PBW & the Chemistry of Clean

[Alexis]

From my combusting days (i.e. last year xD ). My bong had real bad hard water / limescale marks. I tried everything, so I decided to ask my mum (I'm almost 30 btw), and she recommend white vinegar too. Said to leave it over night as it takes awhile. Mine was pretty bad, but you could see the hard water / limescale fizz and dissipate(?).

Highly recommend white vinegar for hard water / limescale. PBW marks, I'm not so sure about

Could look at some brew forums (where PBW is highly used and talked about). Example: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/stains-in-glass-carboy-even-after-pbw.493756/

Well Im 38 and Im still enlisting mum's help! But she is truly professional when it comes to cleaning.
The Herbo Sphere will be sparkling. Today I cleaned the bowl for thd first time ever. Overnight ISO and salt soak. The bowl and the glass stand for the injector- both have those ocha/reddish heat stains on the glass where the injector makes contact.

ISO got everything off except the heat stains. Curently soaking in bicarb, looks to be working anyway. It looks like the whole setup will be sparkly new, and for the record, PBW played zero part in this in the end. But no harm done anyway.

ISO, bicarbonate of soda, vinegar FTW!

 

[ataxian]

Well Im 38 and Im still enlisting mum's help! But she is truly professional when it comes to cleaning.
The Herbo Sphere will be sparkling. Today I cleaned the bowl for thd first time ever. Overnight ISO and salt soak. The bowl and the glass stand for the injector- both have those ochor/reddish heat stains on the glass where the injector makes contact.

ISO got everything off except the heat stains. Curently soaking in bicarb, looks to be working anyway. It looks like the whole setup will be sparkly new, and for the record, PBW pkayed zero part in this in the end. But no harm done a anyway.

ISO, bicarbonate of soda, vinegar FTW!

BASIC CHEMISTRY REALLY!

 

[Baron23]

"Whenever you feel like criticizing anyone,"
"Just remember that all the people in this world haven't had the advantages that you've had".

Ok, a short jaunt off topic...I always liked this one by John Wannamaker:

“I learned thirty years ago that it is foolish to scold. I have enough trouble overcoming my own limitations without fretting over the fact that God has not seen fit to distribute evenly the gift of intelligence.”

 

[ataxian]

Ok, a short jaunt off topic...I always liked this one by John Wannamaker:

“I learned thirty years ago that it is foolish to scold. I have enough trouble overcoming my own limitations without fretting over the fact that God has not seen fit to distribute evenly the gift of intelligence.”

@Baron23 Nice quote?

How old is the PALE BLUE DOT?

SAGAN say's 4.3 billion years?

 

[narrowsparrow]

May have already been asked, but here it is again: Is PBW OK for frosted glass like that found on the 14 mm adapter that comes with the Arizer Air?

 

[pxl_jockey]

May have already been asked, but here it is again: Is PBW OK for frosted glass like that found on the 14 mm adapter that comes with the Arizer Air?

Yes

 

[OF]

May have already been asked, but here it is again: Is PBW OK for frosted glass like that found on the 14 mm adapter that comes with the Arizer Air?

Yes

Indeed it is, but use it as directed! It's a detergent, wash stuff in it, don't decide to soak it for a long time. Guys have etched 'cheap' (even top class) glass that way. And watch getting it on metal that has a finish, it's been known to eat the finish?

Otherwise give it a go. You can get it at Amazon (a pound lasts years), also local 'Home Brewing Shops' where you get stuff to make wine and beer. They sell small packets since it was developed to clean brewery equipment in the first place?

OF

 

[Baron23]

Guys have etched 'cheap' (even top class) glass that way.

Yes, I do remember some folks stating that they had "white" rings in their glass but I haven't heard any such reports in quite a while. I believe, but can't attest to it, that these folks may have let it sit and soak for a long time.

For me, soak is 5 minutes and absolutely not more than 10 minutes. Also, I think its very important to fully dissolve it in hot (lightly boiling) water before putting into your piece. I microwave some water in a pyrex measuring cup, add PBW, stir thoroughly, then pour into my glass and let it sit for 5 minutes.

