olivianewtonjohn
Well-Known Member
This was on the right side when I was watching a youtube video. Seems relievent to the OP as well as the last few posters talking about school.
hard life decision..input?
- Thread starter clukx
- Start date
t-dub
Vapor Sloth
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djonkoman
Well-Known Member
olivianewtonjohn
Well-Known Member
Yes I have heard about Mike Rowe's program really a cool idea. Obviously college is not always the answer for every situation/person, there are many factors to consider if an individual will benefit from it. I was just posting to give an alternative view from the college sucks crowd. I liked that he gave an economic and noneconomic reason.
SalamiCity
Well-Known Member
Mike Rowe's progam is great, he was on Fox saying how there are so many construction jobs(3 million shovel ready jobs) tons of welding jobs, but like this dude I know said "Who wants to take those jobs?" Obviously people who want to work and want to try. Yeah, "labor" is a lot of work, but you know what I busted my ass off in sports, and in working out, so what is a little cement?
There are many sides to "is college worth it."
Most smart people know they can go out and do shit without college.
That video is biased imo, "As long as you go to a credited university."
Yeah, and you forgot "IF YOU CAN GET A JOB."
The validictorian of my school went to Cornell, told me he wasted his time, and all of his money there.
No job opportunities at all, and now he is doing science writing after applying and trying to get a job/medical school for the past 2 years. Evven if he got into med school, they said they wouldn't allow him to research what he wants, even if he got the funds.
My buddy Mike dropped out his second year and now owns his own marketing/ad agency in Manhattan.
I got my degree and am doing shit on my own, I learned it all on my own, college, is a waste.
College is for people who cannot learn on their own, and need people to teach them.
I thought I needed to be taught, but in reality I can do it all on my own.
There are many sides to "is college worth it."
Most smart people know they can go out and do shit without college.
That video is biased imo, "As long as you go to a credited university."
Yeah, and you forgot "IF YOU CAN GET A JOB."
The validictorian of my school went to Cornell, told me he wasted his time, and all of his money there.
No job opportunities at all, and now he is doing science writing after applying and trying to get a job/medical school for the past 2 years. Evven if he got into med school, they said they wouldn't allow him to research what he wants, even if he got the funds.
My buddy Mike dropped out his second year and now owns his own marketing/ad agency in Manhattan.
I got my degree and am doing shit on my own, I learned it all on my own, college, is a waste.
College is for people who cannot learn on their own, and need people to teach them.
I thought I needed to be taught, but in reality I can do it all on my own.
lwien
Well-Known Member
Wow. Generalizations are typically inaccurate, but hey, you learn that in college.
One of the main things that one can learn in college is................ "how" to learn.
While I totally agree that college is not for everyone, and we can all bring up anecdotal evidence to prove our point, there are just as many circumstances where college has made all the difference in the world.
SalamiCity
Well-Known Member
Wow. Generalizations are typically inaccurate, but hey, you learn that in college.
One of the main things that one can learn in college is................ "how" to learn.
While I totally agree that college is not for everyone, and we can all bring up anecdotal evidence to prove our point, there are just as many circumstances where college has made all the difference in the world.
So you're saying that if one "Goes to college" he learns that "generalizations are inaccurate?"
and in college you "learn how to learn."
That's pretty stupid. You learn how to learn from going to school for most of your life. College is SUPPOSED TO be where YOU LEARN HOW TO ACTUALLY DO SOMETHING, which in most cases, YOU DON'T.
Also, the generalizations happen for a reason. Why do you think Bill Gates, and Steve Jobs dropped out of school? Because it was useless to them, and they started their empires.
My buddy and myself are on our way as well, and I don't credit ANY of it to school.
In fact I would say College did teach me something valuable, it taught me to only trust myself and what I learn, and not to listen to the spew of "professors" who don't know what they are talking about.
I've learned more on my own in the past 3 years than ANY institution could have taught me.
If you actually want to learn, get certified, certifications are a great way to learn information, from people who know what they are talking about.
Some people goto college, and they have found the greatest thing ever, and can go out and do whatever they want, this is great, and this is the point of college, to be able to work wherever you want, and do what you love, but do you know how many people actually get to do that?
I just graduated in 2012, do you know how many people in my class have jobs? EXTREMELY LOW AMOUNTS. People either rushed into Graduate school because they couldn't find a job, or are now with mommy and daddy at home.
