HerbalAire combusts my pot

[CrazySmooth]

New member here, first time poster. First of i'd like to say that this forum is awsome. ok now that that's out of the way lets get down to business.

A friend of mine bought a Volcano digi 2 years ago. At this time i was a joint/pipe smoker but after discovering the wonderful world of vapor there was no turning back. I finally got my own vaporizer 6 months ago(HA 2.1) After extensive research into just about every model on the marked. Finally the battle was between the E and the HA cause they offer both bag and whip delivery. I went for the HA cause the E is just about the ugliest thing i ever saw(the new EQ looks awsome though).

Anyway... after extensive testing there is no longer any doubt that the HerbalAire does lead to combustion. I start vaporizing at 170? C/338 F before gradualy increasing and even at this temperature there is some combustion. If you let the pot sit in the heated chamber without vaping it either with the bag method or the direct draw method, you can see a smoke, not vapor but smoke, rising from the "vaporizer".

This is because the chamber that holds the pot is in direct contact with the heating element, causing the pot to burn. It's funny because i actually discarded the extreme partially cause? it had seperated the pot chamber from the heating element, meaning the displayed temperature is actually lower then the temperature of the pot. Now however i realise that this is a necessity to prevent combustion I really like the direct draw method though and actually never use the bags exept when i have company, so now im considring the Silver Surfer, Purple days or the extreme q.

btw i notice this place has alot of extreme fanboys, hope you wont all try to pursvade me on the E based on subjective biased opinoins. Peace

 

[Beezleb]

I have very limited experience with the HA but what comes to mind is that your the first person I recall with combustion issues.

I would contact HA and explain your situation as this does not seem normal to me but perhaps someone with some good experience with the HA can better help you. Wish I had more for you.

I believe Max has or had an HA, I imagine his advice would be good and their are a few others who use the HA or have good experience so hopefully soon some better advice will be coming.

 

[CrazySmooth]

I don't think HA can help cause i don't think there is anything "wrong" with the vaporizer, just bad design i guess. I tried putting the HA on full 200C with just the empty chamber in it for half an hour to check if it was the actual device that was "burning". It wasn't. There is no sign whatsoever of any smoke when the chamber is empty. As soon as you put some pot in the chamber though and let it sit there for a minute you see a thin line of smoke exiting through the whip, this is because the chamber is in direct contact with the heating element making it boiling hot(you cant touch the chamber for a while after you turn of tha HA or you'll burn your hand) So the problem lies in the design i think. i'm pretty sure if anyone else here who owns a HA would test it they would come to the same conclusion. thx though.

 

[max]

I've used the herbalAire for years. Never combusted a single time. The temp control tells you the approx. temp you're using, and it's always worked fine for me. If it's combusting for you, then you've got the temp way too high or your unit is defective.

This is because the chamber that holds the pot is in direct contact with the heating element, causing the pot to burn.

Incorrect conclusion there. The heating chamber has 18 inlet holes, where the heated air is pumped in (it's convection, not conduction). It's an outstanding design for efficiency, since the unit is designed to use pieces/chunks of herb instead of ground, and it does a 1st class job of thoroughly vaping the herb, without burning it. I've milked a lot of crucibles, putting a 3rd, 4th bag on, to make sure I was getting every bit of vapor. No matter how long I let a load of herb sit in the crucible, unit on and at vaping temp, it never blackened any herb, let alone combusted it.

 

[moonlit knight]

I thought the HA used heated air, hence the holes at the bottom, not direct contact with the heating element :/

 

[Frickr]

are you sure your nor mistaking the wisps of vapor as smoke?

 

[nicelytoasted]

That would be my guess, Frickr. I've seen small wisps of vapour come out when I whip hit it.

I've owned an HA for ~ 2 yrs and have used it every which way and at all temps, and have never come close to combustion. It was designed with a max temp of 400F (205C) so it couldnt combust, unless there's a problem with the heater/temp controller.

