Why Ceramic or Glass Heat Exchangers?

[OO]

I was doing some research after reading a claim by the manufacturer of the Supreme Vaporizer. He said "It's also an excellent heat conductor (un-like ceramic or glass)."

My search turned up this.
"In contrast to Metals Ceramics have low thermal conductivity due to Ionic-Covalent Bonding which does not form free electrons. "

From here:
http://www.substech.com/dokuwiki/doku.php?id=thermal_properties_of_ceramics

So why is it that people pay more for less conductance?

 

[wowthisisrandom]

I believe it has to do with the taste. Glass and ceramic are pretty inert I believe, and people say the taste is better.

 

[OO]

I believe it has to do with the taste. Glass and ceramic are pretty inert I believe, and people say the taste is better.

I believe this begs the question then:

Can you taste steel?
Most people cook and eat with steel cookware/utensils. Does it contaminate the taste of the food?

Many people cook with aluminum, can you taste aluminum?

I don't think that taste is the reason, but that's just my suspicion.

 

[Hippie Dickie]

i personally prefer beer in a glass bottle rather than a can. for taste.

 

[DaProfessor]

Completely subjective, but I can taste a difference between metal/ceramic heaters and glass encased heater (VHW). I'm not saying it taste better, but I think I can distinguish it. Just like you, I was skeptical. I was using an herborizer and MZ daily before obtaining a VHW. The first big hit I took with the VHW, I immediately noticed a subtle taste difference. Same glass piece, same water source and same strain I had been using for a couple weeks at the time of comparison. I started a using the VHW as my daily driver a month ago and do notice a lessening of the hangover. My usage has increased by 1.5x, so the decrease in hangover effects may be some sort of tolerance. It could also be due to the hottest point of the air path being glass rather than metal/ceramic. Don't really know...

 

[weedemon]

i personally prefer beer in a glass bottle rather than a can. for taste.

that's a good example and i totally agree

another reason is even if you can't taste a difference, most people will agree that a glass path is safer than a metal one.

Can you taste steel?
Most people cook and eat with steel cookware/utensils. Does it contaminate the taste of the food?

Many people cook with aluminum, can you taste aluminum?

I don't think that taste is the reason, but that's just my suspicion.

Aluminum is linked to many diseases. i think in the future we will not use it for a lot of the things we do now.

the utensil question is an interesting one. depending on the quality of the materials in the utensils while we may not actually taste it, our bodes can become exposed to the impurities or even the metal itself (think lead solder for plumbing in old houses. etc). Substandard steel can also have mercury in it. there have been issues of this happening with products produced on the cheap.

"The following are impurities commonly found in steel:
Silicon
Sulphur
Phosphorus
Lead - Added to all classes of Steel to improve the machinablity of the Steel.
Manganese
Tin
and various gasses..."
http://www.codecogs.com/reference/engineering/metallurgy/impurities_in_steel.php

tin for example:

Acute effects are:
- Eye and skin irritations
- Headaches
- Stomachaches
- Sickness and dizziness
- Severe sweating
- Breathlessness
- Urination problems

Long-term effects are:
- Depressions
- Liver damage
- Malfunctioning of immune systems
- Chromosomal damage
- Shortage of red blood cells
- Brain damage (causing anger, sleeping disorders, forgetfulness and headaches)

and Lead:
For as far as we know, lead fulfils no essential function in the human body, it can merely do harm after uptake from food, air or water.

Lead can cause several unwanted effects, such as:
- Disruption of the biosynthesis of haemoglobin and anaemia
- A rise in blood pressure
- Kidney damage
- Miscarriages and subtle abortions
- Disruption of nervous systems
- Brain damage
- Declined fertility of men through sperm damage
- Diminished learning abilities of children
- Behavioural disruptions of children, such as aggression, impulsive behavior and hyperactivity

* Both from: http://www.lenntech.com/periodic/elements/sn.htm

My point is: our bodies collect and store heavy metals. these things bio-accumulate over our lifetime and once the level gets to a toxic point we begin to feel the effects. so I think that we do/can get it from our exposure from using cutlery, but even worse is all the other metal and plastics we come into contact with on a daily basis. not to mention how we voluntarily put more toxic stuff on us to bathe, stay fresh, and generally look "good".

regarding vaporization: we chose this method for health reasons right? so it make sense that we would go a step further and question the materials going into them.

feel like im maybe a lil too vaked. haha will stop there.

 

[max]

The Wiki definition is - "A heat exchanger is a piece of equipment built for efficient heat transfer from one medium to another". With vapes, exchangers are considered to be storage devices for heat, to maintain temp better than a heating element by itself can do. Metal (aluminum, stainless steel, etc.) is used because it's more efficient. And you can have a heat exchanger that isn't in the vapor path, just as you can have a heating element that isn't in the path. With the Supreme, the metal heating element (with the claim "There is no metallic taste") also serves as the exchanger/heat storage device. That isn't always the case. The PD, for example, uses a ceramic heating element, which transfers heat to the stainless steel exchanger. I guess you could argue that in this case the exchanger IS the heater, since you have to wait until it acquires enough heat, before you can get vaporization, but it does have the typical heating element. The heating element for the Supreme could be considered the butane flame. It gets kind of confusing terminolgoy wise, since electricity would equal flame for the typical vape. But the way I see it is a heat exchanger doesn't always = the heating element, so sometimes it's an apples and oranges comparison.

 

[vap999]

There is somewhat of a theoretical basis for some metals and alloys sometimes giving off a detectable odor upon initial heating. Metals commonly form various reaction products (at very low concentrations) on their air-exposed surfaces, such as metal hydrides and sulfides, besides the usual oxidation. I recall learning that the characteristic smells one commonly encounters when heating many metals and alloys comes from hydrides, sulfides, etc. on the surface being driven off/vaporized by heat. For example, when one turns on an exposed metal coil electrical space heater; or the smell I (and surely others) get when I turn on my home's forced-air heating system (with its vaporizer-like but way larger steel heat exchanger heating the air). I presume most people would recognize the various peculiar odor(s) of rapidly-heated metals/alloys when they encounter them. At the very dilute but odor-detectable concentrations involved here, there are no toxicity concerns; and most of these reaction products should likely be long gone by the time you use a vaporizer.

As far as I know, theoretically (any real chemists out there?), once heated and with any volatizable surface reaction products driven off, hot metals (as if vaporizer heat exchanger temperatures are even hot by metal standards!) should not be contributing metal or other molecules to passing air streams or catalyzing chemical reactions involving air molecules. Thus, heated air streams from metal vs. glass/ceramic heat exhanger-based convection vaporizers should be comparably reaction product- and odor-free.

So, 2 questions for those alleging or perceiving a distinctive odor from metal- vs. glass- or ceramic based convection vaporizer heat sinks/exchangers:
1) What substances might you be smelling/tasting?
2) How were these formed -- what does hot metal do that hot glass or ceramic do not do?

 

[crawdad]

fwiw... http://www.fuckcombustion.com/viewtopic.php?id=4141