Saionara Atomizer thread

Jory K said:

Good luck with that one man! I'm mean it! I don't know how all these guys manage to get theirs working so killer but I've got a Sequoia with both reg and taf caps and I can't get the buckets or the donut to work well and it's been over ;months now. I got so disguested with it I said screw it and ordered a G9 TC Port enail. You can adjust it anywhere between 300-800f and after warming up, which only takes about 20-30 sec depending on temp, it gives you a 45sec sesh. It's got an America designed clear and green glass recycler, comes with sic, Quartz, ceramic, and t2 nails, and is powered by a single 18650 amd works amazing. The only coils I've had any luck with from HVT are the triple ti w/ black ceramic wicks. I set the wattage at 33,'TC at360 and go up 15* each draw up to around 450. Oh, that's with a set resistance of .361 withbabstarti g setting of 440-450f you can fully vaporize almost 1/3G in one hit ifnyounwant to. Those coils WILL put you on your knees.
Good luck man.

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What problems did you have with a donut coil? I'm having good luck with my sai using a donut set at 28w, 280-300F in temperature control mode. I get vapor in about 3 seconds, and the good taste lasts.

That's considerably more wattage than is generally recommended, but it works well for me. I had it at 30w but I got quite a bit of splatter. I do get some splatter, but not a lot. And if I go to a lower wattage it takes longer to get vapor. So wattage settings are trade offs.

I vary the temps by the concentrate. Older sappy rosin ussually needs less heat than newer buttery rosin IME. Being able to limit temps in temperature control mode, and using low temps keeps the hits tasting good.

It also helps to really saturate the donut with rosin. The first average sized loads get wispy fast, but if you reload it before it runs down it hits great. So now I just keep adding rosin until its saturated pretty well before I hit it. Its a big step up from my previous pens, with tiny donuts, so it makes since it needs more fuel. It also helps to get the concentrate directly on the bottom. That where the heating wire in the ceramic is, so while it's easy to scrape it off on the sidewalls, it's not productive. I melt it on the donut off a thin dabber while I pulse the fire button.

Mr Turnip said:

I've gone through the thread and had a little read.

So I kinda know what settings to use but I can't download arctic fox I have an Rx Gen 3. Am I going to get the same experience using the same settings but without the added benefit of the extras arctic fox gives me. I've got the ti bucket I'm a bit confused as I've got a sprinter z at the same time and Im trying to work that out too.

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I wish I could help you guys more, but I have limited experience myself. I never downloaded anything so my pico still has the factory pico controls. And I'm usng ceramic donuts. I wouldn't give up tho, it really is a beast once you tame it. I use a couple sai's now so I have flavor choices.

I used it last night set in ni mode the ti bucket at 380f and 35w.

Knocked my head off but really really like it looks like I'll have to mess around with settings more.

Looking to rig up a whip-based wpa for my Sai taf. Anybody know what ID of silicone tubing fits over the mouthpiece of the Sai?

BabyFacedFinster said:

Wondering if @shredder or anyone else can comment on a comparison between the Sai donut and the Divine tribe donut?

Maybe I'd be happier with a bucket?

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YES you would. I am.
The bucket is superior in many ways to putting oil straight onto a donut, omg.

First of all, that bit of loss that you write about doesn't happen. There are no holes in the bucket.... the oil can't leak and escape anywhere. You vape it ALL.

Secondly, the bucket is simple to CLEAN. You just can't clean a ceraminc coil off like you can clean a titanium bucket. Quartz bucket is also very cleanable, but, retains some staining which is really hard to get off sometimes. I prefer the titanium.

Thirdly, no mess ! Clean taste ! Because you have wiped it out with a q-tip, and, titanium is not porous, so no oil soaks into it ! Fresh clean hit every time !

