Finally Got Certified for FL Medical - Issues and New Processes

[hibeam]

Maybe I am getting what I pay for with a certifying-only doc that costs me double the cheapest guy in town...I wonder. @His_Highness, maybe the insurance factor is somehow souring your deal? Fl says insurance will not cover MMJ, but with GP's and specialists there might be a grey area for lots of people that is actually a barrier to high THC.

As soon as I gave my doc my formal diagnosis paper from out of state, he told me I was lucky FL approved THC for migraine, that it would work great for me. Now I have had two review/revise visits since my initial rec meeting, will have to continue to go back every 70 days/150.00 for the year, but his staff told me if I was running out of medicine just to call and the doc would revise my rec accordingly.

At my card renewal time I am going to shop around for another doc and see if my current one puts me on a cheaper schedule!

I can use as much as 30mg of THC (the measured terp) a day now which does everything I want it to do, including totally hitting my mood reset button for half the day. I suspect this 30mg is on the very low end of what actually might be in the product tested.....pre-ground sealed flower. (I am not at liberty to discuss details.) Or, I am lucky to have super low tolerance.


The doc wants me to take like 200mg of high CBD product a day, even after I keep trying to tell him I seem to need only 2mg. Huh?

 

[stickstones]

Getting an up close view of the complete fucking up of the administration of such a harmless and helpful drug has renewed my faith in the ineptitude of our health care system as a whole.

 

[Baron23]

renewed my faith in the ineptitude of our health care system as a whole.

Lay this one at the feet of the fucking FL politicians that, with an enormous sense of self-importance and entitlement, decided that they knew better than the electorate that passed the constitutional amendment AND pay their salaries.

FL's program is a complete joke and right up with NY and Iowa to name just another two.

I hope Morgan and the others involved continue to sue the living shit out of the FL state goverment over this crap.

Sorry, but I believe in democracy, I have read the actual txt of the amendment, I have read the text of the law that defines marijuana by reference, and there is NO FUCKING WAY that what Tallahassee did meets the mandate from the voters.

Throw these assholes out of office and make them work to earn an honest wage.

 

[MinnBobber]

Getting an up close view of the complete fucking up of the administration of such a harmless and helpful drug has renewed my faith in the ineptitude of our health care system as a whole.

......................................................................................................................................
The only way to save Florida's med cannabis misery (and likewise here in Minnesota) is full legal adult cannabis so folks don't have to go thru the intentionally overly- bureaucratic, time-consuming, money siphoning, BS, .....designed to give the appearance of a system that cares about the patients but in reality, crafted to fuck them over every way possible.
Full legal for Florida and all states.......please.

 

[His_Highness]

Thank you for the updated info. I'm waffling on all of it. Right now, I don't want to put my name on that list and I have cancer. I would be considering it more if Florida would let us have flowers.

So if I have a card and am prescribed a certain dosage, I'm no longer supposed to drive? Or just not supposed to drive while I'm medicated?

The certification allows you to buy legally approved cannabis products from a legal dispensary. It doesn't mean you can't legally drive. Basically same old rules for driving that were in place before FL went medically legal.......you can't legally drive high/euphoric. The certification supposedly protects you from the police being able to charge you with possession if they find medically legal product on you or in the car.

Without reading any statutes..... I'm approaching this like alcohol.....I'm not keeping "opened" legal product in the body of the car while driving and I don't drive toasted.

Do I like the idea that they've linked the driver license to the certification.....Nope. Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get me

@hibeam - I think you nailed it as far as why my neurologist is starting with the lowest dose product. He's not cutting any corners by starting off with a higher does prescription since he is working through insurance. The neuro did say we could come back in 30 days and he'd increase the THC dosage if the lower dose product doesn't help. For what it's worth I have had two neuros "suggest" using "the real deal" in the interim. Go figure.....

 

[His_Highness]

Well.....we finally come to the end of our story. Unfortunately, it doesn't end with a "happily ever after".

I created this thread to document our FL experience so that other FL residents would have a better understanding of how to go about getting certified, where things stand and what they can expect. I'm not sure I've cleared up as much confusion for other FL residents as I had hoped.

