Anybody gone edibles only?

[Shadooz]

The last couple days I've clicked on this thread thinking it was a discussion on edibles, and each day I'm dissappointed to see that it's all about @Zipford's liver. No offense @Zipford. I'm sure you have a fine liver.

Contradication is the most important part of an edible discussion.
I'm kind of sure he not has a perfectly "fine" liver.
We all have fucked liver with our contemporary medecine/diet. And as he takes cholesterol pills, he is far from being the healthiest.

I am still genuinely interested in what you mean by a liver lipid dump

Lexicaly explicit..
Fatty liver having an enzymatic dumping.

Alcohol reduce fat accumulation in the liver. Stopping it, will bring fatter liver with the same diet.
Statin drugs are made to stop lipid being dump into your blood. By stopping the enzymes.
Both bringing high Accretion risk. The wrong side of medicine, trying to change the output not the input... (painkiller era, anxyolitic, soporific..)

[Relationship between liver fat content and liver enzymes in individuals with various statuses of glucose metabolism] - PubMed

Liver enzymes are correlated with LFC even in normal range. The optimal cut-off point of 23.5 U/L (male) and 17.5 U/L (female) might predict the occurrence of NAFLD. The current used ALT upper limit could underestimate the NAFLD.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

NAFLD.

Can't be more vulgar. Even if modo censure me for "vulgarity"..

 

[Shadooz]

As I said, I was looking forward to the bloodwork precisely because I though by switching to cannabis, my bloodwork might improve.

Cumulating isn't switching.
But thanks for the interactions refresh.

 

[shredder]

Levothyroxine, Simvastatin, Metoprolol Succinate and Quinapril.

Im actually taking a blood test tomorrow morning, and im on levothyroxine and quinapril myself ,lol. No statins though, they tore my ass up.

Im sure you know this but if your thyroid is off it can affect many things, including triglycerides. A blood test for tsh, or thyroid stimulation hormone, should tell you if your thyroid levels are good.

PMC3109527

Say hidy ho to your liver.

 

[Truth Seeker]

The last couple days I've clicked on this thread thinking it was a discussion on edibles, and each day I'm dissappointed to see that it's all about @Zipford's liver.
No offense @Zipford. I'm sure you have a fine liver.

It's such a unique situation he's in that it kind of needs to put through a bit of an acid test. I'm learning quite a bit and the discourse is refreshing from an informational and speculative perspective.

 

[Shadooz]

I didn't ask u to do a liver biopsy. Just said it was the only test needed to know further..

Who wants to be my prometheus ?

Prometheus, the Titan, was bound to a rock, and an eagle(american?)—the emblem of Zeus—was sent to eat his liver. Which would then grow back overnight, only to be eaten again the next day in an ongoing cycle. Blackrock...

I'm kind of sure he not has a perfectly "fine" liver.
We all have fucked liver with our contemporary medecine/diet.

Hopefully liver is the best to recover, not like our lungs..

Say hidy ho to your liver.

 

[Nina]

your liver must be getting paranoid with us all talking about it Zipford!
Lately I'm wondering about tolerance to edibles, when I started out it seemed like 50 mg was the right amount and would give me a good night's sleep, now my preferred amount is more like 60 or 70 mg and it just doesn't feel as soporific as it did. When I vaped or smoked cannabis it would get me to sleep without fail, but with the edible version it seems like I learn to manage the impairment effects more quickly?

 

[Truth Seeker]

Who wants to be my prometheus ?

Prometheus, the Titan, was bound to a rock, and an eagle(american?)—the emblem of Zeus—was sent to eat his liver. Which would then grow back overnight, only to be eaten again the next day in an ongoing cycle. Blackrock...


Hopefully liver is the best to recover, not like our lungs..

Never had any idea where the name "Blackrock" came from....makes perfect sense that the firm with that much money under management would pick a name out of mythology.

