any NHL fans here?

[2clicker]

Those were good days. Hockey has certainly changed, especially now that the ref's wont allow some decent fighting. I know there are some here in the D that don't like the Blues, but my dislike is still for the Avs.

yeah the instigator rule has really changed the game.

and i dont really have any reason to hate the wings other than i was sick of watching them win so often... but my true hatred is and will forever be for the blackhawks... i wanted to throw my tv out the fuggin window when i watched Pat Kane hoist the cup...... im scarred.......................

 

[momofthegoons]

-No one mentioned ron hextall when discussing goalie fights. That's inconsiderate. He might beat you up for that. Or throw a stick at you.

This what you're talking?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2nAVNvoUp2Y

Amazing goalie. One of the best. I just wish he had gotten a piece of Roy. I hated him.

 

[2clicker]

There was a strike, and then a lockout 10 years later. Both hurt the game, both, i'd argue were gary bettman's fault, douche that he is.

It's neat to see that there are so many hockey fans among the vaporizing crew - i love it!

A few thoughts after reading the forum to this point...

-there should be fewer teams in the NHL, because the talent pool is diluted and it will only become more so as players are drawn to the KHL. Fewer teams, better hockey, easier to follow for the average fan. Fewer regular season games would be nice, too!

-Carey Price will have a better career than Jaroslav Halak, in my opinion, and with his contract demands and high value, the trade with st. louis was a great move. Especially if the Habs can turn around and sign Anti Niemi.

-The Wings/Avs battles in the mid-late 90s were incredible. So much talent, grit, and heart, and only one team able to represent the west in the final - great series'.

-No one mentioned ron hextall when discussing goalie fights. That's inconsiderate. He might beat you up for that. Or throw a stick at you.

-A league that requires building through the draft, like the penguins, capitals, black hawks, senators, and others have done, necessitates throwing seasons and intentionally (selling off your best assets and icing a losing team) providing a bad on-ice product. This is a horrible framework. Instead of a lottery draft where the team that finishes lowest in the standings has the best chance of receiving the 1st overall pick, it should be that every team that finishes out of the dance(playoffs) has an equal chance of landing the #1 pick. That way teams could produce a good on ice product without ruining their chance to draft a sidney crosby or a taylor hall.

Last - within every sport there is incredible variability in fitness level from athlete to athlete. Every sport has some killer, top of the line, win at any game types. They are fun to watch!

good post

we will see about the Price and Halak saga... i remember watching those Habs playoff games last year and thinking to myself... fuck why cant the blues get a goalie, like this Halak character (who was absolutely brilliant for the Habs) that can perform in the post season... and then this summer they made it happen. losing Eller hurt, but we have a slew of talent in our pool.

and i couldnt agree more about buttman!

 

[chucku]

Being a Detroit gal, it's the Red Wings in my house! Some of our favorite moments in this house were the nights that Mike Vernon and Chris Osgood beat the shit out of Patrick Roy. The only fight better was the second Bobby Probert/Tie Domi fight. What a meeting of the clans!

Oh to be at the UC for a game against the Dead Wings when after giving up the third goal of the period the crowd spontaneously erupts calling the goalies name (Osgood, Osgood, Osgood...).

After seeing my local heros lose some of their top players over the years go on to win Stanley somewhere else (Belfour, Hasek, Chelios, Savard). The Indian finally wins it all for the first time since I was a toddler. With the salary cap as restrictive as it is currently it will be very difficult for any team to repeat. The NHL can learn something from the NBA by allowing teams to go over the cap to sign their own free agents.

Agreed there is nothing like the playoffs. Overtime is the best. 20 minute periods until either team scores.

Thank you Patrick Kane.

 

[chucku]

Mom,

If you hate Patrick Roy I am sure you loved his final game (a loss, in the playoffs, against Detroit, fights aplenty).


Lock,

I dont think the talent is as dilute as you claim. There are a lot more American players, a lot more European players in the show. The top European players for years have known the NHL is the highest level of competition and what they aspire to. Not that their own top leagues are chopped liver. Far from it. The caliber of play is probably on a par with the high minor league teams here and in Canada.