@Iwien, since college helped you out so much, what exactly do you do?
lwien
Well-Known Member
Salami, please show me anywhere in my previous posts where I said that college helped me out so much. I never said that, but again, that's another thing that one learns in college. How to assimilate information objectively without subjectively tainting it with your preconceived ideas. But like anything else, what you get from going to college is equal to the amount of effort that you put into it. Is it a guarantee of financial success? Absolutely not. Is it a guarantee that you will find a job once you get out? Absolutely not. Can one find financial success without ever going to college? Absolutely.
Regarding what I do now? Nothing. I'm retired. What I did do though is spend 40 years in the consumer electronics field on the retail end doing everything from working as a salesman and manager on the sales floor to a district manager covering 8 stores in a large chain, to working as a VP of Advertising, and VP of Sales and Marketing for a 46 store chain and then becoming part owner and VP/General Manager of that chain that employed 350 people.
Could I have done all of the above without ever going to college? Yup.
Looking back, would I have ever opted out from ever going to college in the first place? Nope.
Regarding what I do now? Nothing. I'm retired. What I did do though is spend 40 years in the consumer electronics field on the retail end doing everything from working as a salesman and manager on the sales floor to a district manager covering 8 stores in a large chain, to working as a VP of Advertising, and VP of Sales and Marketing for a 46 store chain and then becoming part owner and VP/General Manager of that chain that employed 350 people.
Could I have done all of the above without ever going to college? Yup.
Looking back, would I have ever opted out from ever going to college in the first place? Nope.
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Snake Plissken
Transcendentalist
Wow. The age range of some posters is blatantly obvious through their remarks. I agree w/ Iwien's statement about 'learning to learn'. It's called 'critical thinking' and mostly discouraged in schools until college. Instead of doubting iwien, you could easily look at any working professional (dr, scientist, teacher, admin, it, etc) and know that a degree is a req for the position they hold and that they would never even make it to an interview w/o one.
I won't pretend that most colleges/u's aren't uber left wing, profit oriented or partially staffed by individuals who couldn't make it in the real world (if you can't do, teach), but blanket statements regarding their uselessness seem oversimplified. Certifications are great for people who don't have the time or resources to pursue a degree but are not a replacement for a more rounded education.
Many people graduate college only to be confused by their inability to procure good employment w/ an English/arts degree. Do you really think that graduates w/ engineering degrees are having the same troubles?
I believe a lot of it boils down to people's increased need for immediate gratification. If your aspirations are no greater than assembly tech, forklift driver, etc then college might be a waste of time for you. Many drs, scientists, it guys, engineers, and upper management would disagree w/ that evaluation.
When the economy is like it is, and there are many overqualified people applying for the same position, you had better believe that any additional skills/education are taken into account even for menial jobs.
imo, you don't 'learn to learn' a lot in schools prior to college - you learn to memorize, regurgitate exactly, discard and start over.
I won't pretend that most colleges/u's aren't uber left wing, profit oriented or partially staffed by individuals who couldn't make it in the real world (if you can't do, teach), but blanket statements regarding their uselessness seem oversimplified. Certifications are great for people who don't have the time or resources to pursue a degree but are not a replacement for a more rounded education.
Many people graduate college only to be confused by their inability to procure good employment w/ an English/arts degree. Do you really think that graduates w/ engineering degrees are having the same troubles?
I believe a lot of it boils down to people's increased need for immediate gratification. If your aspirations are no greater than assembly tech, forklift driver, etc then college might be a waste of time for you. Many drs, scientists, it guys, engineers, and upper management would disagree w/ that evaluation.
When the economy is like it is, and there are many overqualified people applying for the same position, you had better believe that any additional skills/education are taken into account even for menial jobs.
imo, you don't 'learn to learn' a lot in schools prior to college - you learn to memorize, regurgitate exactly, discard and start over.
olivianewtonjohn
Well-Known Member
Lol at a poster bringing up Bill Gates and Steve Jobs. Yeah because that is the norm. Love to see some statistics on this not just two billionaires who dropped out. Also you say very few people have jobs in your class? What did you graduate in? Also how do you think the job market is for people without college degrees? Pretty good?
