Gel capsules

invertedisdead

Weapons of VAS Destruction
No issue with tightening as i eat some couple minutes after, and no dissasembling, nor taste, or oil on my fingers.
They have leaked from the edge not the separation


I'm french, not even a question to ask :rofl: olive oil



I put the link above, it is pullulan.
Thought it was hpmc at first, but pullulan seems even better anyway...

I'm just surprised you didn't use butter 🇫🇷 😁😁

I'm not familiar with pullulan, but I found this with some quick searching.

"water vapour interplays differently with the capsule types examined. Pullulan, the most hygroscopic of the excipients described here, creates a perceived tackiness when holding capsules for more than 30 seconds.

HPMC capsule shells have a three-fold lower average moisture content than hard pullulan and gelatin capsule shells … and are therefore thought to be the logical choice to formulate moisture-sensitive APIs."

I switched to HPMC a few years ago after reading it was more gastroresistant than gelatin.
 

Shadooz

Well-Known Member
I'm just surprised you didn't use butter 🇫🇷 😁😁
Two school :lol: butter is for grandma recipe, with cholesterol..
A lot move to cooking with only olive oil those days, like me

I let butter to marrocan :rofl: who do it since centuries... we call it "beurre de marrakech" here

I switched to HPMC a few years ago after reading it was more gastroresistant than gelatin.
I've readen about gelatin and hpmc, why i've bought "vegetarian" caps. I wasn't aware of pullulan till today

creates a perceived tackiness when holding capsules for more than 30 seconds.
I perceived nothing while holding, and it has reacted with the oil only. But some are perfect sealed, just became floopy, but without leak..

May i move to HPMC,
or just put raw ABV straight, no leak, and no oily mess :)
 
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Cheebsy

Organicly inVerted
I've done my first caps today, with 000 pullulan caps.
But a lot leaked really soon, with good grade caps from amazon..

I don't know how u keep them unleaked ? Cause right now i'm going to make them as i use them... they're all floopy :cry:

I was eating my abv raw till then, first time using oil, but the taste can't be hide as easily as with raw abv in simple recipes..

I use the exact same branded caps. Mine are a different size but they should be the same or very similar. Here's a link to mine.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01GRTUQ7O/ref=cm_sw_r_apanp_QrColpPEfzd7e

I use coconut oil, I don't remove the abv from the mixture so the slurry is obviously less viscous than plain coconut oil at the same temp. I only see seepage when the ancient temp is high enough to make the oil particularly runny.

Hope that helps mate 👍
 

shredder

Well-Known Member
Back when I first started make capsules I read to only use gel caps, not vegetarian caps. So that's all I've used for roughly ten years. Along with coconut oil, lecithin, and some form of cannabis.

I must have bought ten thousand or more capsules in that time. My last purchase was for 3000 gel caps. I currently have 11 varieties of capsules.

My only leakers we're from capsules left at room temperature for a couple days.

Refrigeration solidifies coconut oil, and coconut oil doesn't melt gel caps. So it's a good match.
 

shredder

Well-Known Member
for me, this has been a very good thread. lots of information.
thanks!

i am now messing with dry abv in caps vs. mixed in with food. was thinking if i took a big swig of dairy with the caps, it may speed up the effects?
a buddy puts rso in peanut butter to add kick.

bob

Most of us use coconut oil and lecithin in cannabis capsules. Coconut oil can speed up the effects because of how our bodies digest it. Lecithin works as an emulsifier. Cannabis oil by itself does not digest in our guts very efficiently, so coconut oil helps with digestion. Lecithin makes the oil particles smaller and easier for us to digest. So you get more bang for your buck using lecithin and coconut oil.

Cheap coconut oil seems to work fine. If the taste or smell of coconut puts you off there is unscented that doesn't have the taste or smell of coconuts. For lecithin most recommend sunflower over soy. Ive used liquid and powdered lecithin. Both work well. The liquid is easier to work with for making capsules imo.