 

[chucku]

Doesn't anyone remember Billy Smith and his exquisite stickwork

'Old time hockey coach, Toe Blake, Eddie Shorr."

 

[momofthegoons]

Mom,

If you hate Patrick Roy I am sure you loved his final game (a loss, in the playoffs, against Detroit, fights aplenty).

chucku, it was a thing of beauty any time Roy lost to Detroit. However, if I'm not mistaken, his last game was against the Minnesota Wild in '03.

I am finding myself a fair weather fan these days. The way that the Wings have been playing in the playoffs, the Dead Wings is right. Such a pity. I had really hoped for a last cup for Steve Yzerman.

Yeah, watching hockey was a lot more fun when we were winning.

 

[2clicker]

Thank you Patrick Kane.

i woulda traded kane before trading big byf... he was the hawks best player in the playoffs.

 

[tuttle]

agreed, but what about the contracts like the Kovalchuk deal...? they need to fix that.

They absolutly do, and I think the league invalidating the contract is a good first step. We'll see what happens though in 2012.

A lot of Bettman hate, and I have to disagree. Post lockout hockey is some of the best hockey in 20 years (just go back and watch some of that ol' clutch and grab hockey). I think a lot of people boo him just because it is the fashionable thing to do. I am not excusing the lockout, but there was more than one party involved in that negotiation.

As for teams tanking to rake in the picks at draft as a driving strategy, I would also have to disagree. Certainly there are teams that came out of the lock out in dismal shape with no assets to speak of because they could no longer afford to keep the players they overpaid for in the beginning. Certainly for them the only option is a rebuild, but I don't think periodic or perpetual rebuilds are at all in the best interest of the team or a GM. In order to make it worth your while, you are going to have to suck for 3 to 5 solid years, which is often longer than the life span of a GM on a team that is sucking. You then have to wait for those young picks to mature and make an impact at the NHL level, and then once the team starts getting good enough then you spend on trades or free agency to fill your remaining holes, only then do you become a contender again. Of the teams you named Pens, Caps, Hawks, and the Senators, only the Cap's George McPhee survived the process. I think the Red Wings also prove that you can maintain a perennial contender with good scouting.

All that said, I probably have a bit of a bias as the Kings are finally starting to benefit greatly from the post CBA landscape, I have very much enjoyed the moves Lombardi has made (and not made in the case of Kovi) and it is nice to know in the next two years or so the Kings are looking pretty good for several years to come with no obvious cap issues, right in time for the next lockout

 

[illadelph]

havent posted in too long. my boys came up short but FLYERS BABYYY!!!!!!

 

[LOCKSTOCK93]

I think the Hawks followed the same principle trading Byfulian as the Habs in trading Halak; are they as good as they look right now?

Halak is a little small for an NHL goalie of the present, most of the best keepers are plus sized. He was lights out in the playoffs, at least for the first two rounds, though Martin coached well against the Penguins and Caps, and the Canadien's defense played very well in front of him.

The talent pool is diluted. The level of play that could be if there were 24 teams would make this league seem slow and plodding. The quality of play around the world is rising, but there is no need for a 30 team NHL. Fewer games would be nice as well.

I'm interested to see what Kane does this season. He could be lights out, but I'm sort of expecting him to Malkin. His move along the boards that got him free to score the game winner was nifty.

 

[LOCKSTOCK93]

tuttle, the game changed because bettman let it, not because he led it. Bettman was approached by Shanahan and the result was the competition committee. It wasn't as if the point of the lockout was to add speed and skill to the league, it was purely to protect the owners' costs. Bettman may or may not be good for the NHL, but I can tell you that he rubs me the wrong way and that, under his regime, there has been one and a half fewer years of hockey than there might have been under someone else.

I'd like to see them eliminate the salary cap and recognize that the most important development in the post lockout world is the Canadian dollar's resurgence. The canadian teams and a handful of american clubs float the rest of the league. It isn't that there aren't hockey lovers in Phoenix, Miami, and the rest of the non-hotbeds of hockey that Bettman has taken money from in order to "build", but it isn't enough. When the canadian dollar resets to 70 percent of the greenback, things will not look very nice in the nhl!

Mark it.

