Are desktop vapes in decline?

[Petro]

Thought this was an interesting trend and maybe people here would have some thoughts on it.

I got my first vaporizer, an MFLB, in '09 when they were reasonably new and back then the portable options were very limited. If I remember rightly the choices were pretty much the MFLB, Vaporgenie or an Iolite - which wasn't making much of an impact due to noise and heating times. Desktop vapes were all the rage then and I bought a Da Buddha (never liked it).

Five years later the situation has completely changed. We have heaps of new portables out but there is nothing happening on the desktop front. Just looking at the Thread Candidates in the portable section vs the desktop section makes that pretty clear I think. Basically only the staples of the desktop remain - Volcano, log vapes, 7th Floor SSV/DBV and the Extreme. I just ordered an Underdog though - which I am very excited about.

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

I don't think it is purely because they are portable either. Most people here are too old to be sneaking around their parents to have a quick toke - this isn't Grasscity - so I think it must be something else.

Is it just the advances in portable technology? Apart from the Solo I would say that the most popular portables are the least technologically advanced, like the Vapman or Lotus for example.

Possibly that portable vapes are closer in experience to smoking rituals? I love my MFLB because it is almost like using a pipe (I never enjoyed bongs) and I mostly use it at home on the couch.

Do you think it is the more intimate interaction with a portable? Sometimes I think the more high-tech desktops don't really mesh well with the cannabis experience - they are too soulless. Too disconnected. Is it easier to convert a combuster with a personal portable than it is with a "soulless contraption" that you plug into a wall?

I could ramble on about this but you guys might have some insight - I think it's interesting. In my opinion desktop vapes haven't seen much improvement in the last 5 years - the innovation just isn't there compared to the portable market.

It's definitely a great time to be vaporizing though, no matter how you do it!

 

[zippy]

I thought the same then tried a sublimator glad i did.


mod note: This is a general topic, in General Vaporization, and discussion of specific models should be avoided.

 

[stickstones]

Desktop vapes will always be there to provide the connoisseur experience for vapor geeks like us. But you are right that a perusal of the two main vape sections reveals that almost all the action is in portables. The tech has been improving and the legal issues have been loosening. Most of the money looking to invest in the vape market is looking for portable action.

 

[momofthegoons]

I spoke to Ed last year, after he had been to CHAMPS, and he was amazed that most of the vapes there were geared towards concentrates. I think with this 'new wave' of oils and waxes, vaporists have gone the way of ease and stealth.

 

[stickstones]

I think with this 'new wave' of oils and waxes, vaporists have gone the way of ease and stealth.

True that. I got some wax once to keep just for going out, but it was so easy to use any time that I ended up using most of it while at home!

 

[momofthegoons]

I never thought I would see the day that I used more wax than flower... but it has come. It is so much faster. I can do a quick dab before heading out in the morning rather than it turning into a 20 minute minimum session at my desk.

And as to buying new vapes, I find myself leaning more towards finding new pens than desktops. So I can understand how this trend isn't going anywhere for a while. Once a pen vape is made that will handle a good amount of flowers, vape well and that is small and discreet like the wax pens, it will be a real hit too. To my knowledge, that hasn't happened yet.

 

[max]

Is it just the advances in portable technology?

We tend to want top performance in conjunction with smaller size and portability. Even at home it's much easier to break out/put away a portable, vs. plugging in a desktop. We want better and smaller batteries for everything, not just vaporizers.

Add in the recent popularity, as mentioned, of concentrates, and it's easy to see why portables have been the more popular, innovative part of the vape market. I wouldn't say the plug-in side is in decline though, just lagging in popularity vs. portables.

It's certainly understandable why new vaporists would make their first purchase a portable-more versatile if nothing else. For home use though, once most have used a good plug-in model, they tend to appreciate the pluses. The only time I use a portable at home is when I'm either vaping while moving around the house or inside/out, which is rare, or finishing off a bowl I started when I was out. Even down the road, when battery technology is much more advanced and you can easily power a desktop with a smallish battery, plugging into an AC outlet will still be preferred for many, since batteries need to be recharged and eventually replaced, adding to the cost of operation via extra batteries and buying new ones.

 

[pakalolo]

First, I want to emphasize that drawing conclusions about the general vapourizer user base from reading FC is a mistake. We're a motivated bunch with more in-depth knowledge and we don't reflect the general trend.

