Ammonia during vaporizing
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darkrom
Great Scott!
@biohacker
How much cannabis do you use when you are using it? I know your dr says its normal, but I'm curious how much you must have used to have any real physical withdrawal symptoms like this. Not judging, just curious what it takes you to have to deal with this shit.
How much cannabis do you use when you are using it? I know your dr says its normal, but I'm curious how much you must have used to have any real physical withdrawal symptoms like this. Not judging, just curious what it takes you to have to deal with this shit.
biohacker
H.R.E.A.M
Waaaay too fucking much.... probably NEVER less than 1-2g/day, and at peak i'd say more like 2-3g. I have a great supply and very high quality meds. Then throw concentrates in there...budder or shatter. Plus frequency..... wake n' vape, and just generally constantly "testing" vapes....it became very excessive so i'm a unique case, but trying to share my experiences as to have others avoid the pitfall that I fell into.
I'm so fucking exhausted right now....I think a nap has to be in order...even my eyes feel so dry and tired, which is something I don't think i've ever yet experienced. I wonder if there are some chems in the buds to that haven't been flushed properly or fertilizers....i'm not sure....but i'm very scared to return to this, so i'm restructuring my relationship with the plant, first by abstaining, and then enjoying the HERB, instead of the VAPES.
I need to take some time to get my health back on track.... once everything is smooth sailing with the sleep and no night sweats, i'll then only dabble with it once in a while instead of vaping myself stupid sober all the time.
With all this being said, I really strongly encourage anyone to stop their usage for only 1 week, or even better 2 weeks and just observe what happens. Surely many of you do not have my history of 10 years of vaping fairly hardcore. Apparently withdrawals can worsen each time, and I can't care to remember how many times i've gone through this. It's just sad considering how much misery i've caused myself. But I thought vaping weed was so benign?
I'm so fucking exhausted right now....I think a nap has to be in order...even my eyes feel so dry and tired, which is something I don't think i've ever yet experienced. I wonder if there are some chems in the buds to that haven't been flushed properly or fertilizers....i'm not sure....but i'm very scared to return to this, so i'm restructuring my relationship with the plant, first by abstaining, and then enjoying the HERB, instead of the VAPES.
I need to take some time to get my health back on track.... once everything is smooth sailing with the sleep and no night sweats, i'll then only dabble with it once in a while instead of vaping myself stupid sober all the time.
With all this being said, I really strongly encourage anyone to stop their usage for only 1 week, or even better 2 weeks and just observe what happens. Surely many of you do not have my history of 10 years of vaping fairly hardcore. Apparently withdrawals can worsen each time, and I can't care to remember how many times i've gone through this. It's just sad considering how much misery i've caused myself. But I thought vaping weed was so benign?
MinnBobber
Well-Known Member
biohacker
thank you for sharing. Not judging, but even a good thing like cannabis can get out of hand.
Good luck in your journey.
I have very very limited supply so need to ration my use. I vape about 5 times a week BUT your
peak use of 2 - 3 grams (a day) lasts me about 4 months.
With an easier supply, I'd probably do more but not sure how much??
thank you for sharing. Not judging, but even a good thing like cannabis can get out of hand.
Good luck in your journey.
I have very very limited supply so need to ration my use. I vape about 5 times a week BUT your
peak use of 2 - 3 grams (a day) lasts me about 4 months.
With an easier supply, I'd probably do more but not sure how much??
Wow, get well soon!
In the 30+ years I have been consuming I have had plenty of breaks and probably should have done more. Your amounts of use are not high by my standards of consumption. there where years of my life that I smoked 5-7g on a slow day, even recently I have let my tolerance get to where I was using 1-2g of BHO a day. The last time it was that high I stopped for two weeks and went to Ireland, no problems at all. Really I have never had any physical reaction to taking breaks, mentally it is tough on me so it is best for me to take advantage of being away from home to take breaks.
sorry if I missed it but why would you want to use weed again if it is the cause of these problems?