 

[LOCKSTOCK93]

For real hockey talk - The east should be hot next year, eh? Watch for the Caps and Pens both to race from the gate! I'm thinking the playoff order will be Pittsburgh, Washington, Buffalo, NewJersey, Ottawa, Philly, Carolina, Tampa, but Carolina could finish way high and washington could enter anywhere from 2nd-6th, but they make the third round next season.

I'm looking to take a trip to california in the winter to see the leafs and oilers play the sharks and kings, and hoping against hope that prop 19? passes on November 2nd. Come on California, please be sensible!


I hope for my Leafs to lose the first 10 games and fire that asshole who coaches them, then win the rest, obviously!

 

[Rudy Rudiger]

No athlete has done more for a single city. The best there was, the best there is, the best there ever will be. Time to start raising banners in the Consol Energy Center.

 

[chucku]

http://www.hockeyworldblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/sidney-crosby-stanley-cup-kiss.jpg

http://product.images.fansedge.com/33-54/33-54379-P.jpg

No athlete has done more for a single city. The best there was, the best there is, the best there ever will be. Time to start raising banners in the Consol Energy Center.

That would be the owner of your team, who is retired from playing and kept the team in Pittsburgh after the team filed for bankruptcy. Don't you really mean Mario Lemieux?

 

[Rudy Rudiger]

That would be the owner of your team, who is retired from playing and kept the team in Pittsburgh after the team filed for bankruptcy. Don't you really mean Mario Lemieux?

Ya I really mean Mario. Thought that was implied. There was a pic of him too. Don't leave out five goals five ways, or that Christmas gift on December 27, 2000. Now its the our turn to give something back to the greatest player who ever laced up the skates, December 27, 2010. Now thats a day to mark in your calendar.

 

[chucku]

The picture of the kid was much more prominent. Also no conversation of the greatest is not complete without mentioning Mark Messier. Possibly the best all around player to put on skates. I hated him when he and the Oilers were beating the Hawks and making it look easy.

 

[2clicker]

I think the Hawks followed the same principle trading Byfulian as the Habs in trading Halak; are they as good as they look right now?

yes they are

what happened to the hawks this offseason should be filed under "how not to build a dynasty"... seriously what a joke. they will be competing for the 8th spot this year IF they play well. Kane is a lil bitch. just wait till Oshie or Backes line him up.

Towes is the Hawks true star. they shoulda kept Byf and traded Kane.

 

[wunderkind]

...long suffering Black Hawks fan right here. This summer has been pure, sweet, hockey bliss.

 

[2clicker]

...long suffering Black Hawks fan right here. This summer has been pure, sweet, hockey bliss.

as much as it kills me to say it... congratulations

 

[Rudy Rudiger]

I think the Hawks followed the same principle trading Byfulian as the Habs in trading Halak; are they as good as they look right now?

yes they are

what happened to the hawks this offseason should be filed under "how not to build a dynasty"... seriously what a joke. they will be competing for the 8th spot this year IF they play well. Kane is a lil bitch. just wait till Oshie or Backes line him up.

Towes is the Hawks true star. they shoulda kept Byf and traded Kane.

So true, so true.

Speaking of Chicago, whats up with that traitors deal? Hossa? Is he still under investigation? Last I heard they were looking at it, but never came to a conclusion. I would love to see Oshie line him up, if he could catch him.

Trading Halak has to be one of the most foolish moves of this offseason. He was hands down the best goalie in the playoff's. He was hot and doesnt usually play that well, but still I dont see how you trade a guy like that.

Congrats to Chicago fans, they probably wont win another for 50 years or so but Im still glad they beat those goons from Philly. Flyers fans have to be some of the dumbest people I have ever met. "Crosby sucks, Crosby sucks, Crosby sucks" Ok he just scored a hat trick against your team, keep on chanting.

Its so hard to follow hockey when ESPN just refuses to discuss the sport and VS doesnt really do offseason coverage. Such an injustice to the game.

 

[wunderkind]

as much as it kills me to say it... congratulations

thanks amigo. Here's to many, many future rough and tumble affairs between the Blues and Hawks!