 

[Nina]

I've fallen off the wagon and tonight I am vaping
I just wasn't getting the quality of sleep that I needed. I don't think edibles only is going to work for me, I seem to develop tolerance after about a week, can anyone else relate
( not liking the coughing though)

 

[shredder]

I seem to develop tolerance after about a week, can anyone else relate

Your edible tolerance definitely can creep up, just like vaping. Lately ive been just using a capsule at night before bed. They used to put me to sleep pretty quick, now im tripping for an hour or two before I calm my thoughts enough to sleep. A little too strong for my "new" self. And most of my edibles are roughly 45mg give or take. Right now 45mg would make me crazy high. But a month ago 45mg was a yawner. I may just dose at night with infused mct oil that I count drops to figure dosage, even though it's mostly sativa derived oil.

I don't see edible tolerance as different from vaping tolerance. IMHO dabbing is the worst tolerance robber.

If you keep chasing a buzz your tolerance is bound to go up, no matter how you ingest and then a break is appropriate, but a consistent dose works medically, even if it's not trippy..

 

[Zipford]

Contradication is the most important part of an edible discussion.
I'm kind of sure he not has a perfectly "fine" liver.
We all have fucked liver with our contemporary medecine/diet. And as he takes cholesterol pills, he is far from being the healthiest.


Lexicaly explicit..
Fatty liver having an enzymatic dumping.

Alcohol reduce fat accumulation in the liver. Stopping it, will bring fatter liver with the same diet.
Statin drugs are made to stop lipid being dump into your blood. By stopping the enzymes.
Both bringing high Accretion risk. The wrong side of medicine, trying to change the output not the input... (painkiller era, anxyolitic, soporific..)

[Relationship between liver fat content and liver enzymes in individuals with various statuses of glucose metabolism] - PubMed

Liver enzymes are correlated with LFC even in normal range. The optimal cut-off point of 23.5 U/L (male) and 17.5 U/L (female) might predict the occurrence of NAFLD. The current used ALT upper limit could underestimate the NAFLD.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

NAFLD.

Can't be more vulgar. Even if modo censure me for "vulgarity"..

I'll readily admit I am far from the "healthiest," which would be some kind of professional athlete, but I am also very far from the most unhealthy. I'm 5'9" and 175 lbs -- in America that's practically svelte. I have a family history of cardiac issues, so I take common medications to reduce blood pressure and cholesterol. I get comprehensive metabolic panels multiple times a year that show nothing out of whack. You can say my liver is shot, but I'm not buying that. I have been getting blood tests for decades, this wasn't some one time deal.

Regarding your theory of lipid dumping, your theory seems to be stopping alcohol and using statins both built up lipids in my liver. So far, so good. But what released them into my bloodstream 3 months later? And why were they all gone 6 days later at the follow-up? You seem to be assuming there was some huge unexplained lipid dump, and my blood got tested at the perfect point when my TG were already dropping back to normal (also unexplained), such that my TG was over 1,000 and 6 days later it's 200. And my correlated cannabis use (how luckily!) is just a complete red herring.

Your theory doesn't explain why the lipids suddenly left my liver, doesn't explain why they were leaving my bloodstream so quick and assumes that my bloodwork just happened at literally the perfect time to catch a tremendous drop in my TG. And for some reason, my many metabolic panels (which include testing for ALT) failed to show any indication of having a fatty liver, before, during or after. Sorry doctor, I'm staying with my first opinion on this.

Here's my take: you are a cannabis evangelist who cannot tolerate the idea that cannabis could have harmful side effects. You wouldn't be the first example of this, and it would be hardly surprising to find that attitude on a board like this. And so you're reflexively attacking my story.

I appreciate the back and forth having been mostly civil, but I think I'm done with this specific conversation. There's not much more to say.

 

[Shadooz]

you are a cannabis evangelist who cannot tolerate the idea that cannabis could have harmful side effects.

U def dont know my post in that forum to say that. I said "i'm the ugly", because i'm the only left to point all the risk existing.
As u seems to point a new one. TG spike. I had to clarified. Found the mechanism.
French scientist, explaining to bunch of pothead..

Regarding your theory of lipid dumping

That's not "my" theory. "Liver dump" is mostly used for diabetus, and so glycogen.
But liver stock up fat also.
"My theory" is only about the enzymatic triggering of it, by cannabinoides.
Which have already been demonstrate for the increased assimilation of drugs, my interaction chart, potentiator effect.