In the 30+ years I have been consuming I have had plenty of breaks and probably should have done more. Your amounts of use are not high by my standards of consumption. there where years of my life that I smoked 5-7g on a slow day, even recently I have let my tolerance get to where I was using 1-2g of BHO a day. The last time it was that high I stopped for two weeks and went to Ireland, no problems at all. Really I have never had any physical reaction to taking breaks, mentally it is tough on me so it is best for me to take advantage of being away from home to take breaks.
sorry if I missed it but why would you want to use weed again if it is the cause of these problems?
biohacker
H.R.E.A.M
@MinnBobber no worries, you are 100% correct. This is 100% self inflicted, and the poison is in the dose. I guess it's just 1st world problems that I have access to as much good supply as I want. It gets psychologically addicting wanting all these different strains and such, like a candy store - and then I have no self control. It's a NON issue if i'm medicating ALL the time, but once the sweats started happening ALL the time, even while medicating, I knew I had a problem. Apparently (according to Wiki), weed helps with the onset and early stages of sleep, but can backfire and cause problems in the later stages with withdrawal, so I wonder if that is what was causing me to sweat, and wake up early - my brain needed more?
@GR Thanks for sharing. I find that incredible! Everyone has a different body chemistry, genetics, diet, bodyfat etc. SO many factors. Some people get higher than others. I'm very lean, perhaps this makes a difference?
I dunno, it sucks....I feel so dope sick from not sleeping....HOWEVER, I have always had tendencies toward insomnia since I was a kid (partial genetics - brother same issue, never medicates, and partial environment - death of parent when young so prone to anxiety).
So now I know many of you will jump on me and say I was self medicating etc. and that's why my insomnia is back. NO FUCKING WAY. Not THIS bad....not even CLOSE. I've gone 5 weeks before, and was sleeping pretty decently by week 3, and the sweats stopped after about a month. Just gotta let my body do its thing, and then control myself with .1g-.5g MAX, instead of 5x that.
As to WHY I would want to use weed again? Why does ANYONE want to use weed...med or rec?
However, I WOULDN'T want to use weed again (at the doses I was before). And I won't. But i've promised myself this before.
@GR Thanks for sharing. I find that incredible! Everyone has a different body chemistry, genetics, diet, bodyfat etc. SO many factors. Some people get higher than others. I'm very lean, perhaps this makes a difference?
I dunno, it sucks....I feel so dope sick from not sleeping....HOWEVER, I have always had tendencies toward insomnia since I was a kid (partial genetics - brother same issue, never medicates, and partial environment - death of parent when young so prone to anxiety).
So now I know many of you will jump on me and say I was self medicating etc. and that's why my insomnia is back. NO FUCKING WAY. Not THIS bad....not even CLOSE. I've gone 5 weeks before, and was sleeping pretty decently by week 3, and the sweats stopped after about a month. Just gotta let my body do its thing, and then control myself with .1g-.5g MAX, instead of 5x that.
As to WHY I would want to use weed again? Why does ANYONE want to use weed...med or rec?
However, I WOULDN'T want to use weed again (at the doses I was before). And I won't. But i've promised myself this before.
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biohacker
H.R.E.A.M
Sweats greatly subsided last night after a nice deep 4 hour quality slumber (napped for a couple hours after on the sofa)...only my shirt was fairly damp, but not soaked....sheets completely dry! Boom! It's getting better...today is day 9! Hopefully it's not the sleep every other day thing though, I couldnt even believe how tired I felt last night, but I did take an OTC.
basement farmer
My face is melting...
This topic intrigues me. Especially MichaelAB's science experiment. Very cool.
Now that we have some data I'd like to see what it means.
A couple of thoughts:
-It begs the question, if that is what is left from bong water, I'm definately not up for ingesting it (per my bong water thread)
-If that is what is left behind, how much of it makes it into you blood stream?
-What is ammonia concentration of combusted bong water, the healthy alternative.
-My web search has yielded kind of vague details regarding low dose toxicity. And as others have pointed out, it is a normal body chemical which is converted and excreted all of the time. In oter words, it's fairly benign in low level or tiny concentration exposures.
-Despite the risk factors associated with ammonia in vapors, it's still gotta be way more healthy than breating in tar and all those nasty gases associated with combusting.
Now that we have some data I'd like to see what it means.
A couple of thoughts:
-It begs the question, if that is what is left from bong water, I'm definately not up for ingesting it (per my bong water thread)
-If that is what is left behind, how much of it makes it into you blood stream?
-What is ammonia concentration of combusted bong water, the healthy alternative.
-My web search has yielded kind of vague details regarding low dose toxicity. And as others have pointed out, it is a normal body chemical which is converted and excreted all of the time. In oter words, it's fairly benign in low level or tiny concentration exposures.