 

[2clicker]

as much as it kills me to say it... congratulations

Here's to many, many future rough and tumble affairs between the Blues and Hawks!

cant wait! (if i had an emoticon sharing a vapor whip with another i would post it)

 

[2clicker]

I think the Hawks followed the same principle trading Byfulian as the Habs in trading Halak; are they as good as they look right now?

yes they are

what happened to the hawks this offseason should be filed under "how not to build a dynasty"... seriously what a joke. they will be competing for the 8th spot this year IF they play well. Kane is a lil bitch. just wait till Oshie or Backes line him up.

Towes is the Hawks true star. they shoulda kept Byf and traded Kane.

Speaking of Chicago, whats up with that traitors deal? Hossa? Is he still under investigation? Last I heard they were looking at it, but never came to a conclusion. I would love to see Oshie line him up, if he could catch him.

Trading Halak has to be one of the most foolish moves of this offseason. He was hands down the best goalie in the playoff's. He was hot and doesnt usually play that well, but still I dont see how you trade a guy like that.

no sure whats up with Hossa's deal. i havent been paying much attention the last month and a half... i think it has a little to do with when i got my DBV. and yes catching Kane does seem to be harder than it looks. he is a shifty lil kunt, but if and when they do, he will hurt.

see here as Rick Nash sets his sights for Oshie who has the puck in the corner. Oshie looks like he invented the reverse-hit.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZHYIUiDAmg&feature=related

and that was game one of a "home and home" series against the Jackets. here is what happened the night after that.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=192N9jbJirQ

bwwwaahahahaahahahahahahahaha


i agree also about trading Halak. except that they Habs do have a quality chance that Price can do what they hope he can. but you should have seen the Habs forum right after the Halak/Eller trade. it was hilarious. that town was about to riot. i wish Eller well and i know he will do so. that kid has much potential, but ill take Halak to replace Mason thank you...

is it october yet?

 

[tuttle]

tuttle, the game changed because bettman let it, not because he led it. Bettman was approached by Shanahan and the result was the competition committee. It wasn't as if the point of the lockout was to add speed and skill to the league, it was purely to protect the owners' costs. Bettman may or may not be good for the NHL, but I can tell you that he rubs me the wrong way and that, under his regime, there has been one and a half fewer years of hockey than there might have been under someone else.

I'd like to see them eliminate the salary cap and recognize that the most important development in the post lockout world is the Canadian dollar's resurgence. The canadian teams and a handful of american clubs float the rest of the league. It isn't that there aren't hockey lovers in Phoenix, Miami, and the rest of the non-hotbeds of hockey that Bettman has taken money from in order to "build", but it isn't enough. When the canadian dollar resets to 70 percent of the greenback, things will not look very nice in the nhl!

I am in no way saying he isn't a sleeze ball, or he isn't a shill for the owners, because really that is his job. But I give him two high marks, putting in place rules to get rid of clutch and grab hockey (as well as the enforcer), and getting what I believe to be a sensible cap in place (he is also the only commissioner in any sport that I know of to have a live call in show where you can ask him questions, that takes some stones.) I will agree that perhaps he let it happen instead of being the cause of it, but regardless I'm glad it happened.

I have to disagree on the cap. Before the lockout, there seemed to be a lot of bankruptcies and teams in "distress." Now, I agree completely that that was due to poor management and unrealistic revenue projections, but I don't think it would be healthy for the NHL to let them wither away (I know you are in favor of contraction, but contraction by bankruptcy and contraction by planning are I feel are very different). The fact that you have 30 teams, some in some pretty poor markets, and they are all financially stable, that says something. We will see about the value of the CAD, in late 2008 / early 2009 it was down to $0.80 USD and there didn't seem to be much distress. I will concede that a strong CAD doesn't hurt

He isn't a great or charismatic guy by any stretch of the imagination, but I don't think he is terrible. And yes you are absolutely right, we have missed 1.5 years under his tenure to accomplish cap stability, someone else might have done a much better job, that I will not contest.


As for the Hawks, I wouldn't put them out of contention yet. Yes the Soupy contract was a major albatross that contributed to the dismantling of the 2010 team, but Tallon continued to do a good job of keeping the cupboard stocked while he was at the helm.