Comes out beautiful and I have never had a hint of etching or any other negative impact on my glass.

And yes, a pound lasts me about a year also! haha

 

[cybrguy]

I guess this isn't a recommended method but it works for me. I put a small amount, maybe 1/4 teaspoon in a water piece then fill it with hot water and cork the mp opening and the joint with a rubber stopper. Then I shake it to make sure as much of the PBW as possible is dissolved in the water and let it sit for a few hours. Then I drain the water and rinse it several time to be sure all the PBW is cleared out. Works great for me.

You could dissolve the PBW in a hot water tub before poring it into the piece to avoid particles in the piece but I usually don't bother and don't have a problem.

 

[Baron23]

I guess this isn't a recommended method but it works for me. I put a small amount, maybe 1/4 teaspoon in a water piece then fill it with hot water and cork the mp opening and the joint with a rubber stopper. Then I shake it to make sure as much of the PBW as possible is dissolved in the water and let it sit for a few hours. Then I drain the water and rinse it several time to be sure all the PBW is cleared out. Works great for me.

You could dissolve the PBW in a hot water tub before poring it into the piece to avoid particles in the piece but I usually don't bother and don't have a problem.

Yeah....people have done all sorts of stuff with PBW and never have had a problem.

I really don't know the cause of the few folks who got "rings" and the like.

 

[cybrguy]

And just as another data point, I only need to PBW my pieces very occasionally, as I use Cranberry Extract (=Rezblock) in my water daily and usually only need a hot rinse to do cleanup.

 

[OF]

Yes, I do remember some folks stating that they had "white" rings in their glass but I haven't heard any such reports in quite a while. I believe, but can't attest to it, that these folks may have let it sit and soak for a long time.

That's my 'take' as well. Several of those who reported the damage 'at the time' said as much. The discussion at that time was this was not following the directions, and a bad idea. PBW is highly alkaline (which is part of why it works so good), some types of glass are more vulnerable than others I guess. Best plan is to avoid long soaks anyway, by reports they do little good. Unlike soaks in solvents, which is probably where the idea comes from.

Detergents don't dissolve the junk, they work by 'getting under it' so it can be rinsed away like food on your dishes or dirt on your clothes when you wash them. Like there, heat is important to strong action.

I guess this isn't a recommended method but it works for me. I put a small amount, maybe 1/4 teaspoon in a water piece then fill it with hot water and cork the mp opening and the joint with a rubber stopper. Then I shake it to make sure as much of the PBW as possible is dissolved in the water and let it sit for a few hours. Then I drain the water and rinse it several time to be sure all the PBW is cleared out. Works great for me.

Hey, if it works, it works? That's how it's used in breweries as I understand it. Solid, or partially dissolved PBW is introduced then 'flushed through' with hot water. After a (short) soak, it's flushed out (you can't scrub out brew kettles and plumbing there either.

I do this often personally. If I have say a stem in a 'travel tube' I then put it in a bowl of hot tap water for the five minute soak to keep it hot. Right in the sink.

The key is, I think, to not let is sit for long times if you're going to be upset with etched rings and stuff after?

BTW dishwasher detergent has many of the same features. Putting stems in the silverware rack with the dishes works great in many cases. I even rig a small funnel to some with a bit of tubing to catch more wash water and flush it through.

The stuff is really much superior to the solvent alternative. Safer (no explosion/fire issues), more effective, better for the environment (be honest most let ISO evaporate or pour it down the drain....) and it's cheaper by a long shot. It's even fun to watch the 'oxyclean' part attack years old junk in neglected bongs...... Add 'entertaining' to the list.

But as you say, be sure you rinse it all out......not good to drink I'm sure.

OF

 

[narrowsparrow]

This is all good info. Just to be on the safe side, I guess I won’t leave my Arizer stems soaking for days at a time! Thanks for all the commentary.