In my experiments with plain decarbed buds ground into powder and capsules filled with it took about 2 hours to kick in and the effects lasted 2-3 hours. With less ground buds, but with coconut oil and lecithin it took 45 minutes for lift off and it lasts 5+ hours.

BTW I started putting mct oil (made from coconut oil) on our two outside cat's food. I think they have worms and getting pills in them has been about impossible, lol. They both lost weight over this summer. I read about using coconut oil on their food helps get rid of worms and is generally good for their health. And they seem to love it. Too soon to say it worked for worms or weight gain, I just started using it today.
 
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Shadooz

Well-Known Member
Back when I first started make capsules I read to only use gel caps, not vegetarian caps.
I've readen the opposite, gelatin caps being to weak for oil, compared to hmpc. people saying to only buy vegetarian one.

But it seems pullulan being too weak too..

am now messing with dry abv in caps vs. mixed in with food.
Coconut oil can speed up the effects because of how our bodies digest it.
I used to cook abv raw, and it kicks way more than my first oil (but i've put a lot of fresh CBD, only decarb, with abv, so unrelevant for the effect).
Abv Oil is hard to mix with food if u want to hide the taste. And it's an over messy step to put in caps,..

so if raw abv caps kicks too, i will no longer use oil...
for now i had no issue digesting abv...
my highest trip was with abv straight into a "fondue savoyarde"🧑‍🍳

Will have to try dry, or just water cured, ABV caps..
 
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Shadooz

Well-Known Member

I was more comparing them about their structural strenght with oil.
I'm not vegan :rofl:

I eat gelatine in the french "caps" :rofl:without abv, for now :evil::rofl:

gros-saucisson-bride.jpg


Then, yes, their is controversy about hpmc manufacturing and all the solvent...
Reason only pullulan is allow, as vegetarian, in some pharma (like japan).

I Have only one pullulan pack, of 1000..
the floopyness and leak may come from manufacturing. But it seems a good one, well known from amazon (british) and @Cheebsy use the same, so...

I don't think i can premade them with oil, while i can with raw abv..
maybe only hpmc can handle long term oil unleaking..
 

Shadooz

Well-Known Member
20210928-053407.jpg


Only after one night in fridge, i will def not premade them with pullulan... :cry:

Sry back .. to back again... tell a friend...

"
Guess who's back, back again
Shady's back, tell a friend
Guess who's back, guess who's back
Guess who's back, guess who's back
Guess who's back, guess who's back
Guess who's back

[Verse 1: Eminem]
I've created a monster, 'cause nobody wants to
See Marshall no more, they want Shady, I'm chopped liver
Well, if you want Shady, this is what I'll give ya
A little bit of weed mixed with some hard liquor
Some vodka that'll jump start my heart quicker

Than a shock when I get shocked at the hospital
By the doctor when I'm not co-operating
When I'm rocking the table while he's operating
(Hey!)
You waited this long, now stop debating
'Cause I'm back, I'm on the rag and ovulating
I know that you got a job, Ms. Cheney
But your husband's heart problem's complicating
So the FCC won't let me be
Or let me be me, so let me see
They try to shut me down on MTV
But it feels so empty without me
So, come on and dip, bum on your lips
Fuck that! Cum on your lips and some on your tits
And get ready, 'cause this shit's about to get heavy

I just settled all my lawsuits, fuck you, Debbie!
"
Back, i lead the pack, but not like Minaj, not like her "big bank".
Cbd isn't the same muse... :rofl:

"
I can you see niggas hatin' with the door close
Now I'm lookin' for a glove with the sparkle on it
And my CBD got chocolate on it
Big bank take small ass shit
Bank account on some tall ass shit
"

:cough:
 
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Cheebsy

Organicly inVerted
Hey @Shadooz I have some news!

