Are there any studies on the effects of weed/hemp dry herb vaping?

Green420

Member
I always see articles about cartridge vapes and smoking, I've read a lot on these things. But I never see any research on dry herb vaping, which is what I do. I sort of figure, there's no vitamin oil in the dry herb like in the cartridge, and there's not as many toxins as smoke. As for the possible effects of late life difficulty remembering words, I usually mix my cannabis with CBD hemp and only use it only on the weekends, whereas I use CBD hemp for the rest of the week.

I do worry about the resin I see built up in my glass piece, and I wonder what sort of effects vapor has on the lungs, especially since it contains such high amounts of resin.
 
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Shit Snacks

Milaana. Lana. LANA. LANAAAA! (TM2/TP80/BAK/FW9)
Not really, but there are a lot of other threads here about this very topic if you search back, so whatever studies there are have been shared, but they're pretty minimal and flawed as I recall?

Also a good extract oil cartridge is not going to have any vitamin oil in it, I think you're confusing with vitamin e acetate or whatever it was that poisoned a few people with cartridges in the news... You just need to get high quality shit reputably?

Technically clean extracts would be healthier in this regard compared to dry herbs because you would not have to worry about particulate as much, it would be smoother cleaner vapor, proper vapor, since what we're doing is technically not even vaporization per se the way we extract...

I'm sure it's best not to do things like this with your lungs, but there's many things, the body is built to withstand things, anything with moderation, but body chemistry between different people etc so many variables I don't know how you even begin to build a conclusive study or make up your own mind what is safest for you! So many people think edibles are the only safe answer, but even those can lead to issues as well in some...
 

darbarikanada

Well-Known Member
vaping's a relatively new phenomenon, so there may be long-term effects that won't become apparent for a while (tobacco-caused lung cancer doesn't typically hit until after decades of smoking). if I were to guess at possible harms from vaping it would have to do with the heat possibly harming the cilia in the lungs.
 

GoldenBud

Well-Known Member
there's no vitamin oil in the dry herb like in the cartridge, and there's not as many toxins as smoke
yeah, there's less risk with dry herb for sure... it's not like a cartridge that needs to be full and somebody can add vitamin E etc' to save money and still produce a product that looks ok :/ ....
just because the vapor is above ~340F and our lungs are kept around ~75F , some very small amount CBD stays in our lungs. but it's still much better than smoking etc' because there are no Byproducts... I think if you stop to vape at all, the lungs will clear most of the CBD...

are lungs, while vaping, are some kind of heat exchanger.... so some CBD will be kept there, still no research about it i think....
 
GoldenBud,

Green420

Member
Here's a video by a neuroscientist that talks about numerous cannabis topics with regards to actual studies.

It has timestamps if you want to skip around to topics that interest you.

Worth the watch if you want to educate yourself.

He says smoking and vaping damages the lungs and endothelial cells. I wish I could see studies on this, I've never heard of vaping causing this sort of damage. This really sucks, nonetheless. I will consider limiting my intake drastically.
 
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Green420,
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vapeape77

Well-Known Member
Don’t vape above 198c, more carcinogens are released above that level. There’s a couple studies out there on this but I can’t seem to locate em….
 
vapeape77,

florduh

Well-Known Member
IMO, the long term studies on cannabis smokers are still relevant to vaping herb. Probably relevant to dabbing as well.

That's because smoking always involves vaporization in addition to combustion effects.

If I recall correctly the only health condition they could correlate to long term cannabis smokers was gingivitis. Maybe stoners forget to brush their teeth before bed?

It seems logical that if you remove combustion byproducts from the mix, the long term effects would be more mild.


Here's a video by a neuroscientist that talks about numerous cannabis topics with regards to actual studies.

It has timestamps if you want to skip around to topics that interest you.

Worth the watch if you want to educate yourself.


So the first part of this video that stood out to me was the section about "Chronic Cannabis Use and Changes in Speech". The implication being that cannabis makes you sound like a dumb dumb stoner. And this Huberman guy basically says this is now a proven scientific fact. Because there's a study!