Edit: And you criticize that video for not including getting a degree in something useful. Your right if you get a degree in a field with high demand and if it's a beneficial degree or in some cases mandatory then your more likely to get a job. That seems like common sense to me. Then you say smart people know not to goto college? You know there are more fields than liberal arts right. Seriously please don't give advice to anyone.
@SalamiCity
I still cant get over how moronic this statement is: "Also, the generalizations happen for a reason. Why do you think Bill Gates, and Steve Jobs dropped out of school? Because it was useless to them, and they started their empires."
LOL your thoughts seem to jump from one point to another with zero logical flow. I am guessing you didnt graduate with a degree in the STEM fields. Here instead of listing anecdotal evidence lets look at some statistics shall we?
http://everydaylife.globalpost.com/...uate-make-just-high-school-graduate-8703.html
"With a high school diploma only, the average full-time worker earned $652 per week in 2012, or $33,904 for 52 weeks, according to the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics. Bachelor's degree graduates earned an average of $1,066 per week, or $55,432 annually -- a difference of $21,528 per year."
"Not all college degrees bring equal financial rewards. The American Community Survey breaks down annual earnings for bachelor's degree graduates by type of major. Full-time employees with a bachelor's degree in science or engineering averaged $66,000 per year as of 2011, while business majors averaged $62,000 annually. Employees with an education major averaged $44,000 per year, while employed graduates in arts, humanities and other majors averaged $51,000. Self-employed workers averaged lower incomes for every major -- for example, $52,000 per year for science and engineering graduates."
Interesting.
Then you talk about how your professors didnt know anything? Why would you stay at that school/program if they did not know anything? Sounds like bad judgement to me. I am not at a top ranking university just your average state college and I am routinely amazed by how much my professors know. In fact I was amazed by how much some of my professors at community college knew as well (one of them could have easily been teaching at a top university IMO).
Edit: And you criticize that video for not including getting a degree in something useful. Your right if you get a degree in a field with high demand and if it's a beneficial degree or in some cases mandatory then your more likely to get a job. That seems like common sense to me. Then you say smart people know not to goto college? You know there are more fields than liberal arts right. Seriously please don't give advice to anyone.
@SalamiCity
I still cant get over how moronic this statement is: "Also, the generalizations happen for a reason. Why do you think Bill Gates, and Steve Jobs dropped out of school? Because it was useless to them, and they started their empires."
LOL your thoughts seem to jump from one point to another with zero logical flow. I am guessing you didnt graduate with a degree in the STEM fields. Here instead of listing anecdotal evidence lets look at some statistics shall we?
http://everydaylife.globalpost.com/...uate-make-just-high-school-graduate-8703.html
"With a high school diploma only, the average full-time worker earned $652 per week in 2012, or $33,904 for 52 weeks, according to the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics. Bachelor's degree graduates earned an average of $1,066 per week, or $55,432 annually -- a difference of $21,528 per year."
"Not all college degrees bring equal financial rewards. The American Community Survey breaks down annual earnings for bachelor's degree graduates by type of major. Full-time employees with a bachelor's degree in science or engineering averaged $66,000 per year as of 2011, while business majors averaged $62,000 annually. Employees with an education major averaged $44,000 per year, while employed graduates in arts, humanities and other majors averaged $51,000. Self-employed workers averaged lower incomes for every major -- for example, $52,000 per year for science and engineering graduates."
Interesting.
Then you talk about how your professors didnt know anything? Why would you stay at that school/program if they did not know anything? Sounds like bad judgement to me. I am not at a top ranking university just your average state college and I am routinely amazed by how much my professors know. In fact I was amazed by how much some of my professors at community college knew as well (one of them could have easily been teaching at a top university IMO).
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olivianewtonjohn
Well-Known Member
Looks like this thread has no purpose. The OP doesn't seem to be here anymore.
lwien
Well-Known Member
Since when does ANY thread over 2 pages long have anything to do with the OP?
Hoof Hearted
Vapesallday Industries
Jeremy Driscoll
Well-Known Member
What did I miss?
nopartofme
Over the falls, in a barrel
Clukx is the OP!If I would have remembered that the OP of this thread is the same OP from these threads:
http://fuckcombustion.com/threads/what-is-wrong-with-people.11170/#post-476335
http://fuckcombustion.com/threads/hoa-sucks.11327/#post-483411
I never would have responded...........