While Statin, being the "ugly duckling", doing the opposite, as being a p450 inhibitor. and so having its effect inhibit by cannabinoides which do the opposite.

It would also explain some "hungriness" part.

U can't read all the sources i gave. I get it. I vulgarize them. Still can't get a shit, and so call me "evangelist"...

You can say my liver is shot, but I'm not buying that.

Liver gets shot fast.

Exemple:

Non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drugs: What is the actual risk of liver damage?

Then it recovers at different pace, (old alcoholism, age, diseases slow that pace. Couple days for healthy, to more than 60days for alcoholic(or other drugs), until cirrhosis end any recovery cycle)

Had to ask 4 times, before u give us your "plenty" daily medication..

But what released them into my bloodstream 3 months later? And why were they all gone 6 days later at the follow-up?

U stopped the mct oil..
I stop talking to shit/pothead.. u can't get my many explanations of the enzymatic p450...
And interact to me like that !
Thick skin for no brain.

An "evangelist" with relevant medical publications as Bible...
Keep enjoying the wrong side of medicine, lethargy of the masses.

Cytochrome p450 and steatosis - PubMed

The term fatty liver identifies a liver in which lipids account for more than 5% of the liver's wet weight. When fat accumulates, the lipids primarily stored as triglycerides (TG) result in steatosis and provide substrates for lipid peroxidation. Accumulation of neutral lipids in hepatocytes...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Short (already too long) story of a fatty liver that "deliver"..
End. (Happy? )

PS : i'm 5'11 and 142lbs that is "svelt" in France. Still can get a fucked liver..

 

[Truth Seeker]

There are no 5'11 Frenchman........lol
You must be a German in disguise! Oy!

PS : i'm 5'11 and 142lbs that is "svelt" in France. Still can get a fucked liver..

 

[Shadooz]

There are no 5'11 Frenchman........lol
You must be a German in disguise! Oy!

2h from amsterdam, of a pure genetic (don't worry i'm not german thinking.. ).
We stretch like sativa with low sunlight..
We say "tigé" (=to make stem) under low northen sunlight..
Dutch being the world tallest, with 6'05 average, i'm quite "small" here..

The few interaction with u @Truth Seeker were about my garnish, little asides

 

[Shadooz]

Im actually taking a blood test tomorrow morning, and im on levothyroxine and quinapril myself ,lol. No statins though, they tore my ass up.

No news, means good news i guess..?

 

[shredder]

No news, means good news i guess..?

No news, at least not yet. I have an appointment coming up though, so I should know then.

 

[Shadooz]

No news, at least not yet. I have an appointment coming up though, so I should know then.

I'll have to go into a full edibles week. As Covid strikes my house (with "family doctor" in, Covid strikes each waves...) Everyone coughing like hell since december. Not me.. , but first time my weekly daybreak isn't enough for my self-healing pace..

Hopefully my last batch of "dry mct" feco (reclaim+abv) is good.
I add the lecithin u and @invertedisdead recommended to me, but it was mostly to bind mct to lemon juice .
i move from 10 triple 000 caps of abv to 2 caps for one of my dose..

 

[shredder]

No news, at least not yet. I have an appointment coming up though, so I should know then.

It was 139, with 150 as high. So my triglycerides are good after 2 years of using 98% edibles, sometimes 3 or 4 a day, although I've slowed a bit lately.

 

[Nina]

So my triglycerides are good after 2 years of using 98% edibles

Good to know Shredder
I'm trying to get into a good routine with edibles, but I am prone to increasing the dose for a better experience.....
and then regretting it
Even though my self-control isn't the best I am being very methodical and taking careful note of the doses and the effects
Ive noticed that I tend to use the same amount of raw material whether I'm vaping or going the edible route, I thought this was peculiar because I read so much that edible cannabis is stronger than pulmonarily administered cannabis. Thus I conclude that stronger means not that it gets you higher but that it lasts longer!
Or have I got that wrong and really it's all down to liver enzymes ?

 

[selector_plume]

Anybody gone edibles only?
Would love to hear your experience transitioning to edibles, tinctures only and giving up any forms of inhalation.
It seems like a natural process the older one gets when weighing the risk/reward of any kind of inhalation usage.