A little Googling lead me to discover this "study" involved 31 cannabis users and 40 controls. I'm sorry but this is garbage. An absolute garbage study. That proves absolutely nothing. And this Huberman guy pulls the clickbait journalist tactic of presenting a single bad study as proven scientific fact.

I bounced after that. Never heard of this guy before but now my opinion on him is that he's a bullshitter.
 

DrJynx86

Well-Known Member
Huberman is an ophthalmologist (eye doctor), that happens to know (and sell) a lot of "magic" supplements and pills in every video I see of him talking about anything.

I don't say he's talking bull**** but I would take anything that he says with care, and then do my own research aside.
 

florduh

Well-Known Member
Huberman is an ophthalmologist (eye doctor), that happens to know (and sell) a lot of "magic" supplements and pills in every video I see of him talking about anything.

LOL. Color me shocked that he's hawking magic beans. Definitely the vibe I got.

I don't say he's talking bull**** but I would take anything that he says with care, and then do my own research aside.

Maybe he's not a bullshitter. But he's a "science educator" who apparently has the scientific literacy of a Buzzfeed writer.

That whole section with him doing "vocal phrenology" on cannabis users was one of the dumbest things I've ever seen.
 
I find NCBI to be a decent source for all kinds of cannabis studies. Like you said, still not a ton on dry herb vaping but still, plenty of decent papers on other cannabis related issues. As always, check the sources but most of the stuff is pretty reliable. Search "All Databases" for the word "cannabis" and you hit a lifetime of reading. Papers in the PubMed database is a good starting point.


 

Dan Morrison

Well-Known Member
Manufacturer
From all the research I've done, I think I can conclude a few things,

Moderation in all areas, dose, vapor temperature/density, over-all usage, etc. Basically, consume the least amount possible to reach desired effects, and keep a lid on tolerance.

Stick with concentrate products with zero adulterants, and vaporize at low temperatures ideally.

Be aware of the over-all health impacts of cannabis in general (negative and positive), not just the damaging effects on the lungs. Being mindful of how cannabis is impacting your life, and regularily check in with yourself to make sure it's still a net positive.
 

grandaddy

Purple
This guy doesnt differentiate between dry herb vaping and liquid vapes...or perhaps I missed it? I havent read any studies which show dry herb vaping to damage the lungs and I regularly search pubmed and other medical databases. In fact, wasnt there a study showing improved respiratory symptoms when cannabis smoking switched to dry herb vaoprizers?

A few years ago there was a lot of news about "vaping" damaging the lungs but these were liquid vaporizers not dry herb vaping. Again maybe I missed it but he seems to have a negative bias to cannabis in general.
 
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Siebter

Less soul, more mind
No smoke, no fire: What the initial literature suggests regarding vapourized cannabis and respiratory risk: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4456813/

Cannabis "Vaporization": A Promising Strategy for Smoke Harm Reduction: http://cannabis-med.org/index.php?tpl=journal&id=230&lng=en

Medicinal Cannabis: In Vitro Validation of Vaporizers for the Smoke-Free Inhalation of Cannabis: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4718604/

Cannabis Vaporizer Combines Efficient Delivery of THC with Effective Suppression of Pyrolytic Compounds: http://cannabis-med.org/index.php?tpl=journal&id=136&lng=en
 

blackstone

Well-Known Member
Not directly related to the lungs, but an article was posted in Cannabis News on here recently which references a study of the effects on health related quality of life from three months of vaporizing THC flower in patients with chronic pain and anxiety conditions.

If vaping dry herb significantly improves people's lives when we are sick, then hopefully it's not something we need to worry about as much as cigarette smoking is.

