inconsistent results with same cooking method

[daoist]

hi,

When i make oil i always put some grinded up herb in a glass and cover with oil. i let it cook using double boil method (au bain marie) for about 1 hour and filter out the herb and drink the oil. most of the time i get great results. but there have been times the result was disappointing.

It could be that some strains do it better than others.

so my questions are:

Should i boil longer?
Should i avoid certain strains?
Should i use a different decarb method (cooking the oil is already a decarb method, but maybe i need to do something different?)

I made a white widow oil and it barely did anything for me. When i vaped the flower it it me very hard. I find this really weird.
When i cooked happy haze with the same method, same amount and same time it hit me much harder as the white widow.

I hope somebody can give me some pointers where it goes wrong.

 

[shredder]

hi,

When i make oil i always put some grinded up herb in a glass and cover with oil. i let it cook using double boil method (au bain marie) for about 1 hour and filter out the herb and drink the oil. most of the time i get great results. but there have been times the result was disappointing.

It could be that some strains do it better than others.

so my questions are:

Should i boil longer?
Should i avoid certain strains?
Should i use a different decarb method (cooking the oil is already a decarb method, but maybe i need to do something different?)

I made a white widow oil and it barely did anything for me. When i vaped the flower it it me very hard. I find this really weird.
When i cooked happy haze with the same method, same amount and same time it hit me much harder as the white widow.

I hope somebody can give me some pointers where it goes wrong.

I believe it's your decarb method. If you dig into Ardent's web site they have a lot of decarbing data from lab results. It shows a lot of decarbing is hit and miss. Of course Ardent sells decarbing devices, but the lab results should be accurate.

Most people suggest decarbing (without oil, open air) 40 minutes at 240F.

Ardent says their decarbing results are near perfect time after time. But it happens in a sealed container, unlike the open decarb I suggested above. And they want you to decarb first, then infuse in oil/butter. So a two step process.

edit, I almost forgot lecithin. It comes in powdered, grannuals, and liquid. We use organic sunflower over soy, because of gmo's in soy. Using it helps your body's ability to get more out of the oil. It's more bioavailable. So the same amount of oil goes further.

So lecithin and a proper decarb should make you a canna chef!

decarboxylation-myths

 

[daoist]

Thanks for the info. I tried 40 minutes in my airfryer at 105 degree celsius (220 fahrenheit i believe).
I decarbed 3 different strains of 1 gram each for 40 minutes.

I had 1 strain grinded, and the other two i dacrbed as a whole bud.

Right now i am au-bain marie cook the oil for 1 hour because most of the time that seems sufficient. I will try some oil later today.
Not the whole gram but each batch should give me about 0.33 gram of edibles 3 times. I might even go for 0.25 grams 4 times.

 

[FlyingLow]

Were you using the same material in both cases?

 

[daoist]

Were you using the same material in both cases?

I used three different strains. All decarbed the same time.
I had tried those strains before with mixed results as oil. So now i did a pre decarb in the oven.

Tommorow i will see if there is a difference. I had G13 oil before and it did not hit the spot, but vaping was strong.
So tomorow i will check if the oven method made any difference on my G13.

 

[daoist]

I am hitting the G13 right now with the oven decarb. This seems to work better. I feel the head high is better.
It seems this oven method works great.

I tried 45 minutes at 105 degree celsius in the oven. Seems to work great. I will try a different temperature next time to see if it makes any difference. This chick on youtube tried 2 different cooking times and it made a difference. I dont want to spoil which method wins. decarb 30 minutes or 50 minutes but if you want to know visit the youtube video (it is a good video).

 

[shredder]

I am hitting the G13 right now with the oven decarb. This seems to work better. I feel the head high is better.
It seems this oven method works great.

I tried 45 minutes at 105 degree celsius in the oven. Seems to work great. I will try a different temperature next time to see if it makes any difference. This chick on youtube tried 2 different cooking times and it made a difference. I dont want to spoil which method wins. decarb 30 minutes or 50 minutes but if you want to know visit the youtube video (it is a good video).

When you decarbed in oil, the oil insulates the tricombs making the decarb sketchy.

