Can smoking cannabis cause cancer?

[Supdog]

Hi all,
I was wondering if there is any evidence that combusting cannabis can cause cancer or other health problems. I know I only smoke on very rare occasions. I feel better and my lungs don't hurt anymore.
I know I vape under the assumption that it is better for me and I won't get lung cancer but all the pro marijuana studies point to not a single person dying from smoking or consuming marihuana. In fact there have been studies that say that cannabis can help cure cancer and other diseases such as Alzheimer's.
So does anyone know of anybody dying from the consumption of our favorite plant?

 

[olivianewtonjohn]

Hi all,
I was wondering if there is any evidence that combusting cannabis can cause cancer or other health problems. I know I only smoke on very rare occasions. I feel better and my lungs don't hurt anymore.
I know I vape under the assumption that it is better for me and I won't get lung cancer but all the pro marijuana studies point to not a single person dying from smoking or consuming marihuana. In fact there have been studies that say that cannabis can help cure cancer and other diseases such as Alzheimer's.
So does anyone know of anybody dying from the consumption of our favorite plant?

I dont know of a single case. Still why inhale free radicals and carcinogenetic polyaromatic hydrocarbons?

Possible reason why tobacco and cannabis are not equally carcinogenic:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1277837/

Its more of a why not reduce these compounds scenario. Whether causing cancer or not, inhaling smoke (especially as frequently as people do) cant be healthy.

Getting better efficiency, flavor, clearer high are all just perks that come with the health benefits of vaporization. Regarding cancer studies, AFAIK there havent been any on humans. Plus everyone likes to say it cures "cancer", sorry no not buying it. Its possible it is beneficial for some cancers but to say it cures cancer is bullshit. There are alot of different cancers out there, tons of them. In fact I have a book that only lists the different types of cancers and their locations (used for coding for research)....a whole fucking book

 

[herbivore21]

Yes. Multiple carcinogens (polyaromatic hydrocarbons as @olivianewtonjohn noted above like Benzene) are created when you combust cannabis or other plant material. You are deliberately inhaling these. The word 'carcinogen' means it is known to cause cancer. These PAH's are the same chemicals which give you cancer from smoking cigarettes.

However, cancers are complex illnesses, with myriad risk factors (many which we are all exposed to in varying degrees depending on various lifestyle/environmental/sociological factors). What you won't usually find is an Oncologist telling you with any degree of certainty one single specific cause of a given cancer.

Basically, if you don't want cancer, don't smoke. In fact, I often wonder if too-hot dabs and vaping/dabbing anything with plant material (including flowers) may also cause thermal decomposition of inactives (or even some actives) which lead to carcinogens emerging - surely in smaller concentrations than smoke of course!

Again, @olivianewtonjohn has identified the dearth of research into the constituents of cannabis vapor from commercial vaporizers as of yet. We really need some research into this!

 

[nicelytoasted]

Some good points made, @herbivore21 and @olivianewtonjohn

Just to clarify, benzene is not classified as a polyaromatic hydrocarbon (PAH), although they are both carcinogens associated with vapourizing and smoking, and are in the group known as volatile organic compounds (VOCs). Benzene is a simple, aromatic VOC, with one ring in its structure, whereas PAHs are part of a group of more complex, multi-ringed (polyaromatic) structures.

Benzene is the smallest, lightest and most volatile of these carcinogens, and begins to be produced in the higher end of the vapourizing temperature range (~ 200C and upwards), and is thermally desorbed into the gaseous phase of the vapour, for the most part. PAHs are larger, heavier, relatively non-volatile compounds that are desorbed onto the particulate phase of the much higher temperatures used when smoking, and not present when vaporizing.

That’s quite true @steama, but it really seems to speak volumes on how effective our herb is, when cannabis smokers have constantly inhaled all these high temperature nasties for years, and there still has not been one death directly linked to it. If there was even one death, the anti-cannabis groups & lobbies would have been all over it in the media and everywhere else, imo.

Despite that, it is, of course much better to vape our beloved herb and FUCKCOMBUSTION !

 

[herbivore21]

Some good points made, @herbivore21

Just to clarify, benzene is not classified as a polyaromatic hydrocarbon (PAH), although they are both carcinogens associated with vapourizing and smoking, and are in the group known as volatile organic compounds (VOCs). Benzene is a simple, aromatic VOC, with one ring in its structure, whereas PAHs are part of a group of more complex, multi-ringed (polyaromatic) structures.

Benzene is the smallest, lightest and most volatile of these carcinogens, and begins to be produced in the higher end of the vapourizing temperature range (~ 200C and upwards), and is thermally desorbed into the gaseous phase of the vapour, for the most part. PAHs are larger, heavier, relatively non-volatile compounds that are desorbed onto the particulate phase of the much higher temperatures used when smoking, and not present when vaporizing.

