Is dabbing smoking?

[bluenavey00]

Okay so I am from the UK, dab culture isn't really common. I for one have never tried a dab, and 99% of my friend group haven't either.

But yea I was wondering, is dabbing smoking? Is there one conclusive answer? Is it more how you perceive it? I see no flame, none of the signs of combustion so it leads to be believe it isnt. However saying that I haven't seen much talk on here about dabbing.

Fill me in dab experts

 

[420engineer]

well, if it was, it wouldn't be featured on a site called fuck combustion, would it?

tl;dr - no

 

[grindin8732]

dabbing is a form of vaporizing

 

[420engineer]

like old school hot knives, but less ghetto

 

[grindin8732]

i never had to do it the old knife way (but heard all abt it) ive only tried hash a couple times before i started making my own and just sprinkled it on a bowl

 

[420engineer]

they were quite the experience, dabbing without water tools to cool the load; old school ftw

 

[j-bug]

I know people who the only thing they know about vaporizing is that dabbing is vaporizing. I have a friend who I asked if they wanted to Vape with me yesterday said "oh no, I can't handle dabs." So no dabbing isn't smoking it's vaping.

 

[smokum]

Heat with no flame = flash vaporization (provided material isn't bursting into flames lol)

 

[nosmoking]

(provided material isn't bursting into flames lol)

like the guy playing dabsketball and as soon as his dab hits the nail it flames up

 

[j-bug]

like the guy playing dabsketball and as soon as his dab hits the nail it flames up

So sometimes when people do it wrong it's smoking but otherwise it's not smoking

 

[poonman]

Good question , I like to know the answer myself .
I've just started torch dabbing with a quartz banger .

So if combustion point is 450 degrees F , and the D-nail/E-nail is
set at 500 to 600 degrees prior to dabbing . Would that be considered
smoking ?

 

[nosmoking]

Good question , I like to know the answer myself .
I've just started torch dabbing with a quartz banger .

So if combustion point is 450 degrees F , and the D-nail/E-nail is
set at 500 to 600 degrees prior to dabbing . Would that be considered
smoking ?

Somebody else can give you the long answer but the short answer is no. Flower combustion is 462 degrees F (give or take). I am not sure about concentrates combustion point, but I know people take hits at 700 degrees F and are not getting flames or combustion.

 

[KeroZen]

But how do you know for sure that there is no pyrolisis at the contact area? You don't need to combust to create nasty byproducts. Pyrolisis breaks molecules into smaller fragments, and those fragments want to react with everything they touch, because they shouldn't exist in that state. They are called free radicals for that reason, and they are very often carcinogens.

 

[JoeS]

I also wanted to make the same question, so thanks to everyone who replied.

where i live nobody dabs or knows what it is, so i had to get into it by myself, watching videos, trials and errors...

But i've still got some doubts...

I have a titanium nail (with dome) and a bubbler, very basic setup.
I make my own oil, it took a couple of years to perfect the process (with the help of a chemist friend), but now i think i make a preatty good, clear oil. some people call it QWET (quick wash ethanol), it's ethilic alcohol extraction (no butane, no isoprophillic).
Early days i would dab when the nail was still red.
it must have been a preatty big mistake... now i wait until the nail returns to its original titanium color and it all feels much better (i don't cough the hell out ).
so in this situation am i really vaping?
and was i vaping when dabbing with a red nail?
or even at these lower dab temps, like @KeroZen was saying, are we really sure there isn't some pyrolisis and combustion produced compunds?
is there any advice you guys could give to take the safest dab with my basic setup (no temp control)?
sorry if some questions sound stupid...

