Is vaping as good as we think/hope?

[darbarikanada]

hear hear! and all the more absurd that cannabis is classified in the same group (schedule A) with heroin, cocaine, etc. (leaving it to other countries like Israel to do the research, since it's such a hassle for American researchers to jump through all the legal hoops).

 

[CarolKing]

@Scott A @MinnBobber has done extensive research regarding the medical benefits of cannabis. I've read through some of his research he's posted here on FC. I think you were a bit harsh about something that you're unsure of Scott. It's OK to disagree.

I for one appreciate @MinnBobber's contribution here.

I use cannabis for pain. I have arthritis throughout my body, cannabis is something that gives me less pain. It relaxes the muscles that start to cramp up. It doesn't take all the pain away but it makes it tolerable and keeps me moving.

Some people haven't dealt with life ending disabilities much worse than what I'm dealing with. Diseases that are lessened by the use of cannabis. We have folks with MS, AIDS, cancers plus other diseases here on FC. Folks are able to keep going because of this precious plant. We aren't talking just recreational users.

 

[Tommy10]

I'm on team harmless that's for sure, probably not correct if we are playing semantics but I'm not. All these potential negatives you hear myths about, even if true would not in anyway out balance just how amazing MJ is in my eyes.

 

[lwien]

I agree with @MinnBobber. MJ has done wonders for many and when one considers the risk/reward ratio of MJ, it very well could be viewed as a wonder drug, but it also must be said that it does have the potential to be abused and when it is, it can.....have negative consequences.

 

[Taz]

My main complaint as schedule 1 as well.

How many deaths a year?

Why trust anything after the BS fed so far and still trying.

 

[kellya86]

@MinnBobber brilliant post, maybe people that dont use for medical reasons just don't see its real benefits.

 

[The Beagle]

Cannot speak for @Scott A but still when you write things like

A herb that can do all of this has only one possible designation--- a miracle herb that helps your own body help itself/heal itself.

you really sound like a snake oil salesman even if your statements about the beneficial medical effect of cannabis are true, and I don't doubt they are.

 

[CarolKing]

What we hear from @MinnBobber is enthusiasm for a medical plant that has been bad mouthed for 70+ years. If you haven't suffered from a dibilitating disease or known someone that has this info falls on a deaf ear. Bring on all the good info you find @MinnBobber we're listening.

Rick Simpson says cannabis helped to cure his cancer. The name sake behind Rick Simpson Oil.

 

[TboneToker]

.............................................................................
WTF man, please get your head out of the sand.
- Have you seen/met families with epileptic kids go from 80 seizures a day to a couple a week? I have
- Have you seen seen/met folks with Crohn's Disease get med cannabis and suddenly have a normal life? I have
- Have you seen pain patients be able to reduce their oxy-drugs by 80% or 100%? I have
- Have you read about the bodies biggest system of receptors and control system, the endocannabinoid system and how cannabis supplements it?
- Do you realize cannabis has been used for thousands of years to treat diseases, before the diseases even had a name? LOL
- Have you read the med cannabis studies from Israel on cannabis for their PTSD vets and their "Spectacular" results? While the US vets with PTSD commit suicide -- 22 PER DAY.
- Have you read about the 16,000 prescription pain killer deaths in US every year? AND... in states with med cannabis, those deaths DROP BY 24.8 %?
- Do you realize no one has ever died from a cannabis overdose? See previous line
- Have you seen/met an amputee who was in constant crippling pain in the missing leg, until cannabis?
- Have you seen/met migraine patients who say cannabis is the only relief after trying dozens/ all the possible traditional med treatments?

I could go on and on so snake oil it's not.
A herb that can do all of this has only one possible designation--- a miracle herb that helps your own body help itself/heal itself.

P.S. "stuff like this" is why everyone should have a right to cannabis

Minnbob is right, even though it sounds crazy, cannabis really is a miracle plant for tons of different dis-eases, not just smoking/vaping but topical, and other mixtures too

 

[MinnBobber]

you really sound like a snake oil salesman even if your statements about the beneficial medical effect of cannabis are true, and I don't doubt they are.

...........................................................
The truth shall set you free and it needs to be told, even if it sounds too good to be true!