Crazy Smooth, check the colour of the AVB after your usage. If there's no black, there's no combustion.

 

[CrazySmooth]

"Incorrect conclusion there. The heating chamber has 18 inlet holes, where the heated air is pumped in (it's convection, not conduction). It's an outstanding design for efficiency, since the unit is designed to use pieces/chunks of herb instead of ground, and it does a 1st class job of thoroughly vaping the herb, without burning it"

Yes i agree with everything exept the last three words. I may not have been presise enough when describing what i meant by "heating element", for that i apologize. What i mean by heating element is the whole hole that you slip the chamber holding the pot into(that's alot of holes)

You know the white plastic hole that surrounds and holds the metal chamber in place?
That whole element gets extremely hot when i use the HA. Obviously hot enough to burn my pot. When i say burn i don't mean that it turns it into coal, just that there is a visible thin line of smoke exiting the whip (even though the pump is not connected).


please excuse my very limited english vocabulary, i've never been to a english speaking country and most of my english i've learned from watching tv so please bear with me. I hope i am able to make myself understood. peace

 

[CrazySmooth]

That would be my guess, Frickr. I've seen small wisps of vapour come out when I whip hit it.

I've owned an HA for ~ 2 yrs and have used it every which way and at all temps, and have never come close to combustion. It was designed with a max temp of 400F (205C) so it couldnt combust, unless there's a problem with the heater/temp controller.

Crazy Smooth, check the colour of the AVB after your usage. If there's no black, there's no combustion.

I appreciate your input. i don't know what AVB means but i'm asuming it's AfterVaporizationBud? I dont know if it qualifies as black but it's deffinetly DARK brown(much much much darker than the volcano is capable of getting it) and when i empty the remanis into my hand it crumbles into dust when i touch it so at least i know i've extracted every last tricome from it which is a good thing. i don't think there's a problem with the heater/temp controller. i start vaping at 170C/338F which is the same temperature i start with on the volcano, and as i i've said before, even at this temperature i can see smoke(not vapor) rising out of the whip(this is before vaping has started so the 18 jet engines have not even been activated yet) Hope i am able to make myself clear. I would love to compare my HA to another HA but unfortunately there's not alot of HAs here in Norway, mostly volcanos and vapir ones.

The feedback on this forum is quick! Great stuff.

 

[lwien]

I dont know if it qualifies as black but it's deffinetly DARK brown

Dark brown is good. If it's not black, and not ash, you are not going into combustion.

...... and as i i've said before, even at this temperature i can see smoke(not vapor) .......

How do you know it's smoke and not vapor?

btw, you're English is just fine. Actually, it's better than some whose English is their native language. Learning it all from TV? THAT is amazing. /salute

 

[CrazySmooth]

I dont know if it qualifies as black but it's deffinetly DARK brown

Dark brown is good. If it's not black, and not ash, you are not going into combustion.

...... and as i i've said before, even at this temperature i can see smoke(not vapor) .......

How do you know it's smoke and not vapor?

btw, you're English is just fine. Actually, it's better than some whose English is their native language. Learning it all from TV? THAT is amazing. /salute

Why thank you. i know it's smoke cause i've been smoking for alot of years prior to vaping and i know what smoke looks like. It's not alot of smoke, just a very thin line of smoke consistently rising out of the mouth end of the whip, for as long as i leave the potchamber in the heated HA WHITHOUT draving ANY air through it. it looks exactly like the smoke line that rises from the end of a joint/sigarette, only thinner.

 

[Konrad_Zuse]

I dont know if it qualifies as black but it's deffinetly DARK brown

Dark brown is good. If it's not black, and not ash, you are not going into combustion.

...... and as i i've said before, even at this temperature i can see smoke(not vapor) .......

