Cheap Vacuum Purger

[tedthehed]

vacuum chambers are also called desiccating chambers because they remove moisture..
could that be affecting your the taste?

 

[tepictoton]

it can be used as a dessiccator, but mostly they are perfect vac chambers too.

to dessicate you use these dessication stones, when you do not use them the dessicator is just a vac chamber...

 

[Puffers]

it can be used as a dessiccator, but mostly they are perfect vac chambers too.

to dessicate you use these dessication stones, when you do not use them the dessicator is just a vac chamber...

Adding dessicant stones will aid in moisture removal but a vac chamber by design if reaching a low enough vacuum will remove moisture from the product. That's what these commercial HVAC pumps are designed for.

 

[tedthehed]

right, in freeze drying,for instance, the ice turns directly to a gas under vacuum.

 

[Caligula]

*Sublimation

 

[Vapodudule]

ill may be try the mityvac products hand pump for cars repairs, this was pointed by french vapist.

 

[tedthehed]

hand vac I hear is not suitable to achieve vacuum numbers required for process?..

 

[tepictoton]

Mytivac silverline can get up to -29 and keep it for 24hours...It is however going to cost you about 200dollars...so not really a 'cheap option'

 

[tedthehed]

Just checked that , max. vac is 25 hg. for the 8000 silver line.

 

[tepictoton]

it's the MV8550 silverline elite to be correct that makes a lot of difference...just see you can find them at the 150dollar pricepoint.

 

[tedthehed]

http://www.amazon.com/Mityvac-MITMV...SQYUA/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top#productDetails

couldn't find the 8550 but this one, the 8500, also, just $64. goes to just 25 hg according the reviewers..
no figure given by the manufacturer..all the mighty vacs seem to be 25 hg max.

 

[FLskwat]

You need the 8550 to achieve the -29 psi needed... 85 euros on ebay if you search for it! ;-)

I now have an electrical vac pump rothemberg + metacrilate dessicator (500 euros setup...) and the results are really similar, it only divided by 4 my vac purge process and relieved my hands and fingers from a lot of exercise...but other than that, the 8550 does a great job IMHO!

 

[tedthehed]

fine and dandy. but, do you do it to get a dry and easily hand able and more esthetically pleasing product, or / and to 'get all the butane out ' , for a (supposedly.) less harmful product?

 

[kingtut106]

That pump looks okay...

honestly, I have messed with pumps and excicators and what not, only to throw them out again.

What i do now is spray straigth into a layer of everclear(94% grain alcohol). The everclear will push out all of the butane as soon as you spray. Once all the butane is gone, you will see it evaporate quickly into little bubbles, and you are left with a little pool of everclear with oil, you can easily evaporate the alcohol out.

Important thing is to use as big of a pyrex dish as you can. The thinner your product is the easier you can purge the alcohol with a simple warm water bath.

On top of that, one can easily put the oil mixed in the alcohol into a freezer, and winterize it, emoving all waxes from the oil. This will result in a slight loss of flavour, but will leave you with a pristine extract that needs to be scraped while warm otherwise it will shatter into a million little pieces...

Do you complete your spray of butane onto the everclear then bring the pyrex to a double boiler?

At the moment I spray my butane onto my pyrex while it is setup on a double boiler (do not worry there is no flame I use a electric kettle and pour the water into the pot). Is that necessary with your method or do you suggest not spraying onto the pyrex in the double boiler setup?

 

[FLskwat]

fine and dandy. but, do you do it to get a dry and easily hand able and more esthetically pleasing product, or / and to 'get all the butane out ' , for a (supposedly.) less harmful product?

I do it for both and don't really get the question:

dry and easily handable is just a proof of the solvent being gone... A stable extract at room temp and even above is a 'tane free concentrate. Moisture can also be removed with vacuum but I always make sure moisture does not get in the extraction process and voila...

 

[tedthehed]

I'm just not sure the butane left in the oil, if it is butane, is harmful.
I do notice that dry hard extract becomes soft and mushy over time in a more humid environment,
I suppse because it is reabsorbing moisture from the air...