And that list was just the tip of the iceberg.
- Glaucoma help-proven
- Newest study on Crohn's for group that had tried ALL other treatments: within 4? months, 48% had been totally cured.
- MS
- and for us old farts on here, it has been shown that as one ages, your own body's ability to produce its own version of cannabinoids is reduced--resulting in a deficiency, helped by.......cannabis!

Think about it: if a new drug helped only one disease, like kids with epilepsy AND it was produced by big pharma and cost $3,000 per month it would be touted as the "miracle drug for epilepsy". Cannabis has an ever-growing laundry list of diseases and conditions that it helps, stifled by laws and stigma. It truly is mind-blowing how one herb can do all of this.

I am very passionate about it because cannabis should be a basic human health right for everyone.

 

[Winegums]

I will gladly take any harm vapourizing is doing to my body over having appetite problems, debilitating anxiety, high stress and depression. I can't see myself ever being better off without it. I wouldn't be a functioning person if it weren't for the relief I get from cannabis.

While some of my usage is surely recreational, I use it for medical reasons mainly.

I hope further research is done on the effects/possible harms of vapourizing. Though I doubt it will change my usage of cannabis if anything is found. Cannabis allows me a quality of life that I would never have otherwise.

 

[nicelytoasted]

As a biochemist who has extensively studied cannabis (and it's effects in the human body) over the last 10 years or so, I wholeheartedly agree with @MinnBobber 's assessment. Although the act of vapourizing itself may not be perfect, the benefits far outweigh any detriments, in the big picture, imo.

The way that it works on the cause, and not the symptoms, through regulation and balance, allows it to treat such a full spectrum of maladies & diseases! I've had a sneaking suspicion for years now that one of the underlying causes of many of the body's problems occur as a result of system imbalances, arising from a lack of endocannabinoids. The treatment begins with supplementation through intake of cannabis and ingestion of hemp and flax meal, which are the pre-cursors in our body's production of said endocannabinoids.

If cannabis hadn't had that ridiculous stigma attached to it by so many close minded people, it would have been hailed as the wonder drug of the 21st century!!

 

[Hashtag46&2]

As a biochemist who has extensively studied cannabis (and it's effects in the human body) over the last 10 years or so, I wholeheartedly agree with @MinnBobber 's assessment. Although the act of vapourizing itself may not be perfect, the benefits far outweigh any detriments, in the big picture, imo.

The way that it works on the cause, and not the symptoms, through regulation and balance, allows it to treat such a full spectrum of maladies & diseases! I've had a sneaking suspicion for years now that one of the underlying causes of many of the body's problems occur as a result of system imbalances, arising from a lack of endocannabinoids. The treatment begins with supplementation through intake of cannabis and ingestion of hemp and flax meal, which are the pre-cursors in our body's production of said endocannabinoids.

If cannabis hadn't had that ridiculous stigma attached to it by so many close minded people, it would have been hailed as the wonder drug of the 21st century!!

Can you come with me to act as an advocate to my next Doctors Appointment?

Ha.

I take a teaspoon of un-activated Canna-infused Coconut Oil every morning, or inactive Hash Caps orally every morning(Does not get me high at all) I generally shoot for 100mg(estimated)

Along with Flaxseed Oil.

I take Humira, which one of the largest side effects is Lymphoma, and/or other Cancers.
My lymph count was climbing and climbing when I was first put on Humira...

Knowing the properties of the Fatty nature of Cannabinoids, I started the oral administration orf inactive Cannabinoids (Still locked up in their Acidic Form in the Carboxyl Group)

Lymph count went back to normal numbers in 6 months.

@MinnBobber ... You are invited as well sir!

I know for damn sure, Cannabis reduces the risk of Addiction significantly, more importantly reducing the chance of overdose, and simply over-indulging.

Sadly, I witnessed the death of a close family member that had Endometriosis, and she never considered Cannabis to supplement some of her Opioids..

When I noticed that she consistently used up her prescription in a matter of days.
I immediately reached out to her, essentially forcing her to take the Coconut oil.

She got better nearly immediately, it was crazy.
But, I had my own issues regarding pain... I figured the giant jar of oil I gave her, and the first initial 2 weeks of coaching, teaching, etc...

I even gave her an ounce of Shatter, that I activated and made into hash caps at an estimated 20mg of Active Cannabinoids.