I think that the bias towards portables is not driven by the technology, it is a consequence of the increase in awareness of vapourizing as a consumption method. People looking to try a vapourizer tend to want something cheap because they aren't sure it works, and discreet because most people still conceal their usage. This naturally adds up to a portable. They see e-cigs and they want something like that. Sadly, that leads to a lot of disappointed people with electric pen pipes, but I digress.

Although I don't think that technology advances are driving the portables market, they obviously enable this bias. Since smaller batteries with high energy densities are a major factor, there's not nearly as much potential for changes in plug-ins.

It would be interesting to have an analysis of vapourizer sales in Colorado and Washington since legalization.

 

[SSVUN~YAH]

Thought this was an interesting trend and maybe people here would have some thoughts on it.

I got my first vaporizer, an MFLB, in '09 when they were reasonably new and back then the portable options were very limited. If I remember rightly the choices were pretty much the MFLB, Vaporgenie or an Iolite - which wasn't making much of an impact due to noise and heating times. Desktop vapes were all the rage then and I bought a Da Buddha (never liked it).

Five years later the situation has completely changed. We have heaps of new portables out but there is nothing happening on the desktop front. Just looking at the Thread Candidates in the portable section vs the desktop section makes that pretty clear I think. Basically only the staples of the desktop remain - Volcano, log vapes, 7th Floor SSV/DBV and the Extreme. I just ordered an Underdog though - which I am very excited about.

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

I don't think it is purely because they are portable either. Most people here are too old to be sneaking around their parents to have a quick toke - this isn't Grasscity - so I think it must be something else.

Is it just the advances in portable technology? Apart from the Solo I would say that the most popular portables are the least technologically advanced, like the Vapman or Lotus for example.

Possibly that portable vapes are closer in experience to smoking rituals? I love my MFLB because it is almost like using a pipe (I never enjoyed bongs) and I mostly use it at home on the couch.

Do you think it is the more intimate interaction with a portable? Sometimes I think the more high-tech desktops don't really mesh well with the cannabis experience - they are too soulless. Too disconnected. Is it easier to convert a combuster with a personal portable than it is with a "soulless contraption" that you plug into a wall?

I could ramble on about this but you guys might have some insight - I think it's interesting. In my opinion desktop vapes haven't seen much improvement in the last 5 years - the innovation just isn't there compared to the portable market.

It's definitely a great time to be vaporizing though, no matter how you do it!

Welcome to The Dog Pound fellow UD owner! You should check out the Voltage Keeper thread, get that UD portable and you've got a beast of a portable! I think you will come to find FC is much more sophisticated than GC, well at least some other members here!

"The Almighty says this must be a fashionable fight. It's drawn the finest people."​

 

[shredder]

I think a lot is just a natural evolution helped by tech advances. When you can have power, speed, and flavor without an attacthed cord the choice is easy. In a simular fashion, I barely use our desktop computer, instead I'm typing this on a iPad.

And medically speaking, vaping in general is catching on in my crowd (ahh let's say mature). Old lungs don't like combustion, we would rather eat it or vape it. And with more states getting legal and medical states becoming recreational, this trend will only increase. Smaller, better, faster......

 

[lwien]

For me, as I am sure for many others, it's the convenience factor of portables. Being able to use a vaporizer that does not tether you to an AC cord is kinda liberating, even when using it just at home.

Also, with some of the heavy hitting portables available, the performance gap between desktops and portables is defiantly closing.

 

[Petro]

I spoke to Ed last year, after he had been to CHAMPS, and he was amazed that most of the vapes there were geared towards concentrates. I think with this 'new wave' of oils and waxes, vaporists have gone the way of ease and stealth.

Unfortunately I know nothing about waxes, oils or concentrates. I live in Australia and we are almost like the backwater of MJ consumption - it is definitely not the "industry" that it is in the US.

Is the increasing use of concentrates confined to legal states? I could understand an increase in use if concentrates were suddenly easily accessible, like in dispensaries. Can't imagine your average Joe Weedsmoker would have access to them or be inclined to make their own. Like said below, the FC community is definitely not a good cross-section of society.

First, I want to emphasize that drawing conclusions about the general vapourizer user base from reading FC is a mistake. We're a motivated bunch with more in-depth knowledge and we don't reflect the general trend.

Very true, although r/vaporents on Reddit is also full of posts on portable vapes. Not to sound pretentious here but it seems say the vaping community in general is just more educated than the rest of the MJ community. I don't know how to quite word that without sounding like a prick, there are obviously informed and educated combusting users out there but surely they're all wising up to vaping now I would think. The benefits are obviously obvious to us .