 

[OF]

This is all good info. Just to be on the safe side, I guess I won’t leave my Arizer stems soaking for days at a time! Thanks for all the commentary.

Good call, they won't get any cleaner but might not be as pretty to look at afterwards?

You're welcome, of course, good luck.

Important point, you have to use the stems to get them fouled so you can clean them.......... Kind of a duty.

Regards to all, hope you get a chance to grab a favorite vape and enjoy the afternoon. Watch closely, I'm about to show you all how it's done........

OF

 

[narrowsparrow]

I will definitely do my part to foul some stems!

 

[OF]

I will definitely do my part to foul some stems!

"Good on ya" as the Aussies say. If you've got the time, maybe you should foul a couple of extras? I'm thinking not everyone here is going to hold up their end of this......... Stout Lad.

Think of it as 'boosting the average'? Your contribution to the Society..... Good citizenship! I feel inspired. Best practice what I preach. Now, to pick to tool to take into the garden this time. Decisions,decisions.

Regards to all.

OF

 

[narrowsparrow]

OF, you’re my kind of human! Just don’t try to take a hit off of the rake or clippers. Won’t work.

 

[Atomic11]

Just ordered some PBW as ISO is expensive and hard to come by these days. I want to clean some old combustion pieces that I have wanted to use for vaping but haven’t been able to clean.
Ive read a bunch of the comments here, and was just wondering a few things.

1. how much do you need to mix with the hot water?
2. If you’re cleaning a large piece, do you only put one cup of hot water + PBW in and then fill it up with regular hot water for the rest of the volume or is it all supposed to be PBW mixture. Couldn’t really figure that out.
3. Whats the best way to clean the PBW out afterwards?

 

[ataxian]

Just ordered some PBW as ISO is expensive and hard to come by these days. I want to clean some old combustion pieces that I have wanted to use for vaping but haven’t been able to clean.
Ive read a bunch of the comments here, and was just wondering a few things.

1. how much do you need to mix with the hot water?
2. If you’re cleaning a large piece, do you only put one cup of hot water + PBW in and then fill it up with regular hot water for the rest of the volume or is it all supposed to be PBW mixture. Couldn’t really figure that out.
3. Whats the best way to clean the PBW out afterwards?

I use ph as my guide.
Cannabis consumption is the goal.
Water path is smoothness.
Clean glass taste decent.
PBW is a product I used.

What I found was 1 tablespoon to a cup of tepid H2O (8oz.’s)
Heaping and water warm (85f however find what work’s for you?)

 

[OF]

Ive read a bunch of the comments here, and was just wondering a few things.

1. how much do you need to mix with the hot water?
2. If you’re cleaning a large piece, do you only put one cup of hot water + PBW in and then fill it up with regular hot water for the rest of the volume or is it all supposed to be PBW mixture. Couldn’t really figure that out.
3. Whats the best way to clean the PBW out afterwards?

No simple answers, it depends on what the WT is like and how it's contaminated. Lots of good information and suggestions for things like rinsing hardware, not etching the glass, keeping it hot and so on in the early posts. Experience based stuff. Unlike the general suggestion of going back a few pages and reading forward, I suggest you go back to when @t-dub introduced the idea.

You can save a lot of poking around with techniques that way I think.

Regards to all.

OF

 

[Atomic11]

No simple answers, it depends on what the WT is like and how it's contaminated. Lots of good information and suggestions for things like rinsing hardware, not etching the glass, keeping it hot and so on in the early posts. Experience based stuff. Unlike the general suggestion of going back a few pages and reading forward, I suggest you go back to when @t-dub introduced the idea.

You can save a lot of poking around with techniques that way I think.

Regards to all.

OF

but do you mix a cup or two of PBW mixture with more regular hot water to fill the volume of the bong or do you fill the entire thing with PBW mixture?

 

[MoltenTiger]

Just ordered some PBW as ISO is expensive and hard to come by these days. I want to clean some old combustion pieces that I have wanted to use for vaping but haven’t been able to clean.
Ive read a bunch of the comments here, and was just wondering a few things.