But, I lost touch with her for about a month...
Next thing I knew... My little Brother calls me.. (She was his future Wife)

"Hashtag, she is in ICU, her kidneys are failing, she is unresponsive "

The wife and I rush to the Hospital..
My brother said she hasn't even been responding at all... She has a breathing tube, machinery keeping her alive.

I walked over to the bed, grabbed her hand..
Said.. "Mary" "It's me, Hashtag, I'm here, can you hear me ?"

No response..
I'm still holding her hand, repeat my words again..

It was insane...
She turns her head, opened her eyes, and smiled... Then... Nothing again.
I will never forget that moment.

She passed away a few days later.

I can't help but think.. If I just would have kept in contact, maybe, just maybe..

Mehhh, I had a couple other examples, but the emotions are taking over right now..

 

[CarolKing]

Study: Recent Cannabis Use Linked to Better Outcomes for Brain Injury Patients
Guest Articles, Studies

February 22, 2016

by Anthony Martinelli


By NORML

The recent use of cannabis is associated with improved outcomes in patients hospitalized with intracerebral hemorrhaging (ICH aka bleeding in the brain), according to data published online ahead of print in the journal Cerebrovascular Diseases.

An international team of investigators from Argentina, Italy, the Netherlands, and the United States evaluated demographic trends and patient outcomes in a cohort of 725 subjects with spontaneous ICH. Researchers reported that cannabis-positive subjects possessed “milder ICH presentation” upon hospitalization and presented “less disability” at discharge as compared to similarly matched patients who tested negative for cannabinoids.

Read the rest of this entry »

Tags: brain injury, Cerebrovascular Diseases, intracerebral hemorrhaging, norml

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[woolspinner]

Cannot speak for @Scott A but still when you write things like



you really sound like a snake oil salesman even if your statements about the beneficial medical effect of cannabis are true, and I don't doubt they are.

I KNOW this helps medically. I have friends who are cancer survivors, fibro sufferers, anxiety sufferers...

However, what I expect some react to is the florid, new-agey language and tone that was used. What is said may be true, but if all cannabis users talked like that, we'd have a hard time being taken seriously by the majority.

Now, some say, "fuck 'em" and that is fine and well for outliers and radicals...but for those of us who try to work within the system and who want to be believed and not written off as kooks, we are probably going to be more in favor of plainer speech.

I live in Portland, I used to live in Boulder, I have lived in Eugene, so my tolerance for kooky hippy speech and ideas is higher than people of the bible belt, maybe, but it still grates my nerves.

That being said, I hope no one disagrees with the MESSAGE Minnbobber was expressing, just his way of expressing it, which is probably just how s/he feels and speaks being so inspired by cannabis and its ability to help and/or heal.

I am sorry for a slight derail, I just felt the need to chime in because i, too, was put off by the post. Sorry, Minnbobber, I hope you can understand my point, just as I have tried, I hope, to understand your point of view as well?

ETA: A friend's OBGYN wondered if my friend had not run out of money to renew her med card in Colorado (b4 rec), if she might not have been able to carry her baby for a while longer. The meds calmed her hyper stress response, which may have helped her carry closer to term. Baby was fine, but several months in hospital.

ETA: @CarolKing interesting. One reason I now use as cannabis as regularly as I do is because I read it may heal parts of my brain that may be damaged by long term antidepressant use.

 

[MinnBobber]

Study: Recent Cannabis Use Linked to Better Outcomes for Brain Injury Patients

..................................................................
Yes, it is proving to be beneficial for many brain issues, from traumatic brain injuries, to epilepsy (mis-firing brain cells), to MS, to Alzheimer's, to mental health issues like PTSD etc.

That's what really makes it such a miracle herb--it treats the disease (dozens) thru our own endocannbinoid system, rather than treating the symptoms of said disease. It helps our own body's system help/heal itself. Revolutionary.

Cannabis is really a supplement as many people have a deficiency in their endocannabinoid system.
And talking about it needs to come out of the closet---

Studies are even starting to show that cannabis can give cancer cells the missing signal that they are missing---the signal that all other cells in our body have, to die/not live forever. The cancer cells kill themselves naturally.

snake oil is a hoax
cannabis is the real deal and needs to be broadcast until justice is done--full legalization

 

[Tommy10]

Hearing you bubbler, the powers that be have been trying to convince the world that MJ is bad for you for years now. People are slowly starting to see that it might not actually be bad for you, don't see why the greater population can't accept it. The more good reports the better, my father was born when indigenous Australians still could not vote, a lot can happen in a relatively short amount of time.