That’s quite true @steama, but it really seems to speak volumes on how effective our herb is, when cannabis smokers have constantly inhaled all these high temperature nasties for years, and there still has not been one death directly linked to it. If there was even one death, the anti-cannabis groups & lobbies would have been all over it in the media and everywhere else, imo.

Despite that, it is, of course much better to vape our beloved herb and FUCKCOMBUSTION !

Apologies, I have just realized that at times I have conflated benzene and benzo(a)pyrene - the latter of which is a common PAH we find in smoke from combustion of organic substances this one tends to be released at combustion temps though, 300c or higher. Benzene is indeed not a PAH, despite being another carcinogen emerging from combustion for the reasons mentioned above.

Both are not things you would like getting into your body though

 

[t-dub]

I know, I have thirty years of herb combustion under my belt. I know I did damage. Oh well, how long do you fucking want to live anyway?

Indeed, you might be at a higher risk of contracting COPD rather than cancer from combusting cannabis, but that is a different thread.

 

[Supdog]

All good replies and everything I my fiber tells me smoking cannabis strictly should be bad. But I haven't heard of any reported cases of someone being diagnosed with lung cancer from smoking cannabis. People have been smoking the good herb for thousands of years but not one reported case? Unless it slipped by me?

 

[herbivore21]

All good replies and everything I my fiber tells me smoking cannabis strictly should be bad. But I haven't heard of any reported cases of someone being diagnosed with lung cancer from smoking cannabis. People have been smoking the good herb for thousands of years but not one reported case? Unless it slipped by me?

I explained the reason for this above. Cancer is often the result of cumulative exposure to a variety of risk factors. I couldn't imagine there being many, if any cases which are drawn back singularly to cannabis smoking for the reason that there are surely other risk factors the individual was exposed to, and medical histories, like any history, are only as accurate as the sources they came from. Just ask Dr. House lol

For this reason, we will often not isolate the more than likely constellations of causes for many cases of the various cancers.

Still, I repeat: Smoking cannabis is known to expose you to chemicals which cause cancer. It is true that there are constituents which also mitigate some of the negative effects of cancer and the route by which it spreads to other organs (metastasis) - still, if you do not want to get cancer, it follows that you should not willfully expose yourself to avoidable carcinogens. There are ways to consume cannabinoids without exposing yourself to the thermal degradation byproducts of medically inactive compounds

 

[olivianewtonjohn]

I am going to edit my above post, I should not have said cannabis combustion does not cause cancer. I should have said there appears to be a difference between the cancer rates of tobacco and cannabis.

Regarding the cancer "fighting" properties of cannabis (seems relevant to this discussion). I found this very interesting paper written by Dr. David Gorski he is a surgical oncologist and professor.

http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org...rbalism-part-2-cannabis-does-not-cure-cancer/

 

[herbivore21]

I am going to edit my above post, I should not have said cannabis combustion does not cause cancer. I should have said there appears to be a difference between the cancer rates of tobacco and cannabis.

Regarding the cancer "fighting" properties of cannabis (seems relevant to this discussion). I found this very interesting paper written by Dr. David Gorski he is a surgical oncologist and professor.

http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org...rbalism-part-2-cannabis-does-not-cure-cancer/

That's what science is all about, my friend - qualifying your statements as specifically and accurately as possible

We'll always slip up sometime and make an inaccurate statement (like my conflation of two different nasties earlier! helpfully picked up by @nicelytoasted lol). The difference between the scientist and the dogmatist is that the former will acknowledge the mistake and correct it.

 

[olivianewtonjohn]

It slipped by you.

Give me a break with the not one reported case BS it is an argument you are using incorrectly.

People die from smoking all kinds of bullshit. Anything you smoke can cause cancer including burnt weed. People die from lung cancer who never smoke ANYTHING.

The question of whether anyone has died from a weed overdose, and the answer is NO to that question. That does not mean a person has never died from lung cancer caused by smoking weed. Evidence is that smoking can cause cancer and don't take the bet that you are safe burning weed because you are not.

I agree with you that inhaling carcinogens isnt a good idea (exactly why im on this site). But I disagree with it being that simple.

I mean from cancer.org,

"Tobacco use accounts for at least 30% of all cancer deaths, causing 87% of lung cancer deaths in men, and 70% of lung cancer deaths in women. (Source: Cancer Facts & Figures 2014)"


And from the paper I posted above:
"More specifically, over 140,000 lung-related deaths in 2001 were attributed to tobacco smoke"

And

"While cannabis smoke has been implicated in respiratory dysfunction, including the conversion of respiratory cells to what appears to be a pre-cancerous state [5], it has not been causally linked with tobacco related cancers [6] such as lung, colon or rectal cancers. Recently, Hashibe et al [7] carried out an epidemiological analysis of marijuana smoking and cancer. A connection between marijuana smoking and lung or colorectal cancer was not observed. These conclusions are reinforced by the recent work of Tashkin and coworkers [8] who were unable to demonstrate a cannabis smoke and lung cancer link, despite clearly demonstrating cannabis smoke-induced cellular damage."