-Despite the risk factors associated with ammonia in vapors, it's still gotta be way more healthy than breating in tar and all those nasty gases associated with combusting.
Radio
stay true to yourselves
I have faith in the realm of the unknown, and I pray that vaporizing is much healthier than burning and inhaling thick smoke. You never truly know, but I have an inkling.. haha
MinnBobber
Well-Known Member
So I was searching around for what is a human body composed of:
Most broke it down into the singular elements like oxygen, nitrogen, hydrogen.
One site had more complex compounds like ammonia, NH3
the average adult human body is comprised of Water (35 L), Carbon (20 kg), Ammonia (4 L), Lime (1.5 kg), Phosphorous (800 g), Salt (250 g), Sulfur (80 g), Fluorine (7.5 g), Iron (5 g), and fifteen other elements in trace amounts.
?? It just seems like if there is that much ammonia, the tiny amounts from vaping should not have much impact.
But, every body is different and just like some have allergies to XYX, biohacker may have an "allergy" to even small amounts of ammonia ??
Most broke it down into the singular elements like oxygen, nitrogen, hydrogen.
One site had more complex compounds like ammonia, NH3
the average adult human body is comprised of Water (35 L), Carbon (20 kg), Ammonia (4 L), Lime (1.5 kg), Phosphorous (800 g), Salt (250 g), Sulfur (80 g), Fluorine (7.5 g), Iron (5 g), and fifteen other elements in trace amounts.
?? It just seems like if there is that much ammonia, the tiny amounts from vaping should not have much impact.
But, every body is different and just like some have allergies to XYX, biohacker may have an "allergy" to even small amounts of ammonia ??
MinnBobber
Well-Known Member
4 L sounded like a lot of ammonia to me too.
I'll try to see if any other place reports a similar amount.
It was tough because more just did, carbon, oxygen, hydrogen etc
Radio
stay true to yourselves
For some reason I'm struggling to find any info about ammonia in the human body.. Apart from one website that says that ammonia is created in small trace amounts when our bodies break down proteins. Ammonia is a byproduct of this process.
It's unfortunately damaging to any cells that it comes into contact with though..
edit: it looks like McDonalds use it to clean their meat.. haha
It also comprises 78% of our atmosphere (apparently)
It's unfortunately damaging to any cells that it comes into contact with though..
edit: it looks like McDonalds use it to clean their meat.. haha
It also comprises 78% of our atmosphere (apparently)
biohacker
H.R.E.A.M
Another night sweat, but again not the worst....never smells of ammonia anymore though. I think i'm just going through typically withdrawal sweats, like i've had before. What's going to be VERY interesting is when I return to vaping. Last time after a 2 week break of insomnia and night sweats, I just vaped .1g and it was like a virigin high (giggity!) and slept incredible with zero night sweat. Ladies and gentlemen, this IMO is a case of severe dependency brought on by excessive vaping of very, very high quality BC bud.
It also could be my lack of water retention due to an ultra low carb diet....perhaps gluconeogenesis going on, proteins converting to glucose, with ammonia as a byproduct. Gonna keep on hacking it until I have answers!
It also could be my lack of water retention due to an ultra low carb diet....perhaps gluconeogenesis going on, proteins converting to glucose, with ammonia as a byproduct. Gonna keep on hacking it until I have answers!
KeroZen
Chronic vapaholic
I know several people told you so already @biohacker, but let me chime in: I do experience strong withdrawal symptoms when I quit, but I never ever had night sweats and even less any amonia smell. Amonia is excreted in the urine and if it's excreted by your skin, it could be the tell-tale you have a bladder and/or kidneys problem.
Please, just to be safe, go visit a different doctor to get a second opinion. Don't gamble with your health!
PS: and gawd do I hate doctors myself too!
Please, just to be safe, go visit a different doctor to get a second opinion. Don't gamble with your health!