When you infuse your decarbed herb in oil or butter. 220F is recommended.

 

[daoist]

yes thank you Shredder. I looked on the link you gave me and it said 220f has less loss than 240f. So i used 220F temperature (which is 105 celsius). Seems to give me a better head high. Next week i will try shorter decarb time. I think that should work, based on Frenchy Cannoli's work.

 

[invertedisdead]

Frenchy Cannoli only works with hashish. He uses conduction heat from a bottle of hot water to decarb, which is totally different from decarbing flower in an oven.

Also keep in mind that just because the setting says 220F doesn’t mean that’s accurate unless you’re measuring the temperature yourself to verify. Being off by just 20-30 degrees could cut your efficacy in half considering the relatively short infusion/extraction time.

 

[FlyingLow]

I LOVE Frenchy, but as Inverted explained, he is exclusively working with hash.
Flower is a different process.

 

[daoist]

Frenchy Cannoli only works with hashish. He uses conduction heat from a bottle of hot water to decarb, which is totally different from decarbing flower in an oven.

Also keep in mind that just because the setting says 220F doesn’t mean that’s accurate unless you’re measuring the temperature yourself to verify. Being off by just 20-30 degrees could cut your efficacy in half considering the relatively short infusion/extraction time.

Well it works for me. Previous method by decarbing directly in oil did not work very well and barely did do anything for me.

Yesterday i had .25 grams worth of G13 in oil. My new oven decarb method got me so fucking high i had to take out the cbd to take my trip down a notch. I am going to lower the dosage next time because it was very strong.

So my Frenchy Cannoli based theory did exactly what i thought it would do, And also Frenchy got the numbers from edible industry, he did not just guess it or something. I cannot complain other than it was just to strong and need to lower the dosage. I decarbed 40 minutes but i am going to try shorter next time. maybe 35 or 30 minutes. Others have great results with 30 minutes (see video link I from that hazy chick on youtube.)

 

[FlyingLow]

What is your Frenchy Theory?
What makes you think Frenchy got any of his processes from the edible industry?

My mind is kinda blown by this comment.

I do encourage you to study Frenchy. His processes come from decades of experience and refining his craft and has been guided/trained by centuries old practices. He takes nothing from the edible industry, Frenchy was their light.


You are starting to play with a lot of variables. For simplicity and ease of getting the same results, I always make as potent as possible and then portion accordingly. Rather portion smaller than dilute your edible.

 

[daoist]

What is your Frenchy Theory?
What makes you think Frenchy got any of his processes from the edible industry?

My mind is kinda blown by this comment.

Well i got that info from Frenchy himself. He tells this in this video about decarbing.

At 05:17 on the video he says that he got most numbers from the edible industry. And he based his hot water bottle method on those numbers.

No need to start a war on who based what on what though. take it easy oke.

 

[daoist]

So I was wondering how long you should heat the oil before it is ready.

Step 1 I decarb in the oven for about 35 minutes
Step 2 Heat my oil with grinded up weed in it for How many minutes?

In many recipes I see 2 or 3 hours. But that sound a bit excessive and seems to me you will have bigger change of degradation.
Any advise on this would be welcome.

I had good results with hash when i only warm it for 20 minutes. So I am not sure why decarbed weed would need longer.

 

[shredder]

So I was wondering how long you should heat the oil before it is ready.

Step 1 I decarb in the oven for about 35 minutes
Step 2 Heat my oil with grinded up weed in it for How many minutes?

In many recipes I see 2 or 3 hours. But that sound a bit excessive and seems to me you will have bigger change of degradation.
Any advise on this would be welcome.

I had good results with hash when i only warm it for 20 minutes. So I am not sure why decarbed weed would need longer.

If you've taken your time up to this point no need to rush the final infusion. Your transferring plant oils into a base oil, so I would do this at 220F and for 45 minutes to an hour, but longer won't hurt. The point is you want to get all the oil to transfer. 220F won't degrade the valuable oils.

This process is easier with concentrates, because your just mixing, not transferring oils.

 

[daoist]

oke. But does the decarbing not continue while you heat the oil? And therefor maybe has a chance to degrade?

