Getting people high by accident - second hand vapor

[Apathyball]

I'm pretty new to marijuana and I couldn't find anything using the search feature, so I apologize if this has been asked before.

How easy is it for someone to get high from second hand vapor? My wife will routinely say that she feels a little weird while I'm vaping, but she's a bit silly at times so I assumed it was mostly in her head. She's never used marijuana before.

The other night I was vaping some concentrate with the Enano. We were in a 300-400sq ft room and I was sitting next to an open window, blowing all the vapor out the window (or at least towards the window). After awhile my wife says she feels weird and I notice that she can't walk well. I helped put her to bed and she was completely out of it. Massively blood shot eyes, horrible coordination, sense of time all screwed up... she was definitely super high.

Is this a common issue or is she just super sensitive to marijuana? I'm not smoking in a car with her or something; there's a decent amount of ventilation in a decent sized room.

I'm being more careful to avoid this happening again and it seems to be working. The whole thing just struck me as strange though. Is it?

Thanks guys

 

[His_Highness]

If you're blowing the vapor toward the open window, and the wind isn't blowing inward, and she's not in the path ... I can't see how she could be getting 'seriously physically' affected. If she were in the direct path or in an enclosed room without the windows open ... the term is 'contact high'.

I don't hide my use anymore but I don't use in proximity to my 'working' family members due to the possibility of random drug testing.

 

[GuyLeDuche]

When I used to live in a "smoke" sensitive environment I had a small desk fan at the window, pointed out. With an open door/window on the opposite side of the room I got very nice fresh air circulation, and could actually watch the smoke being pulled into the fan. I'm not sure how much she could be getting, but with concentrates and low/no tolerance people better to be safe.

 

[flotntoke]

If there are still actives in your exhale (and think there usually are from most), she could definitely be feeling some effects. Would think this would be worse with concentrates, and an open window doesn't always suck air out of the room. Sometimes it just moves everything around in the room a bit more. Some people seem much more affected by the smallest amounts (and not just because of no built up tolerance) - be that first hand or second hand.

My dog often enjoys my second hand hits. Maybe not the best trick to teach him, but this started when I used the EQ daily. I would sometimes turn the fan on and point the whip in his direction. He usually yearns for whatever goes into my mouth, so he would try it out same as the end of a cookie or sandwich. Now, he will often sit there next to me with his nose perched up as soon as I drop the nano on a bubbler. Not always, but about half the time. Once he gets his fill (usually 3 or 4 good second hand hits), he'll back off and go about his business. He usually seems affected by it. Gets a little goofy and wants to play, or will just lay on his back and roll around. After 1/2 hour or so he he just chills out and seems to enjoy the relaxation. Now he does weigh less than 20 pounds, is getting hits blown right in his face, and can't really tell me how he is affected. But, he definitely seems to get something from it and has some idea of what that is and whether or not he wants some.

So, think it is a good bet that she is getting buzzed by second hand vapor. May want to try the fan tip @GuyLeDuche just mentioned above or vape in a different room.

 

[Derrrpp]

My first thought, since you're blowing it out the window, would be that it's unlikely that she would feel any effects. BUT... She could be getting something if the wind was blowing in through the window and blowing the vapor back in her direction... So I would say it's possible. And I would think the use of concentrates would exacerbate the second hand vapor issue as well.

 

[Apathyball]

I definitely underestimated how much it can affect people second-hand.

My dog often enjoys my second hand hits. Maybe not the best trick to teach him, but this started when I used the EQ daily. I would sometimes turn the fan on and point the whip in his direction. He usually yearns for whatever goes into my mouth, so he would try it out same as the end of a cookie or sandwich. Now, he will often sit there next to me with his nose perched up as soon as I drop the nano on a bubbler. Not always, but about half the time. Once he gets his fill (usually 3 or 4 good second hand hits), he'll back off and go about his business. He usually seems affected by it. Gets a little goofy and wants to play, or will just lay on his back and roll around. After 1/2 hour or so he he just chills out and seems to enjoy the relaxation. Now he does weigh less than 20 pounds, is getting hits blown right in his face, and can't really tell me how he is affected. But, he definitely seems to get something from it and has some idea of what that is and whether or not he wants some.