Here's the first posts I made documenting the initial entry point to the FL process. By reading the initial posts and then reading this post you can get a complete picture of our experience.

http://fuckcombustion.com/threads/f...or-fl-medical-issues-and-new-processes.26491/

http://fuckcombustion.com/threads/f...-issues-and-new-processes.26491/#post-1229037

End of Story:
We went to the MJ certifying neurologist 30 days after he certified my wife for low dose. This would be our third appointment. Remember....The last thing the neuro said on our previous visit was "We can increase the dosage in 30 days if this dosage doesn't work for you".

We had high expectations (pun intended) for this third neuro visit since the dispensary agent told us how surprised she was that someone dealing with such consistent, severe migraine pain was prescribed low dose. The agent gave us a pamphlet of products and circled the ones that many of her migraine sufferers had success with. Armed with the neuro's statement about increasing the dose if it doesn't work and the dispensary agent's surprise and suggestions we went to the next neuro appointment.

Within 5 minutes of meeting with the neuro he updated the certification script with a higher dosage and suggested we take a look at his computer screen for the result. As soon as he suggested we check out his screen I knew this wasn't going to work out as we had hoped. The dosage had been updated ....to a higher dosage of CBD/low dose. WTF?!?! When I said I thought the increase in dosage would be to a higher level/percentage of THC he said "that's why I wanted you to see what's on my screen". The neuro showed me how he is "allowed" to update the certification screen and how those values will automatically define the cannabis type which in our case was ONLY low dose. He then stated that the only patients certified for higher doses of THC are "terminally ill".

I expressed my disbelief and dissatisfaction by stating that the dispensary agent had been surprised my wife wasn't prescribed something with more THC and then showed him her recommendations from the pamphlet. I asked him why do you think the agent was so surprised and he said "The agents are like used car salesman and there are places where you will find certifying doctors who will use "less than legal" ways to get around the patient's conditions so that they can prescribe products with higher levels of THC. He also said these kind of certifying doctors will end up costing you upwards of $400 for their certification where he is using our insurance so it's costing us nothing and he is actually treating my wife's migraines. I wanted call bullshit on the "he's treating my wife's migraines" because the neuro who recommended the MJ neuro is truly treating my wife's condition while all the MJ neuro did was read over her history so he could "claim" he was following the state's and insurance protocol. While he did read through her entire 5 years of medical history.... In no way did he even discuss a single detail of her medical history or suggest alternate treatments. In fact I remember asking him if he would like us to have more recent records from the other neuro sent to him and he wasn't the least bit interested. IMO he is claiming higher ground than the other "less than legal" certifying doctors but has no claim to this moral, ethical higher ground. Hopefully this post will eliminate some FL patients from mis-interpreting the process in the hopes of finding relief.

I stated that the new low dose recommendation was the equivalent of drinking a case of near-beer hoping to get the same effect as 2 real beers. I again mentioned that "WE KNOW" full spectrum cannabis relieves her nausea, gives her an appetite and provides pain relief and the low dose doesn't.....he said, as he had in the past...."this is all I'm allowed to do".

BTW-We still haven't received the actual FL certification card and when we called the FL department to find out why it hasn't been sent we were told they will be sending a new batch out shortly. Gimme a f'n break already.

So ends the saga of someone who currently experiences a minimum of 2.5 weeks of 24/7, level 10 migraine pain out of every 3 months and sometimes more. My wife doesn't get any joy from cannabis when the Botox wears off every 3 months. She NEEDS to session up every 2 hours just to stay out of the emergency room during those 2.5 weeks between when the Botox wears off and the next treatment.

The certification itself is good for a year so I will have to learn to create my own e-liquid so my wife can carry it with some level of protection. As I said to the MJ neuro ... we're done now.

Maybe other FL residents, who had a different experience, could add to the narrative so there is a more complete reference.

 

[Silver420Surfer]

Shitty to hear that is how patients are treated in FL. That certainly wasn't the type of program I helped campaign for down there.

It seems as though some in office may need to be voted out(not tryingLike to get political here so let's keep all that shite out of here please)before significant strides are made. That or John Morgan ties up more of his own $ to try and sue the state into honoring the ammendment the people voted for. I hope those who are preventing this get voted out and that progress comes quick to those in need.