How do you know it's smoke and not vapor?

btw, you're English is just fine. Actually, it's better than some whose English is their native language. Learning it all from TV? THAT is amazing. /salute

Why thank you. i know it's smoke cause i've been smoking for alot of years prior to vaping and i know what smoke looks like. It's not alot of smoke, just a very thin line of smoke consistently rising out of the mouth end of the whip, for as long as i leave the potchamber in the heated HA WHITHOUT draving ANY air through it. it looks exactly like the smoke line that rises from the end of a joint/sigarette, only thinner.

THe HA produces THICK vapor, and even though you have been smoking in the past, vapor can be as thick as smoke. I've seen HA bags that you cannot see through. I would try it, and test the high. See if the high is like a smoker's high, or a vape high.

THE HA WILL PRODUCE DARK BROWN ABV, it is an extremely efficient vaporizer, and it will get everything out of it, that tdoes not mean it combusts.

http://www.youtube.com/user/F34R420 Check out the HA vids on this youtube page, or come to chat and we can help you out if you still need it. Chat is located at the top of the site. If you have an external IRC client, the server is Rizon, channel #FuckCombustion.

 

[lwien]

i know it's smoke cause i've been smoking for alot of years prior to vaping and i know what smoke looks like.

Crazy, I've been smoking longer than you've probably been alive...........smoking bud not for years, but for over 4 decades, and sometimes, I cannot tell the difference between smoke and vapor under certain conditions, especially when it is just slightly leaking out of a whip or a bag. Being that the HA, when working properly, cannot combust, and being that your ABV is not coming out black or ash, I contend that what you in fact are seeing is not smoke, but vapor.

 

[t00fatt]

I used my herbie exclusively for years, only even ran into problems with SLIGHT combustion when the temp was cranked up to 400f, and only bits would blacken and still not fully combusted. If its turning completely black and ashy even at 400f I think there is something wrong with your unit. Besides using up more bud than I could afford I never had ANY issues with my herbalaire, combustion or otherwise. I'd get in contact with HA, I've never had to deal with them but their customer service is supposed to be quite good.



EDIT: I've also found that when vaping buds that were not flushed properly with the herbie, the vapor was unusually thick, and had a distinct appearance and bad taste. It was very odd and I hated getting buds that were not flushed properly. It seems to produce thicker vapor at even low temps, even after turning the unit off and keeping the pump on this thick nasty chemical laced vapor would still pour out for 10 15 seconds. This only happened a handful of times, and ALWAYS was caused by the buds not being flushed. This might be what you are experiencing

 

[MikRoOrganix]

Pretty sure something must be wrong with yours. Contact them through their website. Mine NEVEr combusts.

 

[MikRoOrganix]

""" I dont know if it qualifies as black but it's deffinetly DARK brown(much much much darker than the volcano is capable of getting it) and when i empty the remanis into my hand it crumbles into dust when i touch it so at least i know i've extracted every last tricome from it which is a good thing.""

This happens to mine too - nothing combusts for me, I just get extremly thurough extraction. It is by far the most effecient unit that I know of. You can take ABV (alreadybeenvaped) bud from another vape and fill the HA bowl and still get two bags of thick vapor. I do this all the time and when I run out of bud I can last weeks on ABV in the HA, thank heavens!

You might want to try using good bud and starting at low temps, like 335, for the first bag, then go up by 15 or 20 degrees f for each next bag. This maximizes effeciency and number of bags per bowl, while still giving you some pretty this bags. Also note all the fun variety of ways to smoke the HA that I noted above! Tonight I used autopump-direct-draw.

 

[CrazySmooth]

Crazy, I've been smoking longer than you've probably been alive...........smoking bud not for years, but for over 4 decades

Respect!

 

[lwien]

Crazy, I've been smoking longer than you've probably been alive...........smoking bud not for years, but for over 4 decades

Respect!

Damn. I really sounded like a pompous asshole when you took it out of context like that. My apologies. Didn't mean it to sound that way.

 

[CrazySmooth]

ok ok. So if i turn the HA on and set the temp at 170C/338F(which i usually do), put 0.2 grams of quality bud(flushed 14 days) in the chamber and drop it in into the HA WITHOUT drawing any air through it, connect the whip to the HA and just let it sit there. Would that lead to thick vapor or as i suspect, smoke, exiting the mouthpiece of the whip(it sure as hell does with mine)

 

[nicelytoasted]

Simple convective heating.