Any tips, pointers etc?

Bought the Ardent Flex to properly decarb and it does seem better than the oven method.

Anybody gone edibles only?
Would love to hear your experience transitioning to edibles, tinctures only and giving up any forms of inhalation.
It seems like a natural process the older one gets when weighing the risk/reward of any kind of inhalation usage.

Any tips, pointers etc?

Bought the Ardent Flex to properly decarb and it does seem better than the oven method.

I don’t plan on going 100% edibles as of yet, but I’m close to 80-90% there and have had a shift in how I enjoy my cannabis experience, basically I prefer ingesting it at this point. I do still enjoy my Pax 3 but try to use it more sparingly.

I have been making my own infusions for about 5 years (not in a legal state) and I really enjoy what I’ve learned and tweaking the process. My current method is relying on my Ardent Nova and I’ve landed on EVO as my preferred base although I still enjoy making a cold alcohol tincture at times as well. The Ardent makes it nearly fool proof and I cringe at my old oven methods now for decarboxylation.

I can provide further details but basically I decarb, break the flower down in a glass jar with a wooden spoon handle then cover the flower with EVO to where it’s even with the flower, then I eyeball an additional amount of oil to where it’s approx 2 parts oil, 1 part flower. Obviously, this is the big area of import for me - I’d prefer weight to fluid measurement ratios, but for now, this has served me well.

I then transfer the oil and flower mixture into the silicone sleeve in my Nova and hit go, I typically run 2-3 cycles (although I’m not sure if this is necessary). Then strain while the mixture is still warm (using latex, or nitrile gloves is crucial) and squeeze out the medicine into my cleaned glass jar then transfer into a brown dropper.

For dosing I’ve learned that 1/4 dropper is the best place to start. I target my dosage directly before dinner and the effects are typically smooth, predictable, and repeatable. I prefer the slower ramp of the high this way and it typically provides a warm body buzz and a bit less cognitive disassociation. It helps me fall asleep although I don’t think of it as a true sleeping aid.

I have lots more to say but I’ll stop there. I used to post on the forum years ago but started over with a new log in. Appreciate the community here, thanks!

 

[florduh]

I don’t plan on going 100% edibles as of yet, but I’m close to 80-90% there and have had a shift in how I enjoy my cannabis experience, basically I prefer ingesting it at this point. I do still enjoy my Pax 3 but try to use it more sparingly.

I have been making my own infusions for about 5 years (not in a legal state) and I really enjoy what I’ve learned and tweaking the process. My current method is relying on my Ardent Nova and I’ve landed on EVO as my preferred base although I still enjoy making a cold alcohol tincture at times as well. The Ardent makes it nearly fool proof and I cringe at my old oven methods now for decarboxylation.

I can provide further details but basically I decarb, break the flower down in a glass jar with a wooden spoon handle then cover the flower with EVO to where it’s even with the flower, then I eyeball an additional amount of oil to where it’s approx 2 parts oil, 1 part flower. Obviously, this is the big area of import for me - I’d prefer weight to fluid measurement ratios, but for now, this has served me well.

I then transfer the oil and flower mixture into the silicone sleeve in my Nova and hit go, I typically run 2-3 cycles (although I’m not sure if this is necessary). Then strain while the mixture is still warm (using latex, or nitrile gloves is crucial) and squeeze out the medicine into my cleaned glass jar then transfer into a brown dropper.

For dosing I’ve learned that 1/4 dropper is the best place to start. I target my dosage directly before dinner and the effects are typically smooth, predictable, and repeatable. I prefer the slower ramp of the high this way and it typically provides a warm body buzz and a bit less cognitive disassociation. It helps me fall asleep although I don’t think of it as a true sleeping aid.

I have lots more to say but I’ll stop there. I used to post on the forum years ago but started over with a new log in. Appreciate the community here, thanks!

How would you compare the effects from alcohol infusions vs oil? That Ardent article about making complete a cold ethanol infusion within a few hours was very interesting.

 

[selector_plume]

How would you compare the effects from alcohol infusions vs oil? That Ardent article about making complete a cold ethanol infusion within a few hours was very interesting.