I am currently testing a batch that was decarbed for 35 minutes at 105 celsius (no pre heating).
and than i doubled boiled some oil for 30 minutes (i started to time when the water was hot).

I can say that it started to set in pretty quick. as i am writing this i am only 25 minutes in and i get a nice heady high already. but it is still building up. I kept the weed so i can just put it back in the oil and cook it longer if needed.

 

[shredder]

But does the decarbing not continue while you heat the oil? And therefor maybe has a chance to degrade?

The carrier oil insulates plant oil glands, so the answer is not much if any.

When your pretty much done, I like to dip the used weed in a bowl of hot water. Then put the bowl in the freezer. The oil will come off the weed and come to the top and coagulate as it cools. You can use a slotted spoon to get the rest of the oil goodies. Just don't let it freeze solid. Mush easier than squeezing and squeezing.

 

[tokenknifeguy]

I think when you decarb you need to get a oven thermometer and use that. I started doing that and got more potent results, though I haven't done it too much. But I make sure to use something that is kinda on the deeper side than shallow, so I can put a lid of aluminum foil over the pan and then poke the thermometer through the foil and have it measure the temp inside of the enclosed area, where the weed will be. Once I did this, I realized that it takes a while longer for the pan to heat up and get to the proper temp in the enclosed space than when the oven gets to temp. I found the oven gets to temp and then mins later the inside comes to temp, usually its a bit lower than the advertised oven temp, though that could just be the oven's own accuracy problems. Once the inside temp was correct, I would then add my weed and wait for the temp to get back to the ideal range and then start my timing. I only did it a few times (dont' do edibles much at all, just really jacks my tolerance (vaping) up) but they were killer every time and potent.

The timer I get is the kind with the metal wire extension, so you can put it in your food and close the oven/grill and be able to see the temp without opening it up and inserting. Would highly recommend this and also use it for your foods, especially cooking things like a turkey or boston butt.

 

[daoist]

I tried it again with a different temperature.
115 celsius for 30 minutes. This seems to work the best of all testing.i did.

 

[daoist]

My previous batch of oil was consumed. Now i made a different batch of oil with olive oil instead of rice oil.

I normally dont use olive oil because it usually cannot handle the heat of my wok. But i found a nice bottle of carbonell olive oil on discount
in the supermarket. I must admit that i really like this oil because it is smooth and fairly neutral in flavour. And i just use it for weed infusion at low temperature (double boil method).

I tried a few strains. I think this olive oil seems more potent.

When i was done infusing the oil i ingested some of the left over oils in the jar that i scooped up with my fingers. And I thought it was not that much. But i was wrong.... it was too much. lol.

So I am happy to confirm that olive oil really is the best oil for infusing weed.
It was semi scientific tested, by using the same strains, the same decarb method, same cooking time, just a different kind of oil.

with the rice oil i had 8 portions of oil out of 2 gram of a strain. Now with olive oil i can get 9 or 10 portions of oil out of the same 2 gram of a strain and it just feels more potent and efficient. (to be clear i used the same strains and same amounts in comparing the oils).

 

[shredder]

So I am happy to confirm that olive oil really is the best oil for infusing weed.

You tried them all, eh?

Haven't tried it yet but I heard a lot of people say bacon fat is the best oil to infuse into. My favorites are mct and coconut oils. Both of those oils are also faster acting than other most oils as well, although sooner or later you'll get high if you have enough cannabinoids in any oil or fat, or alcohol, or by itself as long as its decarbed.

I use coconut oil in canna caps because at <76F it stays solid. It goes well in most edibles as well. MCT oil excels in infusions. It's a light neutral tasting oil that doesn't add any off tastes. I use nutiva brand organic mct oil. It's made from 100% coconut oil, some cheaper brands use palm oil. (a lesser oil) For me both these oils work in less than 45 minutes, butter takes me an hour, no oil or fat (or alcohol) up to 2 hours.

 

[Ramahs]

I've found coconut oil with added lecithin to be very effective.

Though, I pre decarb in the oven, and I infuse with the coconut oil in my jars in a double boiler for at least four hours.