 

[Baron23]

Well.....we finally come to the end of our story. Unfortunately, it doesn't end with a "happily ever after".

I created this thread to document our FL experience so that other FL residents would have a better understanding of how to go about getting certified, where things stand and what they can expect. I'm not sure I've cleared up as much confusion for other FL residents as I had hoped.

Here's the first posts I made documenting the initial entry point to the FL process. By reading the initial posts and then reading this post you can get a complete picture of our experience.

http://fuckcombustion.com/threads/f...or-fl-medical-issues-and-new-processes.26491/

http://fuckcombustion.com/threads/f...-issues-and-new-processes.26491/#post-1229037

End of Story:
We went to the MJ certifying neurologist 30 days after he certified my wife for low dose. This would be our third appointment. Remember....The last thing the neuro said on our previous visit was "We can increase the dosage in 30 days if this dosage doesn't work for you".

We had high expectations (pun intended) for this third neuro visit since the dispensary agent told us how surprised she was that someone dealing with such consistent, severe migraine pain was prescribed low dose. The agent gave us a pamphlet of products and circled the ones that many of her migraine sufferers had success with. Armed with the neuro's statement about increasing the dose if it doesn't work and the dispensary agent's surprise and suggestions we went to the next neuro appointment.

Within 5 minutes of meeting with the neuro he updated the certification script with a higher dosage and suggested we take a look at his computer screen for the result. As soon as he suggested we check out his screen I knew this wasn't going to work out as we had hoped. The dosage had been updated ....to a higher dosage of CBD/low dose. WTF?!?! When I said I thought the increase in dosage would be to a higher level/percentage of THC he said "that's why I wanted you to see what's on my screen". The neuro showed me how he is "allowed" to update the certification screen and how those values will automatically define the cannabis type which in our case was ONLY low dose. He then stated that the only patients certified for higher doses of THC are "terminally ill".

I expressed my disbelief and dissatisfaction by stating that the dispensary agent had been surprised my wife wasn't prescribed something with more THC and then showed him her recommendations from the pamphlet. I asked him why do you think the agent was so surprised and he said "The agents are like used car salesman and there are places where you will find certifying doctors who will use "less than legal" ways to get around the patient's conditions so that they can prescribe products with higher levels of THC. He also said these kind of certifying doctors will end up costing you upwards of $400 for their certification where he is using our insurance so it's costing us nothing and he is actually treating my wife's migraines. I wanted call bullshit on the "he's treating my wife's migraines" because the neuro who recommended the MJ neuro is truly treating my wife's condition while all the MJ neuro did was read over her history so he could "claim" he was following the state's and insurance protocol. While he did read through her entire 5 years of medical history.... In no way did he even discuss a single detail of her medical history or suggest alternate treatments. In fact I remember asking him if he would like us to have more recent records from the other neuro sent to him and he wasn't the least bit interested. IMO he is claiming higher ground than the other "less than legal" certifying doctors but has no claim to this moral, ethical higher ground. Hopefully this post will eliminate some FL patients from mis-interpreting the process in the hopes of finding relief.

I stated that the new low dose recommendation was the equivalent of drinking a case of near-beer hoping to get the same effect as 2 real beers. I again mentioned that "WE KNOW" full spectrum cannabis relieves her nausea, gives her an appetite and provides pain relief and the low dose doesn't.....he said, as he had in the past...."this is all I'm allowed to do".

BTW-We still haven't received the actual FL certification card and when we called the FL department to find out why it hasn't been sent we were told they will be sending a new batch out shortly. Gimme a f'n break already.

So ends the saga of someone who currently experiences a minimum of 2.5 weeks of 24/7, level 10 migraine pain out of every 3 months and sometimes more. My wife doesn't get any joy from cannabis when the Botox wears off every 3 months. She NEEDS to session up every 2 hours just to stay out of the emergency room during those 2.5 weeks between when the Botox wears off and the next treatment.

The certification itself is good for a year so I will have to learn to create my own e-liquid so my wife can carry it with some level of protection. As I said to the MJ neuro ... we're done now.

Maybe other FL residents, who had a different experience, could add to the narrative so there is a more complete reference.

Brother, that is truly an awful tale. Just makes my blood boil on your behalf.