 

GoldenBud

Well-Known Member
No smoke, no fire: What the initial literature suggests regarding vapourized cannabis and respiratory risk: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4456813/
"An important question that remains is how to improve safety for the respiratory system in individuals who choose to use cannabis medicinally. Although frequent comparisons with tobacco emphasize that the smoke from cannabis has more carcinogens and respiratory irritants, the absence of nicotine likely mitigates the impact of some of these compounds (2). Evidence suggesting a link between cannabis and lung cancer is equivocal (24), but other concerns remain important. Frequent smokers of cannabis often report respiratory problems. "

"The vapour formed in the gas phase of vapourization of cannabis is composed overwhelmingly of cannabinoids with no significant pyrolytic compounds. "

"Stronger cannabis would require smoking less, thereby decreasing exposure to byproducts of the high-heat decomposition of organic materials (pyrolytic compounds)."

"The amount of exhaled CO showed little to no increase following vapourization compared with large increases following smoking, which would be expected for inhalation of a combustion product. These findings give further evidence that vapourization reduces exposure to gaseous combustion toxins."

Because vaporization is taking place around 250C max, and smoking cannabis is like 600C+, most of us knew that vaporization is much better than smoking. but seeing this written in a paper always giving a good feeling for sure! very interesting article!
 

Curious Gorilla

Sounds like something smells purple.
Any medicine has a risk vs reward ratio. I believe cannabis is known to have a safer profile than any painkiller or antiinflamatory and most pharmaceutical medicines.
Unless you smoke it. FuckCombustion.
Ive been vapourising 9 months, within weeks i could smell and taste better, my lungs were clearer, i stopped coughing or having to blow my nose clear with water in the morning or night, my gum health has improved, my sleep improved, my blood sugars have improved (type1). Only detrimental thing i have noticed so far, getting occasional small sores just inside my nose.
And a devastating glass habit in more ways than i like. (looks at tiny glass shard on floor from latest smashiness)
Saw this a few years back , its about terpenes, I found it useful and interesting info, he makes the point about getting terpenes elsewhere if your MJ doesnt have the terpenes you want. The mango thing is interesting. I started using tiny amounts of hops, lavender or very very tiny amounts of cloves in weed with no enough terpenes. Dr Felice is a tonic after Hubrisman
THC and CBD are the keys that unlock the doors for terpenes to do their thing. I reckon aromatherapy probably works really well when your high!

@DaVapeGuy Thankyou it was interesting, watched most of it at 1.75 speed, and will rewatch it. Any derogatory comments are not made at you.
Onto Dr. Huberman.
Dr. Huberman spends most of the first 15 minutes advertising himself and a few of his sponsors. He quotes papers/studies as if they are absolutely correct. What about all the other papers/studies that disagree with what he believes?
There are so many things he is off the mark on, I deleted the long growing longer list i had. Too ranty.
But, he actualy said you cant keep people in a lab to study something? Really? It is done all the time.
This as much as anything else shows how little he knows and the bollocks he's talking, and not just because you can easily keep stoners in the lab all the time. Just give them their prefered gaming system and as much weed as they want.Failing that, access to a full C.R.I.S.P.R. suite and an instruction manual how to use it.They will work it out. And pay them for their time. Thats how many medical trials work.(minus the weed, and access to CRISPR)
I could go on but he is an educated idiot without a clue and if he has any good info its lost in the sound of the palm of his hand as he watches his own videos. If he thinks occasional use can replace opiates for chronic pain he is a Fucking(Combustion) Idiot.
Hey, Dr. Huberman, hows this for cannabis use altering use of language. FuckYou.
I have seen it written in several articles that cannabis can in fact be neuroprotective, and protective of vasculature and endothelium specificaly.
Unfortunately, i really cant remember where i saw the artcles/papers. This information was from the interdisinformationweb so possibly uncheckable facts. No more so than Hubermans facts i expect-
It has occurred to me in the past that CBN may be more responsible for loss of memory than other compounds in marijuana. just my own musings.
Vapourising can cause dehydration, particularly of the gums, (i always use a water piece or drink water between bowls).
Anything that raises your temperature will increase your yearly dose of background radiation, hot drinks, hot food, smoking (F.C.),also car journies, plane rides. even with all that, and a few xrays thrown in for good measure, it wont be much above 5 milisieverts a year.
UK limit for radiation industry workers is 50 mSv in a year to memory. Avoid old CT scanners. Avoid any CT scanners.
Vaping vs exhaust fumes ? Like many of us, i grew up with lead in petrol fumes, Im more worried i lived in central London for the first half my life than the fact i use vapourised cannabis, and hope to for a very long time.