Finally, my heater coil (the one with the hole in the middle, folks), has lasted me 9 months and counting under heavy use ! Incredible ! (Of course the life is prolonged by using TC settings) This is partly due to the fact that no oil comes in contact with the ceramic, so it goes thru much less stress. Another is superior manufacturing of the coil (legs) I'm assuming.

So try the bucket !!
I used to swear by my 2.5 Divine Tribe Donut for my oil. Now, I can't stand them.
V3, etc, cute ideas, but, to rebuild from that mess of reclaim is a horror.

However, I'm about to receive a v4 from Divine Tribe for review on my site, it looks promising, like a much better QQ, some ideas most likely taken from the Sai.

DJ Colonel Corn said:

YES you would. I am.
The bucket is superior in many ways to putting oil straight onto a donut, omg.

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If you use this thread as evidence the jury is still out.

A lot, maybe most people have trouble with buckets. Especially with taste, and getting the right settings.

IMO buckets are more of a dab rig experience, and the donuts are a more flavorable sipper experience.

It's just a choice we make. And the more choices we have the better off we'll be.

I have friends that prefer the metal coils. To me using the ti bucket, or metal coils, all I taste is metal. It's all very subjective.

shredder said:

If you use this thread as evidence the jury is still out.

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Yes we KNOW you don't like the buckets, ha

DJ Colonel Corn said:

Yes we KNOW you don't like the buckets, ha

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Again read the thread. Not just my posts, lol. If you do, you'll find I'm not alone.

If anyone likes the buckets great! If anyone likes metal coils, great! If anyone like me like ceramic donuts, great!

I don't care how anyone prefers to use their sai. The way things evolve we'll have new tools to use soon anyway. In 2 years our sai coils of whatever type will be dinosaurs, lol.

Wow I just tried the titanium bucket through a dry glass piece at 500F 40W TCR315 0.75Ω and ripped a bb sized dab completely whole in 2 hits. I let it reach 500F before inhaling. Literally nothing vaped at all on the 3rd hit. Usually I vape without a glass piece at 390F and I get 4-5 good hits and then another few wispy hits if I carry on after that. I didn't know the sai could rip so hard!

I wish the quartz bucket didn't leak concentrate onto the ceramic plate, also it clogs up that small metal tube very easily. I accidentally chipped my quartz bucket so that was the final straw for me. I've been using the titanium bucket with ceramic donut (that it came with) for 3 months now with no issues whatsoever.

I'm curious about the black steel version (that I have). How is it made black, and is it as safe as normal stainless steel? I haven't noticed any issues with iso soaking and rinsing with water, but after reading how some people have rust problems with their dynavap shadow m... Yeah. Thanks if anyone can answer me.

Have to say I got off to a slow start with my TAF, and it never quite grabbed me. I bought it on a whim when I saw it on sale at PIU and couldn't resist. I didn't have a great supply at the time, it was all just bad timing.

Put some interest into it a few months ago, even read about settings and everything, and I started to like it. Then my Carta showed up and I started to get the Temp Protect error/message on my eLeaf Pico. I put it down for some time because I just didn't have the time.

Tonight, I had the house to myself and felt like some time. Or rather, me time!

The solution was pretty simple once I relearned how this thing worked for controls.

I really like this. It's small, fast, discrete, the taste is great, and it really seams to stretch the rosin.

All this with stock settings of Ti .7ohm locked, 28W, 380F with the Ti bucket. I haven't played with settings on this or tried any of the other buckets/coils I got with it..... This was supposed to be a productive weekend.....

Just thought I'd post this, I checked my ceramic coil with a temperature probe. When my 75w pico is set to 280° F the coil is actually 428°F.

I never really thought the 280° reading was accurate but now I have a better idea.

It might be more accurate with buckets, IDK.