The FL program, as crafted by the assholes in your Governor's mansion and the legislature, ONLY passed this law in order to appear to comply with the will of the voters as expressed in a democratically passed FL state constitutional amendment while actually giving you NOTHING and fucking you up the ass every inch of the way.

As said, I read the amendment. I have read the law that is incorporated by reference to define "marijuana" and there is NO WAY IN FUCKING HELL that your state Government is in compliance with this shit excuse for a program.

Oh, by the by, as I'm sure you know there is also NOTHING in that amendment that restricts THC to terminally ill only. NOTHING. But suddenly your fucking state goverment (a bunch of self-serving, lying, asshat politicians) have now interjected themselves in your medical treatment decisions. This is appalling.

I lived in FL for many years....Volusia County, the gold coast, Tampa area. If it was me, I would buy on the black market (wtf, I did it for 50 years already) and take all of the money you saved on fake Dr's and fake medication and give it to Morgan to support his suit against the state of Florida.

Good luck and I'm very sorry to read about your trials and tribulations with FL MMJ.

 

[His_Highness]

I just hope this thread will help alleviate any confusion or frustration for other FL residents. I hope it will eliminate any "real" doctors from making money on others, like us, who were hoping that real medicine is going to be prescribed even if they're not terminally ill.

If you try to find out whether someone with severe migraines can qualify for higher doses of THC there are web sites with wording like "We will get you certified or your money back" that manipulate some of the wording to imply you will qualify for something other than low dose but if you look hard enough you'll find that the scam may be that they get to keep your money as long as they get you certified for low dose. This is how I got so frustrated.

On the other hand...at least those who are terminal can get some help. For the time being it seems that will have to suffice.

 

[hibeam]

Wouldn't any cert trained doc in FL know this from the statute:

1. A qualified physician may request an exception to the daily dose amount limit. The request shall be made electronically on a form adopted by the department in rule and must include, at a minimum:
a. The qualified patient’s qualifying medical condition.
b. The dosage and route of administration that was insufficient to provide relief to the qualified patient.
c. A description of how the patient will benefit from an increased amount.
d. The minimum daily dose amount of marijuana that would be sufficient for the treatment of the qualified patient’s qualifying medical condition.
2. A qualified physician must provide the qualified patient’s records upon the request of the department.
3. The department shall approve or disapprove the request within 14 days after receipt of the complete documentation required by this paragraph. The request shall be deemed approved if the department fails to act within this time period.

 

[CarolKing]

I hate to hear stories of people making money off of someone else’s misfortune. The legislature didn’t want cannabis to be legal in their state. They think they know better than the Florida voter. They are making things as difficult as possible for the patient. Hopefully some sensible rules will come out of all this stupid legislative piece not allowing actual flowers. Deciding on only allowing the oil makes money for big business while screwing over the patients. Many patients are on fixed incomes.

Black market cannabis will continue to be an issue for the state unless they decide to go with legal cannabis. The FL mmj is one of the worst laws among all the rest of the states. Tied with NY.

 

[His_Highness]

Wouldn't any cert trained doc in FL know this from the statute:

1. A qualified physician may request an exception to the daily dose amount limit. The request shall be made electronically on a form adopted by the department in rule and must include, at a minimum:
a. The qualified patient’s qualifying medical condition.
b. The dosage and route of administration that was insufficient to provide relief to the qualified patient.
c. A description of how the patient will benefit from an increased amount.
d. The minimum daily dose amount of marijuana that would be sufficient for the treatment of the qualified patient’s qualifying medical condition.
2. A qualified physician must provide the qualified patient’s records upon the request of the department.
3. The department shall approve or disapprove the request within 14 days after receipt of the complete documentation required by this paragraph. The request shall be deemed approved if the department fails to act within this time period.

My certifying neuro did all the above....the grey area seems to be the term "daily dose limit". The dose they are speaking about, according to the certifying neuro, was the dose or amount of the CBD not THC. When the neuro fills in the electronic form supplied by the state the only product that comes up is low dose. He can't over-ride that low dose only selection. No matter what he does, unless he fudges the illness factors the only dose he can play with is the dose of CBD. That's what he showed me on this last visit.