I think that the bias towards portables is not driven by the technology, it is a consequence of the increase in awareness of vapourizing as a consumption method. People looking to try a vapourizer tend to want something cheap because they aren't sure it works, and discreet because most people still conceal their usage. This naturally adds up to a portable..

You are probably right there too. Maybe it's just a cost thing? I know I couldn't bear the costs of a lot of the desktop models these days - I swear they used to be cheaper. Even if I had $500 to spend on a vape I don't know if I would.

If I was going to pick one reason for the popularity of portables now I would have to say cost. I think that most people will just refuse to spend over $300 dollars on a vape - unless they were heavily invested in vaporizing like the members here. Hence the increase in new portables being brought to market - more people willing to spend a medium amount of money vs not many people who will spend a lot. Would explain the popularity of 7th Floor vapes I think - cheapish while still being as effective as more expensive vapes. Not a plug - my Da Buddha was a waste of money for my habits and preferences.

Again, trying not to discuss models here mods but from what I've read the Sublimator seems to be the most innovative desktop to come out in a good while. I haven't read much though so it could very well just be marketting drivel.

Thanks for all the great insight guys. It was just that the whole vaporizer market has changed so much since I was last a member here - I must say it is really amazing and surprising to see.

 

[lwien]

....my Da Buddha was a waste of money for my habits and preferences.

While this is not the thread for it, I would really like to hear a bit more elaboration on your comment above for it is a bit unique.

 

[CarolKing]

Portables seems to be making up for lost time. They are just getting caught up to the desk style vaporizers. With the loosening of the laws in the U.S regarding cannabis I think vaporizers are a wave of the future. We've been seeing that with the ecigs. Vaporizers will only continue to get better whether a desk style or a portable.

Folks are realizing the ease of a portable and finding out some of the models produce some pretty powerful vapor production.

 

[Hippie Dickie]

Sometimes I think the more high-tech desktops don't really mesh well with the cannabis experience - they are too soulless

soulless? i've heard this sentiment before. maybe after fucking around with computer for 50 years, i have a more nuanced (intimate?) take on tech. i see a lot of stupid tech, but when really well done, ahhhhh, definitely not soulless.

to me, there's nothing wrong, nor unfulfilling, about a vape that knows what it is about, and just does the fucking job ... exactly as instructed and every time ... reliable and consistent ... performance good enough to trust and with just enough user i/o to verify.

i'm in the desktop camp, although my desktop vape must be battery powered. and only herb, if you please. i don't know any chemists i trust so i stay away from concentrates/extracts/etc., but this does appear to be the wave of the future.

 

[Petro]

soulless? i've heard this sentiment before. maybe after fucking around with computer for 50 years, i have a more nuanced (intimate?) take on tech. i see a lot of stupid tech, but when really well done, ahhhhh, definitely not soulless.

Agreed. I was more talking about the materials used.

Coincidently I was reading through your build thread earlier today and liked your take on things. In my case when I am consuming natural herbs I would rather be using something made with other natural materials. I have a MFLB, I will soon own a log vape and sometime after that I will probably purchase a Vapman - the use of natural materials really appeals to me for whatever reason.

Would have no problem with a good looking wooden desktop vape with sophisticated electronics - I'm thinking a log vape with automatically adjusting temperature to make up for draw speeds I guess and some other fancy stuff.

 

[shredder]

For me, as I am sure for many others, it's the convenience factor of portables. Being able to use a vaporizer that does not tether you to an AC cord is kinda liberating, even when using it just just at home.

Also, with some of the heavy hitting portables available, the performance gap between desktops and portables is defiantly closing.

Exactly! Right now some of the higher end portables are better (IMHO) than the cheaper desk tops. I don't see this trend reversing. However desk top vapes have a lot of advantages, especially for group sessions.

 

[cybrguy]

It would be interesting to have an analysis of vapourizer sales in Colorado and Washington since legalization.

I would imagine that the trends are very different in legal states than otherwise. Wash, Ore, Co and Cal (not really rec legal, but may as well be) the need for stealth is mostly gone. Stores openly sell all the accoutrements and paraphernalia, and even advertise it.
In states that are still not enlightened (mine for example) you may have to hide your desktop even at home, where as in a legal state you can leave it sitting out, especially when no kids live with you. Doesn't matter if the mailman of the plumber see it sitting there.
While there may be concentrates available if you have the right contacts, I have actually never even seen most of them, other than maybe the bad hash oil we made as kids. So flower4s are still king here, automatic miniaturization that might come along with concentrates doesn't drive the size as much.