I’ve found the effects pretty similar but with a slower and slightly smoother come up with EVO (and MCT) v. Ethanol. I really like the idea of sublingual dosing via ethanol infusion but admit that I’m bothered by the burn it induces day after day so for my go-to defaulted back to EVO. I still enjoy both and if I’m out and about I prefer the ethanol as it does kick in a little quicker.
Sounds like I have some reading to do this eve on the Ardent site, I can’t remember how I landed on cold infusion other than being paranoid about blowing my house up cooking , and remember reading that heat just isn’t necessary. My friend still swears by the “green dragon” double boiler method but I think it’s an unnecessary step… but I’m always learning and could be wrong!

 

[shredder]

How would you compare the effects from alcohol infusions vs oil? That Ardent article about making complete a cold ethanol infusion within a few hours was very interesting.

More than the effects the difference is in usage. Oil infusions are much easier to use. IMHO

Another edible I've migrated towards is canna capsules. Very effective and easy to use.

I think of these different edibles like folks using different vapes.

Some edibles are easier to carry, some have faster onset, some taste better, on and on.

 

[florduh]

More than the effects the difference is in usage. Oil infusions are much easier to use. IMHO

I think I was envisioning using the alcohol tincture in beverages, which is harder to do with oils.

Another edible I've migrated towards is canna capsules. Very effective and easy to use.

Yeah, your testimonial about canna-caps is what originally got me interested in edibles again. I guess my concern is onset time. But I don't find any form of vaping irritating, so I could always take a hit of flower to get the party started, while I wait for the same flower in the caps to kick in.

 

[shredder]

I think I was envisioning using the alcohol tincture in beverages, which is harder to do with oils.



Yeah, your testimonial about canna-caps is what originally got me interested in edibles again. I guess my concern is onset time. But I don't find any form of vaping irritating, so I could always take a hit of flower to get the party started, while I wait for the same flower in the caps to kick in.

The infused oil works great in hot drinks, or on basically any food, but coagulates in cold drinks.

The onset for edibles is variable, and somewhat depends on the individual user. But there are ways to speed up the effects.

An empty stomach helps, caffeine helps, and carbs help.

An alcohol tincture under the tongue is fast, if you handle it. An oil infusion under the tongue is almost as fast as well. The trick is to hold it there. Harder to do for me.

My fastest edible is powdered mj. It's tapioca maltodetrin mixed with feco. Onset in about 15 minutes. Infused oil in coffee is just about as fast.

 

[JollyGreenGiant]

I was primarily an edible user for years, before the last few months when I transitioned back to hybrid of edibles and vapes.

It takes a few months - and looootttss of experimenting with different brands to get yourself dialed in properly, but once you do - they’re extremely effective and they can be quite convenient.

My biggest issue with edibles is the calories/sugar in most of them. I’m a bit of a health foodie - and with a high tolerance, is can easily munch through a few tins/packages of gummies in a day if I’m going hard - and that’s an awful lot of sugar/candy if you do that a few days in a row.

For mild pain relief and medicinal usage for minor issues, I find vaping to be faster, more efficient, healthier and easier to control. If I’m in REALLY bad shape though (IE: post surgery instead of strong opiate narcotics) - a serious sonic boom of edibles gets the job done in a way vapor (even with concentrates) just can’t touch…. Especially if you’re hitting the serious, “experts only” edibles, but you really want to be careful with those, and slowly work your way up (6+ months of daily use) to the big boy edibles, or you’ll have a terrible experience.

One final consideration - the efficacy of edibles can change based on what good you’re eating, and I don’t care who the manufacturer is, I’ve never received consistently dosed products from a single manufacturer. Even with the best brands (Kiva, Plus, Protab, Kanha, Emerald Sky, etc) every once in awhile I’ll get a batch that barely hits at all, and then once in a blue moon, I’ll get a batch where the mg per piece seems to be at least 2X the alleged content, which can lead to some unwelcome surprises.

Bottom line - if I have things to do 5-8 hours in the future, I don’t touch edibles - full stop. I learned the hard way, when I took 1/2 my normal dosage when I had some serious pain in the middle of the day, and the edibles I took were at least 3-4X stronger than their alleged potency and I was flying around in outer space when I needed to have all my faculties.