The above is what is/was so confusing and why I started the thread. We already knew CBD didn't help my wife's illness but full spectrum cannabis does help. The wording you supplied is what got my hopes up when all this started. I don't want anyone who knows they need higher levels of THC filling the coffers of any doctor hoping to get sufficient THC levels to help because..... some of these doctors and certifying locations know damn well you're only going to qualify for low dose. Even if you tell them low dose won't work before starting the process they will still suggest you get certified without telling you that's all you'll qualify for. So you pay them and the state and jump through all the appropriate hoops until you get certified and find out you got scammed.

 

[florduh]

I'm a part time resident of Floriduh. There's a simple solution to all of this. Not easy, but simple.

Stop voting for the Puritan Party. Encourage fellow Floridians to do the same.

Sorry to "inject politics" into the discussion, but if Floridians want easier access to cannabis, it's the only pragmatic move to make. Vote for whoever you want on the National level. But for State Offices, voting for Puritans will only continue Florida's stupidity on cannabis.

 

[hibeam]

My certifying neuro did all the above....the grey area seems to be the term "daily dose limit". The dose they are speaking about, according to the certifying neuro, was the dose or amount of the CBD not THC. When the neuro fills in the electronic form supplied by the state the only product that comes up is low dose. He can't over-ride that low dose only selection. No matter what he does, unless he fudges the illness factors the only dose he can play with is the dose of CBD. That's what he showed me on this last visit....So you pay them and the state and jump through all the appropriate hoops until you get certified and find out you got scammed.

Sorry for making you explain so much but the SCAMMINESS of our current program is so ubiquitous it is up to the patients to share experiences, so I am glad for seeing any more possible revelations of racketeering...yes I am saying racketeering: so far FL provides a mandatory paid legal service via certified doctors who would not be needed if cannabis were legal. This is all just at the starting gate.

Then docs get to dangle the promise of psychoactivity and euphoria (and real fucking pain relief) because everybody is already approved for tanker loads of cbd, so the money comes across before the thc does.

I am so jaded by it all I trust neither John Morgan nor this guy anymore:
http://www.miaminewtimes.com/news/s...strictive-medical-marijuana-licenses-10311564

 

[His_Highness]

@C No Ego - Thanks for that link. Interesting read.

The person mentioned in the link, Joe Redner, may or may not be just looking for publicity or looking out for his own needs but...... Even if Morgan and Redner are self-serving it's still better than no serving at all. I'll reserve judgement until I can see the whites, I mean the reds, of their eyes.

Living in a repub state like FL means that the conservative politicians against legalization feel they can roadblock the legislation and keep their jobs since many voters will vote the party line regardless of whether they are for legalization. I hope these politicians have over-estimated the republican tribalism and find out that the overwhelming positive vote for medical that they are ignoring was the end for them. I have my doubts though.

 

[florduh]

@C No Ego - Thanks for that link. Interesting read.

The person mentioned in the link, Joe Redner, may or may not be just looking for publicity or looking out for his own needs but...... Even if Morgan and Redner are self-serving it's still better than no serving at all. I'll reserve judgement until I can see the whites, I mean the reds, of their eyes.

Living in a repub state like FL means that the conservative politicians against legalization feel they can roadblock the legislation and keep their jobs since many voters will vote the party line regardless of whether they are for legalization. I hope these politicians have over-estimated the republican tribalism and find out that the overwhelming positive vote for medical that they are ignoring was the end for them. I have my doubts though.

Yeah that's the thing. Amendment 2 passed with 71% of the vote. Do you know how hard it is to get 71% of people to agree on ANYTHING?? No Statewide politician ever gets anything close to 71%.

So tons of Republican voters in Florida supported Medical Marijuana. Smart politicians should be paying attention to this. Those are in short supply though.

That having been said, as flawed as Florida's medical marijuana system is, it's still the best we got in the former Confederacy.

 

[subway13029]

Just wanna add my two cents. I was certified for medical marijuana last week and I paid the total of 400 smackeroos but I am in the door on the entry level. I was approved for high thc and it’s a shame what @His_Highness has went through. I guess it’s all in the dr who prescribes it or doesn’t in your case. My dr. Is very reputable dr. Who works at all major hospitals in area as a family dr. Pediatrician and a hospice dr. I guess you gotta pay the piper. I went to dispensary for 1st time today and purchased cannabis oil. It’s a great day but this state has a long long ways to go. Lmk if you need any info mr highness..