Loving my sai taf ti bucket right now. Been spending more time with it and love the power. I am a sipper and was actually not putting enough wax in and just getting wispy hits on like rice size and all that.
But you have to be careful. Too much and it spills. Well it spills no matter what if it is hot and you have to design your whole use around that. Right side up.
I find like 2 good sized dabs is good to throw in there and give it a chance to go. Like the size dab of someone that likes a healthy dab. Or maybe what they give you free at a cannabis cup. Substantial. But I think the more common mistake is that people overload it and spill. I find the same thing with cotton on my enano. Too little wax and it never gets going. Too much and it is overwhelmed and clogs or in this case spills.

What I wipe out of that bucket when the taste changes is substantial and nasty. And thus is pretty clear and stable live resin. Any coil is in reality fouled after its first use. I still have 5 donuts to use but honestly the bucket has where I want.
What are y'all using for cases? I have a pelican 1015 that is pretty sweet. Tell if you use something better. With 2 dabs in the chamber it stinks so I need waterproof.
I am looking at an eyeglass case by witz called the wrapper. It looks like with a pico 75 it might fit inside - be waterproof - and sit up on its own. Have to find one to test it. Called every sunglass place in town and they have nothing so must have to bite the bullet.
Sorry on my phone and cant link but would love to hear feedback. I love the pelican 1015 but it wont stand on it's own. Any waterproof microcases that hold the sai upright? Love to finish the hit and then lock it down but sitting up.

I cant think of anything better than this than a puffco peak and that is even more hassle to carry around and crazy overpriced to run.

shredder said:

Just thought I'd post this, I checked my ceramic coil with a temperature probe. When my 75w pico is set to 280° F the coil is actually 428°F.

I never really thought the 280° reading was accurate but now I have a better idea.

It might be more accurate with buckets, IDK.

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With bare Sai donut coils, tcr between 225 and 240 (there's some variation between individual samples) gives accurate tc according to thermocouple tests I did a couple years back. Those tcr values are effectively unusable irl. Because the bucket leaks a lot heat to the atty body, it takes long enough to reach vaping temps that the Sai becomes uncomfortably hot too quickly for most users.

Just my 2 cents worth. Hope it helps.

Olde7 said:

With bare Sai donut coils, tcr between 225 and 240

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Actually, the recommended TCR value for the Sai TAF is 315.

You'll find it works quite well.

TCR 315, 38 watts, 380 F , is how I have mine set up, works like a CHARM.

Dan B said:

I wish the quartz bucket didn't leak concentrate onto the ceramic plate

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It doesn't actually "leak", it's overflowing, because quartz has a unique property which makes the oil climb UP the sides.
This can be remedied by using LESS oil per hit. This is a LAYGO device (Load As You Go), intended for 1-2 tokes at a time, then you wipe it out with q-tip, and reload.

I also had problems with my quartz cup, and moved to the Ti bucket. I find the quartz cup is too small, and this causes the oil to run up the sides and spill often.

Also, surface area is your friend when it comes to vaping oils. The Ti bucket has a much larger surface area.

All that said, hate to say this kinda, but, I've tried the Divine Tribe V4 Quartz Crucible atomizer, which has a much larger quartz cup, and I find it does not have the same problem.

All the best to all the Sai users, may she service you for a long time.

Reminder: Get the doughnut coils with a lil hole in the middle from HVT, they last much longer than the solid ones.

Enjoy your Sai TAF !

Actually, I specifically said bare donut. Not bucket. Accurate tc happens for them in the tcr range stated. Tcr315 is the generally accepted compromise value for buckets. My thermocouple tests helped drive u/daltesean to arrive at tcr315, over on reddit. It is not accurate, however. You don't get wysiwyg results. Actual bucket temp will go past the set temp and keep on going up quite a bit before it stabilizes. Don't take my word for it - Get a thermocouple (about $30 usd) or do a cotton singe test. That's how I know.

This not to say tcr315 doesn't work or is somehow bad. It's simply a working compromise. A good one. But it's a mistake believe for a second that the temp you set on the mod is what you actually get in the bucket. Just my own experience and 2 cents.