...had to do something entertaining during your extended absence
. Anyway, besides having read all the infighting going on in YOUR thread, did you come across anything helpful?
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clukx
Well-Known Member
I agree and disagree at the same time with the thought that college isnt helpful this may be somewhat true to get a job but what about getting a high paying job? I know in most cases you just gotta know somebody but in my case...i dont.
Its really hard to save enough money to start your own legitimate business...
Its really hard to save enough money to start your own legitimate business...
What position/jobs have you recently been targeting with your resumes, if I may ask?
lwien
Well-Known Member
olivianewtonjohn
Well-Known Member
Medical field
or anything where there is expected job growth and demand. If its something that the average moronic member of our society cant learn between watching reality shows then thats a good sign.There are careers in the medical field that start at 70K and can in some rare cases go into the millions. Go look around. One nice thing you can try is google "______ bls". Where the ___ is what ever career your interested in.
Searching "electrical engineer bls" brings up statistics that say in 2010 the median pay was $87K/$41 an hour....The projected job growth from 2010-2020 is 6% (slower than average).
Next I searched dentist blvs 146K median pay/$70 an hour....Projected job growth 21%
Its not the end all be all but might help get you on the right path. It definitely helped me
EDIT: Also you need to change your attitude and take a shot of man the fuck up
Saying in most cases you need to know someone to get a job is a pathetic copout. Yes it would help but do you think the only people getting jobs are people who knew other people? Really.
2nd EDIT: Also you dont even acknowledge the helpful posts that many others have already posted? Yes the thread got off track but maybe you should go back through it to see some of the helpful responses you have already received?
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clukx
Well-Known Member
I will have to do that. I must admit i kind of scrolled through all the fighting and might have missed some great replies im sorry guys im not ignoring you ill read them now!Medical field
There are careers in the medical field that start at 70K and can in some rare cases go into the millions. Go look around. One nice thing you can try is google "______ bls". Where the ___ is what ever career your interested in.
Searching "electrical engineer bls" brings up statistics that say in 2010 the median pay was $87K/$41 an hour....The projected job growth from 2010-2020 is 6% (slower than average).
Next I searched dentist blvs 146K median pay/$70 an hour....Projected job growth 21%
Its not the end all be all but might help get you on the right path. It definitely helped me
EDIT: Also you need to change your attitude and take a shot of man the fuck up
Saying in most cases you need to know someone to get a job is a pathetic copout. Yes it would help but do you think the only people getting jobs are people who knew other people? Really.
2nd EDIT: Also you dont even acknowledge the helpful posts that many others have already posted? Yes the thread got off track but maybe you should go back through it to see some of the helpful responses you have already received?
And been trying to look at jobs that are new to me or decently paying part time jobs i dont care to make a ton of money either i just want time to enjoy life go fishing learn to do things ive always wanted to try..
I like this idea, also i might look into a little more education but thats not a route i really wanna go down
Mod note: When possible, please avoid making back-to-back posts in a thread. Use the Edit feature located at the bottom of your posts. Posts merged.
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PhotoRider
Diagnosed with level 11 G.A.S.
To the OP.
You only live once... how secure is that job really. One day a RIF could happen and your are hit. Why sale your soul for money. Do what you love. So what's the worst, you become unemployed. That is temporary.
From my experience I always grew more by changing employment. Shit you spend 1/3 of your life working, enjoy it. Otherwise you will always think about when...
Have a deliberate life...
Best of luck.
You only live once... how secure is that job really. One day a RIF could happen and your are hit. Why sale your soul for money. Do what you love. So what's the worst, you become unemployed. That is temporary.
From my experience I always grew more by changing employment. Shit you spend 1/3 of your life working, enjoy it. Otherwise you will always think about when...
Have a deliberate life...
Best of luck.
clukx
Well-Known Member
Well, heres an update first on the current job, i might get a raise and my own office in a new building coming the first of the year so i might see how that plays out.
Second the headshop guy offered me part time hours to work around my "real job" and possible full time with a check after a while. Granted ill be busting my ass for a while but ill get a chance to see if thats something id really like to do and ill have extra holiday money.
Whar are your thoughts guys?
Second the headshop guy offered me part time hours to work around my "real job" and possible full time with a check after a while. Granted ill be busting my ass for a while but ill get a chance to see if thats something id really like to do and ill have extra holiday money.
Whar are your thoughts guys?