My friend's great dane is always very interested when I vape. I've never noticed any effects on her, but she does weigh 120lbs so I don't expect much.

When I used to live in a "smoke" sensitive environment I had a small desk fan at the window, pointed out. With an open door/window on the opposite side of the room I got very nice fresh air circulation, and could actually watch the smoke being pulled into the fan. I'm not sure how much she could be getting, but with concentrates and low/no tolerance people better to be safe.

That fan idea is a great one, thanks! You guys are right that the window may just be blowing it back into the room.

I'm definitely going to be more careful, especially around friends who get drug tested. Even though it's legal in WA now, companies are going to take awhile to adjust (if they ever do).

 

[scoobie-doobie]

I say it's very possible. My wife, like yours, had a history of not partaking. There have been a few occasions when medical conditions prompted her to try. I would never have believed anyone could be so adversely affected by cannabis if I hadn't witnessed it myself, but it can happen. Do your girl a favor and leave the room. Believe it or not, cannabis can be a very unpleasant experience for some folks.

 

[NorVape]

Or this might be an example of the good old placebo?

I've seen people getting second hand high after hours upon hours in smokefilled rooms, but a miniscule amount of vapor in an ventilated room sounds weird.

But, as people have pointed out here, different people react differently to cannabis

 

[Justpassedu]

I am actually wondering this very same thing as we had a party at the house a few nights ago. I Broke out a vape and brought it to the family , normally people who don't or never have smoke where interested and gave it a try and every one was laughing and having fun. My cousin who is pregnantw as around and I was not sure of 2nd hand vapor so we all made sure to be far away from her. Also my dog is always interested when I vape , she always wants to put her nose right up by the mp and same reaction as the posters dog above. She will get playful and than just chill out and relax.

 

[t-dub]

My spouse is a safety professional, routinely drug tested, and very knowledgeable on the subject. IMHO, and our experience, it is impossible to get a "contact" high or test positive on a dug test from vapor exhaled in a room or out of a window. Most of the actives are stripped out of the vapor by your lungs and any small amounts left dispersing into the atmosphere wouldn't be enough to give the required dose to alter a mind or show up on a drug test. Pure placebo and hysteria is all I see here.

 

[Joel W.]

Here is a study on first hand vs second hand smoke with mj and cigs

http://www.ukcia.org/research/ComparisonOfSmoke.pdf

Not sure wtf im reading though.

 

[t-dub]

Here is a study released May 13, 2015, about 2 days ago, by Johns Hopkins Medicine and published in the Journal of Alcohol and Drug Dependence:

Note this study is on smoke, not vapor.

‘Extreme’ Exposure to Secondhand Cannabis Smoke Causes Mild Intoxication

See related article:

Non-smoker exposure to secondhand cannabis smoke II: Effect of room ventilation on the physiological, subjective, and behavioral/cognitive effects

The nitty gritty on this deal: The "scientists", whoever they are, sealed 12 people in a 10 foot by 13 foot Plexiglas room. 6 of them were blazing joints heavily. They did a round with fans on, then fans off, then took blood, urine, saliva and hair samples and measured them for THC. Of course the ventilated people were unaffected by the experience but the non ventilated group, after an hour of exposure to the smoke, tested positive for THC in urine and blood for up to 3 hours after the experiment. When the room was not ventilated, the nonsmokers did report experiencing some symptoms of a high, such as feeling “pleasant,” tired and less alert. In a cognitive test afterward, the researchers found nonsmoking participants in the unventilated room completed the test faster but made more mistakes than when fans were running.

The small size and lack of a placebo where sessions were conducted with smokers using cannabis without THC are considered limitations to this study.

So they had to hotbox people in a small, plastic, unventilated room to obtain a result and it was mild at best . . .

Highlights

• Exposure to secondhand cannabis smoke results in absorption of cannabinoids.
• Secondhand exposure can produce mild subjective and behavioral/cognitive effects.
• Room ventilation ameliorates the effects of secondhand cannabis smoke exposure.