1. how much do you need to mix with the hot water?
2. If you’re cleaning a large piece, do you only put one cup of hot water + PBW in and then fill it up with regular hot water for the rest of the volume or is it all supposed to be PBW mixture. Couldn’t really figure that out.
3. Whats the best way to clean the PBW out afterwards?

If I was cleaning a combustion this is my usual method in regards to those questions.

1. I usually only use a maximum of about 1tsp per bong per rinse. Typically I'd use 1/4 - 1/2 tsp of powder to ~500mL boiled water.
2. I always boil the kettle to mix with PBW as the extra heat from boiling water gets things done nice and quickly. I recommend bunging up the piece so you can fill the entire thing, and preparing a full kettle of water to boil, so 1-2L, and doing your best to fill the piece entirely. At first you may just want to cover the most soiled section of the glass, so covering the percs and the immediate area above the water line. You could fill it up with extra water, but cooling the solution will slow its rate of reaction. So I find it is best to do that with subsequent soaks (which are sometimes necessary anyway with combustion pieces, it can take quite a few goes at it to get it perfect).
3. Just flush the piece under a tap when done, first with hot water for a while. And then 3 times fill the piece, shake it around a bunch and drain it entirely. Repeat with cold water, and afterwards it will be extremely cool & clean, ready to go.

It's perfect for deep cleaning combustion pieces

 

[Atomic11]

If I was cleaning a combustion this is my usual method in regards to those questions.

1. I usually only use a maximum of about 1tsp per bong
2. I always boil the kettle to mix with PBW as the extra heat from boiling water gets things done nice and quickly. I recommend bunging up the piece so you can fill the entire thing, and preparing a full kettle of water to boil, so 1-2L, and doing your best to fill the piece entirely. At first you may just want to cover the most soiled section of the glass, so covering the percs and the immediate area above the water line. You could fill it up with extra water, but cooling the solution will slow its rate of reaction. So I find it is best to do that with subsequent soaks (which are sometimes necessary anyway with combustion pieces, it can take quite a few goes at it to get it perfect).
3. Just flush the piece under a tap when done, first with hot water for a while. And then 3 times fill the piece, shake it around a bunch and drain it entirely. Repeat with cold water, and afterwards it will be extremely cool & clean, ready to go.

It's perfect for deep cleaning combustion pieces

Thanks so much!! I understand now and Im excited to restore my pieces!

Ill post before and afters

 

[MoltenTiger]

Thanks so much!! I understand now and Im excited to restore my pieces!

Ill post before and afters

what kind of glass are you cleaning?

Is it irreplaceable?

Important notes: stuff is insanely slippery, be very careful when handling the glass

It can cause some nuisance stains that are hard to remove (but seem to be able to be), these are kind of a salt deposit that forms and binds to the glass very well.
Some people recommend to mix the solution externally and then pour it in rather than mix in piece, I'd only recommend that for glass that has perfect refraction throughout, otherwise it's not going to be a noticeable thing, and I don't think it's permanent staining anyway, but it could be very hard to remove for sure


Some other tips I forgot, a brush might be useful to scrape areas that are more stubborn to become clean. I usually just break off a bit of tree and use it like a single-use bottle brush.

10 mins of soaking is enough, a bit longer won't do a whole heap more when compared to a fresh hot wash

 

[OF]

but do you mix a cup or two of PBW mixture with more regular hot water to fill the volume of the bong or do you fill the entire thing with PBW mixture?

As I said, there are lots of techniques and considerations. Personally I don't premix since the 'oxygen reaction) starts then, not good to let it get lost waiting? I put it in dry and fill with hot water, to the top, using stoppers if necessary. And, if possible, immerse the lot in a pan of hot water to keep it cooking.

But, still, I suggest research. The question has been 'asked and answered' a lot. No real need to rehash parts of it again (and miss other worthy suggestions?).

Your call, but we do agree to check to see if it's been already answered before posting a question?

OF