edit- just searched "cannabis can in fact be neuroprotective, and protective of vasculature and endothelium"
lots about it being neuroprotective.
I did find these regarding endothelium
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1471491422001514
I noticed it referes only to it being smoked. NOT Vapourised.
Despite the fact delta 9 THC might have a detrimental effect on endothelium(if you smoke it?) this can in theory be negated by drinking miso soup, or consuming other soy products. Cannabis is anti inflamatory on many levels, and thc stops formation of arachidonic acid which is a precurser to pro-inflamatory prostaglandins,(if my weed adled memory works) so despite the above , properties of the whole flower give it cardioprotective properties.
I know its anti inflamatory from experience. Im currently betting my life on it.
 
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hinglemccringleberry

Well-Known Member
All of this smoking vs vaporizing talk is good but eventually they should also study vaporizing flower vs vaporizing concentrates (and not carts, I'm talking about dabs and wax pens) to see if any differences can be found with what it does to respiratory tissue
 
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Siebter

Less soul, more mind
I don't expect any thorough studies about dabbing anytime soon, it's a very niche way of consuming compared to smoking or even dry herb vaping (at least globally). Makes no sense to make a study that nobody will very- or falsify because no one gives a fuck about it.
 
Siebter,

hinglemccringleberry

Well-Known Member
I don't expect any thorough studies about dabbing anytime soon, it's a very niche way of consuming compared to smoking or even dry herb vaping (at least globally). Makes no sense to make a study that nobody will very- or falsify because no one gives a fuck about it.
Vaporizing flower is just as niche and no one outside of a few internet forums gives a fuck about it...
 

Siebter

Less soul, more mind
In the US dabbing might be a thing, but everywhere else it's absolutely not, that's why I wrote „globally“. I have quite a few stoners in my social circle, not one of them is dabbing. It just doesn't exist, you wouldn't even be able to buy anything to dab except for CBD stuff. So while both ways of consumption are definitely very niche, dry herb vaporizing is still quite a bit more common than dabbing, in fact it has spread outside of forums like FC quite a bit.
 

GoldenBud

Well-Known Member
Vaporizing flower is just as niche and no one outside of a few internet forums gives a fuck about it...
also because it doesn't require a combustion chemical reaction, and the temps are much lower than smoking, everybody knows the fact it's much better, so there isn't much of a motivation to start a research about it...
 
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Siebter

Less soul, more mind
Oh I'm sure there would be some interesting findings if someone would make a study about dabbing and how it affects our respiratory system as opposed to vaping or smoking. It's still a very different animal, no plant matter impurities, different temps, higher amounts of THC and terpenes per hit etc.

I'd be very interested, I just don't see it coming very soon.
 
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GoldenBud

Well-Known Member
someone would make a study about dabbing and how it affects our respiratory system as opposed to vaping or smoking.
it's still around 300C vs 600C of burning joint/bong smoking, that's why I think the motivation of the researchers is reduced. like, it's almost a fact or even a fact that if the temp is higher it's more dangerous...
 

Siebter

Less soul, more mind
I agree that dabbing is most likely healthier than smoking by a ton, so comparing it to smoking is not very interesting, but maybe dabbing would turn out to be more ideal than dry herb vaping for medicinal use because it allows to take high doses of THC in a very short amount of time. In that regard it would be interesting to understand the effect of dabbing on our respiratory system vs. dry herb vaping too. There are some details that are worth to study for sure.
 
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