Even at 170C, there is vapour being produced in the chamber. Since there is no flow diluting it, this thick vapour will rise (with heat) and some can wisp out of the top of the whip. I have seen this before myself.

Since combustion does not begin until the temp reaches ~ 230C, I am positive that it is thick vapour that you are seeing. You can just cap the whip to prevent this slight loss until you are ready to draw. When I use bags, I attach them even when the unit is heating to temp, so as not to lose anything.

BTW, the white material on the unit is not plastic, it is PTFE teflon, a BIG difference.

 

[CrazySmooth]

Simple convective heating.

Even at 170C, there is vapour being produced in the chamber. Since there is no flow diluting it, this thick vapour will rise (with heat) and some can wisp out of the top of the whip. I have seen this before myself.

Since combustion does not begin until the temp reaches ~ 230C, I am positive that it is thick vapour that you are seeing. You can just cap the whip to prevent this slight loss until you are ready to draw. When I use bags, I attach them even when the unit is heating to temp, so as not to lose anything.

BTW, the white material on the unit is not plastic, it is PTFE teflon, a BIG difference.

thank you and everybody else for putting my mind at ease. I thought that white area was medical grade plastic. thx for clearing that up. I look foreward to my next vaping session now, and feel better about choosing the HA. I wont be considering any other vaperizors after all, one is enough for me. At least for now.

 

[Konrad_Zuse]

The thing that I know will tell me it's combustion or not is if you get really burnt out, or feel as if you would with combustion. The highs are noticeably different, and if you are feeling like you did with the cano, you should be good. Trust me, there are tons of people who, even on this site, who don't know how to use their vape correctly, or know if it is working correctly. I used to combust, in my vape, for about a month. I used 210C-260C, which is combustion, and I had no idea. THE ha is one of the best vapes out there, and you made a great choice. The guys I speak to on a daily basis, which include Mikeroor, and Nicely, always say how much hey love it, and I'll be getting one in the future. I hope everything works out for you, and again welcome to to the site. Hopefully you'll stop by chat to hang out with the rest of us, Chat is always where it's poppin .

 

[CrazySmooth]

The thing that I know will tell me it's combustion or not is if you get really burnt out, or feel as if you would with combustion. The highs are noticeably different, and if you are feeling like you did with the cano, you should be good. Trust me, there are tons of people who, even on this site, who don't know how to use their vape correctly, or know if it is working correctly. I used to combust, in my vape, for about a month. I used 210C-260C, which is combustion, and I had no idea. THE ha is one of the best vapes out there, and you made a great choice. The guys I speak to on a daily basis, which include Mikeroor, and Nicely, always say how much hey love it, and I'll be getting one in the future. I hope everything works out for you, and again welcome to to the site. Hopefully you'll stop by chat to hang out with the rest of us, Chat is always where it's poppin .

Thank you for the kind comment. I have to be honest and say i really don't notice that much of a difference between the vape high and the joint high. Anyway i usually cook and eat my bud but also vape it when i don't have the time to be high for 6+hours... I have tried cooking and eating some ABV bud and i'll never do that again! first off all it smelled absolutely horrible when beeing cooked and tasted even worse. Pluss the high was very mild compared to unvaped bud(duh).

I haven't had any cannabis for a week now and am starting to lose my mind a little bit but as soon as i get some i'll drop by the chat room and see whats up! peace

 

[B.]

Crazy-I'm only saying this in public because I can't message you...in your quote under your posts, it's 'suggest', not 'sudjest'.
I'm not tryin to be a dick, i just thought you'd want to know, I'll edit this post in a few days, it doesn't need to be part of this thread. You're english is great, better than I can do in another language.

 

[CrazySmooth]

Thank you for correcting me. I strive to learn! Suggest it is!