I also make some nice ice-o-lator, which i usually put in the vape with some herb (really nice).
sometimes ago i would dab it either just a small iceolator ball, or a drop of sticky oil dipped in iceolator powder. that is maybe the tastiest dab i could have but i'm preatty sure there's combustion involved this way (small flames, ashes).
so vaporizing/dabbing is both temp and substance related? at same temps if i dab oil is vaping, if i dab hash is smoking, right?

thanks fellows

 

[1DMF]

IMO 'Hot Knives' was still a form of smoking, as the knife was sometimes so red hot that it would combust the material. If you look at the urban dictionary for 'Hot Knife' it constantly states it is a form of 'smoking' : http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=hot+knife

I would think it is possible to smoke with vaporisers, if you use them incorrectly or are deliberately trying to combust the material by heating the surface to a high temperature.

Though I would surmise that probably only butane powered, "heat it yourself" type vapourisers can get hot enough to combust.

The portables I have only go to a max of 430F, no where near what I have read on the net for combustion to take place (though some nasties still might be released at that temperature)

500-700C (932-1292F) Is the combustion temperature for marijuana

Is this true?

Source: https://forum.grasscity.com/threads/max-efficiency-guide-dont-waste-any-more-weed.1097104/

I've also found this http://www.hightimes.com/read/dab-tech-low-temp-dabs-and-anatomy-flame that states, if your nail is glowing, it's too hot and will burn the oil?

Since ideal vaporization temperatures for cannabis oil are between 300 °F and 400 °F, any noticeable glow means your nail is too hot and your oil will get burnt.

 

[Winegums]

Guys, hot nails exploit the Lidenfrost effect where the material instantly boils and creates a glass layer. This levitates the oil above the nail and prevents it from burning.

Have you ever gotten a frying pan really hot then dropped a tiny bit of water on it? You'll see the water droplet dance on the hot surface with little to no friction. The same thing is happening with a dab.

You might get a tiny bit of combustion at the start but the effect kicks in almost instantly.

Having too cool of a nail would cause the oil to sit and cook on the surface. Having too hot of a nail will cause the vapourized oil to ignite. Though you'd have to be hitting it when the metal is glowing red hot.

Dabbing is not combusting, It's vapourizing.

 

[verdampersweats]

I spill water onto the pan everytime i bring over the potatoes ^^

I still think there is micro combustion, It is just so small people are going to claim there is none. I think there is what is the nail residues then? Winegums stated you might get a little at the start obviously above 230c there will be even if it does levitate after.

This is why i claimed i would go as far north as kief but never oil, Because it seems cleaner to vape kief than dab oil unless i can have an electric nail that is showing a readout below 230c. I would carb cap that no problems but i have reservations over dabbing and do not see it changing.

Even if we went legal i still think i would just move up to kief over flower, No micro combustion and much better clouds than flowers due to the THC content obviously so it will make portable vapes even better if everyone replaced flowers with kief.

 

[Winegums]

I spill water onto the pan everytime i bring over the potatoes ^^

I still think there is micro combustion, It is just so small people are going to claim there is none. I think there is what is the nail residues then? Winegums stated you might get a little at the start obviously above 230c there will be even if it does levitate after.

I wouldn't say there's that much combustion after the initial touch because once the oil is in a liquid state it will conduct heat quite well. The whole mass should be at a fairly equal temperature and just like any boiling liquid it will stay at it's boiling point until it is completely evaporated. BUT when one considers the mechanics of the Lidenfrost effect there is a layer of vapour that is constantly in contact with the nail. This would explain why there's residue on the nail which is indeed burnt vapour or oil. Another reason for this residue would be contaminants that don't vapourize and ultimately end up burning when the temperature of the nail can no longer support the Lidenfrost effect and the evaporative cooling from the oil is gone.

This is why i claimed i would go as far north as kief but never oil, Because it seems cleaner to vape kief than dab oil unless i can have an electric nail that is showing a readout below 230c. I would carb cap that no problems but i have reservations over dabbing and do not see it changing.

Even if we went legal i still think i would just move up to kief over flower, No micro combustion and much better clouds than flowers due to the THC content obviously so it will make portable vapes even better if everyone replaced flowers with kief.