Olde7 said:

Get a thermocouple (about $30 usd)

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Or $5;
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/TM902C-...var=601035452736&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2648

Hello everyone, I’m new to the concentrate game so please forgive me if what I’m asking is a redundant question. Just got a top flow saionara a few weeks ago and I’m a bit lost with the box mod settings. I’ve been getting good results using it in wattage mode but I’m wondering if I’m using it wrong. I’m using the default atomizer that comes straight out of the box. I believe the max recommended wattage for the ceramic donut is 28W. But I’ve been pulsing it at 38W for no longer than 5sec at a time. Works great but I’m wondering if I’m just burning out my coil fast. I’ve perused most of this thread but it seems like everyone is using temp control mode. Is it ok to use in wattage mode at 38W? I’m pretty new at this so any help would be appreciated. Thanks!

Here come the clones

I am looking to place an order for replacement bucket/s and realize I have no portable bubbler. I know you guys fight about this one but any suggestions? Puffitup version looks ok but prob not great. But saionara poseidon looks like something that will break but will give actually good hits.
Should I just forget on the road or some people like the PIU version? I might get the poseidon for special occasions like tailgaiting or something but lugging seems doomed to failure. What say you? It is not like I need to get either.

frank grimes said:

Hello everyone, I’m new to the concentrate game so please forgive me if what I’m asking is a redundant question. Just got a top flow saionara a few weeks ago and I’m a bit lost with the box mod settings. I’ve been getting good results using it in wattage mode but I’m wondering if I’m using it wrong. I’m using the default atomizer that comes straight out of the box. I believe the max recommended wattage for the ceramic donut is 28W. But I’ve been pulsing it at 38W for no longer than 5sec at a time. Works great but I’m wondering if I’m just burning out my coil fast. I’ve perused most of this thread but it seems like everyone is using temp control mode. Is it ok to use in wattage mode at 38W? I’m pretty new at this so any help would be appreciated. Thanks!

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Some posters here use 40watts on the ceramic donut to heat their bucket, so I think you'll be alright. My sai is pretty much my daily driver, and I had it since last winter and only had one coil fail. Actually two but the first one was my fault it was set to 75w and I didn't notice it, lol.

As to running it in wattage mode, I can't help you. I've only used TC mode on mine.

I was new to mods as well and it took me a week or two to settle on a style, and just to figure out using the mod. For me it was confusing at first, my first mod and all. I posted about it here back then. Now I settled on just using the donuts at 16.5 w and 280 F and in TC. Good luck, hope this helped

shredder said:

Some posters here use 40watts on the ceramic donut to heat their bucket, so I think you'll be alright. My sai is pretty much my daily driver, and I had it since last winter and only had one coil fail. Actually two but the first one was my fault it was set to 75w and I didn't notice it, lol.

As to running it in wattage mode, I can't help you. I've only used TC mode on mine.

I was new to mods as well and it took me a week or two to settle on a style, and just to figure out using the mod. For me it was confusing at first, my first mod and all. I posted about it here back then. Now I settled on just using the donuts at 16.5 w and 280 F and in TC. Good luck, hope this helped

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Thanks, I wish there was a better set of instructions for box mods. It’s not that I’m adverse to testing stuff out on my own but concentrates are expensive unlike herb where I don’t mind wasting a few grams trying out a new vape. I’m getting 2 awesome hits from a grain of shatter using wattage mode so I’m not planning on messing with the temp control. Thanks again!

frank grimes said:

Thanks, I wish there was a better set of instructions for box mods. It’s not that I’m adverse to testing stuff out on my own but concentrates are expensive unlike herb where I don’t mind wasting a few grams trying out a new vape. I’m getting 2 awesome hits from a grain of shatter using wattage mode so I’m not planning on messing with the temp control. Thanks again!

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Ya, I agree the instructions are lacking. And mods aren't really user friendly yet. But if you found something that works for you, great! Dab on bro.