I've kept checking my test vegetarian cap throughout the last few hours. It's been kept in the fridge on a paper towel. Yesterday everything seemed normal, this morning it seemed normal but I had a slight oily residue on my finger. Checking it just now, about 30 hours after filling it, it's definitely leaking and the middle of the larger part of the cap is definitely deformed but holding most of the oil. There is residue on the towel now too. I guess olive oil is no good for these caps. It's still in there so I'll let you know how long till it's totally useless, I'm guessing you'll know that soccer than me though!

Stay tuned.... I received my gelatine caps today and have just filled another test cap with olive oil for you 👍 I'll post again in a day or two
 

Shadooz

Well-Known Member
There is residue on the towel now too. I guess olive oil is no good for these caps. It's still in there so I'll let you know how long till it's totally useless, I'm guessing you'll know that soccer than me though
I had no leak and one night after, quite all melt...
Thought coconut get the same viscosity/consistency but it seems not.
Coconut won't grow here, i have none in my local market, only internet import...

I Will only take the pullulan straight after making them to finish my oil..
and then go with raw abv, i guess...
the caps will hold them and it will be way faster, easier to fill them with dry abv..

No more oil making to me for now...
 
Shadooz,
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shredder

Well-Known Member
I had no leak and one night after, quite all melt...
Thought coconut get the same viscosity/consistency but it seems not.
Coconut won't grow here, i have none in my local market, only internet import...

I Will only take the pullulan straight after making them to finish my oil..
and then go with raw abv, i guess...
the caps will hold them and it will be way faster, easier to fill them with dry abv..

No more oil making to me for now...

Coconut oil works well because it solidifies below room temperature. Coconuts don't grow here either but it's not hard to find, even in my rural area.

Other oil that solidify would work as well. Like lard, or bacon grease. Mmmm.....bacon!
 

Shadooz

Well-Known Member
Other oil that solidify would work as well. Like lard, or bacon grease. Mmmm.....bacon!
The reason i put my "french cap" above :rofl:
We smoke porc with herbs since centuries, their is the fat needed.
I just have to found good saisoning 🧑‍🍳:rofl:

Coconuts don't grow here either but it's not hard to find, even in my rural area.
Never taste coconut as oil. but i'm way more salty than sugar for cooking. Olive go with salt, coconut less i guess...

I have to move to a specific store, and the only coconut oil they got is solid...
But your caps seemed to be done with liquid

View attachment 10238
Mine say hello. Decarbed rosin.
 
Shadooz,
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Chicken No Name

Dazed and confused
The reason i put my "french cap" above :rofl:
We smoke porc with herbs since centuries, their is the fat needed.
I just have to found good saisoning 🧑‍🍳:rofl:


Never taste coconut as oil. but i'm way more salty than sugar for cooking. Olive go with salt, coconut less i guess...

I have to move to a specific store, and the only coconut oil they got is solid...
But your caps seemed to be done with liquid
Pic taken just having made on a warm day. They solidify at room temp.
 

shredder

Well-Known Member
I have to move to a specific store, and the only coconut oil they got is solid...
But your caps seemed to be done with liquid
The difference between the solid looking coconut oil and liquid is just a few degrees of temperature. Above 76°F it's liquid, below that and it's semi solid.

When I use coconut oil for capsules I gently heat it to make it liquid.

As a liquid it's easier to mix with cannabis and or cannabis oil and to fill capsules with.
 

shredder

Well-Known Member
From another experiment I have several jars of powdered marijuana. It's feco, mct oil, and lecithin mixed with tapioca maltodextrin.

A typical dose for me is .85 grams. I filled a size 00 cap with it and it was .33 grams.

So I half filled a (gel) cap and put six 4.5mg drops of infused mct oil in the half full capsule. The oil quickly mixed with the maltodextrin. Then I filled to the top with the powdered maltodextrin.

For four days now I've left it at room temperature on a tissue, and there is no sign of leaking or distorting of the gel cap.

It's more work, but I think I have a way to make capsules that don't have to be refrigerated.
 

invertedisdead

Weapons of VAS Destruction
I use organic coconut oil and cellulose capsules and have had the current batch out for months at room temp, weather in the 90s+ Fahrenheit lately. Of course I still try to keep them in a relatively cool and dark location.