PS: and gawd do I hate doctors myself too!
biohacker
H.R.E.A.M
Appreciate your concerns, have had all the blood work done, urine analysis, etc. and everything is normal. Insomnia and night sweats are the most common withdrawal effects for not only cannabis, but nearly every other drug and alcohol withdrawal as well. I'm going to try a couple more things, diet related...everytime I go through this I end up losing a tonne of water weight....i'm leaner now than I ever have been, yet still maintaining all my muscle mass. This is also a common symptom of an ultra low carb diet, which i've been experimenting with for a while, and it was already mentioned it could be part of a protein metablism breakdown. Furthermore, as I continue to research and hack this, night sweats can even be completely normal and benign (unlike some people saying never) and could be genetic. Or maybe i'm just going through man-o-pause? lol
I know that this is a pro weed forum, but it kills me that people sometimes refuse to believe that there is anything with weed, especially excessive use, and it appears to me that many either don't go through withdrawal themselves because they don't have the discipline to abstain, or at least have the insight to use google.
Every time someone brings something up that scares the fuck out of me, I do my homework, research, reflect on my past experiences, and realize that it's only day 10, and this is completely normal. Again, I have gone through this before, and it can take over a month.
@KeroZen, what strong withdrawal symptoms have you experienced? I have experienced SEVERE migraines in the past and horrible nausea as well as complete lack of appetite. Yet, I experience NONE of those effects this round. Everyone is different, the meds we vape are different, tolerance different, different biochemistry/metabolic makeup, bodyfat, again...SO MANY FACTORS. I'm quite confident this is occuring due to the weed withdrawal, because i've gone through it so many times - I just never was cognizant of the ammonia smell before - after all, it is SWEAT. Otherwise, I have a feeling it's my body adapting to my diet, or perhaps a lack of calories and potential starvation mode. Perhaps my appetite isn't what it was since I always vaped before eating? Perhaps I have cannabis poisoning/toxicity? It's quite a change to be a daily vaporist, especially wake n' vape (which is what is causing this the most IMO) and then go COLD TURKEY.
Again, I do appreciate your concerns, if this doesn't subside in a week or so, I will be going back to the doctor forsure. I may have some kidney function impairment as my Creatinine Kinase levels are always high, but this is because I lift weights (it's a muscle enzyme) and my brother has the same issue. Again, the doctor isn't concerned, and this is the 2nd doctor i've seen regarding it.
And just what exactly am I doing when I vape high potency multiple strains at high temps from morning till night for months on end?
EDIT: I haven't even started dreaming yet....it's only day 10, it's going to take alot longer than this for my dreaming mechanism to wake up. I haven't dreamt in years. Part of me is kinda sad, that i'm leaving my beloved plant...but my health comes first, and the good news is that my present supply is probably going to last me over a year! lol
The research continues....and much is also pointing to diet...ultra low carb. Tonight i'm eating junk food for the first time in a while...ordering a pizza! Looking forward to seeing what happens.
EDIT AGAIN: Totally not concerned anymore...completely common, apparently my brain knows that there is THC locked in my fat stores, and thus raises temp to get at it. I was going into withdrawal in the past even while vaping that night because my tolerance was so "high". Furthermore, my metabolism is lightning fast which is another reason why these effects hit me so damn hard. Nothing I can do but wait it out, and it will subside in another week or so. I was really starting to shit my pants for a second, because night sweats can be caused by about a million ailments, including ofcourse cancer.
I know that this is a pro weed forum, but it kills me that people sometimes refuse to believe that there is anything with weed, especially excessive use, and it appears to me that many either don't go through withdrawal themselves because they don't have the discipline to abstain, or at least have the insight to use google.
Every time someone brings something up that scares the fuck out of me, I do my homework, research, reflect on my past experiences, and realize that it's only day 10, and this is completely normal. Again, I have gone through this before, and it can take over a month.
@KeroZen, what strong withdrawal symptoms have you experienced? I have experienced SEVERE migraines in the past and horrible nausea as well as complete lack of appetite. Yet, I experience NONE of those effects this round. Everyone is different, the meds we vape are different, tolerance different, different biochemistry/metabolic makeup, bodyfat, again...SO MANY FACTORS. I'm quite confident this is occuring due to the weed withdrawal, because i've gone through it so many times - I just never was cognizant of the ammonia smell before - after all, it is SWEAT. Otherwise, I have a feeling it's my body adapting to my diet, or perhaps a lack of calories and potential starvation mode. Perhaps my appetite isn't what it was since I always vaped before eating? Perhaps I have cannabis poisoning/toxicity? It's quite a change to be a daily vaporist, especially wake n' vape (which is what is causing this the most IMO) and then go COLD TURKEY.