I'm not sure if there's a you tube video on this. It might not hurt to look. I had my first one all messed up. I had to shut it down to reset itself, lol.

As I write this I'm sipping on some super silver haze rosin in my sai, while I'm bbqing ribs and drinking a cold summer shandy. Life is good!

shredder said:

If you use this thread as evidence the jury is still out.

A lot, maybe most people have trouble with buckets. Especially with taste, and getting the right settings.

IMO buckets are more of a dab rig experience, and the donuts are a more flavorable sipper experience.

It's just a choice we make. And the more choices we have the better off we'll be.

I have friends that prefer the metal coils. To me using the ti bucket, or metal coils, all I taste is metal. It's all very subjective.

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I never found anything to work really at all for rosin until buckets ... never figured out how to get ceramic donuts or coils to work in any way remotely acceptable for flower rosin ...

Just my 2 cents ...

I prefer the quartz buckets and don’t have any staining. They stay looking brand new if you clean them by boiling a few drops of water in their whenever they don’t q-tip 100% clean.

shredder said:

Ya, I agree the instructions are lacking. And mods aren't really user friendly yet. But if you found something that works for you, great! Dab on bro.

I'm not sure if there's a you tube video on this. It might not hurt to look. I had my first one all messed up. I had to shut it down to reset itself, lol.

As I write this I'm sipping on some super silver haze rosin in my sai, while I'm bbqing ribs and drinking a cold summer shandy. Life is good!

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I’d love to be bbq’ing while hitting it. I’m on the grill with some USDA Prime steaks as we speak, no weed tho cuz family is over. Tonight I’ll double tap that sai!

JCat said:

I never found anything to work really at all for rosin until buckets ... never figured out how to get ceramic donuts or coils to work in any way remotely acceptable for flower rosin ...

Just my 2 cents ...

I prefer the quartz buckets and don’t have any staining. They stay looking brand new if you clean them by boiling a few drops of water in their whenever they don’t q-tip 100% clean.

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Different strokes I guess. I bought my first one because of the buckets. But gave up on them after a while. I'm happy with the donuts. It might help that I like low temps.

I wish you and @Olde7 would post a little more here. Or anyone else with good advice. I think a lot of people prefer buckets, but get lost easy. A tip here and there would help. Especially on the mods, my internet is my phone so idk shit about the downloads.

I have friends with sai's that just use metal coils in wattage mode, but few people post about that here.

It would be great if this thread got moving better. I think the vape is pretty cool.

JCat said:

I never found anything to work really at all for rosin until buckets ... never figured out how to get ceramic donuts or coils to work in any way remotely acceptable for flower rosin ...

Just my 2 cents ...

I prefer the quartz buckets and don’t have any staining. They stay looking brand new if you clean them by boiling a few drops of water in their whenever they don’t q-tip 100% clean.

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I also wanted to ask, is the reason for not liking coils or donuts with rosin have to do with fouling of the atomizers? I pretty much only vape rosin now and do know that pressing maintains a lot of plant waxes and leaves a good amount of residue after vaping.

I have a quartz bucket, actually a Divine tribe V4, and while it works, it just doesn't do it for me. My issue is not with DT as they make a great product, but with the quartz cup/bucket concept. My issue is that I only need to use a small amount.

In fact, that small amount makes it difficult to get a few good hits before any residue starts to darken and become foul. And it is hard to see what stage you're in without needing to lift off the metal housing to see. When I use a larger amount, I get several strong hits, but then I'm left with leftover concentrate pooled in the cup. My options then are to keep vaping myself into and use it up, or swab out concentrate that could have been used but is now wasted.

So I am looking at one of those crushed SS coils to try out, either DT or Sai. It seems you can load them up and space out your hits while keeping the melted rosin at lower temps. I worry about fouling and the need for excessive cleaning with the waxes found in rosin.

The DV jetstream looks most appealing because the coils sit in a very shallow housing, making it much easier to load rosin with a dab tool.