If cannabis caused cancer at anywhere near the rates of tobacco I would think it would have showed up by now? I understand that cancer is complicated but alot of research has been done looking into the harm of cannabis (seems most studies). I think researchers would have looked into cancer (first thing id look at).

 

[olivianewtonjohn]

Who ever said it was simple? Cancer is a pretty complex problem as I understand it. All I am saying is smoking is a major factor in lung cancer. I do not have the information to understand where Marijuana fits into the cancer picture.

I guess what I was getting at was that they link 87% of the lung cancer cases to tobacco. If thats accurate, it leaves a very small percentage open to MJ causing lung cancer (excluding people who use both). There must be some reason why there is a difference. Boiling it down to just inhaling bad shit and that causing cancer is too simple in my eyes especially given the amount of people who smoke weed. That paper I linked above gives some possibilities. I did send Dr. Gorski an email, asking his take on the paper and possible reasons why there appears to be such a big difference between the two substances, hopefully he will get back to me

But I think im just splitting hairs. Sorry brother, t-break has me fucked up.

 

[syrupy]

It seems to me that receiving combusted material is not what the lungs were primarily designed to do. Vapor still has particulate matter, right?

 

[Chill Dude]

As many have mentioned, cannabis defiantly has cancer causing compounds. However, there have been very few cases of lung cancer for cannabis only no tobacco use. In fact, some studies have shown weed smokers have a lower incidence of cancer. I'd be more concerned with chronic bronchitis and to a lesser degree emphysema which has been associated with long term extremely heavy smoking of cannabis.

 

[Supdog]

Yeah this is what made me ask the question. Is there something in cannabis itself that helps suppress the onset of cancer when smoked ?

 

[Pain]

Maybe it is not "reported" because MJ is federally illegal so the doctor just wrote "due to smoking" so insurance would cover the treatment costs.

 

[smokedaletobacco]

Cannabis smoking cannot cause cancer, but the opposite, can cure the cancer. We have seen many examples where people getting the extracted canabis as a cure....
And its the only thing that you can not get overdosed.

 

[olivianewtonjohn]

Cannabis smoking cannot cause cancer, but the opposite, can cure the cancer. We have seen many examples where people getting the extracted canabis as a cure....
And its the only thing that you can not get overdosed.

Read this whole article and let me know where you disagree:

http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org...rbalism-part-2-cannabis-does-not-cure-cancer/

Pay particlare attention to these two sections:

Cannabinoids versus cancer: Hype versus science

But what about the anecdotes?

 

[smokedaletobacco]

So you think that cannabis smoking causes cancer?

 

[olivianewtonjohn]

So you think that cannabis smoking causes cancer?

Maybe, maybe not. If you read this thread there is some discussion about it. I know inhaling radicals and PAHs cant be healthy. Do you have some evidence?

Regarding my reply. You need to reread your original post.

but the opposite, can cure the cancer. We have seen many examples where people getting the extracted canabis as a cure....
And its the only thing that you can not get overdosed.

If you bother to read that article. It directly addresses this.

 

[smokedaletobacco]

I think it can only cause lung cancer. Any kind of smoking thing can cause cancer.

 

[olivianewtonjohn]

I think it can only cause lung cancer. Any kind of smoking thing can cause cancer.

Seems contradictory to this post

Cannabis smoking cannot cause cancer, but the opposite, can cure the cancer. We have seen many examples where people getting the extracted canabis as a cure....
And its the only thing that you can not get overdosed.

 

[smokedaletobacco]

Yes, its okay, what about taking THC from concentrate? Without smoking it?

 

[Chill Dude]

There is not enough scientific evidence to support making a claim such as cannabis cures cancer. Needs thorough scientific testing before any claims of cannabis curing cancer should be supported.

I agree, there is not enough scientific evidence that cannabis actually cures cancer, but there has been numerous studies that concluded that cannabis and various cannabinoids have demonstrated the ability to shrink cancerous tumors. Sorry no links, but I remember reading the clinical studies a year or two ago...

I think it's all about risk reduction.. That's where vaporizors come into play. I still combust maybe once or twice a month, usually in social situations. What can I say, I enjoy smoking a joint with some friends occasionally. I'm not worried about any negative health outcomes from occasional smoking, but I would absolutely never go back to combusting on a regular basis.

 

[Chill Dude]

This is known as Anecdotal evidence. What the cannabis movement needs is more scientific evidence to verify or not, many of the claims based on Anecdotal evidence. Still, Anecdotal evidence can really get the conversation going.

Risk-reduction

Good point. I'm not too familiar with the nuances between anecdotal evidence and scientific evidence. However, I would think it would have a lot to do with how large a study was conducted. For example, was there 100 subjects followed for 5 years or was there 5,000 subjects followed for 20 years. Also the quality of the research university and the caliber of the researchers along with any researchers bias one way or the other.

I think you need to take most studies with a grain of salt. There are a lot of studies that provide conflicting evidence and therefore cannot provide absolute proof....