Again, I do appreciate your concerns, if this doesn't subside in a week or so, I will be going back to the doctor forsure. I may have some kidney function impairment as my Creatinine Kinase levels are always high, but this is because I lift weights (it's a muscle enzyme) and my brother has the same issue. Again, the doctor isn't concerned, and this is the 2nd doctor i've seen regarding it.
And just what exactly am I doing when I vape high potency multiple strains at high temps from morning till night for months on end?
EDIT: I haven't even started dreaming yet....it's only day 10, it's going to take alot longer than this for my dreaming mechanism to wake up. I haven't dreamt in years. Part of me is kinda sad, that i'm leaving my beloved plant...but my health comes first, and the good news is that my present supply is probably going to last me over a year! lol
The research continues....and much is also pointing to diet...ultra low carb. Tonight i'm eating junk food for the first time in a while...ordering a pizza! Looking forward to seeing what happens.
EDIT AGAIN: Totally not concerned anymore...completely common, apparently my brain knows that there is THC locked in my fat stores, and thus raises temp to get at it. I was going into withdrawal in the past even while vaping that night because my tolerance was so "high". Furthermore, my metabolism is lightning fast which is another reason why these effects hit me so damn hard. Nothing I can do but wait it out, and it will subside in another week or so. I was really starting to shit my pants for a second, because night sweats can be caused by about a million ailments, including ofcourse cancer.
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kimura
Well-Known Member
I'm sorry, nothing you are experiencing is normal.
I have an extremely high metabolism and a have maintained a high level of fitness over the past 7 years. I am quite lean and get dehydrated easily, my blood sugar drops uncomfortably when I go too long without food, etc. Never experienced anything like this, or any real withdrawal symptoms whatsoever. I don't think what you are experiencing can be chalked up to your body type and fitness level.
I would like to echo those who have recommended you continue to investigate this medically. Good luck man
I have an extremely high metabolism and a have maintained a high level of fitness over the past 7 years. I am quite lean and get dehydrated easily, my blood sugar drops uncomfortably when I go too long without food, etc. Never experienced anything like this, or any real withdrawal symptoms whatsoever. I don't think what you are experiencing can be chalked up to your body type and fitness level.
I would like to echo those who have recommended you continue to investigate this medically. Good luck man
biohacker
H.R.E.A.M
Thanks man, but just because it's not normal for you doesn't mean it isn't normal for others. This is withdrawal. I've been through it before and exhibited the exact same symptoms...not sure if you've skimmed through or not, but i've stated it more than once. Furthermore, if you don't believe this is common feel free to do a google search on "marijuana withdrawal night sweats insomnia"...some have it for a few days, others for weeks, others for months.
I did see two doctors, been completely checked out....everything is fine. I'm now starting to think some of you are just fear mongers. You have NO IDEA how long I have been combusting, vaping, what dosage, how often, how often i've t-breaked.....but thanks again for your concerns.
I just think your first sentence/statement is funny - nothing I am experiencing is normal. Everyone is an expert on here.
I thought it smelled of ammonia... but it may be acetone, which is completely normal when following a ketogenic, low carb, or very low calorie diet.
I did see two doctors, been completely checked out....everything is fine. I'm now starting to think some of you are just fear mongers. You have NO IDEA how long I have been combusting, vaping, what dosage, how often, how often i've t-breaked.....but thanks again for your concerns.
I just think your first sentence/statement is funny - nothing I am experiencing is normal. Everyone is an expert on here.
I thought it smelled of ammonia... but it may be acetone, which is completely normal when following a ketogenic, low carb, or very low calorie diet.
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biohacker
H.R.E.A.M
Or fight fire with fire with urine therapy:
HillaryClinton
Future ruler of earth
I don't mean to downplay this but I live in NYC, me walking down the city for 5 mins with the crowds/cars/subways is probably tons worse then what little ammonia is released, ever walk by a public bus, god I wonder what I am breathing in....
.
In other words, I got better things to fear really
.
.In other words, I got better things to fear really
.
peterpiper
(peter-ex-piper)
Man if i got these types of withdrawl symptons id never touch it again. Which is what i suggest u do.
Can you explain what ammonia smells like, intrigued by this
This sounds similar to my experiences but were to do with my mental/physical health as well as SSRI withdrawal or imbalances
Sounds like when you throw cannabis or any other substance that has changes in the brain, although natural as cannabis is with CBD receptors etc.