 

[Scott A]

.............................................................................
WTF man, please get your head out of the sand.
- Have you seen/met families with epileptic kids go from 80 seizures a day to a couple a week? I have
- Have you seen seen/met folks with Crohn's Disease get med cannabis and suddenly have a normal life? I have
- Have you seen pain patients be able to reduce their oxy-drugs by 80% or 100%? I have
- Have you read about the bodies biggest system of receptors and control system, the endocannabinoid system and how cannabis supplements it?
- Do you realize cannabis has been used for thousands of years to treat diseases, before the diseases even had a name? LOL
- Have you read the med cannabis studies from Israel on cannabis for their PTSD vets and their "Spectacular" results? While the US vets with PTSD commit suicide -- 22 PER DAY.
- Have you read about the 16,000 prescription pain killer deaths in US every year? AND... in states with med cannabis, those deaths DROP BY 24.8 %?
- Do you realize no one has ever died from a cannabis overdose? See previous line
- Have you seen/met an amputee who was in constant crippling pain in the missing leg, until cannabis?
- Have you seen/met migraine patients who say cannabis is the only relief after trying dozens/ all the possible traditional med treatments?

I could go on and on so snake oil it's not.
A herb that can do all of this has only one possible designation--- a miracle herb that helps your own body help itself/heal itself.

P.S. "stuff like this" is why everyone should have a right to cannabis

Yeah bro snake oil salesmen of the past always could point to a bunch of anecdotal evidence too...

 

[woolspinner]

Yeah bro snake oil salesmen of the past always could point to a bunch of anecdotal evidence too...

Ah, I see, you, then disagree that medical cannabis is effective?

I suppose snake oil salesmen could point out anecdotes of healing, but there have been studies that show cannabis helps in any number of ways. Many of those studies began as studies to show the harm cannabis could do - only they discovered instead that it healed instead of hurt.

I guess you are entitled to disbelieve in the medicinal powers of cannabis...just like some scientists still disavow climate change in spite of the evidence. I have certainly seen cannabis have a positive effect on people I know and love, and that is not anecdotal, it is real.

 

[TboneToker]

Ah, I see, you, then disagree that medical cannabis is effective?

I suppose snake oil salesmen could point out anecdotes of healing, but there have been studies that show cannabis helps in any number of ways. Many of those studies began as studies to show the harm cannabis could do - only they discovered instead that it healed instead of hurt.

I guess you are entitled to disbelieve in the medicinal powers of cannabis...just like some scientists still disavow climate change in spite of the evidence. I have certainly seen cannabis have a positive effect on people I know and love, and that is not anecdotal, it is real.

I have seen cannabis help communities, not to mention the co2 levels.

Cannabis is coming out of the closet quick, my friend admitted she still smokes cannabis to her treatment centre and she said but everyone smokes these days, and they said it's true almost everyone is smoking and more people are coming out about it

 

[MinnBobber]

Scott,
I'm sorry if over 5000 years of anecdotal evidence and thousands of medical cannabis studies from around the world don't give you a clue, a hint, or an inkling of what cannabis is really about.

If possible, it's also a real learning experience to attend any State Health Dept meetings on cannabis if such are ever held around you.

I guess it's only anecdotal and should be discarded when a mother testifies that their 5 year old daughter had hundreds of seizures every week and now with med cannabis has none, after spending the first five years trying every possible epilepsy treatment and drug out there with no help AND some even made it worse. But it's just f'in anecdotal BS snake oil crap--I bet mom just wanted the stuff to get high.
I bet she was really a plant, an employee of the dispensary--bastards

So this guy probably was BS'in too. He stood up in front of a crowd of strangers and said that he absolutely would be dead today without cannabis. He was heavy into his prescribed oxy-drug treatment and going up, up, up with his dose and tried cannabis as a truly last resort. Was able to reduce oxy down down down and was almost off them entirely. He said that he owed his life to cannabis--pretty powerful testimony sitting 5 feet away.