 

[jdee]

Anything that doesn't reach -29hg is a waste of time, which means you need a proper vacuum chamber (not a mason jar, that will explode eventually). Also very important is maintaining heat directly below the oil so it remains viscous allowing for proper purging. The easiest way to do this is pre-heating a ceramic tile or plate and placing your parchment paper with the oil on it in the vacuum chamber. Ideal temp ranges for purging appear to be between 110-130c, lower temps take longer to purge and preserve a higher amount of terpenes (what gives off the aroma).

You're budget is too low to allow a proper setup, so that leaves 2 options, save up for a proper setup, or cut corners and get something less than ideal. The cheapest vacuum pumps I know of are $99 from harbor freight http://www.harborfreight.com/25-cfm-vacuum-pump-98076.html and for $70 you can get a proper vacuum chamber from ebay
http://www.ebay.com/itm/2-Quart-Res...237?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ac8bcfb6d

 

[tedthehed]

what happens if you don't purge? and inhale the product unpurged?

from what I can gather, nothing . Workers in environmnets high in butane

for years, have shown no ill effects..

I let it drip downward in long sheets, drawing itself out , perhaps this helps it purge?

 

[vape4health]

Are you guys using the vacuums for complete evaporation or like me just to pull a container up to 25" a couple to pull the last bit of stuff out. I dont mean to discourage anyone at all from getting cool equipment but a 60 dollar pump and candle warmer work perfect for my situation, the gauge goes to 30". My whole oil making kit fits in a shoebox.

 

[tedthehed]

yes the meter goes to 30 but the vacuum goes to only 25. and I'm arguing that you don't even need that.

 

[tepictoton]

@kingtut106 place it in the double boiler to evap the alcohol. It is important to do this in as big of a pyrex dish as possible so your oil and alcohol stay in the thinnest layer possible helping in evaping the alcohol

 

[jdee]

what happens if you don't purge? and inhale the product unpurged?

from what I can gather, nothing . Workers in environmnets high in butane

for years, have shown no ill effects..

I let it drip downward in long sheets, drawing itself out , perhaps this helps it purge?

Vacuum purging is good for controlling your finished product. If you can get clear, light coloured transparent shatter without a vac then your all set. I can't so that's why I use one. It is true that using nothing but a Pyrex dish and a toaster oven or double boiler you can purge, but it will take longer. So that's another reason to use a vac pump. If you make unstable under purged oil (budder) it will degrade faster, due to oxidation combined with the greater exposed surface area than shatter (stable oil).
Inhaling toxic amounts of butane is not a motivating factor to acquire a vac pump setup, as the amounts would be negligible.

So you can either
a) not purge your oil, the trapped butane will make your oil turn to budder, budder degrades faster
b) use heat to purge your oil, this will reduce the terpenes in your oil killing the flavor, depending on how much heat is applied (something that is required to make the oil viscous)
c) use minimal heat and a vac pump to purge your oil in a stable state that won't degrade as well as preserving the maximum amount of flavor (terpenes)

 

[tedthehed]

interesting. when you say 'degrade faster' what kind of time frames are you referring to? how long will stable vs. unstable oil last?

 

[tepictoton]

hmmm I really do not think it is the butane responsible for turning your product into budder...my feeling leans more towards water that is responsible for that, but I am sure the jury is still out on this one.

personally I have not witnessed a lot of degrading from buddered up extracts...maybe if you keep your stuff for ages, yes, but lets say in 3months time I never felt it reduced flavor significantly. Again these are just my experiences, yours may vary

Anyway, if you want to learn more about the basics i can advice you to look at the website of skunkpharm...

 

[Trever]

hmmm I really do not think it is the butane responsible for turning your product into budder...my feeling leans more towards water that is responsible for that, but I am sure the jury is still out on this one.

personally I have not witnessed a lot of degrading from buddered up extracts...maybe if you keep your stuff for ages, yes, but lets say in 3months time I never felt it reduced flavor significantly. Again these are just my experiences, yours may vary

Anyway, if you want to learn more about the basics i can advice you to look at the website of skunkpharm...

Ive def noticed water making shatters start to oxidize like the plague. But also if your not getting all the waxes out it does the exact same thing you can have a slab of shatter and one lil opaque spot and it will spread like wildfire