I just can't remember how/why.
Because of the simplicity of the circuit, both should work. Because of the simplicity of the circuit, I would expect decreased performance with alternating current, through something that is supposed to have a consistent input/output.
One thing I did learn, working on the crap all those years... is it doesn't always do, what you think it will. The theory probably backs up use of AC, I just can't remember how/why.