I could go on for 10 pages but I have a feeling that would not make a dent. A general theme was others begging for their serious disease to be added to our meager list of conditions. Begging that you make them a criminal now cuz they use cannabis---it's the only thing that works for their condition and it has given them a liveable quality of life, where they had been thinking of ending it. So please allow their med condition

So, just curious man--what do you think cannabis is or isn't? What is your cannabis truth?

P.S. that is why I am passionate about it cuz people out here are literally dying without it and medical cannabis can save lives and quality of life for millions.

 

[Scott A]

Ah, I see, you, then disagree that medical cannabis is effective?

I suppose snake oil salesmen could point out anecdotes of healing, but there have been studies that show cannabis helps in any number of ways. Many of those studies began as studies to show the harm cannabis could do - only they discovered instead that it healed instead of hurt.

I guess you are entitled to disbelieve in the medicinal powers of cannabis...just like some scientists still disavow climate change in spite of the evidence. I have certainly seen cannabis have a positive effect on people I know and love, and that is not anecdotal, it is real.

Please link me to these many studies. Most of them that I have read are all based on anecdotal evidence which I take with a grain of salt. And no your last statement exactly describes anecdotal evidence.

edit- Equating this to climate change is a horrible comparison. There is actual full scientific evidence and data backing up climate change not just a bunch of people saying its true with no real facts to back it up.

 

[Scott A]

Scott,
I'm sorry if over 5000 years of anecdotal evidence and thousands of medical cannabis studies from around the world don't give you a clue, a hint, or an inkling of what cannabis is really about.

If possible, it's also a real learning experience to attend any State Health Dept meetings on cannabis if such are ever held around you.

I guess it's only anecdotal and should be discarded when a mother testifies that their 5 year old daughter had hundreds of seizures every week and now with med cannabis has none, after spending the first five years trying every possible epilepsy treatment and drug out there with no help AND some even made it worse. But it's just f'in anecdotal BS snake oil crap--I bet mom just wanted the stuff to get high.
I bet she was really a plant, an employee of the dispensary--bastards

So this guy probably was BS'in too. He stood up in front of a crowd of strangers and said that he absolutely would be dead today without cannabis. He was heavy into his prescribed oxy-drug treatment and going up, up, up with his dose and tried cannabis as a truly last resort. Was able to reduce oxy down down down and was almost off them entirely. He said that he owed his life to cannabis--pretty powerful testimony sitting 5 feet away.

I could go on for 10 pages but I have a feeling that would not make a dent. A general theme was others begging for their serious disease to be added to our meager list of conditions. Begging that you make them a criminal now cuz they use cannabis---it's the only thing that works for their condition and it has given them a liveable quality of life, where they had been thinking of ending it. So please allow their med condition

So, just curious man--what do you think cannabis is or isn't? What is your cannabis truth?

P.S. that is why I am passionate about it cuz people out here are literally dying without it and medical cannabis can save lives and quality of life for millions.

Yes its only anecdotal evidence... just because the shit agrees with what you want it to agree with doesn't mean it isnt just shit.

My cannabis "truth" ( my god you sound so pretentious its horrible ) is that it gets me high just like it gets you high just like it gets everyone high because we all like to get high. I just dont need to sit on my high horse and preach about non existent medical benefits of something that gets us high to make my self feel better.

 

[woolspinner]

Please link me to these many studies. Most of them that I have read are all based on anecdotal evidence which I take with a grain of salt. And no your last statement exactly describes anecdotal evidence.

edit- Equating this to climate change is a horrible comparison. There is actual full scientific evidence and data backing up climate change not just a bunch of people saying its true with no real facts to back it up.

This site has a number of studies that are randomized and placebo controlled. At least two of the MS studies were. Some are pro and some are con. I believe you will find it to be fair.

http://medicalmarijuana.procon.org/view.resource.php?resourceID=000884

 

[MinnBobber]

There have been a few studies
"To date, more than 15,000 modern peer-reviewed scientific articles on the chemistry and pharmacology of cannabis and cannabinoids have been published, as well as more than 2,000 articles on the body's natural endocannabinoids...." From link below

Here's a decent summary:
http://www.safeaccessnow.org/

EDIT: thanks @woolspinner for those 60 peer reviewed studies which are just the tip of the iceberg.