Conclusions: Room ventilation has a pronounced effect on exposure to secondhand cannabis smoke. Under extreme, unventilated conditions, secondhand cannabis smoke exposure can produce detectable levels of THC in blood and urine, minor physiological and subjective drug effects, and minor impairment on a task requiring psychomotor ability and working memory.

http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/news/media/releases/extreme_exposure_to_secondhand_cannabis_smoke_causes_mild_intoxication

http://www.drugandalcoholdependence.com/article/S0376-8716%2815%2900160-X/abstract

 

[SoulCaptivesAreFree]

(...) it is impossible to get a "contact" high or test positive on a dug test from vapor exhaled in a room or out of a window (...)

Contact high is very real, i've experienced it myself and seen friends expeirence it.

But contact high does not mean that the person getting high has any actives in their system:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contact_high

I have not experienced it with cannabis (could be because most of the time i'm high anyway ) but multiple times with mdma (which i don't take myself because of negative side effects) and i've witnessed a friend getting an intense contact high from LSD. I don't believe it's placebo either - it's all about the vibes

 

[CarolKing]

I have been using cannabis for a long time. My husband doesn't partake because he has a job where he gets random drug tests throughout the year. I used to smoke cannabis up until 2 yrs and 5 months ago. Now I vaporize and not once has my husband tested positive for cannabis over the last 15 years or so. Often he is in the same room with me.

Originally I did worry about that but it's not a problem. My husband never feels medicated from my second hand vapor. It could be the power of suggestion.

I suppose if you directly blew cannabis vapor in her mouth and she inhaled it - but that would be a different scenario.

 

[Chill Dude]

"Extreme Exposure" is the key here. According to the study that @t-dub posted, there were 6 people in a 10' by 13' room who were smoking heavily and another 6 people being exposed to the second hand smoke. Each of the 6 cannabis smokers were given 10 high potency joints!! That's 60 joints being smoked in a 10' 13' room!!

I have no idea of the OP'S useage pattern, but it's probably vaping .1 to .5g per session rather than smoking 60 joints with his non using wife in the room. I'm going with placebo effect and a non user becoming anxious of possibility of intoxication which really doesn't exist...

The researchers must have worked hard to identify 6 smokers with an extremely high tolerance with the ability to blaze 10 high potency joints! This is not typical useage for 99% of us LOL...

 

[tiukauleh]

edit - sorry i was real high when i wrote it.

 

[t-dub]

it is impossible to get a "contact" high or test positive on a d[r]ug test from vapor exhaled in a room or out of a window

Contact high is very real, i've experienced it myself and seen friends expeirence it.

But contact high does not mean that the person getting high has any actives in their system:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contact_high

I have not experienced it with cannabis (could be because most of the time i'm high anyway ) but multiple times with mdma (which i don't take myself because of negative side effects) and i've witnessed a friend getting an intense contact high from LSD. I don't believe it's placebo either - it's all about the vibes

From the much needed context department: I guess you didn't notice that in my post you quoted I put the word "contact" in quotes. That means I was referring to having "contact" with second hand vapor or smoke. The contact high you reference is nothing but placebo and hysteria IMHO. Your claim that you can actually get high from being near someone who has taken a pill like MDMA or LSD is patently absurd. Enjoy your fantasy "vibes".

 

[SoulCaptivesAreFree]

Enjoy your fantasy "vibes".

Hehe

I will enjoy them! and i'm in good company, you should read the speech David Nichols gave on Albert Hofmann's discovery (or actually maybe you shouldn't ) - contact high is nothing compared to that theory...

Placebo depends on expectations, if people have never heard of the concept (and not have had an experience like that before) experience it they tend to believe in contact high

I feel pity for you if you have never been moved by music in a way that you could call it a contact high. But no worries you can feel sorry for me for having such silly notions

have a good time stranger and please try to treat people respectful when it comes to their idiosyncratic beliefs, that shows how secure you are in your own beliefs much more than ridiculing

 

[t-dub]

Hehe

I will enjoy them! and i'm in good company, you should read the speech David Nichols gave on Albert Hofmann's discovery (or actually maybe you shouldn't ) - contact high is nothing compared to that theory...

Placebo depends on expectations, if people have never heard of the concept (and not have had an experience like that before) experience it they tend to believe in contact high

I feel pity for you if you have never been moved by music in a way that you could call it a contact high. But no worries you can feel sorry for me for having such silly notions

have a good time stranger and please try to treat people respectful when it comes to their idiosyncratic beliefs, that shows how secure you are in your own beliefs much more than ridiculing

Science is a bitch . . . war is hell. My comments are withing the OP's statement "getting people high by accident with second hand vapor". Yours are not. Questioning my personal experience . . . in life . . . is beyond arrogant . . .