I usually leave the bulk of the capsules in the refrigerator, but keep a small travel tube in my vape-case filled and at the ready.

Next project might be microdose mushroom capsules 👾👾👾👾👾
 

Cheebsy

Organicly inVerted
Interesting link @shredder

Another case of science proving user assumptions and experience. 👍😁

Conclusions​

In conclusion, co-administration of dietary lipids or pharmaceutical lipid excipients may substantially increase the systemic exposure to orally administered cannabis or cannabis-based medicines. Our data suggest that the primary mechanism of the increased absorption of cannabinoids in the presence of lipids is intestinal lymphatic transport. The amount of lipids present in cannabis-containing foods, or following a high-fat meal, is sufficient to activate intestinal lymphatic transport and lead to increased systemic exposure to cannabinoids. The increase in systemic exposure to cannabinoids in humans is of potentially high clinical importance as it could turn a barely effective dose of orally administered cannabis into a highly effective one, or indeed a therapeutic dose into a toxic one. Therefore, it is important for cannabis-prescribing clinicians and those who self-medicate with cannabis to carefully consider the effect of the co-administration of lipids on the therapeutic outcomes of orally administered cannabis or cannabis-based medicines

I didn't think there was a "toxic" dose... It's this identifying the possible effect of nausea as a toxic response?
 

Shadooz

Well-Known Member
20210928-053407.jpg


Only after one night in fridge, i will def not premade them with pullulan... :cry:

Sry back .. to back again... tell a friend...

"
Guess who's back, back again
Shady's back, tell a friend
Guess who's back, guess who's back
Guess who's back, guess who's back
Guess who's back, guess who's back
Guess who's back

[Verse 1: Eminem]
I've created a monster, 'cause nobody wants to
See Marshall no more, they want Shady, I'm chopped liver
Well, if you want Shady, this is what I'll give ya
A little bit of weed mixed with some hard liquor
Some vodka that'll jump start my heart quicker

Than a shock when I get shocked at the hospital
By the doctor when I'm not co-operating
When I'm rocking the table while he's operating
(Hey!)
You waited this long, now stop debating
'Cause I'm back, I'm on the rag and ovulating
I know that you got a job, Ms. Cheney
But your husband's heart problem's complicating
So the FCC won't let me be
Or let me be me, so let me see
They try to shut me down on MTV
But it feels so empty without me
So, come on and dip, bum on your lips
Fuck that! Cum on your lips and some on your tits
And get ready, 'cause this shit's about to get heavy

I just settled all my lawsuits, fuck you, Debbie!
"
Back, i lead the pack, but not like Minaj, not like her "big bank".
Cbd isn't the same muse... :rofl:

"
I can you see niggas hatin' with the door close
Now I'm lookin' for a glove with the sparkle on it
And my CBD got chocolate on it
Big bank take small ass shit
Bank account on some tall ass shit
"

:cough:
So i move to raw abv caps :lol:

So less work/mess than water cure and oil transfer...

And i can premade with pullulan

20211011-063651.jpg


Just have to eat lipid with it (cheese at 16h20 🥲), and it requires a bit more 000 caps than with the more concentrated oil.
But so easier...
maybe just a bit burpier..

I didn't think there was a "toxic" dose... It's this identifying
The Dl50 can't be determined with cannabinoid, that doesn't mean it isn't toxic.
Water is also after a certain ammount...

Light unwanted side effects are enough to diagnose toxicity levels.
Some may put "dry mouth" as toxicity effect.

Medical use, opposed to the "medicinal" uses most say to have, requires an augmented ammount of cannabinoid to be effective.. even more with edibles as assimilation is lower than vaporizer.

Just cannabis toxicity will make u sleep. vasovagal syncope is the worst i've seen, friends falling off, back when i was smoking...
or throw-out if your stomach don't bear edibles...


A lot of drugs needs to be taken while eating, to avoid any side effect. which can be ulcer for basics anti-inflamatory
 
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