 

[MinnBobber]

I went to dispensary for 1st time today and purchased cannabis oil.

.............................................................................
Good news indeed.
How expensive is oil from the disp, dollars per XX mg bottle?

MN has only two manuf/retailers and they royally ream their patients. It's kind of like the mob during prohibition, each has their own territory, making it functionally into two monopolies

EDIT: I have read every comment submitted by MN MMJ patients and when the disp first opened, 1000 mg/ 1 gram conc was reported to go for $200. I believe it is lower now but certainly still stratospheric

It's sad that FL is fucking up their med cannabis program too, very sad

 

[His_Highness]

Just wanna add my two cents. I was certified for medical marijuana last week and I paid the total of 400 smackeroos but I am in the door on the entry level. I was approved for high thc and it’s a shame what @His_Highness has went through. I guess it’s all in the dr who prescribes it or doesn’t in your case. My dr. Is very reputable dr. Who works at all major hospitals in area as a family dr. Pediatrician and a hospice dr. I guess you gotta pay the piper. I went to dispensary for 1st time today and purchased cannabis oil. It’s a great day but this state has a long long ways to go. Lmk if you need any info mr highness..

THANKS DUDE! I may take you up on that!

 

[subway13029]

Here for a syringe of high rhc true clear..no cutting agent..is 60 dollars for 850 mg. And its super tasty..they have few indica..few sativa and few hybrid..and it cost more if you gwtthe pods..which is the same oil just in a pod system..are 94 dollars for 800 mg..too high..i bought a pod and the truestick pod vape..for 100 firwt time customer..so i got the vape for 6 dollars..it is nice hitting little pod system but too ezpwnsive..ill just buy the syringes and dab off them or fill my own pods..which i asked the dispensary and rhe said no thats not allowed..i just smiled and said ok..lol

 

[His_Highness]

@subway13029 - I don't get it. My wife just got the certification card with her picture. What a joke.

In any case....I'm glad it's working for you. It's a good sign.

 

[hibeam]

Did you check the registry database to see if she got any recs?
https://mmuregistry.flhealth.gov/

I mean, things could get weirder for you.

 

[His_Highness]

@hibeam - thanks for the suggestion but I checked the site and account status throughout the process and it's all been a big disappointment and remains that way. Since none of this certification BS is working for my wife's migraines, getting weirder would probably be a step up.

In a month or so my wife's Botox for migraine treatment will wear off and she'll be in 24/7, level 10 pain for 3 weeks straight till the next Botox treatment is given and starts to work. This isn't the medical referendum we voted for.

In trying to follow the advice of our "real" neurologist (by using the certifying cannabis neurologist he suggested) I may have made a huge mistake...... because the certification for low dose may have to stand as is now. What doctor would want to over-ride the certification when it follows the letter of the law?!?!?!

We've done everything we were asked and followed all the rules and regulations and we wasted a great deal of time and effort for nothing. Without exaggeration....we could have gotten the same result if we didn't get certified and just purchased pure CBD over the counter. So we took the high road (pun intended) and got FUCKED! I guess I'll file this under "no good deed goes unpunished".

 

[hibeam]

@His_Highness sorry I was just joking because the OMMU is so messed up I would not be surprised of a data error entry that gives somebody more than they asked for. On reddit people report problems like yours and get told to go to docmj. But what if docmj is just over hyped? This whole industry is hanging itself by greed and indentured servitude. We do all the real R&D for them but then pay them for it!

 

[subway13029]

Hey @His_Highness it will be no problem to override that joke of a dr. Recommendation.she got her card because shes in the database for low thc but a dr..my dr. Will take what you say and use it..as in you need thc..he will give you thc..especially since you already have the card..i saw a patient in their when i was there with same issue and he fixed ir..you just have to have the 1st dr.delete their recommendation.and they have to by law if you request them to.

And also you wasted alot of time and effort but you have not wasted money yet..many people got screwed by fake dr. Guaranteed if you go to a good dr. Who cares and if you pay them you will get the recommendation..just let me know and i will give you the info.