 

[macbill]

I remember in my High School daze, we would load up a small car with 5 or 6 people, roll up the windows, and smoke til it was horribly uncomfortable: 5 -6 joints back when weed was the pressed, seedy and stemmy bricks from Mexico: a very mediocre quality. We'd do it in a garage: when we opened the doors, smoke billowed out. Wow, that was asinine. It's amazing I'm still alive.

 

[poonman]

I believe in second hand vapor and have stated so in another thread .

1. Not all rooms are ventilated the same way as in a
lab test setting .

2. Let's add small children into the mix . Would you still
feel confident that second hand vapor will Not occur and have it's effects .

 

[t-dub]

2. Let's add small children into the mix . Would you still
feel confident that second hand vapor will Not occur and have it's effects .

If you are vaping around small children you need to have your head examined. Also, the lab setting to get a result was an extremely small, plastic hotbox with 60 joints ablaze. Any normal sized room, even if you just blew your vapor up at the ceiling would be ventilated enough.

 

[DDave]

Chiming in with my on comments above...

- I recall back in the combustion days, that exhaling a hit and someone else directly inhaling it did have effect, so I believe some goodies are still exhaled and...

- OP may have overlooked the missing brownie he left on the counter that wifey mistook for a midnight snack...

 

[poonman]

If you are vaping around small children you need to have your head examined. Also, the lab setting to get a result was an extremely small, plastic hotbox with 60 joints ablaze. Any normal sized room, even if you just blew your vapor up at the ceiling would be ventilated enough.

No , I'm not advocating usage around small children .
But I do think the possibilities of that happening in some family
structures today is plausible . Just like when we were young and we were allowed
to be in smoke filled rooms/cars , because it was the attitude
of the time back then .

I brought up children , and pets also .
because sometimes they do Not have the option of been
away from second hand vapor , and will be subjected to it .
Whether they get a contact high or just an adverse reaction .

I'm not confident in having children around second hand smoke ,
nor around second hand vapors . that's all I meant . In a roundabout
way , I was asking you to play Russian Roulette , using your kids .

The OP's wife had adverse effects , that was real .
Maybe the vapors did not air out or had dissipated completely .
When my friends come over to visit , and enter my Cave .
They def. do noticed , I've been vaping . They can wave
at the hanging mist all they want , but they're breathing
some in . No they do not get high , they're long time users .
Where as the OP's wife is not used to it , and could have affected
her differently .

We should learn more about this topic in the coming years .
As e-cigs and vaping is becoming more prevalent . I know my
company has enacted a No e-cig policy for indoors .

 

[Herb-nerd]

I would chalk this up to the immense ability of the human brain.

It is likely a contact high rather than second hand exposure. In-fact i would put money on it - i just can't see your description causing any significant raise in her blood plasma levels. I read a study a year or so back to re-assure my friend from the army and it said it was difficult to achieve any changes in cannabinoid levels of the test subjects using second hand smoke under realistic conditions.

Alexander Shulgin (known for popularizing the use of MDMA as an empathogen and inventing a plethora of psychotropic substances) writes in his book PIHKAL about the event that cause his interest in organic chemistry.
He describes waiting to be anesthetized before an operation in hospital and insisting he would fight the urge to sleep and stay fully conscious. A nurse handed him a glass of orange juice with a white substance in the bottom and instructed him to drink it - Shura thought this to be a surreptitious attempt to sedate him and so drunk the orange juice and set his mind to staying fully vigilant and alert.
Before he knew it he was waking up from the anaesthetic and when he was able asked the nurse what it was in the bottom of his glass that cause such a profound effect - sugar she replied.

"While in the Navy, Shulgin was given a glass of orange juice by a military nurse prior to surgery for a thumb infection. Shulgin drank the juice assuming that it contained a narcotic, then fell asleep rapidly. Upon waking, however, he learned that no psychoactive drug had been present in the juice. The experience made him aware of the influence of placebos over the human mind.[8] "