There's always bubble hash, rosin and dry sift if you don't like solvent concentrates. These offer quite high potency without the worry associated with solvents. Once your area is legal you can purchase these instead and enjoy the benefits of commercially grown bud. Also, concentrates are fine to vape in most convection vapes if you do not wish to use a nail.

 

[j-bug]

I wouldn't say there's that much combustion after the initial touch because once the oil is in a liquid state it will conduct heat quite well. The whole mass should be at a fairly equal temperature and just like any boiling liquid it will stay at it's boiling point until it is completely evaporated. BUT when one considers the mechanics of the Lidenfrost effect there is a layer of vapour that is constantly in contact with the nail. This would explain why there's residue on the nail which is indeed burnt vapour or oil. Another reason for this residue would be contaminants that don't vapourize and ultimately end up burning when the temperature of the nail can no longer support the Lidenfrost effect and the evaporative cooling from the oil is gone.



There's always bubble hash, rosin and dry sift if you don't like solvent concentrates. These offer quite high potency without the worry associated with solvents. Once your area is legal you can purchase these instead and enjoy the benefits of commercially grown bud. Also, concentrates are fine to vape in most convection vapes if you do not wish to use a nail.

Concentrates vaped through my underdog on a bed of flowers is the tastiest thing. The amount of times I've gotten more medicated than is useful cause the taste is so good I wanna keep going is definitely a nonzero integer.

 

[herbivore21]

Whoa this thread has gone every which way! The short answer is no. Dabbing is generally just conduction boiling (what we call vaporization) of an extract.

Smoldering combustion is not even possible with anything that should be dabbed. This is the reaction that is referred to by smoking.

Not all dabbing folks use the Leidenfrost effect either. Many of us with e-nails don't. That only takes place for example when one is dabbing a fair amount hotter than I ever would.

The temp alone or even considered with exposure time is not what determines whether pyrolysis or combustion will take place. The first relevant variable is what is being heated on the nail. If you are dabbing a fully melting extract with no plant particulates/contaminant, you don't have anything there that can react in these ways in any substantial volume/at all. There is the possibility that there is a small element of smoking going on if someone is dabbing something full of contaminant (say a 4 star hash for example) though.

 

[Winegums]

Whoa this thread has gone every which way! The short answer is no. Dabbing is generally just conduction boiling (what we call vaporization) of an extract.

Smoldering combustion is not even possible with anything that should be dabbed. This is the reaction that is referred to by smoking.

Not all dabbing folks use the Leidenfrost effect either. Many of us with e-nails don't. That only takes place for example when one is dabbing a fair amount hotter than I ever would.

The temp alone or even considered with exposure time is not what determines whether pyrolysis or combustion will take place. The first relevant variable is what is being heated on the nail. If you are dabbing a fully melting extract with no plant particulates/contaminant, you don't have anything there that can react in these ways in any substantial volume/at all. There is the possibility that there is a small element of smoking going on if someone is dabbing something full of contaminant (say a 4 star hash for example) though.

After watching some slow motion videos I can see what's going on better. Sometimes it's true Lidenfrost, sometimes it's contact boiling and relying on the fact that the nail material doesn't conduct fast enough to burn, but rather the energy transfer is slow enough that it simply boils rapidly. The effect that a boiling liquid stays at its boiling point still holds true, also ensuring that the material doesn't get hot enough to burn.

I've never dabbed and I'm stuck with plain theory and what my eye balls can tell me from videos. I like physics and vaping is full of it which only makes me more interested. I would own an E-Nail rig the day that I can get concentrates from a legal tested source. Anything else would be too sketchy for my liking. =/

 

[ClearBlueLou]

my lungs can't tell the difference between too much smoke and too much vapor, so it seems moot to me.
impact is impact. then again, I burned mids in pipes for 40 years before glass hand pipes & better grades of medicine came within reach; looking to make my first-ever water-glass purchase soon, then I'll be able to actually experiment & develop a further opinion

 

[looney2nz]

they were quite the experience, dabbing without water tools to cool the load; old school ftw

hot-knife flashbacks great laugh, thanks!