While I doubt I will ever buy a plugin desktop again, the next vape I buy WILL be a desktopish battery operated one. I still, and will probably always, do most of my vaping at home, or in someones home, with the only common exception being the movie theater parking lot.

 

[RUDE BOY]

Just looking at the Thread Candidates in the portable section vs the desktop section makes that pretty clear I think

I see a flood of a whole lot of cheap vapes from china in the portable thread candidate section many of which are duplicate rebrands and newer models or revisions of the same basic vape coming out every few months, like all the flowermate and the Titan/pinnacle type vapes that are out there now along with many that may never see the light of day.

I for one won't buy a vape that's made by people who don't actually use herb which means I'm not picking up any of those vapes from china that are tested with tobacco and purely made to make money off the growing market and not for the love of vaping Marijuana(along with making a living).

I've made the choice Myself to support more companies where the people making the products are also using their product and operate more in the cottage industry realm and not mega corps that produce everything from glow-sticks to vaporizers to autoparts and don't really know or care if they're decent quality as long as the money is flowing.

I Know I'm waiting with money in hand for a vapman heating station that turns the vapman into a desktop plugin unit. Also waiting on the new Vapolution 3.0 ...so There are new desktops in the works and they will always have their place in the vaping world i think.


Enjoy your Underdog I bet It'll be bad ass, I love mine ... Desktops ain't going away.

 

[pakalolo]

I think that most people will just refuse to spend over $300 dollars on a vape - unless they were heavily invested in vaporizing like the members here.

I think even $300 is more that a lot of virgin vapists will pay for a leap of faith.

These next two responses aren't meant to start a discussion, they're just moderator business. If you want to discuss these points, find another thread or start one.

While this is not the thread for it, I would really like to hear a bit more elaboration on your comment above for it is a bit unique.

Right, this isn't. The way to handle this sort of thing is to use the +Quote button, then hop over to the Da Buddha thread and use Insert Quote, then ask for his comments. He gets notified that there's a post in that thread and the discussion continues in the appropriate place.

I see a flood of a whole lot of cheap vapes from china in the portable thread candidate section many of which are duplicate rebrands and newer models or revisions of the same basic vape coming out every few months, like all the flowermate and the Titan/pinnacle type vapes that are out there now along with many that may never see the light of day.

Our Portable Candidate Threads section is a mess. If you can identify any threads that can be merged or eliminated, don't hesitate to report them.

 

[Tweak]

In my opinion desktop vapes haven't seen much improvement in the last 5 years - the innovation just isn't there compared to the portable market.

There have been a few recent Desktops released in the past 5 years that IMO are more innovative than most portables. The Cloud+, EVO, Sublimator, Herbalizer, nano, and the AroMed are all recent additions to the market that are all unique in some way.

Portables are extremely limited by battery power, thus more innovation is needed to work around this drawback.

I'm still waiting for a "game changing" portable. A simple vaporizing lighter that lets you use any current combustion bowl would be awesome.

 

[Hippie Dickie]

A simple vaporizing lighter that lets you use any current combustion bowl would be awesome.

yes, it will be awesome ... i totally agree.

 

[cybrguy]

Right, this isn't. The way to handle this sort of thing is to use the +Quote button, then hop over to the Da Buddha thread and use Insert Quote, then ask for his comments. He gets notified that there's a post in that thread and the discussion continues in the appropriate place.

Thanks, Pak. I've been wondering the best way to do that.

 

[stickstones]

yes, it will be awesome ... i totally agree.

The closest thing I can think of is that W9 product (Persie?) that has the ceramic, 7th floor type of element for vaping herbs. I think you can take the dome off and use it like a portable heater/lighter like you guys are talking about.

 

[jojo monkey]

etro " I think the more high-tech desktops don't really mesh well with the cannabis experience"

To me, getting the most out of cannabis is the experience. I don't care what gets me there. I think there is another level past "fuck combustion" called "fuck inefficient extractions". I have yet to experience a battery powered device that can trump the thermal mass of a large desktop vape.

Sure portables have their place, but I would not want one if I wanted to get the most bang for my buck out of the herb I was vaping. I do want a GH for when I am about.

Tweak - It's not portable, but a HAKKO dash is a soldering iron that is safe for combustion. It is much cheaper than the LSV if you just want something to hold over a bowl. The 25w (the same wattage as the LSV) is around $32. HAKKO does make a portable soldering iron, but I don't think it uses safe materials.